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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 8
manybrokenpieces
♀ Member
Member # 37055
Default  Posted: 12:07 AM, May 4th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For Wayward Men--what are your thoughts on porn now?

Do they differ from those before Dday?

I ask because, as I just posted in Reconciliation, I found out my WH was searching for porn online (think photos of Sports Illustrated Swim Suit models so I am unclear if it is considering porn to all, but certainly feels that way to me).

Due to the nature of his LTA which was sexting & photo sharing to a large extent, this seems a blatant betrayal--enough to end R completely.

WH states it is "normal guy" stress relief although he also states it will never happen again as he didn't see it as I see it and now understands my feelings about it.

I guess I just think he should KNOW this already and he just doesn't care. I would think this much is a given.


Posts: 72 | Registered: Oct 2012
somethingremorse
♂ Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 8:27 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

womaninflux

You asked

My questions for you: "How did you let this go on so long?" and "Weren't there times when you knew you should get out of the affair? Why didn't you?"

First of all, I knew all the time that I should get out. I was so compartmentalized that I completely ignored that part of me. That's a pretty common response from a lot of WS.

I have discovered that at some point my depression was so bad that I really didn't care. It's not that I didn't care if I got caught, because I took a lot of energy to avoid detection. But I just didn't value much of anything in my life. So I had no motivation to actually change my ways and get help.

I have also figured out that the A's made me worse. I'd feel guilty, so I had to wall myself off even more. I kept on separating parts of my life. I kept on doing things that I knew were wrong, so I had to hide them away. This made me more and more withdrawn, which made me more and more depressed.

The question is why didn't I stop? It boils down to I didn't do much of anything during those days. Once it started, the A's were easy to keep going. Stopping was more work than I was willing to put into anything back then. This extended to almost everything. My work is in shambles, and I am trying to fix the things I nearly ruined back then by not putting in any effort.

Now I realize how I was. My IC says "You really were lost, weren't you." I was really unhappy then. Miserable, actually. I need to change my whole outlook on everything I do, which includes but is not limited to my M.


Me: WH (42)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 470 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
bionicgal
♀ Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 9:26 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

JoanH
I was very moved by this:
Personally, I think its much like addiction, you don't plan to become and addict, you don't plan to cheat, or at least I don't feel I did. I think even with all the warnings the education we recieve in this day and age, we still miss the boat. You don't know you have issues till they show, IF I had understood more and recognized my issues then yes I think that would help me stayclear of self distructive behaviors and keep my family safe.

Razor,

If I knew at the time when I was saying yes to my BH, that I would by choice, put my husband and my family into such a unsafe place and hurtful, destructive life, never would I have

said yes.

However, I know at least in my case, I would not have chosen this -- not in a million years. However, I would still choose my husband. I imagine your BS feels the same. There was a post recently where BSes were answering if they'd marry their partner again, knowing what they know now. Probably 95% of people said no -- on the reconciliation forum!

I have hated this hurt, but I do, God help me, believe in my marriage and am beginning to trust my husband again.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is more like a mental break than a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 1859 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
familyfirst
♀ Member
Member # 42651
Default  Posted: 9:46 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MC_Jack, are you wondering how WW could sit with you, hold your hand, look into your eyes and an hour later, be heading off to meet AP?

This is also a hard thing for Waywards to look back on. At least for me. At the time I didn't feel the guilt. I still loved my H, treated him well, why should I feel bad? Unbelievable to think back on that now. The memories of those situations now cause me crushing guilt and remorse. But it was also a learning experience. I'm smarter now, and will never let myself fall into that fog trap again.


