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User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 33
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here is an very interesting thing that happen. A man with perhaps One time in his live let a Boundary drop.. He eats the apple. But once you open pandoras box.. Once a cheat, always a cheat... Unless you get caught.

By jessb115258

This is a long story; I apologize for rambling…I can barely get through a day without swinging between extremes of wanting to divorce him and then thinking about putting it behind us like it never happened. I also think ignorance would be bliss…would be better off not knowing, he should have to spend the rest of his life living with the guilt.

My husband is an auditor and travels frequently; he’s usually gone for at least a week or two each month. He went to South Carolina for an assignment three weeks ago and I thought it was a normal trip like any other; he did tell me he was going with his co-worker, Emily, who I’ve met before and didn’t think anything of them traveling alone together. I hadn’t the slightest idea she was interested in my husband since she’s 16 years younger than him and has a serious boyfriend.

This past Saturday, I ran into his manager’s wife at the mall. We made small talk and out of the blue she said she had to hand it to me…she’s not as secure as me, she would never let her husband share a room with a younger, female co-worker. I was baffled, had no idea what she was talking about and just laughed it off that we had a very strong marriage. I spent the rest of my mall trip thinking about it and when I got home, I took the kids to the neighbors’ house to play so I could question him. I told him what his manager’s wife said and his face dropped. He came clean that his company was severely cutting back on expenses and asked him and Emily if they would be OK with sharing a room for the audit engagement; he didn’t tell me because he didn’t want to make a big deal about it. I believed him and left it alone, but I had a nagging feeling about it. I questioned him again after I put the kids to bed, telling him I didn’t feel right about it.

He broke down with his face in his hands; said he was very sorry, it meant nothing and he told Emily it couldn’t happen again and it was a mistake, and he would do whatever it takes to make it up to me. I was stunned, felt like I had the wind knocked out of me, and couldn’t believe what he was telling me. He was blubbering and I told him to slow down and start from the beginning and I wanted the entire truth and details.

He said the part about the company making them share a room was true and his manager and HR made a big deal about making sure it was OK with him and Emily. He didn’t want to tell me because he knew how I would react and there was no way around it because he had to go. They went about work normally, had dinner with the clients and went back to the hotel. I believe him when he says he didn’t have any sexual thoughts in mind and he didn’t think she did either; he says she hadn’t flirted with him at all. He said they both went about their night routines, got into the separate beds, the lights went out and they made small talk until it got quiet.

At this point, I thought he was going to have a seizure; he could barely find the words through his crying. He said he was half asleep on his side facing away from her, but could hear her moving around in her bed. He said all of a sudden she got into bed with him and when he turned around to face her, she kissed him and pressed up against him and he knew she was naked. He said he stopped thinking, got caught up in the moment, his clothes came off and they had sex in the dark. He said they did it again before falling asleep. He said he woke in the morning and she was back in her bed. He went into the shower to get ready for work and to clear his head (genius that he is, he didn’t lock the bathroom door). She joined him in the shower and they had sex again. They got dressed and left for the client’s office without talking. He said the day went by without any awkwardness from her as if nothing had happened. Through his crying, he said they had sex three times that night and again in the shower the next morning before leaving for the airport. He said reality set in on the flight back; he was wracked with guilt and disgust of himself. When they landed, he told her it was a mistake and it would never happen again. She said she understood and it would be their secret. I was in shock, just couldn’t process it. I couldn’t look at him and told him that I would sleep in the guestroom that night.

I really owe it to his manager’s wife, I never would’ve found out otherwise. He came home and didn’t seem different at all. I believe he’s told me the complete truth and I can see that he’s genuinely remorseful and scared of losing the kids and me. I just wish I could get inside his head to understand how he could have sex with this woman seven times. He’s tried to explain it as being in another city, in a strange hotel arrangement and having someone so much younger aggressively come onto him.

I just don’t know if I can get past it. How can he come home and act perfectly normal? I’ve asked him if he enjoyed the sex and he refuses to answer, says he doesn’t want to add more hurt, but I want to know. They didn't use protection so he's going to get tested; thankfully he had a vasectomy. He says they don’t talk at work unless it’s work related and that no one has a clue what happened. He says he’ll find an excuse not to travel with her again.

