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Reconciliation Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Double Standards
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 10:00 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm worried that I may have a double standard on something, so I want to put it in writing and see what others think.

Last night I participated in my first 5K. I told wBF last weekend about it, and invited him. He said no. My only plans for the night was the 5K with a female friend, and potentially dinner after. I didn't want to do very much afterward since I was in a tshirt and tennis shoes, and I'm usually very picky about what I wear in public. So, we did the 5K and then went to dinner. I was texting wBF the whole night. We left dinner around 9:30 I'm guessing, and my female friend wanted to get a drink at a bar. I told her I was going home, and she grabbed my hand and pulled me along, and so I went. I texted wBF and told him where I was. Around 11 PM, he texted that he was going to bed. I saw the time, and responded that I would be going home soon too. I had all intentions of going home when I said that, and told my friend goodnight. She pouted, and convinced me to walk to another bar that has a pool table. I went, and stayed for about 2 hours. No texting to wBF since he thought I was asleep. On my drive home, wBF texted me and he was very upset that I stayed out that late "bar hopping." He asked me how I would feel if it was reversed, and made a comment about how I didn't act like this before Dday.

At the time, I wasn't thinking that I did anything wrong at all. I was out with a female friend, and having fun. I guess I just didn't really think about whether it would bother wBF or not. I don't go out to bars a lot, and these bars aren't typical bars. I live in a small town, and there's only two bars to even go to. Both are very relaxed. It's not like a dance club or anything. Just a laid back place with a pool table. I wasn't drinking much since I knew I had to drive. I was just with my female friend. Wasn't talking to any guys. And I was still wearing gym shorts, tshirt, and tennis shoes.

I kept deciding to stay out instead of going home like I told wBF because I was feeling relaxed and happy. I actually wasn't thinking about the A at all. I even started texting him sweet things at one point in the night, because I was feeling so lighthearted and relaxed and happy. I guess I stayed out because I wanted those feelings to continue.

He's right though that I didn't go to bars while dating him before Dday. I went to bars before I met him, and I tried to get him to go to bars with me after we met. He said that it wasn't his thing and didn't enjoy it, and we spent all our weekends together, so I just stopped going.

He's also right that I think I have a double standard because I would not want him to go to bars now without me. His A started because he wanted to go to bars, and for whatever reason wouldn't go with me even though I asked him to. He went with a coworker instead, without me knowing about it. And that eventually led to the A. Also, the ONS happened with a girl that he was drinking with in a bar. So, I don't feel comfortable with him going to bars without me because he's proven to me that he doesn't have any boundaries when it comes to him in a bar.

I do have boundaries. I trust myself. I know that I wouldn't do anything inappropriate. I only want to be with wBF, and had no desire to talk to any men there.

But reading this, it sounds like I'm justifying my behavior. And I'm wondering if I have a double standard. Should I say no to getting a drink at a bar in the future in wBF is not with me? There's not much to do in our town except the bar, because everything else closes at 9. Thoughts?

[This message edited by Lonelygirl10 at 10:02 AM, September 28th (Saturday)]


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 1032 | Registered: Jul 2013
Lucky
♀ Member
Member # 6864
Default  Posted: 10:12 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I get everything you're saying & feeling. My honest opinion is one night out with a friend doesn't really create a double standard. If it was habitual then yes, it's a problem.
It sounds like a reluctant celebratory evening & you kept in touch with your boyfriend up until he went to bed.
You can understand his anxiety, right?
His A happened in the bar scene & you are out in a bar. It's possible he was worried that you might be seeking a revenge A?
What really needs to happen is turn to each other and talk this out calmly. He might need reassurance that the bar thing was a one time deal & you truly aren't seeking revenge.

Oh. And good job on the 5k!! Aren't they fun?


♥ WINE - the other fruit juice! ♥


Posts: 36162 | Registered: Apr 2005
heartbroken0903
♀ Member
Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 10:14 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WS here.

