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User Topic: Why was it so easy to lie?
1bigidiot79
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Member # 40557
Default  Posted: 11:14 AM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

There is a thread on the General forum talking about which hurts the most, the sex or the lies? This got me to thinking...I have come up with a lot of things I need to change in my life and have taken a long look at why I did what I did but I cannot for the life of me understand why lying to my BS was so easy.

As many BS's feel that the lying and deception is worse than what we WS's actually did, my BS feels the same way and it is her single biggest obstacle as to why she feels she cannot move forward towards R.

Therefore, I am doing some soul searching and I've got nothing. Sure I could say it was just more lies to cover up the first one and once the cover up was on it was keep it secret at all costs. But that's no excuse. What I find troubling, as I'm sure my BS does, is how it was so easy. How could I look at her with a straight, convincing face knowing that if she knew the truth it would be so very painful.

On the surface I know that I lied to keep her from that pain and that I lied to protect myself and the stupid persona I had created. Lying because I was selfish and didn't want to face the consequences of my actions. But like I said I think all those things are on the surface.

It still doesn't answer the question, why was it so easy? I do not have an answer for that. Knowing I could do that to someone I love more than anything or anyone scares the shit out of me. Am I really that callous. Really that mean. Why did I even think it was an option?

Has anyone come up with an answer for this? Struggling with coming to terms with the person I didn't know I was.


DDay 7/23/13
TT on 3/5/14 - Finally came completely clean
Finally working on making real changes in my life, one day at a time.

Posts: 165 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
Kap12
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Member # 41759
Default  Posted: 12:04 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can 100% agree with you. I know in my situation it was the continuous lying that has put my marriage in jeopardy. Don't get me wrong me having a PA isn't ok but it is not as bad as the lying and deception. I ask myself daily hourly why was it so easy to lie to the man I love. I still don't have the answer and I am hoping with time and lots of counseling I will not only save my marriage but also gain the trust back from my husband.

Posts: 61 | Registered: Dec 2013
SisterMilkshake
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Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 12:11 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWH was taught at a young age to lie. Trained by his dear mother. To keep peace in the house and to not "poke the bear" (his father, a very angry man) and his anger, everyone was taught about "conflict avoidance" which included, of course, lies, lies and more lies.

Have you looked at your FoO for some answers as to why lying comes so easily to you?

eta: to fix sentence

[This message edited by SisterMilkshake at 12:12 PM, January 3rd (Friday)]


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 9712 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
1bigidiot79
♂ Member
Member # 40557
Default  Posted: 1:25 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have you looked at your FoO for some answers as to why lying comes so easily to you?
Yes. My childhood wasn't perfect but by most peoples standards I was raised in a very loving, nurturing home and don't really have a lot to report. My mother was very demanding of me to toe the line so to speak but not to an unhealthy extent. I do think that there was a part of me that wanted to keep things hidden from her because I feared her somewhat. But again, this was not anything extreme. I do think some of that might have carried over into my marriage as I cannot stand the thought of disappointing my BS.

I think my BS is still in shock that I could so easily deceive her and lie directly to her face. I don't understand what was inside of me that said it was OK. I knew it is wrong and that it was cause pain and I did it anyway. Struggling with that. What's the difference between saying no to shooting someone in the head and saying no to lying? I mean I don't even have to think about not shooting someone in the head but not only did I think about lying to my BS's face, I made the jump from thinking about it to doing it. And with ease. I hate myself for that. It's the biggest regret I have in my entire life.


DDay 7/23/13
TT on 3/5/14 - Finally came completely clean
Finally working on making real changes in my life, one day at a time.

Posts: 165 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
Prayingforhope
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Member # 41801
Default  Posted: 1:56 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My BW says the same about the lying, that it was worse than the actual A. You realize trust is the basis for everything and we throw it away so quickly with the lies...

1bigidiot79, If I can ask, if after 6 months your BS still can't move forward with R, what status are you in? Are you separated? I'm curious what form of limbo you're in? (asks one WS in limbo to another..)


WH 41
BS 40
D-Day Oct 28th, 2013
Together 18 years
Three amazing boys 12, 9 & 6
Praying for hope daily

Posts: 260 | Registered: Dec 2013
confused43
♀ Member
Member # 41802
Default  Posted: 2:05 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm wondering this same thing as well. My BH does not know about my affair and I'm so very worried to tell him because the lies were so easy for me and he bought them all.

My lies involve making up friends that I was supposedly with for overnights and vacations when I was really with the AP. That to me will be the nail in the coffin if I confess. I was constantly on the go with "friends" and he never questioned it. My daughter was the one that would give me the third degree and it drove me nuts. but my BH never questioned anything making it so much easier for me.