Posts: 156 | Registered: Mar 2014
99lawdog99
♂ Member
Member # 42615
Default  Posted: 9:47 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is for the Ladies. My wife keeps telling me that she knows and can gaurantee that she will never doo anything like this again. She says she saw the pain and hurt she caused and it is killing her. My response is always, how can you say that, you said before as part of our marriage vows that you wouldn't do anything but you did. She says that is different, she saw what she did and doesn't want to ever lose me. She also said she got it out of her system, meaning seeing what it was like being with another man since I was her only one. I just don't know. You can't gaurantee anything yet she ask me if I would ever cheat on her and I say never. She then says how can I be so sure and I say I just knowI'll never do that and she says that's how she feels. Question, is it possible that is how she feels and be so sure?


Me 54
WW 45
Married 25 years, together 27 WW's first and only til A
In R
"Sometimes we have to be knocked down to our lowest point so that we can reach our highest Level"

Posts: 107 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: pa
20WrongsVs1
♀ Member
Member # 39000
Default  Posted: 10:46 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She also said she got it out of her system

Ouch.

You've heard the expression "white-knuckling" right? It's such an appropriate term to infidelity recovery, because if WW don't figure out our "why," and fix it, then we're just white-knuckling. We'll never do it again! Honest!

Except, what happens when WW wonders what it's like to be with a really tall guy? Or a much younger, or older one? Or a woman? What's going to prevent her from, umm, getting that out of her system? The memory of the pain she caused you?

is it possible that is how she feels and be so sure?

It may be how she feels, but the feelings of WW are not always grounded in reality.

Another expression I like, which gets thrown around in Wayward a lot, is "Fix your shit." What that means to me is, figure out *why* you cheated. Then dig down further, and further, until you diagnose your underlying brokenness. When WW feels hurt, sad, or neglected, what's her go-to coping mechanism? External validation? Fantasy escapism? At the risk of hitting too close to home, sorry...threatening suicide? Or, does she have mature coping skills, where she recognizes the negative feelings, identifies the internal cause, and lets them float away? (Not saying I'm there...but it's a goal.)

Your WW, and I, chose to fill our holes (pun intended) in a selfish way, with no consideration for the collateral damage. If she's saying, "Yeah, I was curious, but that's been completely satisfied, so don't worry 99!" I'd suggest she has quite a bit more digging to do, before she's a safe partner.


fWW: 42
BH: 52
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1092 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
99lawdog99
♂ Member
Member # 42615
Default  Posted: 11:44 AM, May 5th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks 20. I keep asking her why and that's the only answer I get. I told her the A is not the problem, the problem is why she did it and she tells me again she was curious. SHe is 45 , but looks 25 and right around that time, she was looking her best, shape wise and everything. A few months before she got her breast redone because she gained about 70 lbs. after we lost our daughter in 2005 after not being able to have a child in some 15 years. After our son was born in 1990, they said she couldn't have anymore but after a cancer scare she got pregnant. The birth never happened and she went into a 3-4 year depression where she didn't care how she looked and got up to close to 200 lbs.

When she finally got herself together, she lost like 70 lbs but her breast didn't come back and sagged. She went DD and they now look like they belong to a 20 year old, they are perfect. Combine that with her looks, a 22 inch waist and her being 5'7' with legs up to her neck, she got hit on 24/7 by everyone. They didn't care if I was right there. She said it all went to her head and this guy was relentless. Everyday he told her how hot she wasand how much he wanted her . She loved the attention.

So I just don't know. We talked for months now and according to her she felt our marriage went stale and maybe she married too young and wondered about other guys. She has since told me, she feels we are closer now than ever and never stopped loving me. She also told me that while she was doing it, she would think about the future and it was always her and I, not him. In fact, the other day she was thinking what would have happened if I didn't take her back. She was wondering if she would have wound up with him and she said she felt like throwing up. Thanks for taking the time to answer.


Me 54
WW 45
Married 25 years, together 27 WW's first and only til A
In R
"Sometimes we have to be knocked down to our lowest point so that we can reach our highest Level"

Posts: 107 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: pa
AmberDust
♀ Member
Member # 38904
Default  Posted: 7:50 AM, May 7th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For WS ( I am using my own H as an example but this is not a M/F issue).
There is NC between H and OW. He wants to fix our M.

