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Just Found Out Post Reply     Print Topic    
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deeplysaddened
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Default  Posted: 1:27 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bigger

I have looked in the finances and I think I know where the affair is being financed. A good portion of the A is financed through cash. Many of her clients pay for services in cash and credit card. I'd like to be able to account for the cash, but that would involve me being in her office collecting the cash. I could only imagine how happy that would make my WW to see me at her office everyday. HA!

Actually, I am very suspicious of her business credit card. I have never never ever seen one of the monthly business credit card statements. I know she pays that credit card bill (through her business checking account). She'd pay the bill monthly. But, somehow, starting in August, I see no more checks addressed to the credit card company. Plus, that monthly statement goes to her business address. Not too hard for me to get the key to her mail box though. If I could only get my hands on those monthly statements.

I have checked phone records and found a lot of numbers. Problem is that her office gets tons of phone calls. I have checked to see if there are any recurrent numbers or any numbers with long talk times or weird hours. Nothing stands out. I may not be looking hard enough with the phone numbers. But, I guess I need to pay for a service to do that reverse cell phone lookup.

She and her OM do have the advantage when it comes to the office. The OM has keys and access codes to probably all the doors in the building. He knows the ins and outs of the entire building. I am sure they are absolutely itching to share time together outside of the office. And the only time this will happen is when I am out of town.

I know I am obsessing about the hunt. But, I'm a guy. Give me a problem and I want to solve it. I'm patient. I'm waiting. And when the time is right, she will be served with the petition divorce papers.


Posts: 19 | Registered: Sep 2013
Brandon808
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Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What if I am wrong and that the crabs were contracted through infected bedding, sheets, towels, toilet? I think that is far fetched though.
It seems you answered your own question. I dare say it is more than just far fetched. The odds are astronomical. The point is whether she can put you on the defensive.


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 4000 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
mchercheur
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Member # 37735
Default  Posted: 1:58 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What if I am wrong and that the crabs were contracted through infected bedding, sheets, towels, toilet? I think that is far fetched though

Agree with Brandon, but anyway, unless you borrowed a towel from someone in your gym,
I am betting you haven't used any bedding/sheets/towels outside of those in your own home. Catching crab lice from a toilet seat is extremely unlikely. Lice cannot live long away from a warm human body. Also, lice do not have feet designed to walk or hold onto smooth surfaces such as toilet seats. Pubic lice are considered to be an STD.
Even if you caught them, not from sexual contact with WW, but from your bed linen, it still implicates her.


together 25 yrs, married 24 yrs, 4 children;Rebuilding
D Day: 5/10/2011 PA
OW: WH's co-worker,divorced, no children, 20 yrs younger than I-----& she knew he was married, had met our kids, but that did not stop her from trying to destroy our family

Posts: 1396 | Registered: Dec 2012
toomanyregrets
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Default  Posted: 2:00 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Maybe having her served in the office with her co-workers present will shake her up.
Here in NY you don't even need a reason to D, all you have to do is fill out the paper work.

Oh, and by the way you can't get crabs from a toilet seat.

[This message edited by toomanyregrets at 2:29 PM, October 3rd (Thursday)]


BH - 64
fWW - 60

"Affairs are not mistakes, they are a series of deliberate choices." - CrappyLife


Posts: 484 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Upstate NY
Secrets Kept
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Member # 40630
Default  Posted: 2:24 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you make regular surprise visits into her Office? I would several times a week......after texting her that you would be somewhere else.

Or....make up that "out of town" trip you mentioned would be their only chance to meet outside the office. Get a local hotel or stay with friends/family, then both you & your PI sit & see what happens since she will think the coast is clear.


Marriage #1=BW-46 (now)
XWH-Deceased on his 36 bday
Divorced in 1996
Marriage #2= Married in 2003
H-44
2 kids together-DS14 & DD12
"All this time I was finding myself & I didn't know I was lost"

Posts: 219 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Midwest USA
Secrets Kept
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Default  Posted: 2:24 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do you make regular surprise visits into her Office? I would several times a week......after texting her that you would be somewhere else.

