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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 8
BrokenButTrying
♀ Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 7:25 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Deesieved

Why would my WH tell each AP that he loved me/was in live with me and still proceed with the act? he'd sometimes tell them both before and after?

I can't speak on behalf of all waywards but my A wasn't about my BH. It wasn't because I didn't love him, I did love him, very much. It was about me and my own inadequacies.
Without knowing your full story, maybe telling the AP's of his feelings for you was your BH's way of creating emotional distance between him and the OW. Compartmentalising his A from his real life?


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1141 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
BrokenButTrying
♀ Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 7:30 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Feelingsomuch

If my BH gave me that letter I would break down in tears, I would be overwhelmed that he was giving me the opportunity to R.

I would do everything set out in your letter, it isn't much and isn't unreasonable. I think you've set out your requirements for R very well, clearly and firmly. It's a great letter.

I hope your WW accepts your gift of R with gratitude.


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1141 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
BrokenButTrying
♀ Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 7:39 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

99lawdog

I am also 3 months out from Dday. I wouldn't dream of treating my BH in that way. If I go out without him, I let him know where I'm going, what time I'll be home. I verify all the time with photos and videos of my surroundings and who I'm with. We are currently separated, I have even done a tour of the house filming every room, opening all the cupboards to reassure him I'm here alone.

His safety is my absolute priority.

From what you've said, I don't think your WW is remorseful. Full of regret but not remorse. She's not 'getting it', she's upset because of how the A has impacted her life. She doesn't really understand it from your point of view.


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1141 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
99lawdog99
♂ Member
Member # 42615
Default  Posted: 7:51 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Brokenbutrying, Thanks for the reply.

I should clarify, she is really open. I have access to everything and she changed her phone number and calls me before and after every patients house. She is being good. She does do the full disclouser. I have to admit that in the past I was a little relentless, just badgering her about everything. If she was 5 minutes late, I'd accuss her of doing something. Even my therapist said enough, and not to do that. It just seemed like everything was going good and all of a sudden she has this guilt attack and freaks out. I was just wondering if these things happen. To be honest with you, I have been more of a problem going foward than she has. It is hard for me to forget what happened. Also when she ws having her crying fit, she kept saying how much she hates him and what she did to us.


Me 54
WW 45
Married 25 years, together 27 WW's first and only til A
In R
"Sometimes we have to be knocked down to our lowest point so that we can reach our highest Level"

Posts: 88 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: pa
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, I am going to touch on a very sensitive subject as I am sure . I recently hacked my wifes computer, as you may see from here: http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=526579

I now want to know if any of you FWW did this?
1. Did you ever refer to your OM as Hubby/Husband.
2. Did you ever say to OM you wanted him to marry you?
3. Did you your spouse ever discover somethings you didn't tell them and did he confront you about them, or did he just say I know more than you think?
4. Did you talk to OM and say how unhappy you were in your Marriage?
5. Did you and OM ever get into arguments.

As you can probably tell, i have discovered texts between my WW and OM. They talked about running away, well at least she did, and it sounded very immature. She called him husband and wanted to fulfill his fantasies. Through some of the pictures my wife sent him, I can see she is at her job, and thanks to iphone location and picture taking, she was also at a hotel. She talked about how unhappy she was.


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1029 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
BrokenButTrying
♀ Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 7:59 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In that case I think she is remorseful then but I think she's meeting your anxiety with defensiveness instead of reassurance.

If she is going to be late home she should be calling you and verifying where she is. She should be answering your questions with reassurance and patience. Not freaking out and getting angry.

Gently, you will never forget what happened. And of course you have more trouble moving forward, your WW's A is a trauma and should be treated as such.

Deciding to R isn't about forgetting or pretending it never happened. It's about accepting that it did and rebuilding your marriage to minimise the possibility of it happening again, making the marriage a safe place for you.


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1141 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
BrokenButTrying
♀ Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 8:10 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LostSamurai

Very sorry to hear of your recent discovery, that sucks.


1. Did you ever refer to your OM as Hubby/Husband.

No. Never. He used to refer to himself as my boyfriend and call me his girlfriend. I flipped out whenever he did.

2. Did you ever say to OM you wanted him to marry you?

The OM talked a lot about marrying me and wanted children with me. I never discouraged him but I didn't entertain the idea.

