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User Topic: I don't knows could equal divorce
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Member # 39000
Flame  Posted: 12:58 PM, September 9th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't want to h/j the thread either, frankier, but I don't PM men (boundaries!) so when you pop into Wayward and say PL expressing her confusion to her BH is...

tantamount to telling him that you are a slut. This is what he will hear

...I feel angry, because frankier, I'm sensing that's what you hear. Let's let her BH speak for himself. Mind-reading pisses me off, as does using offensive language like "slut" near a WS who is here on SI, working and struggling to be a better person.

fWW: 42
BH: 52
DDay: April 21, 2013
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1234 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
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Member # 33901
Default  Posted: 5:44 PM, September 9th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


I feel that I am not being able to convey to you what I mean. Please read my reply to your message where I say that

I don't know if Pizzalover is a slut and I didn't say she was one.

I did not call her any names and most definitely I am not hearing anything. I am just saying that that is what her husband might think if he is not helped to put things in perspective.

What Pizzalover is implicitly asking is help on how she can find her "whys" and convey them to her husband. That was my contribution, and I am sorry if offended you in any way and made you angry. It was not my intention.

If Pizzalover or any of the moderators believe I am out of bound, I'd accept if they deleted my posts.

P.S.: The PM reference was not directed at you. Sorry if it was not clear.

Me BS 48
Her WS 39
DDay 7/5/10 1/yr EA/PA
DS1 12 DS2 8

Posts: 117 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: ChiLand
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Member # 15162
Red  Posted: 6:44 PM, September 9th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If Pizzalover or any of the moderators believe I am out of bound, I'd accept if they deleted my posts.


Deleting posts is against the Guidelines. If you haven't already, it may be a good idea to read through them

FBH - 42
FWW - 43 (BrokenRoad)
2 kids 7&12

The people you do your life with shape the life you live

Posts: 37393 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Michigan
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Member # 38336
Default  Posted: 9:14 PM, September 9th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks to everyone for your responses - I'm going to try to address everyones comments.


Will any reason really ever satisfy BH? What if a therapist could hand you both *all the perfect answers* on a silver platter? Would BH's anger evaporate then?

I don't think any answer will satisfy or take the anger away, but I want understanding for both of us.
Do you have any theories you're working on?

Some theories: I have extreme neediness. I feel like I have always been like this, but am not sure why. I need people to like me and to approve of me. I get validation from others and not from myself. I obviously have flexible morals that allowed me to be promiscuious after losing my virginity at 15 and making mistake after mistake after mistake. I continued to let men use me. I felt that giving the man pleasure and happiness made me feel good about myself. I grew up with low-self esteem. Kids made fun of the way I looked (premature gray hair) at the way my mother looked (very over weight). I don't think I've ever really been able to get validation internally. My IC feels, based on what we've been discussing, that I DON'T like being disregarded, but if there is something I want I am able to disregard others. I feel like I have always been impulsive - not thinking before I engage in something - not weighing every consequence. I am a selfish person, and until D-day, I really didn't realize the extent of my selfishness.
I held onto a lot of anger at my father for leaving my mother. I am finally starting to rebuild with him, but it's going to take some time. Maybe subconsciencely I didn't feel that I deserved a happy marriage so I destroyed it. My "daddy issues" along with my contentious relationship with my brother over the years may have added to my need for male approval. Just some ideas. However, it's like an onion. I keep peeling back layer after layer and finding more out.
Are you proud of the progress you've made so far? Try to stay positive and avoid getting discouraged. You can only heal yourself; fixing the M takes two.
I'm proud of the work I've been doing in IC/MC. I'm proud that I've become more self aware then I was during the A an shortly after D-day, even if its just a little more self-aware. I'm trying to be a healthy person for myself and my BH.


The one thing I slowly came to realize as we started climbing out of our own black whole was that my WS was NOT deliberately trying to forget things. I know this because both our memories in general are not functioning at all well.....a sign of significant trauma. "I just don't know, or the I can't recalls" for a BS they are so hurtful. Instead try using something like " I am working so hard in IC to figure out these things and when I know them in more detail I will share them with you or maybe there is nothing more I would like to do right now but answer all of your questions, i know how important the answers would be to help your healing"

I am also not deliberatly trying to forget things, but my reasoning is cloudy. I feel like I was operating in some fantasy universe, which really doesn't make sense to me now. I like the language that you suggested I use. I understand your point of view that I don't knows are hurtful. Hell, it hurts me that I don know!
What finally helped H and I get over the hump of deceit was time, consistency and an awful lot of deep hard conversations. If you have not already read the book by Janice Abrahms Spring called "After the Affair, how to stop the pain and rebuild the trust when one partner has been unfaithful" go and buy it and read it. Give it to him and suggest working through the book together. Just the title alone will make him feel you are serious about working on this and getting through this WITH him. He can't read your mind and right now he feels he doesn't even know the person you really are. Help him to see that you do care about him and WANT to work through this.

We actually did read this book on our iPads together shortly after D-day, but it would probably be helpful to go through it again and do the exercises together. I remember getting a lot out of it. A second reading would be beneficial.


He is asking you why your moral compass is/was so out of bounds. The real answer is because you reasoned that what you wanted immorally, outweighed the right thing to do. Once you gave in you were too scared to stop. Fear of the fallout and also fear of losing the guilty pleasure of being selfish.

There may be a lot of truth to what you said above, even though it sickens me to read it. I hate that I had no boundaries. I hate that I didn't know how to stop.
I think you keep running from really confronting yourself because of what you may find out.

I may have been running then, but since D-day I'm confronting myself, even though its fucking terrifying. No more running.


And tell your BH "What I DO know is I am doing everything I can to change and BECOME the safe person you, I, and our marriage deserve." Then add "And when, during my process of healing, change, growth, and self-discovery I find an answer to one of my 'I don't know's' I'll reach out and let you know so we can discuss". And then walk that talk.

Good advice! Thanks!

Trying to rebuild each day

Me - WW 39
Him - BH 40 (mpb1974)
2 Furrbabies - sweet cats

Met - 8/13/99
Started dating - 9/11/99
Moved in together - 3/03
Engaged - 6/5/09
Married - 8/21/10
D-Day - 1/24/13
Affair started 5/09

Posts: 487 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: Pennsylvania
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Default  Posted: 10:09 PM, October 6th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Who WAS I?? It was/is soooo surreal. I can't imagine my husband hearing me say that, b/c it sounds like a cop out, even to me, but it's like I was possessed. I'm not excusing it, just relating to what you said....

Posts: 11 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: SE US
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