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Divorce/Separation Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: No sign of "unfulfilled"
erzulie
♀ Member
Member # 3293
Concerned  Posted: 9:33 AM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So I took down my box of cards and letters I've kept over the years from WH. I know, a little self-tortuous ... but, the greatest emotional torture I feel right now is how he re-classified our entire marriage. I was happy, fulfilled, joyous. Many of our friends have told me that if they were asked, "who do you know that is married and truly happy?", that they would be quick to mention me and my WH. So, I've wracked my brain, trying to figure out if I missed any signs somewhere ...

So, I look through the cards just from the last year or two. He wrote many things ... "you are the wife of my dreams", "I am so blessed", "thank you for blessing me with your unyielding love", "I am so lucky", "I get to spend the rest of my life with you", "I am the happiest man alive", and "my love, trust, honesty and heart are all yours, forever".

No sign anywhere, not in any month of any year, that there was a deficit in this gushing of adoration. Certainly no signs of "I am unfulfilled", "I am not getting enough sex", "I can't talk to you", or "we bicker all the time".

Was he lying every time he told me he loved me?

[This message edited by erzulie at 9:34 AM, September 30th (Monday)]


A saying for my SI Family: "We may not have it all together, but together we have it all".

Fooled twice - almost exactly 10 years apart.


Posts: 3377 | Registered: Jan 2004 | From: California
chikastuff
♀ Member
Member # 35288
Default  Posted: 10:26 AM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is such a hard question to answer. I tell myself that it wasn't me he was lying to, it was himself. They lie because they can't be true to themselves.

I think waywards are often in the moment people. They compartmentalize, so while they're with you, or sending you flowers, or thinking of you, they really DO love you. But as soon as they think about something else, they shut off your compartment and they "love" the next thing. And I think they lack the attachment instinct that ties people together.

I struggle with the same thought. A lot. Because I truly did love him. Even with all of his imperfections. But I recognize that my feelings of love and attachment are my own instinctive feelings and he fundamentally lacks those things, along with a conscience and sense of empathy.


Me- 32
Happily engaged and moving on

Posts: 382 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: New England
FaithFool
♀ Member
Member # 20150
Default  Posted: 1:13 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I gave him back all those cards and letters. No use for them anymore.

Agree about the compartmentalization thing too. We were basically snowjobbed...


DDay: June 15, 2008
Mistakenly married Mr. Superfreak
20 years of OWs, WTF?
Divorced Dec 26, 2011
"Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget
to sing in the lifeboats". -- Voltaire

Posts: 17488 | Registered: Jul 2008 | From: Canada
Take2
♀ Member
Member # 23890
Default  Posted: 2:56 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Chickastuff nailed it describing my experience too. I received a lovely, and spontaneous: "you are the best thing that ever happened to me" note, the day before Dday


"We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us." Joseph Campbell...So, If fear was not a factor - what would you do?

Posts: 4129 | Registered: May 2009 | From: New England
Housefulloflove
♀ Member
Member # 38458
Default  Posted: 3:02 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What Chikastuff said.

But I recognize that my feelings of love and attachment are my own instinctive feelings and he fundamentally lacks those things, along with a conscience and sense of empathy.

Especially this. If you see people as being functional objects, you can't love them in the way a normal human can.

I love my coffee-maker. When I say that I mean I love what it does for me. I'm attached to it. If I moved it would go with me, I wouldn't do anything I know would break it and I proudly display it on my kitchen counter.

If it stopped working tomorrow I would be upset but only because it's not giving me what I need at that moment (a fresh cup of coffee). If it became clear that it wasn't going to do what I wanted to do anymore or that it would take a lot of effort to get it to work again, I would toss it in the garbage in a minute and try to replace it as soon as I could. I would "mourn" the loss of my coffeemaker for as long as it took me to find a suitable replacement. I "love" my coffee maker as much as a person can love an inanimate object. I think that is the type of "love" people like him have.

I think my ex is so twisted that this is love for him. He isn't capable of anything more. He doesn't *really* love the way one person should love another, but he lies to himself and others by giving his shallow feelings and attachments the same name.


