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Wayward Side Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Insensitive Comment
Aubrie
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Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So have you ever have those moments where everything is comfortable, and OMG, normal, and relaxed, and then you say something really, really stupid? Maybe I'm the only one.

We were standing in the kitchen Monday night, eating pie, laughing and excited about our upcoming time together. He made a sexual comment which then led to a sort of, "Have you ever?" kind of thing. And then I opened up my mouth and said the dumbest thing ever. It just flew out. "Well I've never done XYZ with another man." Dear. God. I have never prayed so hard for a sinkhole to swallow me up in my life.

Hello!? So what if I haven't done it with. I did it for. No difference IMO.

Cue instant panic and horror. Apologies spewed from my mouth and I searched his face and body language for a reaction. Nothing. He brushed it off. Was actually kind of smirking. He said it was no big deal.

I feel really stupid though. It was like, for 5 minutes in time, everything that had ever happened, hadn't. We were a normal, happy, innocent couple, cutting up and having fun. And with that stupid comment, it all came crashing back on me.

I can't figure out if this is a good thing or a bad thing. Good thing because we were having a really great time? That for a few minutes, we weren't defined by infidelity. We weren't "those people". Or bad thing because I was stupid enough to forget my past actions, even if only a few moments in time. I don't want to hang onto this crap forever. Meaning, I don't want to wallow. But at the same time, I'm not going to lay it aside and act like it never happened. That it's over and done with, lets move on. Guess I'm looking for the balance.

At any rate. If you've said or done something stupid lately, know you're not alone.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"What if I fall?" Oh but my darling, what if you fly?


Posts: 6227 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
TimeToManUp
♂ Member
Member # 37538
Default  Posted: 6:41 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm sure TCD may have something that I missed, but I can't think of anything recent. But I have had jokes cross my mind, then thankfully my filter steps in and says "Yeah, dipshit... I'm sure she'd find that a laugh-riot..." Earlier on, I definitely did it more often. The first time post DDay that I said "That's what she said" after a comment? Wow... What an asshole. TCD just looked at me and said "Really?"


I know we're worth it.
WH (Me-33)
BW (tattoodchinadoll-31)
D-Day: 12/22/11
Together 15 years, married for 10.
Three daughters, 8, 4 and 2.

Posts: 227 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: New Jersey
unfound
♀ Member
Member # 12802
Default  Posted: 6:57 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Did you say it maliciously? No.
Did you say it and not even realize that it might be insensitive? No
Did you say it and immediately want to suck the words back up? Yes.


The balance is that you can feel "normal", and now know when you've made a mistake, you address it, and learn from it.

Even though he shrugged it off, I would touch base wtih him again about it. Not a huge discussion, but a mention of how it made you feel and how you'll be more mindful of your words, even when, especially when, things are going so good. That's just me and what I'd want as a bs. You know better if it didn't bother him, or he just needs time to process it. Sharing that you are disappointed in yourself, even if he wasn't, is a great way to show him that you haven't gforgotten, but love your new, healthier normal.

((Aubrie))


ka-mai
*******************
From time to time, I do consider that I might be mad. Like any self-respecting lunatic, however, I am always quick to dismiss any doubts about my sanity. DK

Posts: 14845 | Registered: Nov 2006 | From: mercury's underboob
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 9:10 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have you had the courage to ask him if he REALLY brushed it off, or has it been digging a wormhole through his heart. Don't hope for the best. Clear the issue.

Justifying such a remark as getting "lost inthe moment" can indicate a lack of awareness and empathy. I'm not sure of your Dday, but if it is only 2years ago, it is too soon, in my opinion to be cavalier and lost in the moment without concern for the consequences.

I don't mean to sound harsh, I really don't I hope you accept my comment in the spirit of showing you a BS's perspective in hopes of you two healing the hurt.


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
looking forward
♀ Member
Member # 25238
Default  Posted: 10:13 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lots and lots of times, Aubrie!
And then something like what you described happens!
I don't believe that you are cavalier at all! You were being normal with your H.
You were relaxed and comfortable. Good grief, as WS are we supposed to be on guard, eyes darting back and forth constantly, previewing absolutely EVERYTHING we plan to say to our spouse???? THAT is not normal.
We are trying our hardest to help our marriages heal, to help our spouses heal.
I don't want to hang onto this crap forever. Meaning, I don't want to wallow. But at the same time, I'm not going to lay it aside and act like it never happened. That it's over and done with, lets move on. Guess I'm looking for the balance.