I don't think going to the bars with your female friend is a problem. I do think it would have been more courteous to let your boyfriend know that your plans had changed and you'd be out a couple of hours later than you initially told him. For all he knew, you could have gotten into a wreck or been assaulted or something, God forbid. I know that's what would be going through my mind if I were in his shoes.


Me: WS, 30s
XH: BS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

Reconciling after divorce

"Someday you'll look back on all these days
And all this pain is gonna be invisible." - Hunter Hayes, "Invisible"


Posts: 2077 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think going to the bars with your female friend is a problem. I do think it would have been more courteous to let your boyfriend know that your plans had changed and you'd be out a couple of hours later than you initially told him. For all he knew, you could have gotten into a wreck or been assaulted or something, God forbid. I know that's what would be going through my mind if I were in his shoes.

This will probably sound like a justification, but I was keeping him updated until he told me he was going to sleep. If he wasn't asleep, I would have continued to keep him updated. And I was going to send him a text when I got home safely letting him know, but he texted me about 5 minutes before I arrived home. We both have GPS on our phones, so he was able to see that I wasn't home yet. I guess if it happens again in the future, I'll just keep him updated even if he's asleep.

His A happened in the bar scene & you are out in a bar. It's possible he was worried that you might be seeking a revenge A?

I do understand that, which is why I'm worried I have a double standard and should avoid bars in the future. I'm not seeking a revenge affair. That might have been more of a realistic concern right after Dday, but I've settled out since then. I really only want to be with my wBF. He's always been the jealous type though. I thought it was cute before Dday. Now it aggravates me more I think. But, I do want to be respectful to him and his feelings.


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 1032 | Registered: Jul 2013
Lucky
♀ Member
Member # 6864
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

heartbroken0903 is exactly right & I thought I'd put that in my response about letting boyfriend know about the change in plans & the delay in coming home. Even if he was asleep he'd have woken to a text or voicemail that you'd be out later than planned.


♥ WINE - the other fruit juice! ♥


Posts: 36162 | Registered: Apr 2005
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 10:23 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You went out with a girl friend and had a good time. You kept in contact with him..and changed your mind and decided to stay out a little later. I don't see this as a double standard. I see this as him trying to punish you because he feels it's unfair that he has to check in with you when he is out.

Honestly? I think he is trying to find something to put off on you,to distract from his shitty behavior.

You didn't cheat. You don't have poor boundaries. You were showing him more respect than he showed you,when you kept checking in with him throughout the evening.

Since his A started in a bar..then no more bars. Affairs have consequences..this is one of them.


BS(me)41
FWH 45
4 kids..21,20,11,9
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Happily Reconciled.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7136 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 10:27 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Since his A started in a bar..then no more bars. Affairs have consequences..this is one of them.

He's in agreement that he can't go to a bar without me. I think he just thinks that it should work both ways, and that I shouldn't go to a bar without him. I kind of feel that it's unfair that I can't go to a bar, but I do understand his feelings since I don't want him going to a bar.


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 1032 | Registered: Jul 2013
Lucky
♀ Member
Member # 6864
Default  Posted: 10:56 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

One of our rules in R was:
If he can't do it then neither would I.

Bars weren't an issue with us, however, in the many years of being here I've seen many affairs starting in bars/clubs. It's a breeding ground for affairs.


♥ WINE - the other fruit juice! ♥


Posts: 36162 | Registered: Apr 2005
Josephine01
♀ Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 11:09 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He's in agreement that he can't go to a bar without me. I think he just thinks that it should work both ways, and that I shouldn't go to a bar without him. I kind of feel that it's unfair that I can't go to a bar, but I do understand his feelings since I don't want him going to a bar.

I have followed your posts a little because I worry about you. My first indication was to tell you to tell him that you did nothing wrong. But after thinking about it you should have let him know where you were. As for crossing other boundaries. I don't think you should be punished for his A. But, you two should talk about it and get whatever decision you make ironed out and stick to it.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
Josephine01
♀ Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 11:10 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

*when I said where you were, I mean that you were going to stay out later.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
soconfusednow
♀ Member
Member # 40078
Default  Posted: 11:33 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can see it both ways

He's right though that I didn't go to bars while dating him before Dday. I went to bars before I met him, and I tried to get him to go to bars with me after we met. He said that it wasn't his thing and didn't enjoy it, and we spent all our weekends together, so I just stopped going.

