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Madhatters Only Thread

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AngelFlower posted 1/7/2016 10:27 AM

I struggle with the HOW some of the things happened, also. Perhaps some of you will have some insight on this. Here it is...

In 2008, when I had caught him sexting one girl (and I thought that was all that was there to be discovered), I went to to get contraceptive and to get an annual checkup. The doctor found evidence that I might have an STD. I received treatment, based on the possible symptoms and the fact that my husband had been sexting. Of course, I went directly to him and confronted him, accusing his sext relationship of being an actual PA and also accusing him with the main AP. He denied, denied, denied. And within 24 hours of me telling him I had an STD, he was texting his main AP again (among others). Now, in his defense, the std test came back negative (the doctors now tell me that this was because it was already in my uterus at that point and they could not culture it). But, my question is...for the 2 weeks that we waited on those STD test results, WE BELIEVED I HAD AN STD. He KNEW he was having unprotected sex wither her and, further, that she was likely having sex with her significant other, who AP had told him was cheating on her with a "skank." So basically, 4 people were all having sex with each other and knew it. How could he text the person he should have known was responsible for that within 24 hours of learning it? I have asked him. He said he thought I was bluffing. Really!!! I got a shot in my rear and took a pill and he thought I was bluffing!!! He also said he thought she was "clean." How can you think a person who is having sex with a married man, unprotected, while she was having sex with her SO, who was having sex with a "skank" is clean? He says he was worried that it was going to come back positive and he would have to deal with it and confront her...but how did he not do that immediately?

LosferWords posted 1/7/2016 21:45 PM

I am really not sure what to say to the STD stuff. That is perplexing. My best guess is that maybe he was doing everything he could not to get caught? Compartmentalization can play a big part in all of that, where he was somehow able to turn around and text the AP(s).

Literature can be very helpful, particularly when an IC isn't an option. My wife and I found "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass particularly helpful, especially when it comes to boundaries.

The impression I am getting is that your husband hasn't truly acknowledged your pain, and the very real, tangible, and physical consequences that his affair had on you. I personally think that will be necessary when it comes to remorse. Has he acknowledged this at all? Is there possibly a part of him that doesn't want to face this because of shame? Shame can get some of us stuck in this process as well.

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 09:29 AM

AngelFlower I am so sorry for your pain. I know we have chatted briefly in another thread.

About the STD, they never think the person they are wife is dirty. Being dirty and having an STD doesnt fit into the fantasy they have created. The real worry of a STD happens after the A is over. By then I am sure WH thought everything was fine because the test came back negative which means she/they were clean. The thinking isn't rational. Keep reminding yourself, they were living in a fantasy world.

My WH's OW actually told me she had herpes. I told her that I tricked WH into coming clean about having sex with her by convincing him he had a STD. She said, "oh it's herpes and it's real, I have it, he surely has it, and I bet you do too". It was a lie thank goodness but I really thought it was true.

LosferWords posted 1/8/2016 10:21 AM

Hi itsmyvwbeelte,

I cross posted with you yesterday and missed your post. Hello and welcome!

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 10:36 AM

itsmyvw...I think maybe you hit the nail on the head. It didn't fit with his fantasy. But how in the world does a damn STD not slap you out of it like 10 tons of bricks on the head? I get why AFTER the test came back negative it was easy to continue the fantasy, but HOW did he continue it for the 2 weeks while we waited? I guess if you are acting so devious, it is hard to believe others aren't. I guess that is how he convinced himself I was bluffing (especially since I had confronted him before).

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 10:47 AM

Losfer...I think he is acknowledging as best he can. I think, first of all, it is really hard to comprehend what happened to me...it was such a series of statistical improbabilities. Frankly, it is a little hard to get my own head around it and I am the one living with it. I will say that when I was in the hospital for 9 days and recovering for another 6 weeks, he was right there with me the whole time. Neither of us knew at the time that it was his affair that caused it, but he went through the brunt of it with me. We were scared I was going to die. I am sure, in retrospect, it is hard for him to NOT acknowledge, because he was there watching me go through unbearable pain, watching me get wheeled away into 2 emergency surgeries, watching my heart monitor bc they were scared I was going to have a heart attack. He was there, holding my hand before and after my third surgery. Then, we both knew it was him. And he was there. He helps me with pain days...he does a special abdominal massage that he learned from a therapist. He pours epsom salt in my bath. He tells me he is sorry he hurt me when I struggle to go to the bathroom. I get frustrated with him at times, but the truth is, he is there with me in this.

LosferWords posted 1/8/2016 10:50 AM

I get frustrated with him at times, but the truth is, he is there with me in this.

This is really good. I have great hope for you two. There is still a rough road ahead, but I think as long as you are both willing to work on yourselves individually in addition to coming together as a team, it can be done.

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 11:58 AM

AngelFlower, yes I believe that your WH probably thought it was a way to "bluff" the truth out of him. He felt she was clean/he was clean and showing even a hint of doubt would instantly show you the truth. I am sure he worried for a bit there but not enough for you to see it.

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 12:22 PM

Ah...Losfer...thank you for the encouragement...I think it is exactly what I needed. He could leave. I know it would be easier than facing this. But, he didn't. And he's not perfect. And his head is still up his ass at times. But, he is here and he's doing this hard thing with me. Thank you for helping me see that.

