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User Topic: details get them or not
♀ Member
Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 6:51 AM, August 4th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For me, the more FWH lied, trickled, minimuzed and half truthed, the more stuff didn't make sense, the more I asked the liar for more truth(???) to cross examine, to understand, to go crazy.

Also, back then, I also got a little bee in my bonnet that I wanted him to toally betray her like he had me, so I had to have everything.

Had the idea, too, of how can I forgive what I don't know, what you don't ask to be forgiven for? How do e build on a weak foundation? How about after all the trickle-truth we get it all out there so there are no more suprises?

How would I know he exorcised all of the demons if I didn't know the demons were there?

Not to say any or all of those are good or apply to you, but for some of us, we just need (or think we need) to know everything..

BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)

Posts: 3629 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
♀ Member
Member # 40060
Default  Posted: 2:09 PM, August 4th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I appreciate all your advice and welcome them.

I don't have mind movies,and if I get specific details I probably would end up w/mind movies. I don't want them.

We had a great day yesterday. He took our child to swimming lessons, I took a bike ride by myself. After that we went for a swim at our clubhouse.

After that we went out on a friends sailboat. It was nice even though I did get a little sea sick. The ride home I started thinking about the betrayal and stuff. He reached ove and grabbed by hand and held it. I couldn't really look at him.

We didn't talk much in bed, just went to sleep. He had to be to work early this morning.

I have written down questions to ask and they are somewhat general, no sexual questions cause I really don't want to know that. It already bothers me to think he gave someone else what he gave me when we got married and vowed to be there sickness/health, better/worse. That's what kills me.

I did snoop a little on his phone and found a msg to a girl who he used to work with that he stays in contact with. It said something about "so you don't want to b friends anymore?" I don't understand why he would care. He says she irritates him that he almost can't be friends with her. She is married, I know her and she has 5 kids of her own and 2 she has legal guardianship over. (a family members children)

It makes me think maybe there was something more.

She is pretty hot lookin, no too pretty in the face but rocking bod. However she abuses the systems and out of the 3yrs she worked at his company she probably only showed up 6mo, otherwise it was all medical/FMLA issues which are a bunch of crap. She doesn't want to work.

The only time we really have alone to talk is in bed at night.

I guess we need to find a sitter and go somewhere to talk things out.

I can't wait anylonger.
I need some basic timeline questions answered.

If you don't want me at my worst, maybe I won't need you at my best.
DDAY 1 - not sure but it was July, Aug or Sept 2010 (supposed bj from hooker)
DDAY 2 - 7-22-2013 she was the made up hooker

Posts: 99 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: IL
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Member # 39667
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, August 4th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have not been through the full disclosure process yet...I am told it is coming eventually (SAWH is entering his 6th week of therapy). I know some of the details - when it started, how long he was seeing her after I confronted him (both of these were things he danced around full explanation at first). I have done a fair amount of snooping, too, and the more I find out (from looking at his old cell phone, etc.) and the more info I have (texts, glimpses into how he felt about her or at least told her how he felt about her) it just makes me more upset. For me, I'd rather not know all of the details. Timeline is important but I don't want to know anything about sex acts or when the first time they had sex was or anything like that. I just don't see the point.

BS - mid-40's
SAWH - mid 40's
Kids - 2 elementary school aged
Getting tons of therapy and trying to "work it out"

Posts: 910 | Registered: Jun 2013
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Member # 38391
Default  Posted: 5:41 PM, August 4th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If/when we start mc I don't want to discuss that. I want to discuss how we can move forward.

I think that's perfectly fine. There are lots of things I asked about that now I wish I didn't know.

However, I'm not so sure you should ignore the big elephant in the room altogether in MC. Maybe discuss it in a broader sense without getting into the gory details??

D-Day 11/15/12
5 month PA
Married 20 years, 3 kids
All good is hard. All evil is easy. Dying, losing, cheating, and mediocrity is easy. Stay away from easy.
- Scott Alexander
It was the day I thought I'd never get through - Daughtry

Posts: 1083 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: FL
♀ Member
Member # 40060
Wink  Posted: 10:22 PM, August 5th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I got basic time line details. No sexual details. Don't need them.
He wasn't placing blame on someone else but did say a guy he worked with @ time was pushing him on her. Well come to find out (he's slow to catch on) this guy was baiting him to see if she would do anything with him because this guy was havin A with her at the time.
He did break it off in the beginning but she supposedly lured him back in. They haven't been sexual since April. Said it has been more like friends & oddly enough (his words) they mostly talked about family & the children.
He still doesn't fully get that I am the victim not him.
We are trying to get through this. It will take time & he seems very forthcoming although I still feel something is not right. I also found out he was flirting with another girl he worked with... she is someone I know. Pisses me off. Her & I were pregnant @ same time & she was @ my baby shower.
Gotta get sleep.
Thanks for the support.

