After he was a sleep we started talking and I felt like I'm on trial again.
"You didn't want to do this before..."
"You didn't want to do that before..."
"How do i know??..."
Then she brought up me changing my fb password from 2 years ago and why i did that.
It just seems like we have the same conversation over again. I dont feel like we are moving anywhere.
R is a 2-5 year process. Is it tiring to hear the same stuff over and over and over? Yeah. But we put them in the position for them to doubt everything. Infidelity gives people PTSD. This is no picnic. It takes alot of time for them to process and work thru this.
Time. Patience. Lots of it. Over and over. For 2-5 years.
"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne
"What if I fall?" Oh but my darling, what if you fly?
If you can , tell her what you understand to be the answer to her questions. You made the choice now you have to own it.
When you have blown up a home, down to its very foundations, there are no shortcuts to re-building it. You are going to have to put out the fires. You are going to have to stand fire watch to make sure that all of the gas services are off and the fires are indeed, out. You are going to have to meet with inspectors and tell them, over and over again, what happened and assure them that all of the outside spigots are turned off. Then you're going to have to get the permits to clear the site. Then you have to hire someone to clear the site. And once the site is cleared, down to the foundations, you are going to have to get a loan to start re-building. And you're going to have to tell the bank what happened, and what you are going to do to ensure that the house won't be blown up again. Once you have convinced them, you need to get the building permits. And that's going to entail talking to the inspectors and making them feel comfortable that you're not going to blow up the house again with your re-building. And if, IF, you get the permits, then you can start exploring rebuilding.
Your marriage is that blown up house. If you want to rebuild, then you're going to have to jump through each and every hoop, sometimes again and again, to convince your BW that you are rebuilding for the ages vice constructing a plywood structure that will fall the first time an alley cat rubs up against the walls.
Of course, if you don't want to put the hard work into rebuilding your marriage, then the compassionate and mature thing to do is to acknowledge that and let your BW know so that she can get on with her life and her healing.
Look. You signed her up for this rollercoaster ride to hell and back. She didn't choose this, you did. So. You either help her to heal, or you admit that you can't/won't do it and you let her go. Those are the only two honorable choices.
Yeah, this is somewhat blunt. I could sugarcoat it a lot more, but I hope that you realize that I do you the honor of believing that you are reaching out for honest help in understanding what is going on and what you can expect for the next few years. I chose to believe that you are reaching out for help.
And here's the good news. Every time that you fully answer your BWs questions. Every time that you are honest and sincere, loving and compassionate, you rebuild that foundation a bit more. Every time that you answer the same question, elaborate on your previous answers, and are present and loving, you build up trust and credit. Little by little, you prove yourself as being present and committed.
Your choice what will you choose?
D-Day, June 10, 2012
No longer together
"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."
From your post it actually seems like you are making quite a bit of progress. Sounds like you are lucky to be "on trial" because your first post shows your BS not wanting to R and being done with you. This is leaps and bounds ahead of 3 months ago!!!! Be thankful and check your ego at the door.
I know it sounds like 2-5 years is a long time... I didn't quite believe it myself at first. Now 15 months out, I can guarantee you buddy that timeline is for real. As the others have posted, her world shattered and she may be repetitive, but she needs you to help her feel safe to heal.
You will have many nights of this:. Feeling ok during the day and then getting down to the brass tax at night. The road through R has many bumps in the road. Like I said, be thankful for even getting a chance. R is a gift, treat it as such
I was questioned out of nowhere last night. Things were going well for the first 4 hours.
I was trying to answer honestly. But honestly, somethings I could not remember.
"why did you change your facebook password?"
I changed this around 2 years ago. After she found I changed it, I gave her the new one. It was one of standard passwords.
I think I changed it because of security reasons, but im not 100%
You are right, we have actually made progress. At first she was against R. But now it might be on the table, even though she is not actually telling me that.
When it gets to that level with her, I just don't know how to handle it.
Don't get me wrong, I do listen and I do talk and answer her questions. I apologize and tell her how sorry I am for hurting her.
