how can she give a man who is cheating with HER marital advice? doesnt that seem sick to you guys?
Yes, and I can relate. OW #2 was a mutual friend. We both went to her to vent/talk when we were frustrated with each other. She would give me advice and him advice. She even kept our infant son one night so we could go out and 'work on our relationship'. She was sleeping with him the whole time. Sick sick sick!
also number 4 is very scary to me since as I said the OW was a type of dr and knows too much about certain personal issues concerning my husband that I suspect that she could report and take our kids away as well--or at least try to.
please give your H a wake -up call about that one! Oh my gosh that one makes me vomit for you!
its scary what these OW will do.
My MIL is a psychiatrist and is upset with me because she thinks I am trying to blame my SAWH's issues on his childhood. HELLO? Isn't a lot of pain that people experience and act out on rooted in childhood issues? Isn't that why psychiatrists and therapists ask about your family and childhood? Also, I suspect that she may have cheated on my H's father at some point.
The psychiatrist father of a friend of mine committed suicide after years of committing adultery with his patients! The wife never knew about any of the affairs until later in their marriage, and I think that is what prompted her to divorce. He had to surrender his license to the state medical board. The D - which he did not want - was about to become final and that is when he committed suicide.
The school psychologist girlfriend of one of my H's friends got pg so her boyfriend would stay with her.
Hey, I'm not perfectly mentally intact either but you have to admit some of these stories are whack. You would expect someone who IS a trained professional to conduct themselves in a healthy way. But then again, they are human too and make mistakes.
[This message edited by womaninflux at 2:27 PM, September 7th (Saturday)]
It wasn't long after that I changed my major. It was this same class that taught me that psychology isn't an exact science. So many symptoms overlap that diagnosis is often subjective and incorrect diagnosis is extremely possible. In fact, the entire class had to diagnose a patient and all but two of us diagnosed him incorrectly according to what the professor said was wrong with him. Even though my diagnosis was correct (according to her), I couldn't live with the possibility that a misdiagnosis screwed up someone's life.
My point is that the OW might be a psychotherapist and a psychopath all wrapped up in one neat little package. And she may also have no clue what she's talking about. If there is a way to report her, I'd do it. That way at least there is something on her record if she continues to behave this way. It may not save your husband this time around but it might just save someone else down the road.
She sounds like she might have some psychological problems herself. What problems she may have, are not your concern. Just know that she is not your friend, not trying to help you. I am sorry. =(
The ow in my case was also a professional-- in my case, she was a nurse that helped abused kids. She used her knowledge to manipulate my kids. It was really gross.
She also told me stuff after WH left her. My WH also is horrified that he had a relationship with her.
Your OW sounds like she might want to derail your R and get your husband back. I know my ow wanted to do that.
[This message edited by Gottagetthrough at 3:20 PM, September 7th (Saturday)]
This is typical of many AP actually (not all). They often bond over being armchair shrinks to each other. When they are in that mode they don't care that the person they are talking to is just as clueless about actual mental health as they are. What they are looking for is someone who will look at all the crap they spew and say it's not that bad. The type of person that can do that can do so because they have their own mound of crap they are hoping someone will shrug away. Then they don't have to do the work or even face their issues. Instead, it can be either dismissed or blame shifted onto someone else...like the BS.
I did call her licensing board but they would not take anonymous or phone complaints. WH would not participate in the complaint. I could have filed it myself, but the board would have sent H a subpeona and he was not going to willingly say anything bad about her. The licensing board did agree that even though WH was not her client, she violated several tenets of their code of ethics by using her training in her interactions with my husband. She had only been a counselor for 10 months and clearly didn't understand what boundaries she crossed.
I sent her my own NC letter. It had a copy of her states board ethics code enclosed. I highlighted the sections she had violated with the email evidence backing up the violations. I let her know I spoke with her board and they agreed that she was walking on very thin ground and that a complaint would be taken very seriously. She was trying to launch an online counseling service and a complaint would have been a big headache for her. I also sent her a copy of our states cyber harassment law, stating that she had been asked by both my husband and myself to never contact either of us again. It was clearly a threat to report her to both her state board and our local prosecutor if she made even a peep our way. Neither of us have heard a thing from her in 1 1/2 years so I guess it worked.
What bothers me though is she is out there with her special brand of crazy, counseling people on their relationships. She did launch her online counseling service and has opened an office. It just makes me sick. She is a sociopath that shouldn't be allowed to counsel anyone.
