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Divorce/Separation     Print Topic    
User Topic: Abbondad Part 4...
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 1:09 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you, DMom. Very helpful. This gives me clarity and a surer path. I will think about all this and ultimately of course confer with my attorney with regard to how best to negotiate.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 1:21 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi,

Been cleaning out the home--putting away reminders, packing boxes with her remaining stuff. Unfortunately came across some "love notes" from her POS. Just the most juvenile, scrawled bullshit imaginable--as though written by a smitten teenager (he's in his late thirties, never married, no kids). "I will wait until the end of time" sort of stuff (referring to her needing more and more time to decide to leave me for him). "Her aura." Puerile crap.

Meanwhile these were written when STBXWW was still telling me how much she loves me, can't be happy without me, renewing vows, on and on, and of course I was saying the same to her, fool that I was.

Must have been nice to have two men fawning all over you and you telling each of the men the same thing--that I love you but I need more time (possibly the rest of my life) to decide which one I will deign to commit to.

Well, she's all his. All middle-aged-divorced-with-two-kids-emotionally-broken-and-still-attached-to-her-husband-deceitful-needy 100% his.

Yes, I'm upset, but actually not that shaken. More angry and resolved.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
homewrecked2011
♀ Member
Member # 34678
Default  Posted: 2:15 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Save those love letters for your atty, just mail them to the paralegal for your file.

Also, I didn't know this til later. It is ok to email the paralegal with info for your file and just put on the topic line "for my file". The paralegal will file the info. THEN when the atty is looking thru your file it will all already be there.

You never know when he will be working on your case. He might be off all next week and will be taking his computer with him all week to review stuff....

Mine did not even touch anything really until 2 weekends before the trial that never happened. I had more stuff to give him, but he had basically prepared the case by that time, so I regretted not forwarding stuff to them.

When I had a question, I tried to email 3 quick questions at a time to the paralegal. Sometimes it was days b4 they got back to me.

I understand the paralegals would rather have stuff emailed to them because it takes up too much time to talk...

[This message edited by homewrecked2011 at 2:17 PM, August 8th (Thursday)]


Keep Calm and Happy On!

me BS 52
him - 46
married 15 years DIVORCED 10 31 12
children - ds15 ds12
d-day 12-19-11
I gave a 24hour ultimatum then went to attorney next day
Divorce filed


Posts: 2256 | Registered: Jan 2012
JustDone
♀ Member
Member # 9742
Default  Posted: 2:22 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Make a copy of those notes before you mail them, though. Or scan them and email them. Or just bring them in next time you see your attorney.

And, a bargaining chip, so to speak, with be a subpoena to the OM from your attorney. The last thing most WS's want is their OP on the record or on the stand. And it's usually the last thing an OP wants to do, too.

It's one thing for this single OM to get involved with a married woman, but it might be another thing to get involved in her divorce.

You never know...


Forgiveness is giving up the possibility of a better past.

Nobody forgets what happens, the secret is learning to live with it.


Posts: 2804 | Registered: Feb 2006
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 2:53 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you. Does it matter if I submit copies or should I just take the originals?

I know I ideally should strive for indifference, and others on this site will understandably recommend I shrug it off, but I honestly want this man to experience consequences for his part in destroying my family and in particular for hurting my children.

Any additional ideas would be appreciated.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
heartbroken_kk
♀ Member
Member # 22722
Default  Posted: 4:31 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just a thought regarding purging and cleaning and coming across her crap. A friend of mine used craigslist to post a help wanted ad in the GIGS section for a few tasks that she just could NOT deal with emotionally. Stuff she put off, put off, piled up, etc.

For $10 an hour, you can get someone to come and take all that stuff to the copy shop, make copies, put the copies in an envelope, address and send to lawyer, put the originals in an envelope, and give back to you.


BW then 46, STBXWHNPDPAFTG the destroyer of my entire life.
D-Day 1 1999, D-Day 2,3,4,5,6... 2009 thru 2011.

Separated, divorcing, moving on.
I edit because I always make typos.


Posts: 1221 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: California
CheaterMagnet
♀ Member
Member # 33581
Default  Posted: 4:40 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

AD, you're getting there! Thank you for continuing to post and share your story. I gain so much strength from your story. I know that sounds weird, but I truly do. It helps me gain clarity with my own situation and I have moments where it just smacks me! If you want so badly for AD to behave a certain way or take a certain step, why do you not want the same for yourself???

We'll keep holding each other up til the end of the road.


If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

Posts: 1038 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Kailua-Kona, HI
gonnabe2016
♀ Member
Member # 34823
Default  Posted: 5:25 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Awesome and extremely helpful post, DM.