Or....make up that "out of town" trip you mentioned would be their only chance to meet outside the office. Get a local hotel or stay with friends/family, then both you & your PI sit & see what happens since she will think the coast is clear.


Marriage #1=BW-46 (now)
XWH-Deceased on his 36 bday
Divorced in 1996
Marriage #2= Married in 2003
H-44
2 kids together-DS14 & DD12
"All this time I was finding myself & I didn't know I was lost"

Posts: 219 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Midwest USA
OK now
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Member # 14459
Default  Posted: 2:47 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree with OMG6886; why don't you tell your WW that you are leaving town on a business trip for a couple of days, book a motel room and you and the PI keep tabs on her and the OM.

You may need to put VAR's in your house just in case the OM wants to screw your wife in the marriage bed; sounds like something he would get off on.

Seriously though neither of you love one another; its nearer hate than anything. Certainly no respect. Why not just file and be done with it; then you will be free of this cheater and can move on. Your wife isn't going to reconcile and give up her convenient lover; she isn't going to be your partner again - in both a physical and emotional sense. Why torture yourself any further.


Posts: 1748 | Registered: May 2007 | From: NC
deeplysaddened
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Default  Posted: 5:12 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for the insight everyone.

While I could now just simply file, there are certain things I need to take care of. I am in the process of changing beneficiaries for the investments, life insurance, retirement, educational investments. Also, I have to visit another lawyer to change my revocable trust.

All this has to be done prior to filing for the petition. Otherwise, she stays as the primary beneficiary.

Of course I wouldn't do anything stupid like hide money and have secret accounts. That would bite me in the ass later.

While my WW may be good at lying and duping me for the past 3 or so years, she knows little or next to nothing of the finances. I basically control all the finances, investments, deeds, etc. Sure, it's pretty much community property in a no fault divorce state.

But, if by some miracle I get concrete proof, this becomes incredible leverage. I doubt she will want to fight it out in court (because of discovery). Basically, there will be all sorts of digging and shedding light on every possible detail (credit card statements, office video surveillance tapes). And hopefully she will wake up and realize that all this litigation will be expensive and embarrassing. It will leave less funds for our
kids.

Though I know she will accuse me of being a neurotic obsessive spouse.

If she still refuses to come clean, then I will start asking questions from her employees (current and past), office staff, OM and his wife, etc. This may be uncomfortable for my WW.

As for the surprise visits, I do that now. I bring lunch for her and her secretary. I show up a couple times a week with the kids. I don't expect to find anything then because she is busy working.

Actually, I don't hate her at all. I hate what she did to me and the family. My lawyer has already given me names of child therapists that will be meeting my kids.

As for the out of town trips, that will be scheduled in the upcoming months.

And maybe I will take further tactics against the OM. I know he is a custodial staff and does not make much. I will contact the OM wife and encourage her to protect herself. The idea of helping her out financially (to acquire the services of a top family law attorney) is not out of the question.

I am willing to take some punishment now. First and foremost, I want to protect my kids. But, I also want to be the one who has the last smile.



Posts: 19 | Registered: Sep 2013
doggiediva
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Default  Posted: 5:45 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I thought that changing beneficiaries especially when it comes to pensions and trust funds ( if one is married ) required a signature(in front of a notary as a witness) from the non employee spouse to waive being designated as a beneficiary..In my state it works that way..

[This message edited by doggiediva at 5:47 PM, October 3rd (Thursday)]


Don't tie your happiness to the tail of somebody else's kite

Posts: 1255 | Registered: Nov 2011
Calabro
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Angry  Posted: 6:24 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I thought that changing beneficiaries especially when it comes to pensions and trust funds ( if one is married ) required a signature(in front of a notary as a witness) from the non employee spouse to waive being designated as a beneficiary..In my state it works that way..

Yep I had that problem. You definitely need her authorization in order to change.
I had a house on my name 15 yrs before I got married and her name was not on the mortgage or deed but when I want to sell it. I needed her signature.