I have always been a good liar I guess you could say. I would use fake ID with confidence when I wasn't legal age. I always say if you have confidence about your lie then people will believe you. I don't think I've ever really lied about other things in my life, at least not major lies, but of course this is the biggest lie I will ever have and not sure how to get over the fact that I did this and try to move on.


Me: WW 42 - Him: BH 45
Dday: Confessed 1/12/14 - EA/PA: 8 months
Married: 15 years - 3 Kids(5-13)
It's scary to think you know someone well and then realize you don't~~Even scarier when you realize that person is you!

Posts: 107 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: SW Oregon
1bigidiot79
♂ Member
Member # 40557
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1bigidiot79, If I can ask, if after 6 months your BS still can't move forward with R, what status are you in? Are you separated? I'm curious what form of limbo you're in? (asks one WS in limbo to another..)
For now things are in kind of a holding pattern. I think my BS is in protection mode and just waiting to see if the things I am telling her are for real or just me blowing smoke. I think she wants to love me again but just cannot get past the trust issue and the thought of being this hurt again down the road. So right now I am just thankful that I am in the house (albeit in separate bedrooms)and have the opportunity to prove myself to her everyday. I'd be lying if I said it was easy. In fact, the hardest part is being so close in proximity to her yet so far away from her in relationship.

Things are moving at a glacial pace but at this point I'm just glad they are moving. One baby step at a time. I keep telling myself if things work out between us it will have been better to go this slow so that everything gets dealt with rather than going too fast and not dealing with everything appropriately.

I have made progress in regards to not lying to her now or in the future. For example, even the smallest of things make me stop and think to tell her the entire story. And not even necessarily bad things. Just being totally forthcoming in everything. I didn't realize just how much information I had been withholding from her.

But the question still remains and haunts me. How am I supposed to explain to my BS why I was able to deceive her so easily and without concern? I don't know and I hope some others who have been through this can tell of their experiences because I'm at a loss.

[This message edited by 1bigidiot79 at 2:44 PM, January 3rd (Friday)]


DDay 7/23/13
TT on 3/5/14 - Finally came completely clean
Finally working on making real changes in my life, one day at a time.

Posts: 165 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
rachelc
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Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 2:57 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it wasn't. I told him within three weeks. I lay on the couch every night and cried. Then, I didn't tell him the truth about everything, I lied by omission that it wasn't physical. I started drinking. a lot. I almost committed suicide.

Yet, I still did it. and then unloaded the burden to him. ugh. Proof that you really need to know yourself. You really need to clarify values. I just floated through life existing. Not good.. and look how many people I dragged down in the process.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's


Posts: 5062 | Registered: Dec 2010
scream
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Member # 36506
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Intresting post. I have spent a long time on this subject. By myself,IC and with my wife. I have come up with any hard core why's. For me it became like breathing. Just something I did. Had it been a money maker I would be a billionare. But the cost of those lies almost cost me my family. Was it easy to lie yes. Is it easy to really know why? Not sure. I go back to my childhood....I lied to get what I wanted and to not get in trouble. Is it just something that easy to learn, get good at and just keep doing?

Posts: 290 | Registered: Aug 2012
rachelc
♀ Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 9:12 PM, January 3rd (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'll have to say that it was never part of my repertoire before the affair. Just wasn't part of me, which is pretty concerning considering affairs are all about lying.
It was part of hubby's life though and I saw the red flags- cheating on exams, taking proprietary info from jobs and saying everybody does it. I'm an idiot.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's


Posts: 5062 | Registered: Dec 2010
Scorpio2310
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Member # 41561
Default  Posted: 2:14 AM, January 4th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My BSO even gave me a chance to be honest... I still chose to lie. I believe that my problem lies with my desire to please everyone and control issues. When I was a kid I hid notes from the teachers and lied to my parents because I did not want to upset them. I would hide things from the women in all my relationships because I was afraid that the truth would turn them away from me.

I chose to withhold the truth from them. I had the power because I held the truth. Even when given the option to tell the truth I decided to lie. I took away their choice in the matter. I made up their minds for them.

I thought and said that this relationship, with my BSO, would be different. I told her and myself that I would always be honest with her, but when it came to crunch time I still took to my old ways and lied to her.

I am working on correcting this habit now. It is difficult because every time I am honest with her and she doesn't like the truth I think about how it would have been easier to lie to her. The good thing is that I don't because I stop at the crossroads of truth and lies and tell myself that in the long run the lies will hurt her even more.


Posts: 61 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: Indiana
1bigidiot79
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Member # 40557
Default  Posted: 12:00 PM, January 4th (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Scorpio, I can very much relate to your story and have employed these tactics in my own life. In the search for answers to why I could lie so easily this is the one thing that kind of makes sense. It still shouldn't have made it so easy.

