I had a RA This is something H is unaware of. I am aware that many people are against it, but I have to say that it helped me immensely. My self esteem had been shattered by H's EA. H was not there for me the way I needed emotionally.
Been sitting here trying to think of something to say, but I think the best thing is for you to take that over to the WS forum and run it through the heavy duty cycle.
me (WW/BS): 48
4 kiddos in mid 20's
The conditions we face do not define us. They remind us of who we are and who we want to be.
When we were in MC the guy said that if I had an RA it wouldn't have the same shock value and hurt wh because he would be expecting it.
I had this very thought. When I was in the phase where thoughts like this were crossing my mind, this is the biggest reason that I never seriously considered it.
One of the most horrible things about the A to me was that I was completely blindsided. This would not blindside him after what happened. Also, I've agonized so much over "why". Well, he would know exactly why.
Correct or not, that was the thought process that kept me from pursuing anything. That and the fact that I've never been into casual sex, so it honestly didn't even sound very appealing.
I wish I could say that I am just so together that I never considered it. But I did and the reason I didn't actually end up doing it was not very altruistic.
I had a RA This is something H is unaware of
Again, how can this be revenge?
"to inflict hurt or harm on someone for a wrong suffered at their hands"
He doesn't know. You do, though. You're the only one that does know.
Sounds more like a HA. Hypocritical Affair.
I think people have different views on infidelity. Some people do believe that there are valid reasons. We see that here. Hell, there's even a difference in what some view as cheating.
If ones view is infidelity is ok in certain circumstances I'd think that would certainly limit how one would react as a victim. If you had "good" reasons why wouldn't he? Or are you the only one that can determine if they're valid or not...for you and everyone else.
You say it wasn't really an RA yet you continue to call it that through your post.
The work you and your husband have ahead hasn't even started. He has no knowledge of his reality. All work you do is artificial as you are the sole control of that reality. You know, kinda still like in an affair.
'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth
I really wanted fWH to feel and hurt just as badly as I did. He is the only person I have ever been with sexually - and I have just felt (and still do feel) like boo-boo the god damn fool for being faithful and having other partners ever - even before we were married and were apart from each other at college. I've recently learned that he slept with "one or two" people during that time. Which was years and years ago, but still hurts like hell.
But the truth is, in our situation what would probably hurt him more than a RA would be leaving him because of what he did and letting him know that I now plan to have a few other "experiences" myself without the betrayal.
R is going well, but this is still one of the things that I struggle with.
With regards to WS, I do believe that they would not be as hurt since they would likely not be surprised by it. Which I think is another form of disrespect from WS, since they often are eager to bring the BS down to their level of immorality. After DDay#1, my WW brought the concept of "Free Passes" and said that she would forgive me if I had an affair. At that time we seemed to be doing well with R, but I was still dealing with some issues of emotional pain. One of the ways that I deal with pain is to become sarcastic. Normally, my sarcasm is directed at myself; but in this instance I fired back at her saying that considering she had 5 separate affairs with 2 of them LTA that I get 5 free passes and that 2 of them could be LTA. She and I both had a good laugh with that.
Fast forward to DDay#3; she brings up the concept again with a little sarcasm by saying that I still only get 5 "free passes" even though she cheated again because it was with the same OM. This in my mind clearly indicates that she has no concept of the pain that she has caused to me both emotionally and psychologically. I replied to her by saying that I never have any intentions to cash in on the free passes since there is no such thing as a "free pass": everything comes with a price when all is said and done.
But I did fire back at her saying that if I did cash in, the total was now up to 7 because DDay#2 and DDay#3 had to be added even though it was with the same OM.
The point I am trying to make is that RA do one thing: they drag you into a moral hole in the ground from which there is no escape and you will take that with you through life whether its with your WS during R or with the next person that you wind up with. Even the first step on the slippery slope is the one that puts you in the hole. Every step after that just gets easier and easier. Better to not take that first step. Take the moral high ground instead. In the long run you will feel better about yourself.
Kidding- You helped me realize something, that I wanted to get caught, that my A was a scream out to my BH, he never listened to me pre-A and for a while after my A but I think he is listening more now. I don't know if he would have changed eventually sans A though?
Sunflowergirl- I think loss of respect for my H played a huge role, I didn't feel the same about him after his EA and the other stuff, but I didn't even think for a second that my actions would create a loss of respect for me, honestly I had no thoughts about the repercussions, until like right after and I was like WTF have I allowed to happen??!!
Unagie- I know what you mean, BH still denies his actions were EA because the girl didn't feel that way about him, but he had the intentions, he would go to her apt to hang out with her and he told me he wanted to bang her, and even went into detail how. I have told him to post all the details of the EA and let others judge but he won't do it, he knows I'm right, he refuses to ever see how much he hurt his sweet 20 y.y. bride and mother of his 2nd child for a chain smoking, loser, video game playing wife of his best friend. She ended up cheating on that guy btw and he left her ass!
