Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
Find a Local Couselor
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: saveme25 (43179)

General Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: How do you set boundaries?
TXBW68
♀ Member
Member # 36456
Default  Posted: 5:07 PM, July 24th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMO, you must have very clear boundaries with very clear consequences. Write them down if you need to so you are both on the same page. No guessing or looking for the gray area. Most importantly, You have to be willing to follow thru with those consequences.

The night of DDay 2 in my signature, I was very clear with my husband. He had 2 choices.

1) Take off the new wedding band he was wearing, go wake up the kids and tell them Exactly why we were divorcing and get the F out of my house.

2) Keep that new ring on. Read NJF. Cut off ALL inappropriate friendships immediately! (He still called OW2 his best friend.) No inappropriate comments to the 1 female friend I let him keep. All passwords were to be disclosed. All inappropriate pictures/messages were to be deleted. No Porn!

I also had a spreadsheet of inappropriate actions and their consequences, ranging from counselling to divorce.

I made it very clear that the kids and I lived on our own for 10 months without him. I didn't have to put up with any more bullshit.

He agreed to everything!

I think the key for me was not caring if I made him mad or if he felt like I was treating him like a child. I didn't make this mess. He did!

It took the drama of the first 6 months alone to get me to that point though. I didn't have SI at first and I was trying to please him to keep him - even after he left! Once I figured out that I didn't Need him - just Wanted the old him - I grew a set and started standing up to him.

By the time DDay 2 came around, he knew I was dead serious about kicking his ass out and filing for divorce if he screwed around again.

SI helped me get stronger - and it will help you too! Hang in there!

((lonelygirl))


Me (45) WH (42),2 boys 14 & 11
M 18yrs T 22yrs
Separated 10 months (4/12 to 2/13)
Final Total - #1/#2 ONS and #3/#4 EA/PA - left me for #4, didn't know about #2 and 3 until he moved back home
We are solidly in R now

Posts: 781 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: Dallas, TX
Tearsoflove
♀ Member
Member # 8271
Default  Posted: 8:12 PM, July 24th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't have the right to tell him that I don't want him to engage in certain behavior,

How is your telling him that certain behaviors upset you and you'd rather he didn't engage in them treating him like a child? In all relationships, we have to have boundaries. And yes, some things should be second nature like not slapping people you love, not cheating, etc. But sometimes others don't know what hurts us unless we tell them. And if someone keeps slapping you despite the fact that it is unacceptable to everyone else in society, you either set a boundary with consequences or you walk away. How does you not telling him how you feel and not protecting yourself with boundaries help you?

To me, your IC is not concerned about your best interests. If he/she was, you'd be encouraged to do what you need to feel safe in your relationships (not just the one with your boyfriend). Sitting back and accepting hurtful behavior to avoid treating someone else who should know better but obviously doesn't care like a child is asinine.


Me: BS
Him: FWS
3 kids

DD#1: 3/18/2003
DD#2: 9/28/2010 with a follow up on 1/28/2011 where he decided to come clean about the EA actually being a PA.

The OW could have been anybody and both turned out to be nobody special.


Posts: 3774 | Registered: Sep 2005
Nature_Girl
♀ Member
Member # 32554
Default  Posted: 8:28 PM, July 24th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You say, "It is completely unacceptable to me if you do X, or Y, or Z. These are, however, your choices. If you participate in these activities, my choice will be to end the marriage."

This is perfect.

I, too, struggled with establishing boundaries once DDay happened. I, too, had lived the whole marriage trying to be understanding & tolerant. My IC helped me figure out what was important to me. STBX did not appreciate me letting him know what I would no longer tolerate and what I would do if he engaged in those behaviors. In fact, he was outraged. I held firm, though.


