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Divorce/Separation     Print Topic    
User Topic: Abbondad Part 4...
heartbroken_kk
♀ Member
Member # 22722
Default  Posted: 6:10 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I suggest you stop delivering the children. The parent who is receiving them should go and get them. That way if the recipient is a flake, the children are not uprooted from their activities, put in a car and driven somewhere where the other parent may or may not actually be present, or ready to accept them.

I also suggest that you state that you will give her a 30 minute window after the specified pick up time to pick them up, and if she doesn't show by the end of 30 minutes, you will make alternate plans and ASSUME she will be unable to take the children AT ALL for this trade off, and that the next time you see her will be for her NEXT trade off time, not some ambiguous random time whenever she feels like yanking your chain to finally come and get them.

Stop setting yourself up for her to ignore your requests for confirmation. Stop delivering the kids.

Tell her "because you do not respond to me when I ask for confirmation of trade off time, I am now going to operate in such a way that I will not be left hanging wondering what is going on. In particular, I am no longer going to deliver the kids to you. If you want time with them you will have to come and get them. "

Also, I suggest you use a google SPREADSHEET to arrange the children's schedule. When you share a google calendar, and give the other person permission to edit the calendar, they can change events - AFTER THE FACT and it leaves no record. Google's spreadsheet functions allow you to see who edited the spreadsheet and at what time, and what they changed in the FILE HISTORY. Using a spreadsheet makes it impossible for her to falsify the record without leaving tracks.


BW then 46, STBXWHNPDPAFTG the destroyer of my entire life.
D-Day 1 1999, D-Day 2,3,4,5,6... 2009 thru 2011.

Separated, divorcing, moving on.
I edit because I always make typos.


Posts: 1121 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: California
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 6:26 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for the specific and general advice. I feel like I am floundering here. Feeling a bit overwhelmed.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 6:35 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I suggest you stop delivering the children. The parent who is receiving them should go and get them.

Not intended as a criticism Heartbroken--thank you so much for your detailed response--but this is a good example of why I am feeling confused and overwhelmed at this stage. (I hope this stage will pass!:-)

I am taking an online parenting course as required by the court. In it it says just the OPPOSITE, Heartbroken--that the parent whose custody is ending should drop off the children at the receiving parent's domicile.

Their rationale is to avoid the child feeling like he is being "taken away" by the other parent.

Sigh.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
DeadMumWalking
♀ Member
Member # 25341
Default  Posted: 6:36 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

First, you are doing a good job trying to navigate all the bullshit.

However:

Should this prove to be unacceptable for you, I will inform my attorney that you are not able to handle the children even 50 percent of the time as your actions are stating.

Quit telling her what you are going to discuss with your L. Just let your L act for you. (Sure, go ahead and tell your L all of this stuff - just STOP giving the heads up to WW.)

Overnights are what counts for CS and custody. If she is supposed to have them for THE DAY - a WEEKEND DAY at that - then she should be getting them in the morning. NOT at the END of the day, where she will get 'credit' for the overnight but didn't actually do any of the PARENTING.

Hang in there AD and keep documenting. Don't ask her open-ended questions, just tell her how it is. Like: the children will be ready at 9.00, if you are not here to pick them up by 9.15 (or whatever time you decide, someone else suggested 9.30) then I will assume you cannot take them this time. (And then make sure that you take the kids somewhere so that you are NOT HOME whenever she decides to stroll on by.)

Hang in there ((((AD))))


Me (BS), Him (WH): early 50's
3 DS: teens!!! :)
M: 24 (19 1/2 at Dday), Together 29
Dday: Dec 2008
re-separated (in-house), for good (??) <-- should really remove these, shouldn't I...

Posts: 2545 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: EU
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 6:38 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, if that be true, what is to stop children from feeling like the parent transporting them to the receiving parent isn't pushing them away?


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
DeadMumWalking
♀ Member
Member # 25341
Default  Posted: 6:40 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ETA: in light of your last comment, you could say that you will bring them to the tradeoff point at 9.00, and let her know that if she is not there by (whatever time) then you will be keeping them, etc...

You might also ask your L for advice on exactly how to handle this/what to say.