And:

You offer your optimal (or close to it). She will counter with something stupid


"Oh, what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive." - Sir Walter Scott

In my effort to be *concise*, I often come off as blunt and harsh. Sorry, don't mean to be offensive.


Posts: 8114 | Registered: Feb 2012 | From: Midwest
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 6:13 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi,

Turns out cleaning out the home alone is not the cathartic, cleansing, purging experience I thought it would be. Or maybe it is, but I don't consciously realize it:

Worse than the few scraps of lame love letters from the POS, I've found scores of cards and notes from her to me and from me to her.

Excruciatingly painful to read. But I cannot stop. They span every year of our marriage and every event: birthdays, anniversaries, Valentines Days, Father's Days, Mother's Days...

The painful ones are those from her to me, for they contradict everything in her marital rewrites: she details lovingly every wonderful trait I possess, how profoundly lucky she knows she is, just everything. On and on and on. The most wonderful, loving, supportive husband she could have wished for...

Worst of all: "I am so happy to know it is you I will spend the rest of my life with..."

Of course I am a pathetic sobbing and angry wreck now. I know that cards don't tell the entire tale, and our relationship wasn't shangri la every day, but the deep love was always there. And in this case there in black-and-white, irrefutable.

Irrational, I guess, but every card, letter, and note I come across, I keep thinking, "Exhibit A, B, C...So much for your claims of such unhappiness that I drove you to your crimes..."

I better stop foraging, huh? Give myself a break?


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 7:24 PM, August 8th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

2. If it isn't a set schedule, I mean, she will be home to have them EVERY Wed and Thurs nights, if her schedule is variable and she will be here some Wednesdays, but not others and she would expect the 50/50 to work around her schedule, that's really not good for the kids. If it's going to be this week Mon Tues she is home, then next week Mon Thurs, and the week after Tuesday only....that's a pain for the kids especially when school starts. They need to know where they are each night, not it's always variable.

Thank you, DM. This is likely the scenario with regard to her job. It already has been. And as you observe, this is not good for the kids, who have suffered enough from her erratic schedules and abrupt changes. (To say nothing of her unpredictable actions.) They MUST know where they will be, and when. I will keep all your advice close to me when negotiating.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
LifeIsBroken
♀ Member
Member # 27071
Default  Posted: 12:10 AM, August 9th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Two things:
1. Fortunately, I had kept cards from now-xh and our daughters through the years and had even dated the year of the receipt. When we went to court and my now-xh testified how terrified of me he had been during the last 10 yrs of our 35 yr M, so afraid that he had feared for his life, my L dragged out a stack of anniversary cards along with valentines & birthday cards, and asked my x to read them into the record.... x's lawyer stipulated when x was reading card #6 or #7, saying, "We all get the drift of the cards...." Give the cards AND the love notes to your L, especially if they are dated.
2. Subpoena the OM to testify as to time spent with your WW during your M, pointing out that meant WW wasn't spending those times parenting her children. I subpoenaed the bimbo for her testimony as to money xh spent on her during our M. She lied 99% of the time and was caught 99% of the time. But, the best part of her testimony? It showed me how stupid she is. It showed me how much she looks like a horse. It showed me how f'd up my xh was to value THAT over me and our daughters. Her appearance and testimony in court was the best 'medicine' I could get. We got the best years; she gets the lying, cheating, caretaking years.
You can do this; just think with your head and not with your heart.


BW: 59
XH: 60
Married 34 yrs, LIBerated: 2/17/11
MOW: 50 (she said she wanted a sugar daddy; xh said, "I'M HIM!")
Actions ALWAYS have consequences. Too bad cheaters don't consider the consequences BEFORE they create so much damage.

Posts: 513 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Missouri & Massachusetts
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 12:51 AM, August 9th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

^^^^Great advice. Especially as it as it relates to the OM. She exposed your children to him when? Was she aware that DS knew this was the AP and had seen the porn she had sent to him?

Stay strong.

Doing good.


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 3035 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
FaithFool
♀ Member
Member # 20150
Default  Posted: 7:11 AM, August 9th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((AD))) I came across that pile of cards also. It was very difficult to read them.

Not having to keep them for 'evidence', I bundled them up and gave them all back to him.

I didn't need to carry them around anymore.

Big hugs. You're doing great.


DDay: June 15, 2008
Mistakenly married Mr. Superfreak
20 years of OWs, WTF?
Divorced Dec 26, 2011
"Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget
to sing in the lifeboats". -- Voltaire

Posts: 17591 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
homewrecked2011
♀ Member
Member # 34678
Default  Posted: 10:28 PM, August 9th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am realizing that my atty wasn't good. I never knew I could have subpoenaed the OW and her husband (who still doesn't believe me about the affair).