But:
Him: Yes, I find fault in what OW has done. I was looking for validation and admiration. I know she helped me lie, cheat and betray you, tried to get me to leave you, and be the worst person I could be.
Me: What if we were divorced and not together anymore? Would you be ok with her contacting you or you contacting her?
Him: Well, if you were not with me anymore, and I was looking for that validation and admiration… you never know what happens in life.


I was hoping that from now on his loyalty would start and end with me and himself, and he would rather die than be with the accomplice that helped him stab me and the children in the back.

What does this mean? Does this mean he will carry a torch for this person forever even though he denies having any feelings for her now? Is he supposed to want to avoid her for the rest of her life? Am I overreacting when I expect that?


Posts: 723 | Registered: Apr 2013
20WrongsVs1
♀ Member
Member # 39000
Default  Posted: 8:17 AM, May 7th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

AmberDust, the emotionally mature answer would've been something like, "Her? No way. What I realize now is, the validation and admiration from OW was cheap and meaningless, and we were just using each other. I'm working to be a better person now, and I only want you. But if I were in the hypothetical position of dating again? I wouldn't go after the low-hanging fruit of damaged people like OW who'd try to steal someone else's husband. Good people don't do that, and I intend to be a good person now."

Does it mean he's carrying a torch for OW? Not necessarily. Is he still longing for the external validation and "ego kibbles" she gave him? Yes, clearly he is, sorry. Until he figures out that meaningful validation and admiration only come from within, I'd worry that he's not a safe partner.


fWW: 42
BH: 52
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1092 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
AmberDust
♀ Member
Member # 38904
Default  Posted: 9:48 AM, May 7th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

20WrongsVs1,
This is heavy on my heart, so thank you for taking the time to clarify this to me. I couldn't figure out why it was bothering me so very much. I am seeing my new IC next week and I hope to discuss it with her. Thanks again! Have a wonderful day :-)

Posts: 723 | Registered: Apr 2013
nestlee
♀ Member
Member # 39871
Default  Posted: 3:09 PM, May 7th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For WS's....why when caught and showed evedince of cheating.some cheaters will Deny, Deny and never admit to it. Even when they know they are busted!

I ask this because even though my H was caught with condoms and cologne hidden in his car, dirty pair of panties widgets between his back seats. Skipping work and telling me his boss lied he was there and I dont believe that..because It was an Emergency..I was 35 weeks pregnant and was massivley bleeding do to having full placenta . That day I had a Emergency C-section instead of waiting at the hospital.. my H went to supposivley work out. I have caught him red handed in so many lies... Evedince that said guilty .

After leaving my h for almost 6 months I went back to him. He has changed in many ways and has become a very comitted family man. Has even worn his ring for the past year. We are not married( common law) but we have wedding bands. My H seems much more happier and caring. I love him so much. But have days when I just feel that I can't fully heal or get on with the past until my H mans up. We had a few drinks last night and ohoh, I tore in to him and called him a pussy for not being able to man up to me. All he did was ask if he could hug me. Sorry so long.. So why do some cheaters never man up and confess,



A woman needs a man..Like a fish needs a Bycicle.

Posts: 71 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: Canada
nestlee
♀ Member
Member # 39871
Default  Posted: 3:47 PM, May 7th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For WS's....why when caught and showed evedince of cheating.some cheaters will Deny, Deny and never admit to it. Even when they know they are busted!

I ask this because even though my H was caught with condoms and cologne hidden in his car, dirty pair of panties widgets between his back seats. Skipping work and telling me his boss lied he was there and I dont believe that..because It was an Emergency..I was 35 weeks pregnant and was massivley bleeding do to having full placenta . That day I had a Emergency C-section instead of waiting at the hospital.. my H went to supposivley work out. I have caught him red handed in so many lies... Evedince that said guilty .