Me-29 Starting over
ExWH-29 Probable NPD, PA, manchild
3 beautiful young children
DDay 1/20/13 Admits PA
No remorse so NO R. DIVORCED! 9/2013

Posts: 541 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: USA
sparkysable
♀ Member
Member # 3703
Default  Posted: 3:19 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I absolutely can relate to this post.

NOBODY in this world loved their wife more than XWH. People were JEALOUS. They wanted to be us. My friends told me after D-day that they used to think "I wish my H loved me as much as XWH loved SparkySable"

In fact, on D-day, I looked at the counter in the kitchen, and there were the beautiful bouquet of flowers he had brought home, because he had been being a jerk that week. Those fucking flowers. 9 days before D-day, he had given me a Mother's Day card with "I'll love you forever, and I sure hope you know it". REALLY?

So when you say this:

No sign anywhere, not in any month of any year, that there was a deficit in this gushing of adoration.
I get it 100%. And THIS is why I'm so fucked up over it.

The only thing that gives me some comfort is that I did research on sociopaths and NPD, and they get a high of of conning people, and people are just players in their little "game". I figure I was the victim of a sociopath, and back when I met him, I was young and naive and ripe for the picking. As I started getting older and more aware of the world, I wasn't serving his purposes anymore. Cue OW's entrance.


D-day OW#1 2/2004; R for 6 years; D-day OW#2 5/2010

Marriages that start this way, stepping over the bodies of loved ones as the giddy couple walks down the aisle, are not likely to last.


Posts: 3390 | Registered: Mar 2004 | From: NY
Catwoman
♀ Member
Member # 1330
Default  Posted: 3:38 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It is highly likely he was doing what he felt he had to do to keep you in the relationship. NPDs are excellent mimics. They mimic emotions, having none of their own. They also avoid self-introspection. Because their focus is on ego kibbles. They will do what it takes to stay on the gravy train. If it sounds cold and heartless, it is.

Cat


FBS: Married 20 years, 2 daughters 25 and 22. Divorced by the grace of GOD.
D-Days: 2/23/93; 10/11/97; 3/5/03
Ex & OW Broke up 12-10
"An erection does not count as personal growth."

Posts: 29661 | Registered: Apr 2003 | From: Massachusetts
laney57
♀ Member
Member # 35617
Default  Posted: 3:53 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is a very helpful thread erzulie. I am really starting to understand and believe that it was not US. I've been in this "what did I do"? Spiral for way too long. It's time for us to all see the light! Hugs


Update 09/28/14
Me - BS, 44
Him - WH, 46
Married - 23 years
D-Day - 05/12/2012
Trying to find me still
Gotta do this, but I'm broken - headed for divorce - 02/20
Hell if I know - 02/24
Divorcing 09/28/14

Posts: 230 | Registered: May 2012 | From: KY
Abbondad
♂ Member
Member # 37898
Default  Posted: 6:17 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think waywards are often in the moment people. They compartmentalize, so while they're with you, or sending you flowers, or thinking of you, they really DO love you. But as soon as they think about something else, they shut off your compartment and they "love" the next thing. And I think they lack the attachment instinct that ties people together.

I think this analysis is right on, as well as Kiblz's. I too was flabbergasted when my STBXWW informed me--as I literally begged her to stop this insanity and come back to her loving family--that she was "unhappy for most of the marriage."

I too have all those cards and notes expressing the precise opposite--a nearly point-by-point "rebuttal" to everything negative she has ever said about our marriage. It hurts, for sure. But she/he/they are truly troubled individuals. To have this incredible capacity to flat-out fabricate, rewrite, and compartmentalize does indeed reveal very serious attachment issues and personality-disorder.

When I first found all those letters--only a few months ago--it destroyed me for a few days. I felt like D-day all over again--just shocking betrayal. I walked alone around our empty house holding those cards, crying, and talking aloud to her: "See? What in the world are you talking about? We were a great couple! We always said we were! Everyone said we were! And you damn well know it!"