3. Did you your spouse ever discover somethings you didn't tell them and did he confront you about them, or did he just say I know more than you think?

I've told my BH all there is to know. I confessed to him on Dday. Hypothetically, if there was more and BH discovered he probably wouldn't tell me. He would just divorce me.

4. Did you talk to OM and say how unhappy you were in your Marriage?

Yes but not in great detail.

5. Did you and OM ever get into arguments.

Oh god yes! We had a one month PA during which we argued because he wanted more than I was willing to give. Then I ended the PA but the EA continued for three months with us arguing every single day because I wanted him to leave me alone but didn't have the balls to go NC. We argued more than anything else to be honest.


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1141 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
99lawdog99
♂ Member
Member # 42615
Default  Posted: 8:12 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Broken, really appreciate your time and effort. It helps. There are some days I am perfectly fine like nothing ever happened and others I just want to leave as I realy resent her for what she did.


Me 54
WW 45
Married 25 years, together 27 WW's first and only til A
In R
"Sometimes we have to be knocked down to our lowest point so that we can reach our highest Level"

Posts: 88 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: pa
CantBeUndone
♀ Member
Member # 42205
Default  Posted: 8:17 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1. Did you ever refer to your OM as Hubby/Husband.

No. I find this one a little strange honestly.

2. Did you ever say to OM you wanted him to marry you?

No. But my AP was totally inappropriate. I knew from the beginning there was zero long term potential with him.

3. Did you your spouse ever discover somethings you didn't tell them and did he confront you about them, or did he just say I know more than you think?

No. My BH didn't catch me, he suspected but never had proof. I think he was afraid to confront me because he didn't want to know that I was capable of that kind of betrayal. Once I confessed, the affair had been over for 8 months with NC for 6 and I told him everything at that point.

4. Did you talk to OM and say how unhappy you were in your Marriage?

Yes. We really didn't talk about BH or my marriage much but we did talk a few times about how I wanted out of my marriage.

5. Did you and OM ever get into arguments.

I'm not sure on this one. We never really argued because we didn't really talk or more most of conversations were superficial. But there were definitely hurtful things said and done that were kind of just swept under the rug. I don't think I wanted to deal with them because I had him on a pedestal and didn't want to admit to myself what a total loser he was.


Me: WW
Him: BH
30's, 4 kids
DD- Jan 2014

Posts: 55 | Registered: Jan 2014
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:24 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LS -

I now want to know if any of you FWW did this?

What conclusion can you draw from people saying "yes" they did or "no" they didn't?

Affairs run the whole spectrum - from no emotions, just sex, to all talking, to pretend marriage, to whatever. Some talk-only affairs are exit affairs. Some full-blown pretend "marriage" are meaningless. The affair description does not indicate what happens after D-Day.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6073 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 8:41 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LostSamurai - I recently hacked my wife's computer.

As a FYI, while I know that we have a whole Investigation Tips forum here, the truth is that depending on where you live and the applicable laws, hacking into a email account, even if it is your spouses, can be considered illegal.

http://communications-media.lawyers.com/privacy-law/email-hacking-is-a-serious-crime.html and http://www.examiner.com/article/spying-on-a-cheater-can-land-you-jail-unless-you-do-it-legally-here-s-how are recent articles that touch on this issue. Just saying.

HUFI


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3226 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 8:54 AM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For those of you who have discovered that you were truly conflict avoidant and were experts at compartmentalizing, how much do you believe that contributes to a wayward who chooses to run rather than admit the A and at least try to work on the relationship? In other words, how difficult was it to stand up and try to make it right in the face of these coping mechanisms that were likely with you since you were kids??


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2693 | Registered: Jan 2011
heartbroken0903
♀ Member
Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 7:04 PM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LostSamurai

1. Did you ever refer to your OM as Hubby/Husband.

No.

2. Did you ever say to OM you wanted him to marry you?

Yes.

3. Did you your spouse ever discover somethings you didn't tell them and did he confront you about them, or did he just say I know more than you think?

Not applicable

4. Did you talk to OM and say how unhappy you were in your Marriage?

No. I told the OM I was happy in my marriage. It was OM who said there must be something wrong with my marriage if I were cheating.