I just don’t know what to do. My mind is screaming divorce most of the time, but I also think about the life we’ve built together and our kids…how can I just throw it away without trying to fix it for them and then I think how he easily threw it away for cheap sex.

Now My theropist says.. and we talked about this situation.. It is heartbreaking. It happens.
I have posted this subject a few times.

He says..Look this is rare... it is no different than Honest M..

Honest, You cannot affair proof a marriage with NPD spouse.

There is not such a thing as an absolute. But the majority of M can be very happy if one partner is most healthy. That is perhaps what I should say.

[This message edited by trynhard at 2:43 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 2:35 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

but according to you we would have been justified if we did

I never said that. When did I say that?

It is never OK to go outside of your relationship to solve problems within a relationship. It's not our fault.

My blaming us would be an excuse. But there is always a reason. Be it sex, attention.. blah blah blah..

Dr Phil,

Don't try to make sense out of nonsense. Rationalizing your cheating spouse's behavior or sympathizing with him/her is pointless.

Beleive me.. I sympathize with NO CHEATER.

Then Dr. Phil goes on to the cheater..

It is unfair to compare a new, exciting, taboo fantasy relationship to one you've been in for years where there are kids, bills to pay, a house to run and noses to wipe. That is a ridiculous comparison.

Now my theropist says.. Be new, be exciting, etc.. Take those bill pressures off... and the consquences will be Married and Happy.

OK.. Here is my theme song..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOprnbaIgaY


Be quality = Happiness

[This message edited by trynhard at 2:46 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 2:47 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Brainwashing can be a good thing

Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
SisterMilkshake
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Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 2:50 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

- $5k spend in MC and IC
- $1000's in behavoir & sex theropy 237 hours.
You were robbed. Too bad you didn't at least donate the money you spent on your behaviour and sex therapy to SI because it would have been money better spent. This behaviour/sex therapist is the one giving you the poison Kool-Aid. If he really has a "panel" of women it is somehow skewed and the same as the cheaters to come up with the conclusion that if the BS's had been meeting their needs they wouldn't have cheated. What a fucking racket he has! Blame the BS's because they weren't "quality" "attractive" or "developed as a man" (or a woman, I suppose, or is this only for men?).
a question....how could so many of us "see" that being a quality husband or wife does not affair proof a marriage....and you don't....way too many times you have put yourself in the preachin mode of being a quality person within the marriage and the hiusband/wife would not have a need to cheat...
i wonder if you NEED to believe that in order for you to continue in your marriage..especially since your wife claims she is just fine and not the issue...because of her attendance at classes she "knows" enough.
iwam, I believe this is the truth for tryn'. And is trying to get everyone else to drink the Kool-Aid. No thanks!
Not many people are as fortunate as I have been in life to recieve the help I needed.
I feel it is very unfortunate that you got the "help" that you did. There are many people that prey upon vulnerable people to make themselves rich.

And tryn, if you have been really reading here at SI for 4 years you would know no one "strong" believes your "theories" . Only the newbies suck that shit up. You don't post in the Betrayed Men thread 'cause they won't listen or agree with your bullshit. Except for Jack.

BTW, I don't feel Nature_Girl is bitter. Is she angry? You bet and righteously so. I believe she is amazing and wonderful. She is surviving not only infidelity but abuse. I am in awe of her.

Of course, these are your opinions and these are mine. You have as much right to express yours as I do mine. The tribe isn't drinking your Kool-Aid. Who do you want to drink it?


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8988 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 2:59 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here is some of what that theropist teaches...
However it is only 120 questions.

http://www.quicksurveys.com/s/s2HBb9y

Much of that theropy is discussions about what other men go through.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 3:02 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And tryn, if you have been really reading here at SI for 4 years you would know no one "strong" believes your "theories" .

I know.. I was drinking that kool aid before I started drinking this kool aid 21 months ago.

You know Jack has an advanced degree. He might just be way smarter than you criticized him to be.