After and 1.5 hours the intensity was starting to grow and it seemed like it was getting much worse.
I told her I didnt want to talk about this anymore and I'm leaving now. We are still living separately.
Next time a situation like this occurs, tell your BS. "I want to do (thing here). I want to do it for (reason here). I want to know if that's okay with you?"
The password change with no notification or permission probably set them off.
"A lesson is learned. Life is. Simply. There is no Death. There is no Before. There is no After. All is in Flux. Simply."
Pretend none of this horror had happened and your marriage is whole and good. You are having a romantic dinner with your wife. Great conversation and delicious steak. You reach your hand across the table to touch hers and out of nowhere--she takes her steak knife and stabs your hand! You are shocked, scared, and wounded. You leave the table to nurse your wounds. Time passes and your wife would like to start eating dinner with you again. You timidly start dining with her, but you likely have a lot of anxiety. Soup nights are OK, but if there is a knife on the table you have a panic attack. Wouldn't you need A LOT of reassurance that your wife won't be unpredictable again? Would a few "I'm sorrys" make up for this crazy thing she did? Wouldn't you need an explanation for her behavior? And when that explanation boils down to a selfish desire to stab something and that is was about her needs, not yours, would that sit well with you? Wouldn't you want her to offer those reassurance and explanations for as long as it took for you to feel safe sitting at the table with her again? I'm sure it would take YEARS for you to get over your dinner time fears....but she stabbed you and if she wants to eat dinner with you, she had better do the work to make you feel safe again.
His betrayal of me was not because I didn't shine brightly enough, but because he chose to put on blinders.
I was questioned out of nowhere last night.
It may have seemed to you that the question came out of nowhere, but it had probably been swirling in her mind for some time. Less than 4 months out, I guarantee you that thoughts of the betrayal are never completely out of her mind. It's something the BS lives with every waking moment. And a big part of his or her sleeping moments as well. Sometimes it lingers in the background, other times it's in the foreground. But it's always there. At 9 months, I'm just now starting to get some relief from the intrusive thoughts. Just now starting to feel like myself again.
Look at it this way: you've committed a serious marital "crime," and the sentence is 2-5 years. At least the hard time is that long. The probationary period is probably a lot longer. The only alternative to serving out the sentence is to skip bail and run, i.e. give up and divorce.
I have asked my WBF for a chat tonight because there were some burning detail questions I needed to ask him. He has come clean and wants to R, is doing everything right. After I asked him if we could talk and he said yes - I wanted to get my thought organised on the detail - stuff like timeline, emails etc.
Thinking about it - we are in R and I realised they don't actually matter. I am fixating on details he has forgotten and I screw them up into evidence of him not fully committing.
I think this is where the "being on trial" comes. If we sat down and I started interrogating him about the details I think I need to know, he will feel attacked and uncomfortable but will be trying so hard to give me what I want. What I really want to know is how do we reduce my fears of you stabbing me in the hand again!
Of course, the burning question of why the hand was stabbed is still there, but that's what takes really good communication to get to the bottom of.
So thank you for the post and as a BGF I am thinking twice about my motivations to interrogate.
"After and 1.5 hours the intensity was starting to grow and it seemed like it was getting much worse.
I told her I didnt want to talk about this anymore and I'm leaving now. We are still living separately."
Wow, noglamour, seriously? You gave up after 90 minutes and left?
Because it was too intense for you?
How "intense" do you think it is for your BS?
You don't want to talk about it any more?
I'm willing to bet your BS doesn't want to have to think about it any more, doesn't want to have to remember it, doesn't want to have to feel it, doesn't want to have to suffer through it.
So you walked out on her, literally? You left her with questions and went out the door?
Think about what that said to her.
If you truly want to have a smidgeon of a chance at R with her, you're going to have to do better than that. You're going to have to stop focusing on what is hard and unpleasant and challenging for YOU, and start focusing on what is painful and horrible and soul-crushing for HER.
It's good that you're here asking for help -- that's a positive step. Lots more steps to go...
Hell even "good" days have their horrible WTF moments. I don't think WS realize how this can infiltrate almost every discussion, every interaction, every TV show, movie or whatever.