<<This!>>
I'm looking too...


Memory and hope; one looks backward, and the other forward; one is of today, the other of tomorrow.
"Find a place inside where there's joy, and the joy will burn out the pain." (Joseph Campbell)

Posts: 2839 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: Where a river runs through it
Teardrop29
♀ New Member
Member # 40297
Default  Posted: 10:24 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Coming from a BW, I'm actually touched by your post. You're human... You didn't intend to hurt. In all honesty, I'm sure your BH was triggered by the comment but was clearly comforted by your apologies. You deeply understand the cause of your A and I see genuine remorse.

I agree with unfound. Touch base with him anyway.


BS: me (29)
WH: 37
Together 4 yrs, Married 3 years
2 children: DS 2yrs/ DD 3mos

Posts: 15 | Registered: Aug 2013
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 10:28 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For many, being in the moment, without considering the consequences, is what permitted infidelity, especially when there is flirting and sexual innuendo floating around.

Those BSs who have kept strict boundaries were sensitive to such circumstanes before their betrayal Some are hyper sensitive following their betrayal.

So, yes, some of us BS would hope that our WS develop empathy and sensitivity to the possible mortal blow to their BS's heart that an off-hand remark might make.

Being on-guard is prudent and empathetic. "Eyes darting around" sounds rather dramatic, however.


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 10:45 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For many, being in the moment, without considering the consequences, is what permitted infidelity, especially when there is flirting and sexual innuendo floating around.

I can''t say that I agree since the context of this one is between Aubrie84 and her BH. That would qualify (imho) as a situation where boundaries aren''t the issue. You''re supposed to be able to be flirty and let sexual innuendo fly with your SO. You''re both inside the boundary so to speak.

As far as the comment goes I have found that it is less what is said but how it is treated. People say things they don''t mean or phrase things in a way they did not intend. What ultimately defines those moments are how they''re handled after those words escape our lips. Aubrie''s reaction was immediate. It was apologetic and sincere. If I hear a remark that might be taken as insensitive or offensive then the reaction afterwards would be the clincher.

For example, had Aubrie said "Don''t be so sensitive" instead of "Cue instant panic and horror. Apologies spewed from my mouth..." then I think I would look at it differently. I can easily see it not being a big deal if I were the BH''s shoes. Why? Because then I would know she cared about whether the comments hurt me. That she was sincerely remorseful for them. Sometimes its enough to know that.

[This message edited by Brandon808 at 10:46 PM, September 12th, 2013 (Thursday)]


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3800 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 11:09 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And then I opened up my mouth and said the dumbest thing ever. It just flew out. "Well I've never done XYZ with another man." Dear. God. I have never prayed so hard for a sinkhole to swallow me up in my life.

Hello!? So what if I haven't done it with. I did it for. No difference IMO.

Do you understand what Aubrie is saying here? Do you understand her remark isn't about she and BH?


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 11:34 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you understand what Aubrie is saying here? Do you understand her remark isn't about she and BH?

Yes, I understand that.

However, I don't see making a comment that is potentially offensive or insensitive as a lack of empathy. People do that to each other. I know many people who are very caring and sensitive but being fallible human beings we say things that ill-timed, ill-advised or just plain foot-in-the-mouth wrong. That isn't a problem confined to WS and neither is it imho a problem that indicates poor boundaries or consideration for consequences. How a person handles it when they make they mistake is what I consider the more defining moment. Just my perspective on it.

Aubrie said something she regrets. She immediately apologized for it and expressed remorse. That's what most of us in life would hope to see when that happens.


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3800 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
aesir
♂ Member
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 11:43 PM, September 12th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As someone with a damaged filter IRL, I can so relate to comments like this.