Going to bar was something you did, but stopped because he didn't want to go. He said it wasn't his thing.

Have you ever crossed the line at a bar? He has.

One of our rules in R was:
If he can't do it then neither would I.

This sounds like a good idea.
It did catch me last night though. My WH knew I was coming on this site but I chose not to tell him the name of it, since I see it as my "safe place" Last night he asked my directly "What is the name of that web site?" Since I expect honest answer to all questions I ask, I felt I had to tell him, whether I was ready to or not.


D-Day January 2013
prior EA in the 90's
me 50
WH 52
NC-several
last broken NC 7/2013 (hopefully)
Married 29 years
2 kids
Want to believe it's over, but is it really? Will I ever trust again?

Posts: 306 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
sisoon
♂ Member
Member # 31240
Default  Posted: 11:53 AM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hate double standards. When arguing, if someone shows me I'm arguing based on a double standard, I fold. I can't even look for other reasons to support my position.

But after cheating, there can be apparent double standards. My W has to follow different rules than I do, to protect herself and our M. We're both NC with ow and her family, but basically I have no limits on who I spend time with. (There are, of course, limits on my behavior, because of our M vows and various agreements.) W must keep me informed of her whereabouts and companions. I keep her informed out of courtesy, but if I'm late, it's no big deal. I go for 2 hour bike rides, during which I'm out of communication areas, and during which I could really be doing anything. W has very few 2 hour blocks of totally free time. As I say, this protects her and our M.

Your BF said he was going to bed. I wouldn't communicate with anybody who said they were going to bed unless it was an emergency, and another drink isn't an emergency.

Second, he cheated via the bar scene; you didn't.

A healthy initiative from him could have been, 'I'm uncomfortable with your going to a bar. Let's negotiate a new agreement about this.'

Instead, your BF beat you up emotionally. Maybe he's just immature, maybe he's not a candidate for R, maybe he's an abuser, maybe he's one of a million other possibilities.

But I don't think you violated any agreement, based on what you report, so I see no problem with your behavior.

BTW, some people, including me, think t-shirts are sexy. In fact, I suspect lots of people think women are sexy no matter what they wear. You can get hit on anywhere, no matter what your standards are.

It's fine to put yourself under the same limits as your BF - but he doesn't get to complain unless you've made an agreement to do so. If there's no agreement, all he gets to do is to ask for one - and you get to choose whether you agree or not.


fBH (me) - 65+, fWW (her) - 65+, Married 45+, together since 1965
DDay - 12/2010
Recovered, not yet fully R'ed
I share my own experience because it's the only experience I know, not because I'm a good model.

Posts: 9757 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 1:15 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have you ever crossed the line at a bar? He has.

I've never crossed any lines at a bar while I've dated him. I did used to meet guys at bars before I met him, and he knows that.

One of our rules in R was:
If he can't do it then neither would I.

This makes me think that I do have a double standard then, and that I shouldn't go to bars. I do follow that rule on most things. Like I wanted a GPS thing on his phone, so I put it on mine too.

It's fine to put yourself under the same limits as your BF - but he doesn't get to complain unless you've made an agreement to do so. If there's no agreement, all he gets to do is to ask for one - and you get to choose whether you agree or not.

We didn't have an agreement, so I don't think I did anything wrong last night, other than not anticipating his feelings on the subject. I guess I need to decide what to do in the future, now that I know he has a problem with it.