[This message edited by trynhard at 3:06 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
SisterMilkshake
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Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 3:06 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I didn't criticize Jack. I said he is just about the only one who agrees with you. You are the one that assumes that must be a criticism.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8988 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 3:18 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

criticism
You were robbed.

You don't post in the Betrayed Men thread 'cause they won't listen or agree with your bullshit.

shall I go on? do you do this to your H too?

My point exactly... And I was once no different.

Peace out


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 3:21 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, yeah, I am criticizing you. I said I wasn't criticizing Jack.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8988 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 3:24 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

do you do this to your H too?
Yeah, ask him. Thats why he cheated on me. 'Cause I wasn't quality and I criticized him all the time.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8988 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
iwantamiracle
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Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 3:33 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ok boys and girls....i think we need to calm down just a bit....

and tryn i respectfully disagree with you as usual....and not all therapists are created equal.....and you do say that if you are quality your spouse will not have the need to cheat...this would be true if your spouse were normal with no foo or any issues of any kind...but we all know that WE ALL have issues...there are no guarantees in life.....you contradict yourself my friend...

and most of us here, especially in the lta forum have just about as much experience with therapy, books and self help shit....and you can't possibly truly know who you marry til the end....so many of us were fooled....we were lied to by the best there is....no matter what type of marriage one has....i have learned that you really just don't know who people are....even after knowing someone for years...you may think you know who they are but truly we don't.....

pfm accuses me of lots of things lately...and some of the shit he accuses me of is actually laughable and sad at the same time...it shows that he really doesn't know who i am...so that table turns both ways....he is so busy being within his small mind and he can't possibly "see" beyond his own logic, "see" beyond his perceptions, "see" the difference between right and wrong...

ironic ain't it....not only do i not really "know" him....but he really does not "know" me.....but alas because of all the therapy, books, self help shit and si i do know enough now.....and irony again...pfm has also read some of the books attended and attends therapy....and guess what he knows...and guess what its done for him....not enough...

tryn some people are just too broken....and life is too short....and his brokeness in a way broke me...i am forever changed by this experience...and frankly...if a ws never does the work...imo...they don't fix what was broken that caused them to make their poor choices....it means they stay broken...and they are really good at covering it up...and even if they work on it, like pfm does not mean it gets fixed...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
trynhard
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Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 3:34 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know Sister?

I know this.. Every cheater I have talked with had a hole missing.. Some were addicted.. because the could cope with.. ALL kinds of reason... The addiction was kinda like them giving up on life.. who cares.. It made the feel good. Most all the men said they were beat up.. no sex... Always a no.. Some me were just plain evil.. No fix for that man.

The women mostly said the needed attention. When you really questioned them, they said there men were not romantic.. they did not feel appriciated.. things like that.

Most all did regret what they did.. Said it was the biggest mistake in there live.. some didn't.

But most all said they felt like has there spouses been behaving different they would not have made that hurtful choice. So perhaps I place way too much value on those comments.

[This message edited by trynhard at 3:47 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 4:03 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know Sister?
Exactly. But it must be my fault. If I was behaving differently (quality) he wouldn't have "needed" to cheat.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8988 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 4:06 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tryn: just a thought..these ws's whom you interviewed....did any of them or all of them get to the bottom of their whys...by attending ic, mc and or reading all the books...or were their responses off the top of their heads....because again tryn...so many of us bs's are and were quality spouses....and the ws's are good at lying to themselves most of all....

pfm when questioned about why....still will answer because miracle did not give me sex.....that is still his first answer which is SO FUCKING FAR FROM THE TRUTH.....first off, he was cheatin with a married woman before he met me, second, i only said no when i had my period, was sick or had a sick child....and the most we went without sex was the 5 weeks after giving birth...was supposed to be 6 weeks..but I...ME...I wanted sex so i coerced him.....and of course he complied....and on a regular basis before the time he raped me the longest period was a week....and still the asshole will stay its because miracle didn't give him sex.....

go figure....but that is the mindset of a ws....they have to find justification within their own minds to be able to do what they were doing....

gotta run...play nice


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
7yrsflushed
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Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 4:09 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No offense taken Tryn. We have differeing opinions and that is fine.