Me (BS), Him (WH): early 50's
3 DS: teens!!! :)
M: 24 (19 1/2 at Dday), Together 29
Dday: Dec 2008
re-separated (in-house), for good (??) <-- should really remove these, shouldn't I...

Posts: 2545 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: EU
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 6:49 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree with the last post AD, arrange a meeting place and speak to your lawyer about this. When my SAWH were divorced, he was so difficult that I had us meeting at the police station. She hasn't risen to that level yet but meeting them at a neutral spot and having a deadline, seems to follow all of your needs. You have a right to tell her that and might do better to have your attorney send that letter. Something about, since she is not showing up for drop off that this will be the new arrangement. This is why you have an attorney.

[This message edited by Missymomma at 6:49 PM, August 23rd (Friday)]


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 7:09 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks everyone. I guess my possible blunders and confusion are to be expected as I move into different stages of the "game." I am doing my best.


Overnights are what counts for CS and custody. If she is supposed to have them for THE DAY - a WEEKEND DAY at that - then she should be getting them in the morning. NOT at the END of the day, where she will get 'credit' for the overnight but didn't actually do any of the PARENTING.

Right! And this is exactly what she has been doing. As for tomorrow night: she is dropping him at his friend's for a sleepover at 7:00! So she won't even BE with him AT ALL that night.

I am just sick to death of being the nice doormat, always always kowtowing to her dictates. I want her to know I mean business and her days of driving this bus are over.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
momentintime
♀ Member
Member # 16394
Default  Posted: 7:22 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you are sick of it stop playing.

Send her a text telling her what time you are dropping off the kids. If it doesn't work for her, then she needs to respond, and you will have a record of her putting off the children. She doesn't need to know what you plan to do if she doesn't comply. Just keep your L apprised and forget about trying to work WITH her. You know from repeated smack downs she doesn't play fair.

You truly have to stop thinking with kindness towards her, hoping she will reciprocate. Never gonna happen.

[This message edited by momentintime at 7:23 PM, August 23rd (Friday)]


BS-me FWS - him
D-day 8/04
R'd

"Global editing disclaimer - I edit almost everything I post, and I am not going to post why every time."...re: Bionical girl


Posts: 2940 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: New York
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 7:41 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am just sick to death of being the nice doormat, always always kowtowing to her dictates. I want her to know I mean business and her days of driving this bus are over

Then stop the codependent behavior! Expect that when you stand your ground she is going to give you alot of "flack" because she wants the doormat back. Really, a lawyer can help you set down alot of ground rules. You are not going to be able to coparent with her but do lateral parenting. Forget this happy divorce dream that you seem to be holding onto. She is NOT that woman.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
Nature_Girl
♀ Member
Member # 32554
Default  Posted: 9:14 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I forget. Have you read Codependent No More and The New Codependent, both by Melody Beattie? If you haven't I implore you to read them ASAP. You need help finding your inner strength. Melody Beattie changed my life. I think she can change yours.


Me = BS (Stay-at-home-mom)
Him = EX-d out (abusive troglodyte NPD SA)
3 tween-aged kids
Together 20 years
D-Day: Memorial Weekend 2011
2013 - I DIVORCED HIM, I'M FREE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBOJpIwF47Y

Posts: 9505 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: USA
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 10:41 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

K, this is strictly from the custody battle end of things. Up to and until things are decided, you are a *doormat*. You are the reasonable parent willing to work through whatever bullshit she throws at you, right up til you are not the 60% parent. I fully realize how that sounds. It sucks.

*Your Honor, in order to accommodate her work schedule I....*. Holding her to her *schedule* and not being accommodating to her work schedule will not work in your favor.

Here's the *game*. It's a fine line.

Ask your lawyer for specifics. She seems to be on the ball!


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2715 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 10:46 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I do not agree with that 5454. He needs to show that she isn't doing 50/50 for custody. This is really a discussion you need to have with your attorney. If he tells you to let her do whatever she wants and just document it, then do that. If he says to show that she can't take care of them 50/50, then do that. Alot depends on the actual Judge you get. The attorney should know the Judge and what they look for. PLEASE SPEAK TO YOUR ATTORNEY.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 11:28 PM, August 23rd (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Missy, I think we actually agree. Over and over she wants AD to *pick up the slack* where she has a work conflict. I'm suggesting that he agrees to those proposals as long as he is still providing the majority of the parenting. *Give her enough rope...*

So far, the schedule has been working. AD has been providing a majority of the parenting. If he appears(and in reality is) willing to work with her schedule, what incentive would a judge have to change it?