I think to try and come up with one reason is not seeing the big picture. I have come to the conclusion that a lot of different factors contributed to my ability to deceive my BS without seeing past the moment and thinking about what the implications of what I was doing would do to her.

-trying to protect her
-trying to not upset her
-trying to avoid the pain of the truth
-trying to keep the peace
-habit from childhood to keep out of trouble
-trying to keep the persona I had built intact
-one lie leads to another, cover up after cover up
-selfishness
-justification that my sins were secret and they were not hurting anyone (sold myself that lie)

These are some of the reasons I think that I came to the place where lying came so easily to me. I like you Scorpio have begun the process of thinking things through before I speak and try to think of why it is better to be completely honest in all aspects of my conversation no matter what. Learning every day.


DDay 7/23/13
TT on 3/5/14 - Finally came completely clean
Finally working on making real changes in my life, one day at a time.

Posts: 165 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
fourever
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Member # 30631
Default  Posted: 8:47 PM, January 12th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unless I missed it, no one gave any thought to the fact that your spouses loved and trusted so very unconditionally, that you could have told them anything, and they would believe you.

For you to betray that, is the biggest sin of all. I think for many, that is an incredible thing to overcome. It is so shocking and unbelievable to the BS that holds that much love & trust in you, every hour of every day, it's not comprehendible.

That is the true loss of innocence in a marriage. That is what is so crushing and impossible to comprehend, and so hard to repair.


In R since shortly after DD.
Discovered what was right in front of him and nearly lost.

Always, tell the other BS! Always!

"It's hard to be in love when you can't tell lies"!


Posts: 874 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Northeast
Remone
♂ New Member
Member # 40260
Default  Posted: 11:47 PM, January 12th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For me it was definitely FOO issues. Conflict avoidance learned from my mother very early on. I learned that my feelings and expressions of them were valid. So instead I pushed them way down inside and in doing so became so self centered and selfish. I would say or do anything to avoid conflict and maintain this "nice guy" persona. Unfortunately the lack of honesty with myself allowed the lying to my beautiful wife. Learning to be honest and validate my feelings in a loving way and to not be scared of them is a very scary process.

Posts: 38 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Canada
Stillkicking
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Member # 38246
Default  Posted: 12:08 AM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been lying my entire life, to me it was easier to lie than deal with truth, there are lies I've told so many times that they became truths to me and I could no longer tell the difference. I think that it is part of me that is the manipulator, which was also very easy for me to do. I found from a early age that I was able to lie and manipulate many people into doing what I wanted them to do. I manipulated my parents, my sisters, my friends, and teachers. I have fooled many, many people into believing I was an amazing honest and kind person, truth is, the only part of that last sentence that is true is I am a person. It had everything to do with personal gain and my extreme self centred personality, and a total and complete lack of consequences, or attention and care of consequences.


You'll never learn to fly
until your standing at the cliff

I reserve my right to feel uncomfortable reserve my right to be afraid.
I make mistakes and I am humbled every step of the way.


Posts: 128 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Canada
SlowUptake
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Member # 40484
Default  Posted: 4:53 AM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unless I missed it, no one gave any thought to the fact that your spouses loved and trusted so very unconditionally, that you could have told them anything, and they would believe you.

This is why it was so easy, blind trust.

Lying is a tool for manipulation, for avoiding consequences, a way to be in control.
I found that when I learnt to face consequences and let go of outcomes, the lying stopped.
Maybe you should explore why you want to always be in control of the situation.

ETA:

I think to try and come up with one reason is not seeing the big picture. I have come to the conclusion that a lot of different factors contributed to my ability to deceive my BS without seeing past the moment and thinking about what the implications of what I was doing would do to her.

-trying to protect her
-trying to not upset her
-trying to avoid the pain of the truth
-trying to keep the peace
-habit from childhood to keep out of trouble
-trying to keep the persona I had built intact
-one lie leads to another, cover up after cover up
-selfishness
-justification that my sins were secret and they were not hurting anyone (sold myself that lie)


All of this is about control.

[This message edited by SlowUptake at 4:56 AM, January 13th (Monday)]


Me:WS,50+
Her:BS,50+ (WantToWakeUp)
Married 33yrs
Dday Dec 2009

"Do not say a little in many words but a great deal in a few." Pythagoras

There are two kinds of people in the world.
Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.


Posts: 390 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Limbo in Oz
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 8:52 AM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If you really want to dig into the why, how and the ethics of lying, then check out these sites.

http://www.truthaboutdeception.com/

http://lyingandcheating.blogspot.ca/2007/02/typology-of-cheating.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/lying/lying_1.shtml

Bluntly put, we lie to protect ourselves. We can lie by omission, we can lie by commission. We tell little white lies, we tell big whoppers of lies. Lying isn't uncommon and most everyone who says they never lie just hasn't taken a very clear look at their actions and motivations.