Ok I get that 7years. I have been exactly where you are at before I signed up for sex and behavior Therapy. Please take this as being interesting not offensive.

When men come in making comments like that, he will says you are an undeveloped man. And this is what will make him think that..

“I personally think that if I need to spend my time figuring out ways to meet needs,”
This say you do give a shit about what your woman thinks or feels.

then “I am perpetually walking on eggshells”
This says you are a man who lives in fear.

What he will then tell you.. You are going to give a shit and you are going to develop into a man where all good behaviors become a part of who you are. And you are going to have the confidence that NO WAY you live in fears. But I know you do give a shit and you do live in courage so I don't believe that is exactly what you meant.

My problem with your theory is I was never the problem in my M. My STBXW was always the one with the problem. I want to be in a relationship with a mentally developed, grown adult. You want to know who needs me to worry about filling there needs? My children. Yes, my 6 and 8 year old are not developed enough to be responsible for themselves all the time so yes, for them I do actively look to fulfill there needs even the ones they don't realize they have yet. However my STBXW is a grown fully functioning adult, not a child. She isn't supposed to need the same level of care and attention as my children. She was my partner and we were supposed to have each other's back through thick and thin. When I had a down day, week, month she was supposed to be there to pick up the slack and vice versa. I had enough respect for her to treat her as I wanted to be treated, as an adult. I didn't need or want to treat her like my children, constantly worrying about what she is doing now because to me that's just demeaning to an adult. But my STBX was a child in a grown woman's body. She was the underdeveloped one that couldn't cope with life and just like my kids when they don't get there way she threw tantrums disguised as multiple A's. Normal people cope with adversity in healthy ways. Maybe not always the right way but definitely not by going out and screwing people who aren't there spouse.

Just because I expect a future significant other to be an actual adult and understand that things will not always be great doesn't mean I live in fear. Just because I expect us to work through our problems via communication and understanding doesn't mean I live in fear. Living in fear would mean not respecting my significant other at all. That would mean I didn't respect them enough as a person to allow and expect them to voice there feelings and make choices that I may or may not agree with. Living in fear would be me trying to remove there voice either by trying to anticipate what they wanted all the time or flat our being abusive. NOT living in fear means when things get bad or seem off I open lines of discussion or decide to walk away. Living in fear means instead of opening lines of communication I shut down and try even harder to do better so they won't leave or I sit there with my fingers in my ears saying lalalalalala over and over because I don't want to face reality. Living in fear to me describes WS behavior that we see so often.

To me though, WS fear and BS fear is different. BS fear happens and can take over when trying to break free from an unremorseful WS because the "known" is so much more comforting than the unknown we face when D is a real possibility. That fear isn't about meeting needs for the WS it's about meeting needs for ourself and getting to a point where we can make decisions even when uncomfortable that are in our best interests.

I fully expect to be in future relationships and I fully expect that that lovely lady will want someone that respects them enough to have open discussion with them about things we do or don't like instead of trying to quietly manipulate them via anticipating their needs. I would rather just ask questions then try to guess and wonder about the outcome.

If your group/mentor works for you and your M then more power to you. Everyone travels a different road. I am very secure in who I am after the A fallout. This isn't about degrees or classes or someone's level of experience being more than someone else's. This is about learning to love yourself enough to make better choices than you did in the past. This is about pulling yoruself out of the hole that for some is so deep you can't see light at the top. None of us can change the past so whether you D, R, or stay in limbo you have to deal with the present. Constantly trying to meet or anticipate the needs of your spouse or SO in order to keep others from doing it is IMO a fool's errand. It can't be done. There is ALWAYS someone better at something than all of us. I prefer to accept my future SO for who they are as is and hope they accept me for who I am as is. Again the only person I could ever control was me. No matter how many of my SO's needs I meet or don't meet she will always control her own actions and if she decides she wants out there is nothing I can do about it but accept it. Doesn't make me any less of a person it just means they weren't the right person for me.