Me = BS (Stay-at-home-mom)
Him = EX-d out (abusive troglodyte NPD SA)
3 elementary school-aged kids
Together 20 years
D-Day: Memorial Weekend 2011
2013 - I DIVORCED HIM, I'M FREE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBOJpIwF47Y

Posts: 8759 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: USA
nomistakeaboutit
♂ Member
Member # 36857
Default  Posted: 8:51 PM, July 24th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I guess part of my struggle is that he reverses the logic on me, and I feel restricted. I have a female friend that he doesn't like because she's single and still kind of in the party phase. So he tells me that if I want him to stop seeing Mr. No Morals, then he wants me to stop seeing her. It makes sense. He doesn't like her.

Are you sure it makes sense? He cheated on you. You didn't cheat on him. Doesn't that make a difference? Plus, strip clubs and massage parlors are not the same as dinner with a single friend who is still a little wild.

Regarding your lack of skill in setting boundaries, I think the issue is not knowing what consequences you would be willing to enforce. You know how to,set boundaries, you just don't know how to set consequences you can stick to.

Your IC offers good advice on trust for someone who is in a loving, trusting relationship where trust has NOT been broken. The advice doesn't hold water once a betrayal has happened. You may never trust him again, which is one of the reasons so many people have advised you to leave him. It's hard to rebuild trust.

Finally, in terms of being controlling, it may be that you are. You might want to explore that. For you, if a guy wants to go to strip clubs every other week, you've just got the wrong guy -particularly if you let him know that it bothers you and he pushes back.



Me: BH 56.........Her: WW 43
DD: 6..........DS: 4
Married for six years.
DDay: 12-25-11 Divorced: 7-15-12
...................................
"It's like a nightmare within a nightmare, which in and of itself is a nightmare!"

Posts: 803 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: U.S.A.
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 9:25 PM, July 24th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

These might help you

Credit goes to oktobermest


http://www.divedir.com/media/marriageboundaries.pdf


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
Schilling
♀ Member
Member # 39774
Default  Posted: 1:58 PM, July 25th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tearsoflove,

How did you get so strong to say that to him so firmly?

Or, is that just who you are?

With my partner I feel weak. I am slowly...VERY slowly finding my ground and finding my voice, but I am scared to tell him boundaries I will accept.


I am 26(Bgf). He is 36 (Wbf).
On Again, Off Again - 10 years.
Not Married. No Kids.
D-Day: Too many to list/ remember.
Trying to Reconcile.

Posts: 103 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: San Francisco
Tearsoflove
♀ Member
Member # 8271
Default  Posted: 3:24 PM, July 25th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, Schilling, the first time, I had no strength whatsoever and that may be why I went through a second time. My boundaries were weak and we didn't really establish why he did it. Oh, we came up with reasons but they were just excuses, really. We didn't discuss his KISA tendencies or cover any of the issues he has with alcohol. I thought because he said he would never do it again and acted really sorry, he'd never do it again. Wrong.

When he had the second affair, I was numb. It hurt but it wasn't really shocking. I didn't question how he could do something like that- I already knew he was capable. I just knew that my self-esteem had suffered for years because of everything I put up with the first time and there was no way in hell I was going to put up with anything less than exactly what I wanted after the second time. He could either choose himself or he could choose our marriage but if he chose the marriage, nothing was getting swept aside. Not one thing. It scared him that I'd have been fine either way.

I laid down my boundaries and told him to take it or leave it. Along with no friends of the opposite sex, he gave me every password to everything he is on. We set up a scan on his computer for hidden files, deleted emails, photos, etc. His phone has GPS software on it and he hands it to me any time I want to look through it. (I rarely look at any of it anymore- I don't want to be the marriage police- but I can if I want to).

He told me he would do whatever I needed him to do to make me feel secure and that is the only reason he got another chance. He knows if he blows it, I'm done. More importantly, I know if he blows it, I'm done. I love him but I'll be fine without him. I didn't know that before but I know it now. I love him but I don't love him enough to compromise myself for him again.


Me: BS
Him: FWS
3 kids

DD#1: 3/18/2003
DD#2: 9/28/2010 with a follow up on 1/28/2011 where he decided to come clean about the EA actually being a PA.