In my own search for the why of my affair, I had a lot of difficulty coming to terms with the fact that I was guilty of lying to myself as often, if not more, than I lied to LF. I had to face up to the truth that I had been guilty of self-delusion for my entire life as it was easier and less hurtful to me than facing my demons head on. Facing yourself in the mirror and seeing a lying cheat was difficult to say the least but there is truth to the saying that the truth will set you free.

HUFI

Unknown Poster - For every lie I told her, I told two to myself.


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3266 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
1bigidiot79
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Member # 40557
Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In my own search for the why of my affair, I had a lot of difficulty coming to terms with the fact that I was guilty of lying to myself as often, if not more, than I lied to LF. I had to face up to the truth that I had been guilty of self-delusion for my entire life as it was easier and less hurtful to me than facing my demons head on. Facing yourself in the mirror and seeing a lying cheat was difficult to say the least but there is truth to the saying that the truth will set you free.
You are absolutely right. I was just talking to my IC about this the other day. I never realized just how much I had deceived myself. The old saying that if you say something enough times you begin to accept it as the truth really did play out in my own life. As much as all this hurts, I am glad I took that look in the mirror and my only regret is that I didn't do it a long time ago.

I am still struggling with my original question and the reason for starting this thread. I know why I lied. I still have a hard time comprehending just how easy it became. I am ashamed of that. This is why I think my BS is having such a hard time moving forward as well. She looks at me now and thinks if he can lie to me so easily and convincingly, how am I supposed to believe anything that comes out of his mouth. I totally get it and only time and consistency will ever be able to change that.


DDay 7/23/13
TT on 3/5/14 - Finally came completely clean
Finally working on making real changes in my life, one day at a time.

Posts: 165 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 11:45 AM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1bigidiot79 - I know why I lied. I still have a hard time comprehending just how easy it became. I am ashamed of that.

Having negative feelings and thoughts over the extent of my lies (self or external) was a big issue in my healing process too. When guilt or shame struck, I was guilty of internalizing it and was finding myself stuck in the shame spiral. The book, The Journey from Abandonment to Healing was of help at this time.

Part of the healing consisted of looking at why I lied. What was it that I was trying to accomplish with the lie? It was only when I came to understand that my lies were part and parcel of the path chosen by a child trying to cope with trauma that I could see the lies for what they were. Those lies were the mental and emotional structures that supported my internal fantasy. Once I understood that, then I could identify, intercept and refute the negative message and avoid internalizing the guilt. The shame and guilt still sometimes is overwhelming but slowly, I have come to accept that the lies are not the sole definition of who I am.

1bigidiot79 - She looks at me now and thinks if he can lie to me so easily and convincingly, how am I supposed to believe anything that comes out of his mouth. I totally get it and only time and consistency will ever be able to change that.

I donít know if your wife will ever trust you completely and at this point of time, I donít know if she does either. Quite often, BSís describe the pre-A marriage with the words of blind trust and most of them describe the post A era as one of trust with verification.

HUFI


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3266 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
remorsefulww
♀ Member
Member # 42029
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, January 13th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been lying my entire life, to me it was easier to lie than deal with truth, there are lies I've told so many times that they became truths to me and I could no longer tell the difference. I think that it is part of me that is the manipulator, which was also very easy for me to do. I found from a early age that I was able to lie and manipulate many people into doing what I wanted them to do. I manipulated my parents, my sisters, my friends, and teachers. I have fooled many, many people into believing I was an amazing honest and kind person, truth is, the only part of that last sentence that is true is I am a person. It had everything to do with personal gain and my extreme self centred personality, and a total and complete lack of consequences, or attention and care of consequences.

^^^^^ This

I often ask myself why it was so easy to lie to my BS, to the person I love, to the person who loved me for me. For me it was like second nature from early childhood to get what exactly I wanted and what would benefit me the most, and if others got hurt in the process then oh well.
Through IC I have done a lot of searching to try and find myself and the "whys" I do this. I have grown so much to becoming a better me, spouse, and mother.
The best things that I did was coming here reading posts from both sides, not trickle truth anything, complete transparency, complete honesty(yes, that was hard),putting the whole timeline out on the table. After reading posts here I realized it wasn't about me and what I can suppress or hide to get away with something and not have my BS hurting.
He wanted it ALL and thats what I gave him with no lies. He said "if it doesn't hurt then it's a lie." After it was all out I felt better, he felt better, and it was finally a step towards closing that door and start trying to reconcile.
I buried myself sooo deep with my lies. I lied to cover up what I did, I lied to cover up lies to cover up even more lies and all that did was hurt our relationship even more on top of what I already did.


Posts: 55 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: new york
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