5. Did you and OM ever get into arguments.

Once or twice, I'm sure.


What are you going to do about your wife, LS?


Me: WS, 30s
XH: BS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

Reconciling after divorce

"Someday you'll look back on all these days
And all this pain is gonna be invisible." - Hunter Hayes, "Invisible"


Posts: 2073 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
heartbroken0903
♀ Member
Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 7:53 PM, March 26th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FeelingSoMuch

As a WS, how would you react to the following letter at this stage?

If I were to receive that letter from my XH, I would know that hell had frozen over and space aliens were suddenly in charge.

Seriously, I'd be grateful to receive that kind of letter because it would give me insight into his thoughts and feelings, instead of me having to guess/play it by ear as I do now.

Just your username, FeelingSoMuch...if my XH were here his would be What's A Feeling?

I hope your FWW takes your words to heart and continues to help you heal.


Me: WS, 30s
XH: BS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

Reconciling after divorce

"Someday you'll look back on all these days
And all this pain is gonna be invisible." - Hunter Hayes, "Invisible"


Posts: 2073 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
Wayflost
♀ Member
Member # 41583
Default  Posted: 2:07 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme

This requires some thought and attention to answer succinctly. Ultimately the answer is - it took me a lifetime to be the person I am today, and I am positive it will take me a lifetime to get somewhere else. KWIM?

Learning to express myself with empathy, and facing conflict head on is a constant struggle. I'm terrible at it. I shrink away from it. In MC we often are "paused" so that our C can pull me out of the shell I enter when I feel bad. As a child I learned that sad, hurt, angry feelings should be hidden and kept to oneself. I still try to protect that part of me.

But - I know that I deserve that level of communication. I know that my BH deserves the chance to be heard, understood, and cared about. So I will pick myself up and try again and again and again. Maybe one day I will get it right.


Me: WW
Him: BH (totalheartbreak)
Both: 30s
Learning to love myself.
"A successful relationship requires falling in love many times,
always with the same person."
ó Mignon McLaughlin

Posts: 361 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: Southwest US
somethingremorse
♂ Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 3:17 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme

In other words, how difficult was it to stand up and try to make it right in the face of these coping mechanisms

I don't have an answer to your specific question, since I tried to work on the M after DDay. It is absolutely why I never had the stones to tell BW "hey, I'm not happy, let's do something about it."

Standing up and facing problems, rather than withdrawing and compartmentalizing them is a daily task. It's a conscious decision that I have to make every time something unpleasant comes in front of me.


Me: WH (42)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 355 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 8:44 PM, March 27th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I didn't hack her email. I really just changed the password on her admin account and got in.

Then I hooked my iPhone up to her iTunes and restore a backup to it.

Does it matter what you FWW say, absolutely, because it gives me different perspectives on what my WW could of been thinking that she has not shared with me at this time.

What am I going to do about my WW... I have to wait and see. I am doing my own thing and just being nice and spending time with my daughter. As for filing for divorce, I may have to, if the situation doesn't change soon. Be apart is not healthy in my opinion for R...


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1029 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
EvolvingSoul
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Member # 29972
Default  Posted: 5:11 PM, March 28th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LostSamurai,
1. Did you ever refer to your OM as Hubby/Husband.
2. Did you ever say to OM you wanted him to marry you?
3. Did you your spouse ever discover somethings you didn't tell them and did he confront you about them, or did he just say I know more than you think?
4. Did you talk to OM and say how unhappy you were in your Marriage?
5. Did you and OM ever get into arguments.
It seems like what you may be looking for is evidence that someone can be as far gone as your WW seems to be and still come back to being (or as in my case become for the first time) a person that is a truly safe and healthy marriage partner. This forum is a place that you will likely find some good examples of WS who are trying to do just that. Based on your post over in general, though, it sounds as if your WW has not taken a single step towards choosing mental health. I think you know that until she does, attempting reconciliation will not be a viable option for you.

All that said, if it'll help you here are my responses to your questions.

Regarding talk of marriage with AP -- My situation was sort of wack in the sense that I met AP through an online role playing game. Our "characters" were married in the game. So in the game yes I did refer to him that way. IRL (in real life as we called it) I did not refer to him that way but the "in character/out of character" lines were pretty severely blurred for me. We did not talk about a future that did not involve me remaining married to BS until after D-day when BS forced me to choose. I suspended contact with AP while I was trying to figure my shit out.