After leaving my h for almost 6 months I went back to him. He has changed in many ways and has become a very comitted family man. Has even worn his ring for the past year. We are not married( common law) but we have wedding bands. My H seems much more happier and caring. I love him so much. But have days when I just feel that I can't fully heal or get on with the past until my H mans up. We had a few drinks last night and ohoh, I tore in to him and called him a pussy for not being able to man up to me. All he did was ask if he could hug me. Sorry so long.. So why do some cheaters never man up and confess,



A woman needs a man..Like a fish needs a Bycicle.

Posts: 71 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: Canada
20WrongsVs1
♀ Member
Member # 39000
Default  Posted: 7:25 AM, May 9th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nestlee, one word: fear.

Fear that if you know the truth, you'll run. Fear that if he says it out loud, he'll have to really, truly admit what a horrible thing he did. What kind of person does things like that? Often WS mentally "check out" and escape to fantasy land during their A.

Your WS isn't just lying to you, he's lying to himself. That doesn't bode well for your healing, or his. Until he tells you the whole truth, he's not a safe partner.


fWW: 42
BH: 52
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1092 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
RomanticInnocenc
♀ Member
Member # 43041
Default  Posted: 9:19 PM, May 9th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WS - if you engaged in sexting, cyber, sneaking around, pretty much in this day and age, relatively normal affair behaviour, how do you go back to normal life? For me, my WH has lied to me about stupid things for 10 years (quitting smoking) and engaged in online/sexting behaviour with 2 different women, one leading to physical meeting with hugging and kissing and gotten another to send him naked photos. Meanwhile, our sex life was awful. I feel like I will never be enough for him, that to be satisfied he has to engage in these, IMO, juvenile behaviours. He says he is not the same man he was for the past 10 years, yet last night talked about seeing attractive women and imagining what the look like naked and perhaps bringing the energy from that arousal home to our bed. Apparently not be confused with him saying he would be thinking about or imagining this woman. He felt that this way fairly typical thoughts. I don't think that way. I'm so confused, any thoughts or opinions?


Me: BS 31
WH: 29 (theseseatsRtaken)
DS: 6 months old
Together 10 years, married 2.
DD1: 8th of Jan 2014
DD2: 10th of Jan 2014
NC: 8th of Jan
In hopeful R!

Posts: 289 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Australia
somethingremorse
♂ Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 2:17 PM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

how do you go back to normal life?

For me, it comes from understanding the root of my problems, and then fixing that. I cannot just change my actions. I have to change myself and my thoughts.

My personal example: I was depressed, felt neglected, unloved, all that stuff. I really didn't care about much of anything around me. I used to "treat" that unhappiness by putting my day to day life into a box, and having an A (and other destructive stuff). And I went further and further down. After a few years, every little thing I did lived in it's own compartment. I had almost no actual contact to the person I used to be.

How do I fix that? Not by just "not cheating." I am learning why I'd withdraw and go into depression (and some anti-depressants help). I have also seen that my withdrawing makes me unhappy.

What do I try to do now? I try to not get to that place where I withdraw. I recognize the things around me for what they are. If BW gets upset, or something goes wrong at work, it's because of something that I did, not that the world is against me. If something bothers me, I work on it RIGHT NOW, instead of letting it pull me down.

Every single day, every one, I an thankful for my BW and my family. And I know how much I tried to hurt it. I know how miserable I was then, and how much happier I am now.

Wow, I got carried away. Had MC today, got my emotions moving.

Anyway, I'd never make it if I decided that it was OK to swallow my feelings, or be withdrawn and depressed, so long as I never fooled around. I don't know if looking at other women was something that put him in "that place." If it was, he cannot fix his behavior if he's thinking the same way he was back then. He cannot walk close to the edge.

Maybe that kind of thinking was not the problem. But he cannot change without changing himself in a deep, fundamental way.

Good luck. I hope you get the answers you are looking for.