The OW could have been anybody and both turned out to be nobody special.


Posts: 3774 | Registered: Sep 2005
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 8:27 AM, July 26th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Are you sure it makes sense? He cheated on you. You didn't cheat on him. Doesn't that make a difference? Plus, strip clubs and massage parlors are not the same as dinner with a single friend who is still a little wild.

Yeah... true. But where do you draw that line? And who draws it? When I tell him something that bothers me, I expect him to change his behavior if he respects me. So shouldn't it work the same way in reverse? If something I'm doing bothers him, even if I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, shouldn't I change my behavior if I respect him?


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 732 | Registered: Jul 2013
Tearsoflove
♀ Member
Member # 8271
Default  Posted: 3:24 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lonelygirl,

I live by the same boundaries I expect my husband to live by. What I mean by living by the same boundaries is that I accept no friendships from people who are not friends of our relationships and, yes, if a male friend were to bother my husband on some level, he'd be out. I chose my husband so I put him first.

That said, it also depends on the situation. I'm not going to drop everything just because it bothers him if it's unreasonable because, by your standards, he could decide that anything bothers him. I'm not going to stop grocery shopping if my husband tells me he doesn't like me going to the grocery store. And I'm not going to let him isolate me from my family (a tactic of abusers). I'm also not going to ask him to abide by a boundary I am not willing to live with myself. But that's a personal choice. You have to temper your decisions with what's reasonable in a relationship.


Me: BS
Him: FWS
3 kids

DD#1: 3/18/2003
DD#2: 9/28/2010 with a follow up on 1/28/2011 where he decided to come clean about the EA actually being a PA.

The OW could have been anybody and both turned out to be nobody special.


Posts: 3774 | Registered: Sep 2005
nomistakeaboutit
♂ Member
Member # 36857
Default  Posted: 6:30 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lonely,

Where do I draw the line? I draw it differently after someone has cheated. That's what I'm trying to say.

You get to redraw boundaries, once he's cheated. He can't apply the same boundaries to you the you apply to him, because he betrayed you. The rules change after that.

So, back to your girlfriend, if she's acting inappropriately and encouraging you to do the same, that's one thing. If you're having dinner that's another thing entirely.

In any case, IMO. none of this has much to do with the essence of the problem between you and your BF. The core problem is that he betrayed you. The questions are: 1. Why? 2. How will it not happen again?

Good luck.


Me: BH 56.........Her: WW 43
DD: 6..........DS: 4
Married for six years.
DDay: 12-25-11 Divorced: 7-15-12
...................................
"It's like a nightmare within a nightmare, which in and of itself is a nightmare!"

Posts: 803 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: U.S.A.
homewrecked2011
♀ Member
Member # 34678
Default  Posted: 7:19 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah... true. But where do you draw that line? And who draws it? When I tell him something that bothers me, I expect him to change his behavior if he respects me. So shouldn't it work the same way in reverse? If something I'm doing bothers him, even if I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, shouldn't I change my behavior if I respect him?

Ok,,, my thoughts are this::

IF you were dating a NORMAL guy, he would not have cheated, would not have a problem with you having dinner with a friend who is a little wild (because YOU are trustworthy),,probably would not be going to strip clubs, etc.

Where I'm coming from: My first husband drank too much. I asked him to stop drinking too much. He said I needed to stop drinking if I wanted him to stop drinking. BUT I DON'T HAVE A DRINKING PROBLEM. Alcoholics, and people with issues have skewed thought processes which is why AA, Celebrate Recover, Sex addicts Anon, etc works to change their thought processes thru daily contact with their sponsors.

You are working with a person who stopped the affair, but is still not "right" with the thought processes and really doesn't care to change his thought processes or learn a new way to live. This is where you stand up for yourself. If you want to always be like this, then stay with him.

I also had huge issues with boundaries. My WH moved out and I still let him come here to eat dinner each night with our children -- I even cooked for him.