But now I can look at those same cards and sentiments and just feel sad at the tragedy and waste of it all. What unhappy people they must be, and what emotional gymnastics they must have to run themselves through to create and sustain this fiction.

And this is just one of the many reasons I knew I had to divorce. I always thought we were so alike. And we were. But ultimately not in the most important of all ways.


Divorced April Fool's Day 2014

Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
-Dune


Posts: 1626 | Registered: Dec 2012
Nature_Girl
♀ Member
Member # 32554
Default  Posted: 6:29 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I, too, have cards like that from my STBX. But you know what? I gave him lovey-dovey cards, too, even when I knew things were wrong, were broken. I had hopes that if I just kept on acting as if everything was okay, I could make it okay.


Me = BS (Stay-at-home-mom)
Him = EX-d out (abusive troglodyte NPD SA)
3 tween-aged kids
Together 20 years
D-Day: Memorial Weekend 2011
2013 - I DIVORCED HIM, I'M FREE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBOJpIwF47Y

Posts: 9819 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: USA
hurtbs
♀ Member
Member # 10866
Default  Posted: 7:29 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a card from my ex H from two weeks before the start of the A that said things like "You're the love of my life." 'I'm so happy with you." "I'm so excited for our life together." etc etc. A month after he wrote that, I got the ILYBNILWY speech and the "I haven't felt connected/happy/whatever bullshit for a long time."

Affairs aren't about rationality. Think about it, if they legitimately were thinking "I'm not happy... x, y, z are unsatisfying." then they would actually do something about it, instead of scramble for reasons after the fact.


Me BW Him XSAWH
DDays 2006, and then numerous more
Divorced 2012

"In life, unlike chess, the game continues after checkmate." - Asimov
"Be patient and tough; someday this pain will be useful to you." - Ovid


Posts: 15325 | Registered: Jun 2006
ideservebetter45
♀ Member
Member # 36951
Default  Posted: 7:54 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Same here. Tons of cards and love letters. People said we were the perfect couple.we were on a family vacation one month before i found out about the affair..I don't get it..I just don't.

Posts: 162 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: ideservebetter45
FieldsOfLavender
♀ Member
Member # 39154
Default  Posted: 8:01 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But I recognize that my feelings of love and attachment are my own instinctive feelings and he fundamentally lacks those things, along with a conscience and sense of empathy.

This describes my cheating husband. He's a sociopath and lacks empathy.


Posts: 198 | Registered: May 2013 | From: East Coast, USA
thenon-goddess
♀ Member
Member # 31229
Default  Posted: 9:06 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I love my coffee-maker. When I say that I mean I love what it does for me. I'm attached to it. If I moved it would go with me, I wouldn't do anything I know would break it and I proudly display it on my kitchen counter.

If it stopped working tomorrow I would be upset but only because it's not giving me what I need at that moment (a fresh cup of coffee). If it became clear that it wasn't going to do what I wanted to do anymore or that it would take a lot of effort to get it to work again, I would toss it in the garbage in a minute and try to replace it as soon as I could. I would "mourn" the loss of my coffeemaker for as long as it took me to find a suitable replacement. I "love" my coffee maker as much as a person can love an inanimate object. I think that is the type of "love" people like him have.

I still have a hard time with the "love" aspect of our M, but this analogy really nailed it for me and I understand in a way I didn't before. Thank you!

It also kind if explains the tired line if "I love you but I'm not in love with you." The "in love" in their case being the kind of love that "normal" people have and express.


Status: divorcing - I can see the light at the end of the tunnel!

Posts: 1249 | Registered: Feb 2011
PurpleRose
♀ Member
Member # 33129
Default  Posted: 9:15 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think many of us have this same experience... A few weeks prior to dday I was away with the kids on vacation and the Dooosh was lamenting on Facebook "I wish my family was here- way too quiet without them" or some crap. Then there were the phone calls of "I wish you were home already" and him meeting us at the gate in the airport with a boquet of flowers for me, a delicious meal waiting, and his hands all over me once we got the kids to bed because "I missed my wife so much!!"