I think this is going to sound like a justification again... but I feel like my whole life is consumed with his A. I think about it when I wake up, think about it when I'm at work, think about it when I'm with him, think about it when I'm falling asleep. And for about 4 hours last night when I was getting a drink and playing pool with my female friend, I wasn't thinking about the A. I was happy. Relaxed. I was laughing, and I felt lighthearted. It made me in a good mood, and caused me to text sweet things to him. I was happy, and I missed him. I don't go out often (maybe once or twice a month), but I always get that feeling of happiness when I'm with my female friend. She's the only person I spend time with other than wBF, and it's just good for me. There's not much to do past 9 PM here except going to a bar, so I guess it's something I really don't want to give up. But I feel selfish saying that, because I don't think it's fair for me to go to bars and upset him, when I expect him to not go to bars. It is a double standard on my part.

I didn't cross any boundaries last night. If the situation was reversed and he did the exact same things in the bar that I did, I wouldn't be upset at anything he did. The problem I guess is that he doesn't know what I'm doing, and he's sitting at home worried about it. And that's not fair to him.

Not sure what to do in the future on this issue.

ETA: I guess there's also a small part of me that's angry at him for getting upset about this, even though I know it's not right to feel that way. He made a comment in a text last night about what he would have done. I bit my tongue and kept my thoughts to myself in order to avoid a fight, but what he did in the past was tell me he was at his dad's house while he was really at a bar with another woman. For a whole month he was going to bars with this woman before the A started, and I had no clue he was there. What he did in the past was get drunk at a bar while telling me he wouldn't drink more than one drink, and had a ONS with a woman in the bar. So, I guess I'm a little angry. I told him I was going last night. I invited him originally to do the 5K with me. I texted him throughout the night until he went to bed. And I didn't cross any boundaries or do anything inappropriate.

[This message edited by Lonelygirl10 at 1:32 PM, September 28th (Saturday)]


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 1032 | Registered: Jul 2013
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Im curious.

You didn't ask for passwords..yet more than once,he was sneaky and got yours..and at the same time,did NOT give you his passwords.

He pulled that crap on the other forum.

He wanted to vet the couple who was going to counsel you..before you met them.

He has been reading your texts,email,facebook,etc..without your knowledge..for months.

Now he is angry because he told you he was going to bed,and you didn't text him to tell him you changed your mind and decided to stay out a little longer.

He is acting like he doesn't trust you.

Does he?

[This message edited by confused615 at 1:30 PM, September 28th (Saturday)]


BS(me)41
FWH 45
4 kids..21,20,11,9
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Happily Reconciled.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7136 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
Lonelygirl10
♀ Member
Member # 39850
Default  Posted: 1:41 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He is acting like he doesn't trust you.

Does he?

He says that he trusts me. He says that it's other people that he doesn't trust.

I've made that exact same statement to an ex before though, and I've learned in IC that it's not a truthful statement. If you really trust a person, then you know that person won't do anything bad even if they are tempted by other people.

We have both been more on the jealous side throughout our relationship, even before Dday. I actually liked that quality about him before Dday. Neither of us believed in opposite sex friends, and neither of us believed in going to bars alone. I had previously dated someone who went to bars and played the wing man, and I just learned that's not what I was looking for. I gladly gave up going to bars myself when I met wBF, because I thought that was fair. I didn't want to do anything that I wouldn't want him to do, and it was totally worth it to me at the time. I later found out that he was friends with the female coworker and went to bars with her, but I didn't know it at the time.

I think after the A, he's almost more jealous. My theory is that he saw how easy it was to cheat and how long he got away with it, and he's paranoid that I'm going to do the same thing. I didn't know about the A until he confessed, because I respected his privacy and never looked in his phone. If I had, I'm sure I would have found all the text messages. So I think he looked in my phone because he knows how he got away with it. And I think he's worried about bars because he knows that he cheated after drinking. But, all this is just my theory. He hasn't said these things.


29 Bgf
Dday: April 2013
Relationship ended: January 2014

Posts: 1032 | Registered: Jul 2013
sisoon
♂ Member
Member # 31240
Default  Posted: 3:05 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We didn't have an agreement, so I don't think I did anything wrong last night,...