Here is what has helped me learn boundaries:

On this website under I can relate there is a section for those living with Sex Addicts. Read the threads and I think you'll see ways to set up boundaries with your bf.
Alanon. Go to their website, you can listen to meetings on the phone. Almost everyone who is in alanon has boundary issues at first. We can't set good boundaries until our confidence gets higher and an affair and living with a person going to strip clubs will kill self-confidence.

I read a great book called Love Must Be Tough by Dr. James Dobson. This book is a quick, easy read. It's on CD, too I think. Written by a Christian you would think he would say to "Love more". But he does not. He says that the line of respect (boundary)has been crossed over and over by this type of person and shows how to get the line of respect back.


[This message edited by homewrecked2011 at 7:21 AM, July 28th (Sunday)]


me BS 52
him - 46
married 15 years DIVORCED 10 31 12
children - ds15 ds12
d-day 12-19-11
I gave a 24hour ultimatum then went to attorney next day
Divorce filed

Posts: 1707 | Registered: Jan 2012
homewrecked2011
♀ Member
Member # 34678
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah... true. But where do you draw that line? And who draws it? When I tell him something that bothers me, I expect him to change his behavior if he respects me. So shouldn't it work the same way in reverse? If something I'm doing bothers him, even if I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, shouldn't I change my behavior if I respect him?

Yes, if his request were reasonable.

I have a guy friend who told me this:

When you start dating someone, watch them, see how they are, do they go to strip clubs, do they watch porn, do they drink too much, do they flirt with other women, do they check out other women while at dinner w u, ask you to do unreasonable things. Take it real slow. Really get to KNOW them. You don't want to spend all your life trying to "fix" a guy or "convince" him to become how you know they should be. Some people are "off"from the get-go. THIS IS WHY WE DATE - To find the person whose value system is the same as ours.

Also, SI has really helped me learn to set boundaries. If you search on Abbondad on this site and watch his posts from day 1 thru today you will see how everyone has helped him be strong and set very reasonable boundaries. I think it helped him that he started a thread and just stayed on that one thread so he could keep reading everyone's responses. At the beginning, I asked for help on all the forums and then forgot to go back and check who had helped me! LOL The same with you, if you keep posting on this thread that you started with each issue that comes up you will get great advice and thought-provoking responses. It takes a little while for it all to sink in, but one day soon it will all click. You might not like what each person says, so blow off people who don't "get it", but really read those who do.


Also, a book called "Why Men Love Bitches" really put a light-hearted twist on the boundary issues. The author shows step by step how to set boundaries thru the eyes of the "bitch". Thru the book - easy, fun, read, btw- you will see that the "bitch" is really just a person with strong boundaries and when I finished the book, I had already started thinking of some boundaries I could set up and keep.

Another guy on this site said he read a book "How high will you jump" I believe was the name and he set boundaries pretty quickly.

Keep posting here, you are eager to learn and you'll have lots of people here who will help you get these boundaries up.

[This message edited by homewrecked2011 at 7:48 AM, July 28th (Sunday)]


me BS 52
him - 46
married 15 years DIVORCED 10 31 12
children - ds15 ds12
d-day 12-19-11
I gave a 24hour ultimatum then went to attorney next day
Divorce filed

Posts: 1707 | Registered: Jan 2012
hopeful10
♀ Member
Member # 37765
Default  Posted: 8:05 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((LG))) Given your career (I am one too) you are obviously a driven woman who knows how to go after what she wants. This may not be a great fit for an insecure man. Does that make you controlling? No. Well, not necessarily. Controlling is saying: I am going to choose your friends, when and if you can go out, what you wear, etc. THAT is treating him like a child.

After an A, your entire trust system is shattered. To regain that trust, a BS does need to be able to assert some control in terms of behavior that does and doesn't make her feel comfortable. If you look at the boundaries that others have set, they almost always directly relate to ways they were betrayed.