It took me about six months to decide I would end it forever with AP. It took me another 3 months after that to actually send the NC/Breakup letter. I want to say now that I so wish I had been able to commit to BS right away. The best I could do was to see that something was really screwed up about my thinking and to begin to try to figure out what it was. The process of figuring that out has lead me not only to remorse for the affair but to face lifelong issues that have impacted all of my relationships. It has been a long, arduous and rewarding process.

Regarding withheld details and confrontation -- Doesn't apply so much to my situation. I didn't hide the fact that AP was a part of my life. He was in it what seemed like 24/7 through the game and online chatting in the early years plus being physically present in our home, or me in his, during the years it was physical as well as emotional.

Regarding sharing information about the state of the marriage with AP -- I was more of a classic cake eater. I told myself that I perceived the two relationships in contrast rather than in comparison, that the two were different and that it was okay for me to want and to pursue both. Really what I wanted was a three way relationship, and for all of the "way" to be mine. While disparaging the marriage and BS is often used to justify the affair and to give the impression to the AP that the affair relationship could eventually go legit, that was not necessary in my case. The AP seemed very content to be part of team NotSoEvolvingSoul and to "share" me with BS indefinitely. One of the things we had in common was a lack of regard for the future or how things would turn out if it all blew up. (Obviously BS did not know the nature of the "team" I had forced him to be a part of and I actively prevented him from making a well informed decision.)

AP and I did not spend much time talking about BS and the marriage but when we did, AP acknowledged that our relationship (the affair) probably could not survive as a stand alone and he encouraged me to go on cake eating. Hence the necessity of turning to the soul mates/we've known each other before/blah blah narrative of our relationship being rooted in tragic, romantic, impossible circumstances and bad timing rather than egregious selfishness and lack of empathy for the people around us (and even for each other when it comes down to it).

Whew! I hope this gives you some insight into just how screwed up wayward thought processes can be and what you are probably up against when considering whether to divorce or to try reconciliation with your WW. It makes me cringe just to write that I thought that way but it took me a long time and some serious struggle to get to the point where I can acknowledge that I did think that way and that I needed to change.

Whatever you decide, sending strength to you from this FinallyEvolvingSoul


Me: WS (52)
Him: Shards (47)
D-day: June 6, 2010
Last voluntary AP contact: June 23, 2010
NC Letter sent: 3/9/11

Digging our way through.


Posts: 253 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: Turning the corner.
Duskpearl
♀ Member
Member # 41870
Default  Posted: 8:12 PM, March 28th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Do all WS eventually feel remorse for cheating?


Reason I ask is it appears that my WH is happy with his decision to start a new life with the OW ho worker.

I†asked my WH to move out after his sneaky behaviour continued & what does he do, he moves straight in with the OW who was just a "work friend". He continued this lie for another month. Nearly 4 months later their relationship seems to be going full steam ahead & it appears that the life he shared with me for the last 12 years never existed. Thing is he has been in my shoes, his ex fiancť cheated on him & he knowingly put me through the same pain he went through before he met me.....

I have kept up the NC for 2 months now & while this has annoyed him it clearly has not soured the relationship with the she bloke OW.

Of course I feel such guilt for the way I reacted when I first discovered the †emails by accusing him of having an affair. He pretty much told me that I pushed him into her arms!

Is it possible that over time he will eventually feel remorse for what he has done or is it possible that he is truly happy with the decision he made to start a new life with the OW?†

Is it true that all WW are broken in order to have an A?†


Sometimes your heart needs more time to accept what your mind already knows

Posts: 65 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Australia
Sadmumma
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Member # 42192
Default  Posted: 8:05 AM, March 29th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can't speak on behalf of all waywards but my A wasn't about my BH. It wasn't because I didn't love him, I did love him, very much. It was about me and my own inadequacies.

brokenbuttrying did you think that at the time... or did this come as a realisation afterwards?


On any given day you have the power to say "my story is not going to end like this"
Me 41 BS
Him 41 WH
6 kids...7 weeks, 5,7,9,11&13
D day jan 29th 2014

Posts: 533 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Land down under
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