One of the struggles I had, I didn't feel I could post about on SI because of how newbies might take it as permission to rugsweep or adopt a get over it attitude actually coincided with my absence here. I was no longer thinking about this crap unless it was directly brought up, no triggers, no mind movies etc... and I would make offhand comments about other people or stuff that was on TV that were somewhat related to our situation, and STBX would get this look on her face and start to seriously apologize, that reminded me of everything, and there went the good mood for both of us. It is a fine line balancing all of this, but it is probably better to err on the side of caution. These things will come up from time to time.

ETA:
-- IMPORTANT --
Please don't quote this in any posts, I have this strange feeling that maybe I should replace it all with something innocuous like hugs to protect the newbies from getting ideas too early in their journey. I am sure you can understand why I did not post about it at the time.

[This message edited by aesir at 11:44 PM, September 12th (Thursday)]


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 12:12 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aubrie said something she regrets. She immediately apolized for it and expressed remorse. 

I agree Aubrie apologized. Aubrie went on to express her personal discomfort. So far, Aubrie hasn't posted about how she followed up with her BS, so I think it is premature to attach remorse to her thought process.


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
alphakitte
♀ Member
Member # 33438
Default  Posted: 12:25 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

However, I don't see making a comment that is potentially offensive or insensitive as a lack of empathy.

This is compartmentalisation

How we do one thing is how we do most things.


------ Some people are emotional tadpoles. Even if they mature they are just a warty toad. Catt

Posts: 349 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: 3 klicks north of Ambiguous
Unagie
♀ Member
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 12:59 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aubrie hasn't posted about how she followed up with her BS, so I think it is premature to attach remorse to her thought process.

I have to respectfully disagree. She immediately realized her comment, apologized and waited for his reaction. She can speak to him about it again to make sure he's truly okay but and I say this knowing there may be backlash it's not completely on her. She said it, acknowledged it and was ready to do what she could to fix it but he told her it was no big deal. If it was a big deal to him he could have told her then and there. If it becomes a big deal I also believe that they have the kind of relationship where him sharing that would be done. Aubrie can only react with remorse and an apology and go off what her BH shows and tells her. As WS we are not mind readers and constant vigilance to every carefree moment you may have with your BS does not add to it favorably IMHO. If we are enjoying each other yet each word or phrase is being with weighed or filtered before I utter it then I am not having a sweet carefree moment with you. Aubrie I think you handled this well, if QS needs to talk about this I am sure that is a convo that you two will get through.


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."


Posts: 2734 | Registered: Oct 2012
aesir
♂ Member
Member # 17210
Default  Posted: 1:01 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

However, I don't see making a comment that is potentially offensive or insensitive as a lack of empathy.

This is compartmentalisation

How we do one thing is how we do most things.

I dunno, someone once said that the worst thing about the mediocre is that they are always at their best. Sometimes things are less than optimal and do not follow the plan perfectly because we all need to relax, both for our own benefit, and so those around us do not consider us insufferable. The latter condition being aptly demonstrated in this exchange on The Simpsons:

Burns: Now get out!
Lisa: I can't! My mom's not picking me up for an hour.
(long pause)
Burns: So, what do you think of today’s popular music scene.
Lisa: I think it distracts people from more important social issues.
Burns: My god, are you always on!?

I would rather deal with real honest unthinking reactions from time to time that were less than optimal than have everything be perfectly sensitive and empathetic and pass through a committee to be properly vetted before anything is uttered. Thinking of the post on "How can you love me" here, and wondering if there could not also be a t/j post of "How can I love you" if you won't let me see the real you.

Hello!? So what if I haven't done it with. I did it for. No difference IMO.
I think that the distinction between with and for is far less important than the distinction between did and doing, but what the hell, you know where to find my tagline.

ETA:
Crossposted with Unagie.

[This message edited by aesir at 1:04 AM, September 13th (Friday)]


Your mileage may vary... in accordance with the prophecy.

Do not back up. Severe tire damage.


Posts: 14924 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: Winnipeg
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 1:43 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How we do one thing is how we do most things.

Oh, well then I'm fucked. So is everyone I know and have ever met.

For many, being in the moment, without considering the consequences, is what permitted infidelity, especially when there is flirting and sexual innuendo floating around.