In my case, a boundary for R was no porn and no fantasizing about other women. Seems controlling at first glance. What guy doesn't do this from time to time? And how do I even monitor the fantasizing? I can't. He could be doing all day every day behind my back. In our relationship, my WH used porn in place of intimacy with me and fantasized about women he was friends with and knew, he was cheating in his mind before he went out and acted on it. So, I set my boundary, and the consequence was divorce.

I'm trying to draw a distinction for you between setting a boundary that allows you to feel safe in the relationship and setting one to be controlling or out of spite. For example, you BF saying no to a quiet dinner with your friend because he "doesn't like her" is spiteful and tit for tat because he is pissed he can't go out with a guy who encouraged him to cheat and goes to visit strippers and prostitutes.

Boundaries are hard and confusing when you aren't used to having them. I am learning myself and they are SO hard to assert. But, it gets easier every time you do and the result is that all of your relationships will be healthier for it.


Taking it one day at a time.

Posts: 351 | Registered: Dec 2012
GraceisGood
♀ Member
Member # 17686
Default  Posted: 8:56 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

When you BF says that you cannot see so and so right after you tell him your boundary about his friend, that is controlling, he is being controlling, he is being a child and trying to punish you for having boundaries, he is trying to get his way, he is putting himself first, not the relationship.

Re read what homewrecked said about shared values and morals. I think in this case, deciding if he has enough shared values and morals with you is a good place to start. If you are not sure, then stating your boundaries and seeing his reactions/responses will let you know (although it sounds like you have stated enough and he has responded enough that you probably have a good idea already)

For me, in the beginning learning about boundaries, I struggled as it seems you are for a few reasons:

1 - I was a pleaser, big time, I was born a pleaser and the trait was just re enforced over and over again growing up, I was rewarded for "pleasing" and punished any time I tried to have a boundary or an individual like/dislike. I was trained to be a pleaser and I knew nothing else. I honestly did not know I had a choice in life in anything. That was hard to change. It is about changing my whole mind set, questioning why I thought as I did and re evaluating everything, not easy and still not done all these years later.

2 - I was co-dependent, that ties into the pleaser, but it is also a separate entity that had to be dealt with as well, being aware of being a pleaser and spending a few years trying to shift my perspective allowed me to delve into co-dependency, but even with the foundation set it was still very difficult, it really goes against the core of who I was and I fought against it.

3 - I think that deep down I knew that my H did not share my morals and vales in the way I needed him to at the time. Knowing this deep down was a kind of road block to moving forward with boundaries but I could not admit it to myself, I had not gotten to the point where my boundaries were more important than my dependence on having him in my life (still pleasing and still co-dependent)

For me number 3 was my biggest obstacle, I have been able to over come it in some areas and I still struggle in others.

Here is an example that might help, maybe?

You are a ship in the ocean, you know where you want to go, so you set your sails and rudder to get you there, the ocean and wind both say you cannot "use" us this way, you cannot "control" us this way, you are wrong to have a destination, we will choose where you go, or even if you go. So you pull up your rudder and you take down your sails and you are at their mercy, but the truth is that you can set your sail again at any time you choose, you do have a right to your destination and if the ocean and the wind still choose to not cooperate, you can jump in and swim for all your worth to be true to yourself. You know you cannot control the ocean or the wind just as you cannot control your BF (so it is total bs when he calls you controlling imo), but you can still get to where you need to be and that is the point of boundaries imo, just sometimes we cannot get there with the people we want to, sometimes we have to walk alone, or at the bare minimum be willing to walk alone.

Grace


We have a tendency to think the love offered us is a reflection of our worth and value.But in actuality,it's a reflection of the person that is giving it.We love out of who WE are-not because of who the receiver is.At least in terms of real love.TSMF

Posts: 3425 | Registered: Jan 2008 | From: how far the east is from the west
Heavy Sigh
♀ Member
Member # 34243
Default  Posted: 9:23 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LG,

I do not think you need to change counselors. The counselor is perhaps slowly helping you get to the realization of the words homewreckedgirl has spoken, I think. It's just a process she's walking you through. At first, it's scary to realize that there are no magic words to change them. That the only person we can change is ourselves. Scary stuff, because we think it forces us to leave before we're ready or to make a decision. It doesn't, unless abuse is ever involved, which it isn't in your case. You're not ready to hold the boundaries, so no ultimatums other than saying to WS that eventually you will find the strip clubs lifestyle unworkable in marriage if it continues. Work on the other stuff.