NO ONE CAN MAKE YOU FEEL INFERIOR WITHOUT YOUR CONSENT

Posts: 65 | Registered: Nov 2005
Bigger
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Default  Posted: 7:48 PM, October 3rd (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Deeply,

When I read what you have I see the major red flag of crabs but other than that… pinkish red table-flags at best.

I’m a former cop. It was hammered into me never to jump to conclusions.

I found infidelity sites when I suspected my wife of infidelity about 9 years ago. This is the woman that I met about 18 months after my then-fiancé cheated on me. My wife and I have (fortunately) never had to deal with infidelity in our relationship. But at that time 9 years ago I was just like you; I was dead certain she was cheating.
OK – granted she didn’t give me crabs. Like I say then that is a great red flag. I give you that.

But whatever action of her I posted on the sites I always got the reply that this was definitely a sign of infidelity. So if she stated to go to the gym it was because she was cheating. If she didn’t go to the gym it was because she and (possible) OM had a fight and she was moody. If she bought a new perfume it was because she was cheating, if she didn’t use perfume then it was a sign that she was out of the marriage. If she showed me interest it was to subdue guilt – if she showed me no interest it was because she was cheating.
Eventually it got to be like in the witch trials of yore: if the alleged witch drowned when thrown with her hands tied into a pond then it proved she wasn’t a witch. If she floated she was definitely a witch and was executed. It’s a lose-lose situation.

At that point I recalled the things I learned at the academy and applied while in the force. I stopped trying to discover if she was cheating and started trying to discover what she was DOING. And I used all the tricks; finances, GPS, VAR, stake-outs, traps and all.
Quite quickly after this change of methodology I discovered what was going on. Not infidelity but definitely something I had to fix in the marriage. Something I was lucky to find out and even luckier to fix.

Now – I personally don’t think parking side-by-side or wearing work-out clothes indicate infidelity. I find it strange to think of a janitor having an office harem. I find it strange that this goes on undisturbed despite crabs. Sorry friend but I really don’t see that you have “proof” there.

If you truly want to reconcile then I suggest you talk to your wife about the seriousness of the situation (maybe with a MC or mediator present). Offer that you BOTH take polygraphs, the question being about fidelity and the crabs. After all – she insists you brought them home and you insist she brought them home.
Make it clear to her that there really are only two options: a divorce based on the present situation or a possibility of reconciliation based on truth. If there is something that she want’s to confess to now before the poly then make it clear that you are willing to try to work things out, that by fessing up your marriage might have a chance but that the present situation can only end in divorce.

Other than that… Can you bug her office? Can you bug her purse or computer case? Is there any way you can get some sort of monitoring equipment into the office? You mention having a PI so he should be familiar with this sort of stuff. It definitely doesn’t give you legal evidence but right now all you want is the truth.


"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

Posts: 5565 | Registered: Sep 2005
womaninflux
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Default  Posted: 12:03 AM, October 4th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Court doesn't care who cheated and how long it went on. They will care about STDs...that can result in another civil action.

The thing you wrote that struck a chord with me: "WW almost has this split personality or Dr.Jeckel Mr.Hyde thing..."
That is EXACTLY what was going on with my SAWH, especially the last 6 months of the A. It's a characteristic of their "secret/double life" they are leading.

Also, it took 2 weeks and more detective work on my end to finally get my SAWH to admit what was going on. He continued to see the OW two week past the original DD. I noticed perfume on a seatbelt in his car and it wasn't mine...and I had not ridden in the car since the prior weekend. I called him out on it and he said he'd given a friend a ride. I bet he did!!! So I did more searching (went through his glove compartment and found jewelry receipts dating back 2+ years for stuff he never gave me) and confronted him in the middle of the night and he finally admitted it. God, what a long strange trip it's been. No matter what happens (we're trying to R but who knows what will end up happening ) I feel so much stronger for getting to the bottom of this and not taking his crap anymore. I will get through this...and so will you!

Hang in there...more info is bound to come to light. It always does. Remember, the spouse is always the last to know...I ignored my gut for way too long.


BS - mid-40's
SAWH - mid 40's
Kids - 2 elementary school aged
Getting tons of therapy and trying to "work it out"

Posts: 910 | Registered: Jun 2013
deeplysaddened
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Default  Posted: 1:00 AM, October 4th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bigger

Again your insight is invaluable. May I call you Master Yoda?

