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Wayward Side Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: 4.5 years later, is BH being unreasonable?
KBeguile
♂ Member
Member # 38348
Default  Posted: 7:09 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have to agree with Mike, especially since you already knew about his ill-feelings toward your side of the family prior to all of this. Just from what you've said, this sounds like an incredible level of justification on his part: he wants to control your family's influence in his life by means of your A.

Is it just me, or does this sound to anyone else like the serious start of some wayward thinking?


Me: fWS 32
Her: BS 35 (HeartInADustpan)
DS: 4yo
M: 7 years
DDays: 2012/11/14, 2013/02/05, 2013/03/09
-
"Everything that happens now is happening 'now.'"
"What happened to 'then'?"
"We passed 'then.'"

Posts: 801 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: St. Louis
aesir
♂ Member
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 7:14 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BH here, and not really a good judge of reasonable or unreasonable. (Just ask anyone that knows me.)

One of the quick calculations I did when my STBXWW did it again was how many people had to go. When I counted up all the accomplices and co-conspirators and all the other stuff, it was so many people that would have to be gone forever, that it just made a whole lot more sense for me to go instead.

Further into this thread I see a few things that are somewhat troubling. Library cards? Really?!!!

My family never liked him. He is 8 years older than I am and we started dating when I was a teenager.

BH demanded complete submission as a condition of staying married. It was not a matter of me leaving the ball in his court. These were his stipulations.

Maybe it is the wording, but I am getting a sense of where your family was coming from back then, as well as a fairly creepy feeling. And I saw the title and was prepared to come in here and explain why everything I expected to read was completely reasonable. I am totally down with the idea of writing people off (including family) and never dealing with them again... but some of this other stuff is... troubling.


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 7:28 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Can someone define gas lighting for me? Or point me towards a link?

Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 7:35 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Personally, My wife and I never do anything the other is not 100% enthusiastic about.

We call it, care and protection of each other.

You can go back and forth about who's being abusive all day long....

Is it abusive for you to take time away from H to vacation with those that were willing to throw him away like a piece of trash? Many would say yes!

Is it abusive for him to refuse you being away from him to take a vacation with your extended family? Many would say yes!

When you make the time away all about who's hurting who, or who needs something at the expense of the other, it's become a futile discussion that neither one wins.

When it becomes about protecting each other above all else, well that changes everything. Being willing to live a life where both spouses agree to never do anything the other is not 100% enthusiastic about, becomes a marriage worth investing in.

You can read about this concept in the book, His Needs, Her Needs.
It helped my marriage greatly...

[This message edited by Card at 12:54 PM, July 7th (Sunday)]


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 7:49 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So what would you do card?

Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 8:18 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Noescape has given me a lot to think about regarding my own conflict avoidance.

I'm reading some articles on Marriage Builders' site. Is this a good source?


Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 8:25 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SI is your BEST resource.

Trawl the wayward forums, the healing library and the ICR (I can relate). Theres a thread in ICR for Betrayed Men which may be useful.

I found some MB advise to be spot on, other stuff, I found to be toxic and it only complicated any chances at R. (sorry, thats just me).

Here on SI, look out for posts by some of the vets, it becomes apparent who they are after a few days of lurking. Their wisdom is blinding in clarity, honest to god wholesome and no bulls&*t talk.


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
Mrs Panda
♀ Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 8:44 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why would you want to be in a relationship where you are submissive? A captive it sounds like.

No family.

No friends.

No phone.

No internet.

No car.

No fucking library card?!?

What the heck do you do all day?

Sound like prison. Sounds awful.

Just so you know, your BH"s response is not a "normal" response. It is a controlling and unhealthy way of dealing with a horrible situation.

It totally blows my mind how anyone can live and love and feel loved in a marriage like that. Based on control and power.

Do you put up with it because of guilt, or do you not feel you deserve better?


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
aesir
♂ Member
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 8:57 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

t/j
Mrs Panda, I believe prisons have a library and visiting hours.


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
Mrs Panda
♀ Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 9:03 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

T/j aesir, I can only assume you speak from experience?


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 9:07 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have family, a car, a phone with Internet and access to books again now, albeit monitored usage if all of the above.

Should I have done a better job introducing myself and my story? I feel like maybe I've jumped in with this post and skipped some steps.


Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Mrs Panda
♀ Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 9:13 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I understand your story.

You are on probation now. Out of prison.

And you are still not allowed friends or to visit family.

What I don't understand is why his treatment of you is ok with you.

Do you value yourself?


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been with my husband since I was 15 and he was 23. It is nearly impossible to envision my life without him.

Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Mrs Panda
♀ Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 9:21 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did you envision your life without him when you cheated?

Seems to me like you need to dig a little deeper into your self-esteem issues and dependence on your husband.


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
RockyMtn
♀ Member
Member # 37043
Default  Posted: 9:34 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BW here.

My first thought was that your family is in the wrong. My WH had a friend who knew and laughed about the A. Adios, dude. He sucked. If it had been my WH's family who did that?? I'd probably cut them out of my life and ask that he limit contact with them. Pretty much where you are at now.