Me: WH (42)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 470 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
RomanticInnocenc
♀ Member
Member # 43041
Default  Posted: 1:30 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for your reply SR, I appreciate it a lot and see much of my WH in it. Whilst he never got depressed he did with draw because he felt that any time I was upset or angry at him I was saying he was a bad person, not that his actions were hurtful. Many FOO issues there. I believe he wants to change, he seems to be facing these issues although they scare the hell out both of us, but I think if there is a will, then it is possible, not saying there won't be bumps along the way, but all I hope for now is his best and the rest we can face together. (obviously his best consists of being faithful from now on!)


Me: BS 31
WH: 29 (theseseatsRtaken)
DS: 6 months old
Together 10 years, married 2.
DD1: 8th of Jan 2014
DD2: 10th of Jan 2014
NC: 8th of Jan
In hopeful R!

Posts: 289 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Australia
heartbrokeninaz
♀ Member
Member # 40779
Default  Posted: 1:34 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How many of you WS regressed after DD1? My WH cheated on me in July of 13. I thought we were on a great path to R. He then last Monday drives 900 miles for work, goes to the bar that night, a girl gives him her number, and he actually texts her and calls her. I am wondering if he is indeed chronic or if he just makes really bad choices when he is drinking? I also wonder if there is such a thing as midlife crisis? Not feeling attractive, old, whatever it might be? Just wondering if I should give up on this man that I have been with for 20 years or if there is hope that he can stop this selfish behavior. Any insight appreciated. I would love to hear from a WS that did regress.


BW 40 (me)
WH 40
DDay 1 07/31/13 ONS with horseface
DDay 2 05/09/14 inappropriate texts
with another OW
One last shot

Posts: 193 | Registered: Sep 2013
Trying2LoveAgain
♀ Member
Member # 43024
Default  Posted: 5:35 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As WS's do you think EVERY WS is physically attracted to their AP? My WH said that when he had the A (25 years ago...he was 33 at the time and the AP was approx. 25)he did not care about her feelings or what she wanted, etc. He said that he was just selfish and only thinking about himself. The only time I've really asked him if he was physically attracted to her was when we were having a HUGE fight and I accused him of lusting after her, to which he replied, "Yeah, I did for a long, long time. Now is that what you wanted to hear?" Later, he told me that he said things he did not mean, and was just agreeing with me because that's what I was accusing him of. So, I keep wondering this, but haven't had the courage to ask him at a time when we are talking calm and rational. I would love some feedback on this from WS or even the opinions of BS. His "why" of the A was because he needed validation and wasn't getting it from me, he felt unloved, neglected. He also said because he wasn't getting enough sex at home.(true, we were NOT having sex very often due to some of my issues with being molested). Just as a side note: He IS very remorseful, doing all he can to help me heal,and trying to answer all my questions but I just cannot bring myself to ask this one!


Me:BS
Him:FWH
2 DS:35 & 30 , 2 D Grandchildren
"Oh the webs we weave, when first we practice to deceive"....My WH quotes this often.
I found out about H's affair 25 yrs later.Mine is my own "Life is a journey, travel with Care."

Posts: 175 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: New Mexico
Ready_to_run
♂ Member
Member # 20954
Default  Posted: 8:54 AM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question for anyone that thinks they might have some insight for me as I just can't figure this one out.

What would motivate a normally intelligent, well educated, married woman while out with friends in another country, to take off with a man she just met and let him f**k her in a back ally using no protection?


BH
Divorced


Posts: 750 | Registered: Sep 2008
pastthelies
♀ Member
Member # 39269
Default  Posted: 1:34 PM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trying2LoveAgain

I was very attracted to my AP. It was that immediate look across the room attraction that you only feel a few times in your life. It was like there was electricity in the air. There was instant chemistry. The connection didn't come until later. There was a year EA and then 4 of PA.

I can't speak for everyone, only myself.


Posts: 64 | Registered: May 2013
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