[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 4:16 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1584 | Registered: May 2011
ReunitePangea
♂ Member
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 4:21 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here is my best attempt to lighten the mood here.........

One hour BJ's - dont you think it would start to hurt after awhile? It has to at least begin to get annoying right?


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
njgal480
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Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 5:05 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryin-
I think this comment of your's may be the case:

"But most all said they felt like had their spouses been behaving differently they would not have made that hurtful choice. So perhaps I place way too much value on those comments."

Personally, I would not believe these comments from the WS. After d-day they are scrambling for excuses to explain why they had the affairs.
They are looking for excuses for their spouses but mostly they are looking for ways to justify their behavior to themselves.
So...IMHO a WS will ALWAYS try to find some thing to 'blame' for their behavior.
They are grabbing for straws.

And most will later admit that it would not have made any difference what the BS was doing at the time....it was a brokenness inside of them that allowed them to embark on such selfish, immoral, and unethical behavior.

For every criticsm of the BS someone else could see that character trait as a positive.
For example: The WW that says her BH was a workaholic and did not give her enough attention.
Someone else would praise that same husband for being so hard working and being a good provider.
Meanwhile, if the BH was out of work and a stay at home dad the same WW could have just easily used that as an excuse for her affair! She could say her husband was lazy and she had lost respect for him etc. etc.

So ..that's where the theory of the quality BS does not ring true for me.I do not believe that somehow if the BS had behaved differently then the WS would not have had the affair.

Maybe... if the WS had not met that particular OW/OM then maybe the affair might not have happened but....IMHO it had little to do with the BS.

[This message edited by njgal480 at 6:57 PM, November 14th (Thursday)]


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WOW! ...gone for the day only to find that indeed this is the best forum at SI...!

[per honest:]problem is that with sociopaths, emotional abusers, and NPD's being quality is what attracts them! They are masters of manipulation. Perhaps I was not quality enough for ME and had enough self esteem to really see the red flags.
^^^no and yes. Sociopaths find weakness and exploit it, so no quality does not attract them IMO. Yes, it is about quality (for you) seeing red flags and getting NPD out of your life.

[per Sister:]There are no guarantee's.
^^^of course, for me, I am thinking about probabilities. How a statistical probability distribution curve might be altered. Improving a probability is a good thing. Or 'reducing the risk' as Allgood said.

[per tryn:]Once you go through a relationship where an affair happened.. You can then certainly get to an affair proof marriage.
^^^I agree with this - note: this is a post A statement - I think if you get to quality then you will probably serve divorce papers before being a victim again.

[per Sister:]I don't. I would be divorcing because I was sick of his selfishness and wasn't going to accept that anymore. It has nothing to do with reciprocity.
^^^to me your statement reflected reciprocity as a principle. You were giving, he was not, he was not reciprocating, you file for divorce as he was not quality at the time. Plus the smoking thing to me looks like A behavior - addiction without regard to one's partner - selfishness in a different way.

[per 7yrs:]So no matter what you do if your spouse was going to cheat then guess what they are going to cheat...there are many BS's around here that were great spouses and were cheated on.
^^^is there a betrayal predestination? Perhaps that depends on the WS. If a great spouse in a great, easy marriage gets cheated on, then one can conclude that this WS has a pathological problem, i.e. 'broken' inside...

[per ATS:]..there is no way that I or anyone could do enough to meet all of her perceived needs. She realizes that she needs to be responsible for her happiness...
^ That sums it up in terms of fixing oneself. But the big question is whether the perceived feeling of 'need' was circumstantial (leads one to look at coping skills/addiction) or ongoing and chronic (personality disorder).

[per IWAM:] there are waaay too many of us who were quality spouses to spouses who were crappy spouses and never did we ever consider cheating as an option....but according to you we would have been justified if we did...but ironically it was the crappy spouses who cheated on the quality spouses...
^^^I think according to tryn that faced with a crappy spouse you should have created a lot of conflict and pressure and eventually filed for D. Yes, if that was done timely, then the A would have been avoided (see, a divorce affair-proofs your marriage by ending it).