As what Homewrecked said:

You are working with a person who stopped the affair, but is still not "right" with the thought processes and really doesn't care to change his thought processes or learn a new way to live.

He may change, but I like Homewrecked's analogy with drinking. An alcoholic who stops drinking, for example, is white-knuckling it until realizing that many aspects around his/her life must change. To alcoholics, bars were once places to have fun and find friends. Bars are no longer safe places a newly sober person can go to, and loss of social life makes the drinker feel bereft of friends and having no clue how to entertain himself/herself.

You WS seems to wish to change, as he has given up the old pal (so far) and this may mean he wants to give up that stuff. But he hasn't changed that thought-process of how to live differently.


You need shared friends with similar values - together. Look for couples who go to dinner and a movie on weekends, or barbecue and watch the games. He may find that more fun than he thinks - getting to know other guys and learning to have fun without the "lets pick up girls" tie that was the only bond with friends in past.

Find other friends, and look for new places to find them. You're changing the "culture" of your marriage.

If wild guy dislikes his friendship with your husband forever neing limited to barbecue on Saturdays and watching the football game with other families - never going to bars or clubs with your husband - then the friendship will fade away on its own. Same for your wild friend. Invite her over, but limit your time with her to lunches to show you're doing your part to change the "culture" of your social life, as well.

The transitional time in life between being single, a partying couple and moving into family-based circles is always awkward, even without strip clubs to complicate it.

[This message edited by Heavy Sigh at 12:47 AM, July 30th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 1917 | Registered: Dec 2011
Heavy Sigh
♀ Member
Member # 34243
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Note to Whatnow8:

Four counselors? Is this really a string of bad luck, or are you looking for more than what counselors can realistically do? Lots of untrained people rent office space and call themselves counselors, so I'm not doubting you could have a run of bad luck. But think through it before changing again.


I think, at first, we all wish for that magic wand and counselors to "fix' our spouses and stop our pain or be our "our" side.

Counselors don't work that way, and can't make a spouse "behave" for us, or even to provide that epiphany. We BSs want the counselor to lecture the WS for us. They usually don't start out that way because it scares away the WS. Ask if the most recent counselor is a quack or if you're just impatient for WS to work through the process? They often see that the entire culture of our marriage must change.

As I posted to LG, I like how Homewrecked put it. And the culture of a marriage must change. Using an extreme example of mobster wives, it's useless to go to counseling in that culture because you're marriage to amoral thugs with money where the culture is to take the mistress to dinner on Fridays and the wife out on Saturdays. Nothing is going to change, except the person in that marriage unhappy with that dynamic leaving. (Hopefully, alive. :) ) For most of us the shift can be done, and it may be who we hang with or even changing how we deal with our own extended families with boundaries or staying friendly but more hands-off distant if some are toxic.

Affairs are escape and for some people, it's the default behavior from their single 20s that they don't know how to change after marriage, since it's how they valued themselves or entertained themselves with the pick ups or getting ego boosts. Some never change and at that point the BS leaves or just has to shut up about it.

[This message edited by Heavy Sigh at 9:53 AM, July 28th (Sunday)]


Posts: 1917 | Registered: Dec 2011
WoundedOpus
♀ Member
Member # 39521
Default  Posted: 5:08 PM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You can't set a boundary if you aren't also prepared to set consequences and follow through. I told him I wouldn't tolerate it and I would divorce him and I meant it. Your backing off means your boundaries have no consequences which essentially means you have no boundaries...