Great! But the you go and eff it up...

...other than not anticipating his feelings on the subject. I guess I need to decide what to do in the future, now that I know he has a problem with it.

You changed your plans after he said he was going to bed. You didn't let him know. Accept that you did a reasonable thing. Accept that you did a right thing. Accept that there was NOTHING wrong with what you did.

WRT anticipating his feelings, cut that out right now. You were out having fun without him - but e wouldn't have had much fun with you and your GF anyway. You came in late. Boo Hoo. He just needs to accept that sometimes he won't get what he needs. His 'feelings' on this are his problem, not yours.

WRT the 'future', you absolutely do not know that your BF has a problem with the future. You know only that he had a problem with last night, because that's all he told you about.

Ideally, if he has a problem with the future, he needs to bring it up. Practically and theoretically, it's possibly OK for you to bring it up, but given the state of the relationship, it's probably better for you to wait for him.

Look, at best, you and your BF are lousy at communicating WRT your relationship.

It's more likely, however, that you let yourself get stepped on by him and/or by other people. You're the only one who can fix that, and I hope you do. I really hope you're in or will start IC to learn to be yourself without co-dependence.

It's also probable that this guy has no idea how to be a good partner, and he may be some type of abuser, which means you're too good for him - and you should consider, at least, getting yourself out of this relationship.

You definitely have to worry about double standards - both his and yours end up with you being used, misused, and possibly abused. You deserve a lot better than that.


fBH (me) - 65+, fWW (her) - 65+, Married 45+, together since 1965
DDay - 12/2010
Recovered, not yet fully R'ed
I share my own experience because it's the only experience I know, not because I'm a good model.

Posts: 9757 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area
bionicgal
♀ Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 3:13 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Out of consideration, I would have texted him when staying out later. What if he wakes up and worries about you? Would you have liked, even pre-A, to be in that postition? And post-A when lots of WS worry about retaliatory affairs? That is just inconsiderate in my book.

A question to ask yourself is if you weren't flaunting your "freedom" just a tiny, wee bit.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is more like a mental break than a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 1740 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 3:33 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMO you are using your friend as an excuse. You constantly said one thing then did another. Telling your boyfriend about it is better than not, but I'd expect anyone to be put out. Even just setting aside the issue of boundaries - which I disagree that you have good boundaries if you say your friend walked all over them the way she did - constantly updating what you're doing instead of sticking to what you're saying gets old fast.


I say this independently of his other behaviors, which are all questionable.


“Fate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.”

Posts: 7363 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
TimeToManUp
♂ Member
Member # 37538
Default  Posted: 4:19 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I say this independently of his other behaviors, which are all questionable.

Same as this^^^.

I thing there are different types of double standards. You not going to bars because he can't be trusted there? Not right. I cheated, so no opposite sex friends for me. My BW has never done so, so that is not off limits for her. However, she is big on being considerate, and if she expects me to check in with her about changes of plans or the like, I would expect the same courtesy.

But as stated, there seems to be shitty behavior on your WBFs part that is external to that discussion.


I know we're worth it.
WH (Me-33)
BW (tattoodchinadoll-31)
D-Day: 12/22/11
Together 15 years, married for 10.
Three daughters, 8, 4 and 2.

Posts: 227 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: New Jersey
k8la
♀ Member
Member # 38408
Default  Posted: 9:05 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Couples tend to do mystical mind reading when their communication skills are not stellar.

In this case, you didn't necessarily do something wrong, as much as you missed an opportunity to do something right.

Your girlfriend's wishes were more important than your instincts to put your boyfriend first.

Notice that - she pouted when you were going to go home to be with him?? and you acquiesced and stayed with her for HOURS longer than you had planned?

He gets the message that he doesn't matter to you.

And for that matter, you get the message that you're not as important as your girlfriend either.

It's not about a double standard as much as it is missing an opportunity to do something your boyfriend didn't when he cheated on you - and that was to put the two of you first, before all others.


Posts: 121 | Registered: Feb 2013
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