Itsmyvw...thanks also. I guess it is starting to make sense. The fantasy that she was clean allowed him to think I was bluffing.

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 12:34 PM

Leaving seems to be the easy way out. I told my WH just about 10 minutes ago that leaving would be easier but I didnt sign up for the easy out. I sure didn't sign up for all the pain and heartache but it comes with this path.

I am having a very rough day today. Finally got WH to admit to cheating on his ex, they weren't married but they were in a committed relationship. He said 5-6 ONS over the course of a couple of years. He said she knows because he told her at the exit blow-up fight but I sure didnt know. He didnt want me to think he was a POS. If the boot fits.....

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 12:44 PM

itsmyvw...would what he did in his prior relationships have mattered then? I doubt it, because we think "well, they won't do that to us." My husband had an std before me...I knew it....when we started dating before we had sex, we went to get tested together. I surely thought he would never do that to me. Thought he saw how terrified I was of an STD. But, he did. I am willing to bet you still would have been with him.

Also, my husband recently brought up some things I did before we were together. I was deeply offended. Why did that matter now? Where was that going to get us? How was that relevant to us?

ETA... I know you're hurting and I know that when you hurt like this, every little thing is salt in the wound, even maybe things that shouldn't be. We are just so raw. I am so sorry you're having a bad day.

[This message edited by AngelFlower at 12:47 PM, January 8th (Friday)]

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 13:00 PM

No it wouldn't have mattered to me at all. That's the thing, I wouldn't have cared. I am a very accepting, open-minded, non-judging person so him telling me he was a cheater would have been super easy. I hate that he lied to me and continued to lie to me over the years. Honesty is key.

I love him to pieces and I am pretty broken individual myself but I do have a moral backbone. Some days I wonder if his 50 shades of f*cked up is more then anyone can handle. His dad died a lonely man all by himself (well his kids were there). He took advantage of everyone that ever trusted him and now my WH is the same....

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 13:08 PM

I'm sorry itsmyvw...I didn't realize he lied. Now that is a different issue.

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 13:11 PM

I just don't get people who lie like that. It has always amazed me. I am a great liar! I can convince most people of anything but I chose not too. I think if you ask a question then you have a reason to know. Now recently I have learned some people are just curious lol.

Oh well, here's hoping we have a great weekend. We have made so much progress these past few weeks that I'd hate to see it end now. It is our first kid free weekend in a month. He has kids, I have kids, we don't have kids so every other weekend typically is without kids but with the holidays that wasnt the case.

AngelFlower posted 1/8/2016 13:14 PM

2 steps forward, 1 back...eventually, you will make it somewhere!

itsmyvwbeelte posted 1/8/2016 13:21 PM

That's true. I guess the main thing is he is opening up and finally being truthful about the things he has done that he has hid for so long. There is nothing to gain from being honest now but I am glad he is.

Onehurtguy posted 1/16/2016 17:42 PM

I need to know, am I a mad hatter? I found out my wife had a affair for the month of May (from about May 12-June 7). I discovered it all on July 11. My wife said she loved him and still had feeling for him up to kid September. I was talking to an old girl friend and the texting (she lives on the other side of the country so we never met in person) became emotional, intimate and sexual. We talked about leaving our spouses and reconnecting. I was open with my wife about my communication with her (after a few weeks of hiding it). My wife was fine with it. Eventually she was not fine with it and we had to break it off. Am I a mad hatter?

AngelFlower posted 1/19/2016 09:09 AM

Yes, I think you are. You had a few weeks where you were hiding an "emotional, intimate, and sexual" relationship. That is infidelity.

Sadlady14 posted 1/21/2016 01:12 AM

Yes, I think you are a MH too, unfortunately. We are a year out from D day as mad hatters and seem to be reconciling. I have seen stories of other MHs on here who are further out than me who have R also. Of course R isn't the answer for everyone.
That being said, how are you and your spouse doing?

limbo63 posted 1/22/2016 15:52 PM

I'm new here (to this thread), although I shouldn't be. I've been too shy (?) to post. This may have come up before in this thread, so forgive me if I'm repeating.

My question is....and it's probably a dumb one....does being a madhatter hold us up from making a decision, especially if we know that we need or want to or D? do the feelings of guilt keep us in Limbo longer?

as my namesake says....I am in limbo. I do love my husband and wanted to R, but he continued to take the affair underground. For . 5 . years.. over and over again. Lie after lie. had some financial issues for awhile, well still do, so I have had trouble moving forward with anything because of that too, I thought, and also guilt over what I did. It was many moons ago, and it was shortlived, although that didn't make it right. Now I am frozen, I have a young teen son and am afraid of drama and making things worse for us. I have asked him to move out a few times, then we false R. but lately we can't even talk about it. I don't think he has seen her in awhile but who the hell knows. I don't think he has broken it off either. he said he was getting ready to tell her goodbye for real and finally as he knew it wasn't fair to either of us. Really? and then I get ready to try to force him out again and then I just don't. We act like everything's normal. So weird. so dysfunctional. we can't even talk about it. there has been no sex though since before I found out 5 years ago. We talked a little via text the other day about it and I said I couldn't take it anymore and needed an honest convo with him. he said he just needed to "ease into it" (a converstion), he can't take my "bluntness" it's not all black and white. whatever. I gave him so many chances to end it with her. How do I get out of this endless loop?

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