You are allowed to have your feelings as well, and as crazy as this sounds I would probably rather be a BS than a WS, just try and see things from her perspective.
We're 4 years out from DDay, and sometimes I still ask the same Q's, if you ask him. Sometimes I need to hear him tell me the same answer (to make sure he was telling me the truth the first time he told me) and other times I reframe the questions from a slightly different angle to see if there is anything I missed the first time.
If you are committed to R with her, then you need to not put conditions on it. You made the rules when you blew up the relationship. Now she gets to make the rules on what she needs from you to rebuild it.
me (WW/BS): 48
4 kiddos in mid 20's
Me: I didn't sign up for this.
Him: you're already in this. All you can do is resign...
We talked with our MC about it and she helped us by having us choose a time (like after the kids were in bed) when BS could ask me any questions.
Eventually the questions tapered off and BS felt satisfied and stopped asking questions.
It takes awhile but it will happen for you too.
D day - July 2011 after a 4 year relationship with OM
Reconciled and renewed our vows on our 22 Anniversary in June 2012
My H was like you for a very long time. In fact, sometimes he still doesn't understand the random questions that Sometimes come seemingly out of nowhere.
Imagine your wife worked outside the home. You she left and went to work everyday, and you saw her leave. She arrived home at the same time everyday. She talked about coworkers, she told you about things she had done that day, etc… You believed your wife had a job, maybe you even met people who were coworkers of hers.
Then, one day, you find out that your wife doesn’t have a job. Never had one. Has not been working. It sounds strange, but think about it. Imagine all the questions you would ask: well where have you been all day? Where is the money coming from? Who are all these people I met that were supposedly “coworkers?” I’m sure you can think of many questions you would have right off the bat. I’m sure that once you asked those, you would have a bunch more.
If you believed your wife was being dishonest with you about going to work everyday- would you not question other aspects of your relationship, and wonder if she was being honest with you about other things as well? Last week, when she said she was going to the store- was she really there? When she said she was going out with her girlfriends- is that where she really went? When she says she loves me, does she really mean it?
If your wife told you that she was going to work everyday, and you suddenly found out otherwise, would you accept her apology and trust her right away? Or would there be a period of time (potentially a long one) in which you didn’t necessarily trust her? Would you accept all of her answers at face value when she gave them to you- or would you ponder and wonder how you could have missed signs, and if she was being honest with you NOW after lying for so long?
I gave my husband that analogy. The difference, however, is that is your wife were to lie about going to work (maybe in reality she was going to a friend’s house and watching tv all day), it would undoubtedly be a HUGE step backwards in the trust department, which is comparable to an affair. However it wouldn’t necessarily attack your self esteem. It wouldn’t make you feel like your wife was choosing some other man over you.
Triggers come out of nowhere. Things can be going fine, and all of a sudden, she feels upset, has a question, something pops into her mind over seemingly nothing. It is NOT nothing.
It has only been 4 months (my H cheated almost 2 years ago and I still hurt a lot because of what he did…if that gives you any indication about how long this will take). Be patient with your wife and understand the damage that was caused isn’t fixed overnight. As frustrated as you might feel- put yourself in her shoes. How hurt, how upset, how frustrated must SHE feel? She didn’t choose this- you did. So answer her questions, without attitude, and answer them honestly and completely and gently over and over and over again- 1,000 times if you have to, because that is what SHE needs right now. Show her that you are willing to stick it out and do the work and support her. Or, if it’s not something you can handle, tell her and make the choice to leave.
At least the current man "only" cyber-cheated.
"Love means never having to say you're sorry."
As a wayward my mind was constantly on my actions, I asked why a million times of myself. I looked and remembered actions that shamed me to my core. When he needed answers he got them, he could wake me up at 3 am and ask me whatever and did, hell most time he didn't have to wake me up.
As a betrayed dear god it's like having your heart ripped out and then when the questions remain unanswered or when the person with the answers walks away it's like watching them hold that heart and stab it over and over again. If you want to reconcile, truly want to reconcile then stop thinking about you and think about her.