[damn Sista!:] I said he is just about the only one who agrees with you.
^^^ well I agree with Tryn in terms of being quality and attractive from the standpoint of being the best you can be - which leads you to the confidence necessary to protect yourself, insist upon reciprocity, and being able to 'see' clearly. I do not agree with the 'filling all needs' idea, unless that means just being a thoughtful, loving, romantic partner who puts the marriage & lover relationship as the priority. How many of you ladies here made the kids more important (and put your H into a father role) than having your H as a lover? NOW, I make it clear to WW that the M and the adult relationship comes FIRST and it does not get crowded out by the kids.

***

an aside:

You know, I am ok with my WW blaming the M for her having an A if she takes the (deserved) more than 50% responsibility for the bad M.

***

one expert said the following:

WHY DO PEOPLE HAVE AFFAIRS?
Facts:
It’s not about sex
It’s not about relationship unhappiness
It is about ending loneliness and drudgery
Marriages quickly stop providing these things
for 70% of couples, especially after a baby
arrives
So logically, people think: “why not cheat? If I
don’t get caught?”

...SO the question we BS's have to ask ourselves, are the feelings expressed by the WS of 'loneliness and drudgery' circumstantial (scared, poor coping skills person) or ongoing/chronic (damaged, dysfunctional person).. or... really an outright lie (psychopath)...

...some people turn to affairs in times of trouble and despair...some people are chronic cheaters...that is why the pre-A M is important in some cases and in others it is not.

...and a good assessment of the WS is key to healing and moving forward in a safe way, with or without the WS. I think becoming quality helps clear up your own head.

...I think my WW is somewhere between circumstance afflicted and damaged person. I also realize that some BSs here have cheaters in their lives which are on the dysfunctional-psychopathic end. I get that the prime directive of SI is "no BS self-blame". But that principle should not be upheld at the cost of intellectual dishonesty.

...i am starting to write like that guy named somanyyears...

NOW the Tennessee Titans are kicking off soon!!!!

Jack


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
DecimatedHeart
♀ Member
Member # 37657
Default  Posted: 7:02 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ummm... what the hell did I miss? Do I even want to know? Reading the last page, I'm almost afraid to go back and try and catch up...

D-Day was an absolute nightmare for me. First of all, it fell on a Sunday, and I told you about Sundays at my house, right? WH blamed me and DD for everything but the weather, mocked me for being emotional, for being in physical pain from an ovarian cyst bursting, and for wanting to join a gym with him when I was trying to R. It sucked, and I am still reeling in the aftermath. He's been trying to be sweet since, but really, does he seriously think coffee can fix everything he's broken?

Love and hugs to you all!


Me, BS 41
Him WH 42 - LTA, EA/PA
Together 24 years
DD13 - the love of my life
DDay#1 11/10/2012
DDay#4 4/5/2013 (NC broken AGAIN)
A supposedly over 6/14/2013

All my posts are edited - I hate typos. :)


Posts: 129 | Registered: Nov 2012
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 7:31 PM, November 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Decimated -

Your H's post DDay behavior is so similar to mine! Not DDay itself- we were on vacation with his family, so I think he was happy to do whatever it took for me to just to keep it together and not tell anyone. But, the 1st 2 months - were eerily similar.

mocked me for being emotional

Example: 2 months after DDay and just a few weeks after I found his secret phone, WS had to attend a funeral for a coworker and as such, it was expected that OW would be in attendance. WS calls from the event to tell me that OW was on outside duty & nowhere near him & was unlikely to be at the drinking event afterwards. Also told me his phone was about to die. So, after several hours of being out of communication & as he had not picked up the kids as expected, I left early to pick up the kids. WS arrives home an hour after me, apparently annoyed that I was annoyed & when I began crying told me he cant take this anymore,that he's sick of this sh*t.

but really, does he seriously think coffee can fix everything he's broken?

OMG this is my WS's go to move too! Which I think is hysterical inasmuch as it is soooo misguided. Yes, I love coffee, but as such I make a pot of coffee the second I wake up. THen WS strolls in 2 hours later with a coffee for me & acts like he's a superhero.

Selfish asses...


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

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