Keep Calm and Happy On!

me BS 52
him - 46
married 15 years DIVORCED 10 31 12
children - ds15 ds12
d-day 12-19-11
I gave a 24hour ultimatum then went to attorney next day
Divorce filed


Posts: 2256 | Registered: Jan 2012
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 6:04 AM, August 10th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would love to have the POS subpoenaed. His career is everything to him (psychiatric nursing if you can believe it) and it would likely be affected. Plus he spent at least a might in jail in the past, so that might be relevant.

Oh, and BTW: less than twenty four hours after collapsing in tears reading those cards? I was pretty fine and still am. Months ago it would have torn me up for weeks and sent me back to the "See, you did love me, please come back" stage.

I'm continuing to improve, I am so relieved to report.

[This message edited by Abbondad at 6:07 AM, August 10th (Saturday)]


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
PurpleRose
♀ Member
Member # 33129
Default  Posted: 12:27 PM, August 10th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I recently moved out of our marital home (that I was determined to stay in, like you are AD).. And also came across cards and love notes.

Twenty years worth of him saying how happy he was with me, how much he loved me, what a lucky husband he was, etc.. And I also have the ones from me to him, also professing my love for him! He has told anyone who will listen that he was unhappy for 20 years, that I didn't express love, I never truly loved him, blah blah blah.

How sad. Clearly his delusion runs deep. And the pain those letters created was deep and real. I needed to cleanse myself of all that, though, so it was pretty therapeutic. I was advised to keep them in a safe place for trial, and I really thought we were headed there.

So hang onto them, you may need them down the line. But put them away and don't get sucked into what was- that is gone now.


divorced the Dooosh
*****************************
even if you find your voice,
sometimes it does not matter anymore,
when you speak to a man who is deaf by choice.
~dodinsky

Posts: 3618 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: Happyville
LifeIsBroken
♀ Member
Member # 27071
Default  Posted: 12:56 PM, August 10th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Actually, it wasn't my lawyer who suggested a subpoena to the bimbo; it was law enforcement friends who suggested it. Male police officers and detectives who have seen way too much during their careers. When I told my atty I wanted to her called to testify, he justified it as a way to demonstrate the amount of our money xh had spent on her. And the other included questions to her as they related to the affair along with her naked photos (some taken by my xh, others were sent from her to him)? They were just icing on the cake. As I said, her court appearance was at the top of the list of smart things to do for divorce court. If more affair partners were required to testify, maybe - MAYBE - they would think twice before getting involved with other marrieds.

Again, Abbondad.... your ws's AP could be subpoenaed to testify as to the amount of time she spent with him rather than parenting her children. And any photos you may have in your possession ? Use them in court. Oh, you say, I cannot embarrass her like that. Really ? She wasn't much embarrassed or ashamed over screwing a man who was not her husband. So why should naked pics embarrass her?


BW: 59
XH: 60
Married 34 yrs, LIBerated: 2/17/11
MOW: 50 (she said she wanted a sugar daddy; xh said, "I'M HIM!")
Actions ALWAYS have consequences. Too bad cheaters don't consider the consequences BEFORE they create so much damage.

Posts: 513 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Missouri & Massachusetts
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 10:19 AM, August 12th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, Everyone,

This morning (very early, as I was still sleeping) my STBXWW dropped off the children. She was supposed to simply send them inside.

She came into the bedroom with them and proceeded to recline on the bed with our dogs (me next to her)--not looking at me the whole time.

I didn't say anything to her in the moment, as the kids were in bed with me--one big happy family.

Naturally I am very upset and angry. I just texted her to respect my boundaries and never do that again.

I am now very emotional and feel like she's kicked me back in time. She has no sense of empathy at all. She got her narcissistic supply and left.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1649 | Registered: Dec 2012
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, August 12th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just texted her to respect my boundaries and never do that again.

Huzzah!

She has no sense of empathy at all. She got her narcissistic supply and left.
Nailed it! She only cares about herself. You see her games for what they are. Any attempt to talk or act all "family" with you is about her.

It's great that you not only told her to respect your boundaries, but how you did it. No personal confrontations, just a simple text.


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 4007 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 10:38 AM, August 12th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Next time make sure you are up..and meet her at the door. Why does she still have a key? Considering how untrustworthy she is,the last thing you want is for her to have a key to your house. Change the locks.


BS(me)42
FWH 45
4 kids
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Reconciling?

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7756 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
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