I'm sure that is a true statement for some. What on earth does that have to do with Aubrie's post? Seriously. She was having fun with her husband. She said something that she immediately corrected, apologized for and is STILL upset about.

I wish more people had that kind of response when they fucked up and said something careless or insensitive.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 8:31 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wish more people had that kind of response when they fucked up and said something careless or insensitive.

Thank youuuuuu!

Aubrie hasn't posted about how she followed up with her BS, so I think it is premature to attach remorse to her thought process.
I attached remorse because once she realized what she said she was immediately concerned with her BH's feelings, his reaction. She was not concerned with the consequences to herself but the impact on him. This is, imho, the very definition of remorse as opposed to regret.

However, to address Aubrie's original reason for posting...

I can't figure out if this is a good thing or a bad thing. Good thing because we were having a really great time? That for a few minutes, we weren't defined by infidelity. We weren't "those people". Or bad thing because I was stupid enough to forget my past actions, even if only a few moments in time.
I'm inclined to go with 'Good thing'. It's already been pointed out that people say things. We (the human race in general) are flawed beings who do and say things that will inevitably hurt others. Those we love and care about most deeply are not exempt. You will make that mistake. It does not have to define a relationship, whether it is husband/wife, parent/child, siblings or friends. We try not to make those mistakes because we do care about other's feelings (hopefully). Similarly we try to be understanding if we're on the receiving end of such comments because we know it can happen. What defines the relationship is how that's handled. Will they walk on eggshells because he's afraid of what she'll say next and she's afraid of his reaction? Uhhh...kind of doubt that from the post. Could her BH find himself thinking on it later and being bothered, maybe have some questions? Sure. Sometimes we experience a delayed effect once we've had time to mull it over. Then again he could truly be fine and continued followups of "Are you sure you're ok?" could just get really annoying. Every couple is different. That is their dynamic. What I took from this post was someone who had that proverbial slip of the tongue and felt the full emotional effects of its possible consequences.


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3800 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 8:47 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cheese and crackers. Epic long post follows. Grab a coffee.

Have you had the courage to ask him if he REALLY brushed it off, or has it been digging a wormhole through his heart. Don't hope for the best. Clear the issue.
If there is anything this journey has taught me, it's to communicate. I'm a communicator in an almost annoying sense. He knows e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g I think, say, and do. I won't shut him out of my life again. I am very open with him. He knows how I feel and he said the incident didn't bother him. If he said it didn't, I have to take his word for it. If it's digging a wormhole thru his heart, it's on him to tell me. He hasn't said otherwise. That's all I can go off of. I'm not a mind reader. I wasn't blessed with ESP.

Justifying such a remark as getting "lost inthe moment" can indicate a lack of awareness and empathy
I'm not justifying anything. Let me paint you a little picture. The past couple months have been utter hell. Death, family, work, school, sickness, you name it, we've walked the pathway. My husband has been gone alot, and we're been dealing with most of these issues apart from one another and via cell/text. Not exactly comforting for either of us. Monday night when he walked in the door and we knew he was home for the next 36 hours, everything else ceased. He was home with me for the first time in 3-4 weeks and we had shut the rest of the world out. We were simply a man and a woman, standing over a plate of pie and ice cream, enjoying one another, seeing only each other, and genuinely happy.

To say that I lack empathy and awareness couldn't be more inaccurate. And to be honest, I find it frustrating when someone posts and I feel I have to defend myself. Only my husband and I were there, we have communicated about it. However, with your comments, now I feel that I have to defend, and uber-explain myself because apparently I'm not empathetic, remorseful, or too carefree. Each couple's healing is different. And QS is very different from most "typical" BSs.

I was flirting and being sexual with my husband, (because it's a part of my job description and I happen to love it) and there wasn't need for "boundaries". I'm kind of "allowed" to let my hair down and be a woman with him. If I was constantly on alert, constantly hyper-aware of everything I do, say, and think, I don't see how that is being an authentic person. If I stay calculated and deliberate every moment of every day with him, how exactly is he supposed to love that? I would be the equivalent of a robot. Not very sexy, nor the least bit attractive to my husband, I can assure you.