VD we all (well not all) acknowledge that we made bad choices because we are fucked up individuals, but this site is to help us discover ourselves and why we acted how we did. I can tell you that I have been jotting notes down about myself in relation to and through the advice and life stories of others here. I have been intimidated on this site before, but thats not right we need to ask questions to grow and learn. That said, I hope it reaches those who are afraid to ask questions because they may be berated on SI, I hope that the rest of us can ask the right questions for them.
UO- If you had "good" reasons why wouldn't he? Or are you the only one that can determine if they're valid or not...for you and everyone else.
First time you have made sense to me! That is a good thing to think about, very humbling.
2002/3 (him) EA
Tog. 14 yrs, Marr. 13 and counting!
But my boundaries were instinctual, immediate and steadfast. Refused rink etc and told wh.
Was told "oh it happened because you wore a shorter dress then usual."
Not because I'm sexy or anything right?!
so tbh part of me wished I had . My wh imagines fucking girls who walk down the street, points out I no longer have a model body (I'm hardly fat)
Oh me... Well I'm just 'beautiful' and 'pretty'
So fuck I still feel entitled to an RA, but that doesn't mean I have plans to do so or would do it.
And I don't apologise for it either
I am a madhatter. My cheating happened after each of my partners' (two different MH relationships). I don't call it a "revenge affair", for the reason before that I don't blame them even remotely for my horrible choices, and for two because I didn't do it because I wanted to hurt them. I did it because I was selfish. In the second case, I was doing it specifically to hurt myself. Stupid choices, because it did hurt my H along with myself and could have hurt him a lot worse if he saw it as cheating. He doesn't consider what either of us have done as cheating because there was no physical - though there are times I wonder if he did do something physical and lied about it.
While I'm glad my H says he's not in pain, I'm very ashamed of what I did. Calling it an RA would have been a way to try (unsuccessfully) to dilute the shame, to try to put some of the blame or responsibility on someone else. No one else is responsible.
[This message edited by silverhopes at 5:27 PM, August 19th (Monday)]
I only believe in fucked up people making fucked up choices. You don't get to blame it on your spouse any more than I get to blame it on my fucked up childhood.
1) I wouldn't be doing it for my gain; it would simply be to hurt WH.
2) It's never right, no matter which angle you look at it, for a married man/woman to cheat on their spouse. Plain and simple.
3) I DON'T WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH ANY OTHER MAN THAN MY HUSBAND.
"One is not tempted by that he does not want."
Didn't phase him at all.
I don't think he cares that other men could be/are interested in over-stepping his line, because either he 1) doesn't think I'm worth their time or 2) takes my loyalty for granted.
I was VERY tempted to take myself out for a wine and dine just so I could prove to him that I am perfectly capable of attracting attention outside of our marriage.
But I didn't.
And that's where we differ.
He was willing to risk it all for superficial satisfaction.
I'm deeply rooted and couldn't imagine putting it all on the line.
I want his attention. I want him to wine and dine me. I want him to flirt with me.
While he was out "taking care" of his "needs", mine were neglected, and I can't ever fathom causing the same pain to someone I love so much.
It never entered my mind, really, to have a revenge A, except for in the same way that it entered my mind to run over my H with a tractor (wouldn't do that either, but thought about it). It's not who I am, it's not how I solve problems. I already see plain as day in my own home that it does not work.
I think the reason that people don't tell is because they don't actually want the person to feel the pain of being betrayed... The WS would have maybe had to be a person for whom betrayal was unimaginable in order for that to cause an equal devastation.
What they want is for the WS to be 'the fool' that they feel they were made to be. What they don't know makes them the fool and gives the BS/WS a sense of power after being humiliated.
Like any A, it's not about the OP, it's not about the sex... it's about what is broken in the person. I know I'm broken, but I can still look my H in the eyes and myself in the mirror. My H hates what he did, to me, to his children, to himself. He would never wish that kind of pain on me now.
What they don't know makes them the fool and gives the BS/WS a sense of power after being humiliated.
this. I truly believe that my husband's affairs had a little to do with restoring some sort of power balance in our relationship,among other things.
And the thought that not telling your spouse about the affair - well, I think it can still be revenge. Keeping something from someone is kinda like one upping them. It can be your own personal vendetta, knowing that you will always "have" something they don't know about and can chuckle under your breathe at them, knowing they don't know it all, do they, but you do!
it's like when you complain to a waiter that your food is cold, they send it back, he spits in it and you aren't any the wiser, but the waiter is.
I will NEVER tell H about it and I will never do it again but I can't deny it helped me.
Then you will NEVER have a fulfilling marriage. Secrets are to intimacy as Darkness is to light. They just cannot coexist.