She used this as a way to get him to take her out to lunch so she could discuss what services she could offer. Since she was being so "nice" she offered help him and be his life coach for free and then later they went out to dinner and her place. When the therapist angle got boring, she started talking about the other things she knows like reiki, etc and offered those services for free too. Apparently, this woman bounces from one hobby to the next and thinks that one or two classes in something makes her an expert. Plus, I think she believes that pimping out these supposed "services" makes her attractive and she uses them as a bait.
It wasn't until late DDay and over the course of the next few days that he really started to put things together (and I did some research) that we discovered that she isn't a licensed therapist.
About a month before she paid for an online course to be a life coach and they gave her a certificate which she showed my H. But being a life coach doesn't give make a person qualified do what she was offering - giving marital advice to a troubled, addictive personality. And unfortunately there are no laws in place that require someone to be licensed or have specific training to say they are a life coach.
I honestly don't believe that my husband understood at first that a life coach isn't a actual "therapist" and that he had been duped.
I believe that the OW had it built up in her mind that she wanted my H and saw his marriage as an obstacle to getting what she wanted. It seems she took her own sales pitch to heart. On her website she basically states that her goal is to help her clients achieve their dreams and encourages them to do what it takes to get them so you will be happy. Apparently, there is no need to actually pick goals that are healthy or constructive nor is there any concern over whom you may hurt in the process of pursuing these goals.
Her supposed therapy basically consisted her telling my H over and over again that he needed to leave his wife (and given the fact that she is a therapist it must be true!) and that she would help him by letting him stay with her. The rest of the time they basically acted as though they were on dates.
Of course, once she got him into her home, the manipulations only escalated to a whole other level. Basically, she knew what buttons to push and minimized what his actions would do to his family or she changed the subject. She did everything she could to project this image of her being a therapist that he could trust and that she knew better than he.
Every time he hedged on something she would say that oh, no they wouldn't cross this particular boundary so it was okay but then the things that she said wouldn't occur, did happen.
At one point he said that she even admitted that she knew he was vulnerable and she feared she was taking advantage.
There was also a point where she said something and she said that probably shouldn't have said it because it was based on her her own feelings and she wasn't being objective. (As if her motivations weren't already clear by that point!)
My H and I went through Danger Sign check list at the Therapy Exploitation site at:
and checked off almost all of them and the few he didn't were basically because they didn't apply in his situation.
[This message edited by sable at 7:14 AM, September 8th (Sunday)]
It's awful to experience infidelity, but I think it's at least a little bit worse when one partner is a therapist who is supposedly trained in & committed to ethical and professional principles that make cheating an especially terrible act.
Do you know who certifies her? If she's an LCSW, for example, you could report her to the ethics committee of the NASW. I expect a similar body operates for Psychologists, LCPCs, etc.
Her threat alone is enough to file a complaint about, IMO. It would be an act of kindness (to her other and potential clients) to file, if you have the strength to do it. BTW, if you report her, her professional organization would probably offer her an opportunity to undergo therapy and regain full status.
Meanwhile, I agree - this is awful, so feeling awful about it is the right way to deal with it.
I'm really glad you're feeling better.
[This message edited by sisoon at 10:35 AM, September 8th (Sunday)]
[This message edited by naivewife at 4:29 PM, September 8th (Sunday)]
i have to stress that his affair partner was not his personal therapist on record. she was someone he met on a dating site.
i am not sure what can be done for what she does in her "personal life." i mean, even though she is a therapist, isnt she allowed to cheat on her boyfriend, and date married men?
i think the only thing i could do if anything would be to report her for the threat of taking my child. and i am not sure if i even want to go down that road since we have been nc for almost a year.
i will give that some serious thought.
the other thing that i dont want to do is put this all on her. they were both culpable. he sought her out online...and deliberately began an affair with her. she knew he was married and it didnt matter...so they both fooled me. but i blame my h for the cheating in the first place and for bringing this woman into our lives.
it is all on him. his responsibility. i blamed her in the beginning for a lot of this...i mean, since she knew he was married. but the botton line is that he didnt make her do anything. he didnt make her tell him his business, and betray his vows. she simply went after what she wanted...after his invitation....and used her skills as a therapist to get her to open up to him. but he is no fool. he opened up to her and shared all his business because he wanted to. he probably thought that it would make the affair so much more interesting...and easier to keep going and getting sex if he "connected" with her.
really, they are both messed up loses for what they did.
i guess it just hurts me deeply, that she does know so much...and that he did cross that line.
i bet he never thought in a million years that she would call/email me and tell me every detail of their relationship...and throw it in my face on how he confided in her.
but you know what guys....fuck her. and fuck him for what he did.
guess it is just another part of my shit sandwich as part of r.