I'm not sure of your Dday, but if it is only 2years ago, it is too soon, in my opinion to be cavalier and lost in the moment without concern for the consequences.
So if I may ask, when is one "allowed" to start being lost in the moment with their spouse? Because in my opinion, if two people are working on healing a relationship, whether it's 2 months or 20 years out from Dday, they should be "allowed" to enjoy being in the moment with their spouse. Isn't that part of being in a relationship? Being in the moment with them? Shutting out the rest of the world. Seeing only one another.

My husband doesn't want me walking around with a "SHE'S A WHORE!!!!" on my forehead. He doesn't want me sobbing into a tissue, begging his forgiveness and apologizing 100 times a day. He knows my heart, because I have shown it to him every day since November 4, 2011. He wants to R with me. To rebuild. To have a marriage we've always wanted. To enjoy one another like we never have before. To face the trials of life head on and scream, "Bring it on, we've got this." That's what HE wants. At two years out. He actually expressed all that to me just shortly after Dday. I'm sure some of you will say, "OMG! He's like totally rugsweeping!" But hey, that's inaccurate as well. I've been busting my butt for nigh on 2 years. I'm doing the hard work.

So, yes, some of us BS would hope that our WS develop empathy and sensitivity to the possible mortal blow to their BS's heart that an off-hand remark might make.
Maybe many WS are not empathetic or sensitive to their BS's needs. But in an almost 2 year span, I can count on 1 hand the stupid, insensitive comments I've made to QS. This is not a daily, weekly, or even monthly occurrence. I am highly sensitive to his needs, wants, and triggers.

So far, Aubrie hasn't posted about how she followed up with her BS, so I think it is premature to attach remorse to her thought process.
Wrong. I followed up with my husband as soon as the words left my mouth. And I did talk to him about it again later. I can't follow up anymore without being a nag. He said it was no big deal. He saw the shock and horror on my face, he saw my apologies are genuine, he knew it wasn't what I was actually trying to say. The only thing left to do is sob and grovel in the floor. Which honestly, I think is a little dramatic.

One of the struggles I had, I didn't feel I could post about on SI because of how newbies might take it as permission to rugsweep or adopt a get over it attitude actually coincided with my absence here. I was no longer thinking about this crap unless it was directly brought up, no triggers, no mind movies etc... and I would make offhand comments about other people or stuff that was on TV that were somewhat related to our situation, and STBX would get this look on her face and start to seriously apologize, that reminded me of everything, and there went the good mood for both of us.
Wow. Sounds very familiar. And I totally could have taken the opportunity to rug-sweep and make this all go away. However, here I am. Gone are the days of running and hiding.

To those of you who "got" what I was saying, thank you for the comments. Much appreciated.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"What if I fall?" Oh but my darling, what if you fly?


Posts: 6227 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
tired girl
♀ Member
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 10:53 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aubrie,

Not quite sure how your thread took such a left turn onto "she is not being remoresful", as anybody who knows you, would know that isn't true.

We are human, and as such, we do human things. Chalk it up to that. You were having a good time with your H, and you were living in the moment. I see that as a good thing actually. Life is moving on, as it should, and you apologized.

I hope the rest of the time you two had together was awesome


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 4859 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
abbycadabby
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Member # 27428
Default  Posted: 11:42 AM, September 13th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Justifying such a remark as getting "lost inthe moment" can indicate a lack of awareness and empathy. I'm not sure of your Dday, but if it is only 2years ago, it is too soon, in my opinion to be cavalier and lost in the moment without concern for the consequences.

I think this is highly judgmental. Sorry. You aren't the "it's too soon" police. Aubrie handled it the best way she could, demonstrating love, remorse and compassion during the fallout.

It was like, for 5 minutes in time, everything that had ever happened, hadn't. We were a normal, happy, innocent couple, cutting up and having fun.

Gently: isn't THIS, right HERE, why you're reconciling? Why you own your shit? Why you do the hard work? So you can steal away fleeting moments like this that don't happen nearly enough? So that hopefully, one day in the future, you'll look back and realize that the infidelity really DOESN'T define you anymore? That it doesn't HAVE to define you anymore because you've built something so much more than?

Aubrie, you handled it well. Just communicate and stay in tune with H. You're doing great.


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