[Italic]Yeah, someone in my first post on SI I think told me that I had no boundaries. That's why I brought it up with my IC, and she told me that I don't have the right to tell him that I don't want him to engage in certain behavior, because that's treating him like a child. My IC says that I should trust him to do the right thing, without me telling him to. And if I can't trust him, then I shouldn't be with him. I get what she's saying... but it just feels more complicated than that to me.

Please get a new therapist, like yesterday! First, half of that only works if you both agree on 'What the right thing to do' is...You think it's not, he thinks it is. And really, you're not supposed to tell your HUSBAND what types of behaviors you're not ok with him engaging in?? And lastly, OMG, it's not like you said the consequence is taking away 30 minutes of TV time. There ate natural consequences to our actions, you leaving him would be the ultimate one, part of having boundaries is making sure the people in our lives, especially our spouse, know what they are and know what we plan to do if it's crossed.

Let me put it this way, you have 2 ways to state it.

1. I don't approve of you going to strip clubs/hanging with X/having female friends. If you do anyone of those things, you will be facing divorce.

2. I am not comfortable with you going to strip clubs/hanging with X/having female friends. If you choose to do anyone of those things, I will be forced to divorce you.

They may sound a little different but they're the same thing.

Your IC should have a clear understanding of boundaries, since she seems to be clueless, I drop her immediately!


Me: BW 37
Him: WH 38
(DDay: 2/2008)
13 years, 5 kids...Six years of Limbo

“I don't want to get to the end of my life and find that I have just lived the length of it. I want to have lived the width of it as well." ~ Diane Ackerman


Posts: 178 | Registered: Jun 2013
WaryOptimist
♀ Member
Member # 19911
Default  Posted: 7:06 PM, July 28th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lonelygirl10

It's really, really simple: you're not telling HIM what to do regarding certain scenarios, you're telling him what YOU'RE going to do regarding his behavior in certain scenarios ....

(The hard part is knowing what your limits are, and then following up on your stated actions)

(((LG10)

[This message edited by WaryOptimist at 7:29 AM, July 29th (Monday)]


Me: The faithful one
Him: WS
4 great kids
Married 28 years, together 35
D-Day: April 1, 2006 (yep, April Fool's Day...)
Aaaaaas Yoooouuu Wiiiiiish...

Posts: 629 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Here & There
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 12:43 PM, July 29th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for all the thoughtful replies. I wasn't online all weekend, so just now reading them.

It does help to think about it in terms of me deciding what I'm going to do, versus telling him what to do. I guess it's not that I'm telling him that he's not allowed to do something, but more like I'm telling him that I'm not going to be with someone who does those types of things?

I think I'm still struggling over what's reasonable and not reasonable as boundaries, using as an example his friend I don't like and my friend that he doesn't like. Before the A, I believed 100% that we had the same values. It's what attracted me to him. He said he didn't go to bars, didn't go to strip clubs, didn't watch porn, etc. When I would express a concern about a person that made me uncomfortable (such as OW before the A started), he would listen to me and say that he understood and wouldn't see the person. And likewise, I would do the same thing. He had a problem with some male friends, and I stopped talking to the male friends even though I didn't really think there was anything wrong with it. I stopped because I would want him to do the same thing. But after the A, I guess I'm less willing to give up things that bother him if I don't think there's anything wrong with it. With my female friend, I agree that she's a little wild. I've set boundaries with her though, and told her that I'm not interested in partying or doing a lot of drinking with her. The times I see her are dinners and stuff like art galleries. If I'm completely honest, I may have stopped seeing her before the A if my WS said it bothered him. But for some reason, I'm struggling with acting that way after the A. I feel like, looking back, I gave up a lot of stuff to make him happy because I was treating him the way that I wanted him to treat me. And I learned after Dday that I only THOUGHT he gave that stuff up... he didn't really. I thought he was at his dad's house, while he was having sex with OW who he had promised to not see outside the workplace. So, I guess I'm struggling now. My boundaries were always do what you would want the other person to do. But now I'm just struggling to do that myself. And I guess I don't know how to ask him to do stuff that I'm not willing to do. He doesn't think there's anything wrong with him do some work for his old boss/friend, or doing dinners. And technically I guess there's not.... except I know this guy has a habit of things getting out of control. Like dinner turning into OW dancing naked in front of them. Idk. It's just hard.