Yes, the real red flag are the pubic crabs. You know at first I wasn't sure what I had. I'm in my backyard frequently and have been bitten by fireants, chiggers, fleas, and host of other 6 or 8 legged critters. To make things more confusing for me, one of my kids came home with head lice a few months earlier. I figured they were head lice. I treated myself with the lice shampoo and really didn't think much of it. But, now I realize the head lice and pubic lice are two different animals/species. Head lice stay on the head. Pubic lice likes the pubes (and eyelashes too - a sign of child sexual abuse).

Plus, when I confronted my wife about the crabs and affair, her response was highly defensive (more like venomous).

I also agree with you about all the other things (the gym, implants, moodiness, secretiveness of her cell phone, not wanting to share password for her business account) are definitely not proof. To me they are some possible signs of infidelity. But, looking at the overall picture, I am very suspicious.

I really appreciate your comment about checking out what she is DOING. I have caught several of her lies. She tells me that she has to go to one of my kids school function for an hour, but the GPS shows she went directly to the office. And when she gets home she tells me about the school function and what went on there. Or she tells me that she will go to the gym and then to the store to buy a gift for a colleague who is retiring. The GPS shows she went to the gym and then straight to the office. The PI told me that she only had her purse with her (and not a gift bag). The GPS tracker has shown some strange behavior. Like the other day, she was leaving the office. I assume she was going to the gym. But, it shows the car leaving the office and then returning back to the office. But, instead of parking in the front of the building (usual spot), the GPS shows her car parked in the back of the office building. In the 3-4 years she has been in this office, I have never seen her park the car in the back. And she is not the type to look for different parking spots.

The weird thing was that she left the keys in the car and ignition running while I assume she ran into the building (VAR picked this up). I have no idea what this means. Maybe she left something in the office. But, I can't understand why she parked in the back. If I may jump to conclusion, I'd say she was meeting OM for the 5-10 minutes. But, I could be entirely wrong.

During most of the times I have placed VAR in my/her car, I only hear the radio (and a lot of road noise/interference). The place I need to put the VAR is in his office. As much as I would like to, I think that may be illegal.

There's nothing going on in her office (because her secretary is there 8 hours) and my WW will not get up early if she can help it.

I had thought about the polygraph test. Is this controversial? I know very little about the polygraph, but have heard some people swear by it and others totally discount it.

I was gungho about having her served with the divorce papers...until I read your post. I do very much like your idea of talking to her and getting the polygraph. If she refuses to do the test, then what? Does that mean I have my answer? Or could it mean she is in the camp that discounts the utility of the polygraph test?

Actually, is it possible for an honest person to fail the polygraph (because of nervousness)? I would hate to take the test and then fail it because I was nervous or sweating. How awful would that be?

About the beneficiary stuff... I was able to call my investment company and have it changed for both the retirement and nonretirement accounts. Now, for the revocable living trust, that may be a different animal. No problem changing beneficiary for my life insurance policy (in case my WW and OM decide to add strichnine to my diet - just kidding - I hope).

I appreciate everyone's advice and experience. For me I have to make sure I do this right. I don't want to rush it and regret it later.
You guys and gals are the best (and I do mean that).


Posts: 19 | Registered: Sep 2013
deeplysaddened
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Default  Posted: 1:12 AM, October 4th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Womaninflux

Yes, you are right about the STD's. But, in my case, I self treated and was clean. No damages. No medical record. For all I know, the opposing counsel could say it never happened.

But, what is interesting is that when I confronted my WW about the crabs, she accused me of cheating. Now this is assinine because if I were the one who was cheating, why the hell would I bring to her attention I had crabs? I would secretly treat myself and hope to God that she didn't get infected. And that is what I think she went through. Now that is a bad feeling to have - hoping to God your spouse doesn't get your crabs and come to you asking about it.

And by the way, when I showed her my bite marks and itchy red bumps, she didn't blink an eye. She shrugged and walked away.


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