But, on second thought...do you think your family has a legit reason to dislike him? I do. They've picked up on his controlling tendencies. It seems that they thought he was controlling before the A. And look what he did post-A. He lived up to their expectations - exceeded those. Maybe I'm wrong. In-laws sometimes just don't like the spouse. I'm not talking about that - I'm suggesting that he may have scared them a bit.

Look, I don't think its OK that they hid the A. Sounds like your mom/sis didn't discourage you? Do you think they were hoping you'd find your way out of a controlling marriage? I don't think its OK, I'm a BS, that shit stings. But can I understand it? Yes. If my child was being controlled by a spouse and I didn't see any way for him to get out...and then saw a way for him to get out? Even a totally shitty way like an A? It'd be hard to squelch that chance. Could they have done other things to help you get out? Yes, that would have been far better.

I know I'm projecting a lot here. But there seems to be something off with your BH. He sounds extreme. And your family may have saw that years ago, before the A, even when you weren't seeing it. I'm not justifying your behavior or their behavior, but HIS behavior counts, too. He doesn't get to treat you like shit and then expect your family to put you in a dangerous position by disclosing your A. And, yes, I think his behavior after the A was downright dangerous and abusive. By disclosing, they would have been the folks to put you in that dangerous position. I don't know if I could have done that to my kid either.

All that aside...have they ever apologized to him? Attempted to? Any other amends? Do you sense that they have remorse for hiding it from him? I'm not saying he should ever want to have a relationship with them - but if they went to great lengths to make things right, I think he could at least have a calm conversation with you about a visit your family.

[This message edited by RockyMtn at 9:37 PM, July 6th (Saturday)]


Me, BS, 30s
Him, WS, 30s, Steppenwolf
Kids: Yep
D-Day 1: September 2011, 6 week EA
D-Day 2: January 2013, discovered EA was a PA; there was another PA in 2010. All TT.
Goal = serenity.

Posts: 667 | Registered: Oct 2012
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 9:46 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mrs. Panda: I don't think I have done enough self examination and this thread has really illustrated that.

RockyMtn: I don't think there is a chance in hell my mother will apologize. Keep her mouth shut and play nice? Yes. But I think that's the best she can do. There was never a time, even years before the affair, that either BH or my mom had a heart to heart conversation, or really anything more than a civil small talk.


Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Ceili
♀ New Member
Member # 39763
Default  Posted: 9:50 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Earlier this evening I was told this is an excuse, and I will try to figure that out, I'm new here and I get that I have a long way to go , but at the time the affair seemed like a way out. It was so final. I slept with someone else, so of course we would get a divorce. I never expected BH would want me to stay.

Posts: 19 | Registered: Jul 2013
Unagie
♀ Member
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 10:03 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He sounds controlling, manipulative and abusive. He monitors what you read, who you see, what you do and demands complete submission. You were not allowed a phone, internet, family or library card until recently and all these things are now allowed with strict guidelines. If you are caught reading a book that he feels is too sympathetic to the WS what does he do? Do you get in trouble? These are serious questions. What are the consequences if he monitors your use here on SI and gets angry because people are saying he's abusive or unreasonable? This site supports a wayward through their journey of learning and change and yes we can be sympathetic towards each other. Would he be okay with this? Does he try to control how you do everything? What you wear, how you eat, how you raise the kids, where you go for fun, what you say, how you speak? Once again I am not trying to be sarcastic or rude just figuring out what he means by total submission. What aspects of your life are still yours?

You do still need to work on why you had an A and acknowledge those things within you. Would you have had another one if all these rules had not been in place? It sounds like your very existence is dependent on him. You said you wanted a divorce but changed your mind when he wanted to R. Did you want to R or was that his choice and you did what you were told?


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."


Posts: 2760 | Registered: Oct 2012
happenedtome
♀ Member
Member # 6042
Default  Posted: 10:53 PM, July 6th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS here. Ceili, your post sent chills down my spine. Your H sounds like an abusive controlling man who used your A to isolate you from the outside world and better control you. Having suffered years of infidelity, I do not say this lightly . . . But I strongly suspect that your family was complicit in your A because they felt your BS was not good for you and hoped the A indicated your intent to escape from a bad situation. I am not justifying the A, but your BS's demands seem extreme to me. The fact that you were 15 and BH was 23 when you started dating also suggests BH was looking for a partner he could control and my guess would be that his domineering behavior predates the affair. So yes, I do think your BH is being unreasonable. (Edited to say BH instead of WH)

[This message edited by happenedtome at 10:56 PM, July 6th (Saturday)]


Posts: 234 | Registered: Dec 2004
authenticnow
♀ Moderator
Member # 16024
Default  Posted: 6:30 AM, July 7th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ceili,

We all get here with a lot of self work to do. It can be very confusing and overwhelming at times.

I'm glad you're here. Keep posting and reflecting. We're here to help you through this.

AN


Take up your space (and do it well).

"That's the thing about pain, it demands to be felt."


Posts: 38013 | Registered: Sep 2007
Topic Posts: 40
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