Or, another example is a conversation that happened this weekend. I made a comment that I might take a trip to visit a friend and have a girls' weekend. I knew he wouldn't like it cause he doesn't like the girl... and he replied that he would just take a boys trip the same weekend. Before the A, completely makes sense. After the A, the thought of him drinking with the guys somewhere on a trip makes me panic. So does that mean I can't take girls trips because I don't want him taking a boys trip? All this stuff is so hard to figure out.

[This message edited by Lonelygirl10 at 1:02 PM, July 29th (Monday)]


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 732 | Registered: Jul 2013
WoundedOpus
♀ Member
Member # 39521
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, July 29th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I had a huge post written up with passages from a book recommendation, but I realized it was way too long and perhaps copied too much of the book, so I sent it to you in a PM.

But here a few key points:

Limits

Two aspects of limits stand out when it comes to creating better boundaries. The first is setting limits on others. This is the component that we most often hear about when we talk about boundaries. In reality, setting limits on others is a misnomer. We can’t do that. What we can do is set limits on our own exposure to people who are behaving poorly; we can’t change them or make them behave right.

We set standards, but let people be who they are, separate ourselves from them when they misbehave, saying in effect, "You can be that way if you choose, but you cannot come into my house/be a part of my life. All that are repentant are welcome here."

You should limit your exposure to evil, unrepentant people, those who act in destructive ways. We are not being unloving. Separating ourselves protects love, because we are taking a stand against things that destroy love.

Compliants

Compliant people have fuzzy and indistinct boundaries; they “melt” into the demands and needs of other people. They can’t stand alone, distinct from people who want something from them. Compliants, for example, pretend to like the same restaurants and movies their friends do “just to get along.” They minimize their differences with others so as not to rock the boat. Compliants are chameleons.

After a while it’s hard to distinguish them from their environment. The inability to say no to the bad is pervasive. Not only does it keep us from refusing evil in our lives, it often keeps us from recognizing evil. Many compliant people realize too late that they’re in a dangerous or abusive relationship. Their spiritual and emotional “radar” is broken; they have no ability to guard their hearts.

This type of boundary problem paralyzes people’s no muscles. Whenever they need to protect themselves by saying no, the word catches in their throats. This happens for a number of different reasons:

- Fear of hurting the other person’s feelings
- Fear of abandonment and separateness
- A wish to be totally dependent on another
- Fear of someone else’s anger
- Fear of punishment
- Fear of being shamed Fear of being seen as bad or selfish
- Fear of being unspiritual
- Fear of one’s overstrict, critical conscience

This last fear is actually experienced as guilt. People who have an overstrict, critical conscience will condemn themselves for things God himself (or others outside of the relationship don’t) doesn’t condemn them for. “Since their conscience is weak, it is defiled”. Afraid to confront their critical internal parent, they tighten appropriate boundaries.

When we give in to guilty feelings, we are complying with a harsh conscience. This fear of disobeying the harsh conscience translates into an inability to confront others— a saying yes to the bad— because it would cause more guilt. We should be compliant from the inside out (compassionate), not compliant on the outside and resentful on the inside (sacrificial). Compliants take on too many responsibilities and set too few boundaries, not by choice, but because they are afraid.


Me: BW 37
Him: WH 38
(DDay: 2/2008)
13 years, 5 kids...Six years of Limbo

“I don't want to get to the end of my life and find that I have just lived the length of it. I want to have lived the width of it as well." ~ Diane Ackerman


Posts: 178 | Registered: Jun 2013
Topic Posts: 40
Pages: 1 · 2

Return to Forum: General Post Reply to this Topic
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.