If you don't want me at my worst, maybe I won't need you at my best.
DDAY 1 - not sure but it was July, Aug or Sept 2010 (supposed bj from hooker)
DDAY 2 - 7-22-2013 she was the made up hooker

Posts: 99 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: IL
♀ Member
Member # 40144
Default  Posted: 3:12 PM, August 6th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really appreciate the multiple points of view. For a while, it seemed that everyone argued for full detailed disclosure. I've struggled enough with what I already know. I've asked him to keep the door open to more questions and to answer them honestly, but with compassion in the wording. I am 6 months out and the mind movies are still horrible and play almost every moment of the day. I am not convinced that more detail will help in any way.

I guess the bottom line is ask what you think you really need and want to know. My MC/IC suggests not asking questions whose answers don't further the healing process. That seems very logical to me, but obviously is at odds with what many people on this site will say. For the time being, I will follow my gut and try not to ask him to thrust the knife any deeper!!!! He has answered my questions openly and honestly thus far -- other than TT the first week on how long it had been going on. I think it was his shame that wanted to minimize the length, but he corrected that lie quickly.

Each person is different and handles this trauma in a unique and individual way. I firmly believe there is no right or wrong. Figure out what YOU need and ASK for it! That's my strategy!

Me: 40s BS, Him: 40s WH
M 21 yrs - 3 teens
LTA = 2+ yrs, Dday = 2/10/13, he moved out, he officially moved back in 1/25/14 and our work continues...

Posts: 710 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: MidWest
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Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 4:00 PM, August 6th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


I am sorry you are here but it is a good place to be.

Follow your own path. Seek the information you need.

Be careful of rushing toward reconciliation though.

I tried so long to do it alone and on my own. I was bound and determined to be stronger than "this" - well "this" kicked my ass and then some.

Take it day by day. But if your husband is not getting what he has done and that you truly ARE the victim, that worries me.

His chats and wanting to be friends with any other women, especially right now, is a sign he is not truly remorseful. Regretful, probably. Remorseful no. (((sorry)))

With regards to knowing all the information. That is up to you.

I have two POV's on this (for what it is worth)

1. I don't believe anyone ever knows all the details. No matter how much we probe, cry, kick and scream. The WS is not capable of revealing everything. It's not so much about trickle truth as it is about self preservation. So even if someone says they know everything they can't.

How many thoughts do you have that you never share? How many conversations might you have had that you don't remember every detail?

There are things we, the BS, will simply never know. That is something we have to accept.

2. Once you know something you can unknow it.
So many people know when they know enough. And if that is where you are then that is okay.

You have had a double betrayal because you knew the AP. That is double the hurt.

Does the OW's husband know? Something to think about.

I know you are hurting so please take care of YOU right now. However you need to do that.

Pray for God's guidance. I am assuming from your title you have faith in your life. Trust in Him to guide your path.

It is long and hard but you will be okay. You matter and many care for you.

(((hugs and prayers)))

"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1182 | Registered: Apr 2013
♀ Member
Member # 40060
Default  Posted: 8:44 PM, August 6th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

@ 1Faith - the OW was not someone I know.

The someone I know is a girl he worked with that he flirted with. I asked him if anything happened between them because I know they talked/texted/facebooked alot. He said they just flirted. I know her and her husband and kids. SMH - she's piece of garbage in the respect she manipulates all systems.

As far as getting details. I asked what I needed to know. I don't need the physical stuff. He answered all questions without hesitation. The last time they were physical was in April. He said from there they just had lunch together and talked. It was more like they were friends (she was already seeing another guy at work) I asked what they talked about and he said "oddly enough family, her kids, our child".

He would tell me all details if I asked. I know he would, he's never held back on details of past physical relationships prior to me. I never asked talked about them to me like I was a guy friend. SMH

I need to set boundaries and make a list of things he can do to help me through this if he wants this to work as he says he does.

It's up to him to do them. I can only keep working on myself as a whole person.

Lots of love, hugs and prayers to you all.

[This message edited by heathenchristian at 8:56 PM, August 6th (Tuesday)]

If you don't want me at my worst, maybe I won't need you at my best.
DDAY 1 - not sure but it was July, Aug or Sept 2010 (supposed bj from hooker)
DDAY 2 - 7-22-2013 she was the made up hooker

Posts: 99 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: IL
♀ Member
Member # 40208
Default  Posted: 10:10 PM, August 6th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have to have all the details. A small trigger will bring about a bunch of new questions. Some I've already asked. I need everything so I can visualize and accept it I think. I can't accept something I don't understand. It's not pretty, but in my WH's case he said the sex was lousy. So at least he didn't say it was fantastic. I don't think he was sugarcoating either. He said it was hollow and the fog was listing after the first sex act. Anyway, for me I am still not done asking questions. He has gotten defensive at times, but I read him some stuff from here and how it's so important for BS to get the whole story because we weren't there. Another woman was touching him and kissing him. I need to know how it felt and everything to him. Some answers I are hard to take, but mostly I get comfort in just knowing.

BS (me) - 44
WH - 46
DD - July 1, 2013
2 daughters, 14 and 10

Posts: 102 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Southwest
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