Ehh, sure you did buddy.

As for all the cards expressing his devotion and love for his wife?? Well yes I have loads of them. So much for his 20 years of misery being married to me..

It's all horseshit. They lie to cover up lies, and expect everyone to believe the bullshit coming out of their mouths because they believe it. They have to, otherwise the enormity of what has transpired, and the cost of it all, would be too much for them to handle.

[This message edited by PurpleRose at 9:17 PM, September 30th (Monday)]


divorced the Dooosh
*****************************
even if you find your voice,
sometimes it does not matter anymore,
when you speak to a man who is deaf by choice.
~dodinsky

Posts: 3612 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: Happyville
thebighurt
♀ Member
Member # 34722
Default  Posted: 10:31 PM, September 30th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is so true in my M too! What Housefulloflove said hits it on the head. I had never thought of it that way, but he is VERY quick to throw anything away when it no longer suits his purpose. He was angry with me if I suggested it could be re-purposed, dismantled and good parts saved, or donated. He even wanted to scrap anything that was still perfectly good if it was something that was infrequently used, saying that if it was ever needed again, we could buy another! So, I guess I was just the coffeemaker he was tired of having in his kitchen like Housefulloflove said.

My bday was barely a month before DDay and I got a lovely card saying, "A little love letter to my Wife". Things had been strained, so I asked him if he meant it and he said he did and gave me a kiss. Two days before he saw the L and filed, then came home to admit what he had been doing and tell me he was leaving for one of them, he wanted to discuss our future; the immediate future, the next winter, and the rest of our lives. After his admission, I asked him why he had done that when he obviously already had that plan and the L appointment and he stammered until he came out with, "I, I, I, I, I'm making bad decisions". Well, NO SHIT!!!


Finding what life could have been....... Why didn't I see it?

Posts: 2381 | Registered: Feb 2012 | From: the Other Side
Too_Trusting
♀ Member
Member # 99
Default  Posted: 7:15 AM, October 1st (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I see this differently than the other posters. While I agree that NPD has difficulty really feeling ANYTHING sincerely like "normal" people, I still say his rewriting of the marriage is just to assuage his guilt. He can't stand that he has been found out to be the louse he is, and he's making excuses.


"Anyone perfect must be lying; anything easy has its cost. Anyone plain can be lovely; anyone loved can be lost." Barenaked Ladies

Posts: 2481 | Registered: Jun 2002 | From: North Carolina
sparkysable
♀ Member
Member # 3703
Default  Posted: 7:43 AM, October 1st (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It is highly likely he was doing what he felt he had to do to keep you in the relationship. NPDs are excellent mimics. They mimic emotions, having none of their own. They also avoid self-introspection. Because their focus is on ego kibbles. They will do what it takes to stay on the gravy train.
This is exactly it! It's like an actor in a play, reading a script, thinking "how can I make this part REALLY convincing?" Except this play is our life, and we're the unaware supporting actors.


D-day OW#1 2/2004; R for 6 years; D-day OW#2 5/2010

Marriages that start this way, stepping over the bodies of loved ones as the giddy couple walks down the aisle, are not likely to last.


Posts: 3390 | Registered: Mar 2004 | From: NY
cayc
♀ Member
Member # 21964
Default  Posted: 8:33 AM, October 1st (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh good lord, I just realized that I was merely a Mr. Coffee coffee maker.

This learning and realizing shit just never stops, does it?


"The difference between involvement and commitment is like ham and eggs. The chicken is involved, the pig is committed." -Martina Navratilova
"The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me." -Ayn Rand

Posts: 3119 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: Mexico
thebighurt
♀ Member
Member # 34722
Default  Posted: 9:29 AM, October 1st (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh good lord, I just realized that I was merely a Mr. Coffee coffee maker.

I'm so sorry, cayc, but welcome to the Island of Broken Coffee Makers.


Finding what life could have been....... Why didn't I see it?

Posts: 2381 | Registered: Feb 2012 | From: the Other Side
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