But, absolutely brother, talk to your shark!

ETA Maybe I am misinterpreting AD, but I thought he was/is providing a majority of the parenting.

[This message edited by 5454real at 11:31 PM, August 23rd (Friday)]


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2715 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 7:24 AM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Maybe I am misinterpreting AD, but I thought he was/is providing a majority of the parenting.

Indeed I am, and always have. My job has always allowed me to be with them from 2:00 PM on, Monday through Friday.

The problem now is that she is taking advantage of the "overnight technicality." For example today she is "shaving" her time with them so it's as close to what is considered an over night as possible. But the reality is that she will be spending very little time with them.

This past week is a typical week:

I have had them since Tuesday at 2:00. She will have them from 4:00 today until Monday 7:00 AM.

Clearly this is not 50/50 parenting.

But to return to the "strategy," using today as the example:

do I accede to her dictate that she will get them at 4:00 (thus being a doormat) thereby "giving her rope," step back and document?

Or do I fight it (giving up doormat status) and tell her that because she did not confirm the morning time, she doesn't get the kids?

Oh, and I didn't mention: she told the kids on the phone that she would see them at 4:00 today. She hadn't even conferred with me on any time! So my son asked me, "When am I seeing mommy?"

I said, without knowing she'd told him 4:00, "In the morning."

So naturally he was agitated and confused.

This is,what I am dealing with. She circumvents me and dictates "in reverse" co parenting schedule.

I have emailed my lawyer. Haven't heard back.

Thank you!


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 8:55 AM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I forget. Have you read Codependent No More and The New Codependent, both by Melody Beattie? If you haven't I implore you to read them ASAP. You need help finding your inner strength. Melody Beattie changed my life. I think she can change yours.

Thank you, Naturegirl. I did read CNM and it did help give me the strength to finally file. Breaking away from codependent behavior is a process and I have come a long way. I am finding it easier to recognize my patterns as they emerge in different situations.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 10:03 AM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't understand why you have to be a doormat in this. She repeatedly proves to be unreliable. Document the exchange she had with your son, an his confusion. That's the stuff that matters.
I don't know why she would still get them at 4 when you asked her to confirm and drew your line in the sand. I would tell her she missed her chance the kids have other plans. From this point forward have a set time for pick up/ drop off. Confirm 24 hours in advance and any variance from that she does not get them. Period. It is a business transaction just like a dr appt they confirm 24-48 hours in advance you don't make it you don't get seen. Make a new appt. not show up when it's convient for you and expect them to see you then.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8218 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 1:28 PM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Not so much a doormat as the, accommodating, responsible, reasonable parent. Don't really think it would be advisable(legal standpoint) to withhold visitation.

Send an E-mail telling her that you are not pleased that she is using the children for communication. You would appreciate her communicating directly with you so that the children are not placed in the middle.


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2715 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Send an E-mail telling her that you are not pleased that she is using the children for communication. You would appreciate her communicating directly with you so that the children are not placed in the middle.

Exactly what I did earlier today. No response. She is coming at 4:00--doing whatever she wants to do, as always. I have emailed my attorney asking for temporary orders. This cannot continue.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1586 | Registered: Dec 2012
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 2:51 PM, August 24th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Actually...it's great that she's pulling this shit NOW AD. She wants 50/50, but clearly is not capable of having them 50% of the time. So..it's great that she is pulling this shit BEFORE court..it helps your case immensely.

It sucks now..but keep your goal in sight..you want them more than 50% of the time..because you ARE the better parent..that is very clear to everyone here. They are more stable and better cared for when they are with you. They are happier when they are with you. Im not saying she's a shitty parent..no really... ...or that they don't love her or want to see her..they do..she's their mom. But they want to be with you. And her actions are going to make that happen. Keep your chin up...you are doing great!


BS(me)41
FWH 45
4 kids..21,20,11,9
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Happily Reconciled.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7308 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
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