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User Topic: Mistake or Choice?
sisoon
♂ Member
Member # 31240
Default  Posted: 4:48 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In my own mind, an A is really a set of mistakes that add up to a giant mistake - but for me, the word 'mistake' doesn't carry much baggage with it.

If my W had said something like 'I just made a mistake', or 'Can't you forgive me for making this mistake', I'd have accused her of minimizing and avoiding responsibility.

I pretty much feel it's OK for a BS to use the term, if the BS is really calling the WS to account, but it's not OK for a WS to use it.

JMO, of course - but I've thought this for almost 3 years.


fBH (me) - 70 (22 in my head), fWW (plainsong) - 65+, Married 45+, together since 1965
DDay - 12/2010
Recovered, not yet fully R'ed
I share my own experience because it's the only experience I know, not because I'm a good model.

Posts: 10047 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area
scarednbroken
♀ Member
Member # 41961
Default  Posted: 5:00 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is an interesting discussion on word choice. I agree. I think mistake and poor choices are similar.

As a teacher - I talk to my students about mistakes, good choices, and poor choices. (We don't use "bad" bc it's like using a red pen. - rolling my eyes)

I think a mistake carries the connotation that it was UNINTENTIONAL. And that is where the breakdown is in the discussion here. Yes a mistake is defined as an action that is misguided BUT social definition provides for a mistake to be less damning than making a bad choice. Like using not using a red pen saves the ego a little, takes away the bite. But before red pens were used as showing errors it was just a pen...

Mistake, bad choice, poor choice, whatever it is the wayward need to own that mistake, bad choice, poor choice and make retribution to the wronged. And take steps not to make that mistake, bad choice, poor choice again.


BS: Me 44 WH: 50 Kids: 13, 15, 17, 28 DD: every yr Ow: tons Status: fed-up. A woman should never invest in a relationship she wouldn't want for her daughter, nor should she allow any man to treat her in a way she would scold her son for

Posts: 417 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Midwest
whattheh
♀ Member
Member # 40032
Default  Posted: 5:09 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mistake minimizes it. It was an intentional albeit poor choice.

My fWH has said both. He said it was a mistake that he made such a poor choice. But he has owned it.

I don't dwell on this anymore for us because he 'gets it' now.


BW- mid 50's (me)
fWH-late 50's
M 33 T 35
DD-Early 2013 PA 2010
In R but I have PTSD...

Posts: 535 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 5:20 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mis·take
məˈstāk/
noun
noun: mistake; plural noun: mistakes
1.
an action or judgment that is misguided or wrong.

Fits the act of murder too. It was just a mistake, I was cleaning it and it went off. Didn't mean to blow his damn head off, but shit happens.

ETA: Sometimes I hate the semantics game.

[This message edited by Tred at 5:21 PM, January 28th (Tuesday)]


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3910 | Registered: Dec 2011
RyeBread
♂ Member
Member # 37437
Default  Posted: 5:36 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Someone could CHOOSE to make a MISTAKE but why make that choice to begin with. Seems to me that an A is more of a revelation of character than anything. Tack on lies, manipulation, gaslighting, etc and I think it speaks for itself.


But.. if I am going to play the semantics game:

To me a mistake implies some sort of innocence or ignorance. I think the WS knows exactly what they are doing. Therefore, not a mistake.


Let him that would move the world first move himself. - Socrates

Posts: 1030 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Midwest
sisoon
♂ Member
Member # 31240
Default  Posted: 5:50 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've come to reject the importance of intentionality in this.

The pain of being betrayed is awful whether an A is revenge in some way or not.

Besides, what WS hasn't said something like, 'I didn't mean to hurt you,' or 'I thought you didn't love me any more?'

Again, JMO.

On the use of these words, we're going to fall into at least 2 camps. Let's keep in mind that we mostly seem to like and respect each other.


fBH (me) - 70 (22 in my head), fWW (plainsong) - 65+, Married 45+, together since 1965
DDay - 12/2010
Recovered, not yet fully R'ed
I share my own experience because it's the only experience I know, not because I'm a good model.

Posts: 10047 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area
scangel3
♀ Member
Member # 36164
Default  Posted: 6:47 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Choosing to have an A is a choice, although my wh still calls it a mistake. It pisses me off when he calls it that. Like you said calling a choice is owning what you chose to do. You don't accidently have an A, you just don't, you made a choice to call/text the ap, you makea choice to see them. How can that me a accident?

That's at least where I'm at in all this. My wh chose some pretty pour choices for his life, but he didn't do them by accident!!! He knew what he was doing and did it anyway.


BS-me 31, WH-31, M'd-10 years
DD 8.5, DS 6, DS 5.5
Dday 03/01/10 (our DD's bday)
A ended 08/31/10-09/02-10 (with multiple ddays in between).TT on 08/2012, 09/04/12, 11/16/2012, 01/2013, 6/25/2013 Says he wants R, but not proving it

Posts: 714 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Portland
RealityStinks
♂ Member
Member # 41457
Default  Posted: 6:55 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've heard the "mistake" line multiple times. But she made a choice to make the same "mistake" over and over and over......

[This message edited by RealityStinks at 6:57 PM, January 28th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 414 | Registered: Nov 2013
BeyondBreaking
♀ Member
Member # 38020
Default  Posted: 9:46 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The problem isn't the word mistake in and of itself.

It is very common in our society to use the word "mistake" to mean "accident" or even things that aren't a big deal.

Ripping my pants is an accident.
Spilling my coffee is an accident.
Neither is a very big deal. Annoying, damaging- but in the grand scheme of things, not the end of the world.

I rear-end someone in the car-accident. Unintentional error. Accidental mistake. It can be very destructive and expensive- but it was something I didn't mean to do.

Mistakes can also be bad choices that were made intentionally. Losing my virginity in the back seat of a car was very much an intentional choice I made in high school- and a mistake I regretted doing afterwards.

An affair is indeed a mistake- one that is intentional, calculated, and a choice knowing that the consequences would be hurtful and negative. The choices to lie, trickle truth, continue speaking to the OP, continuing sleeping with the OP- all are choices, and all are mistakes.

The problem is that mistake is so often used to mean "accident" that when someone uses it about an affair- it does leave a sour taste in my mouth. When I hear my H say, "I made a mistake," what I end up hearing is: "this isn't my fault and I don't take responsibility. I don't recognize that cheating wasn't a one time error in judgement, but a series of inter-tangled webs of calculated lies and omissions, multiple betrayals, and the choice to disrespect me every single moment of every day for six months."

I prefer the word choice, because when I hear choice, at least I am NOT hearing "accident."


I have been cheated on by 3 different men, and I have more DDays than anyone ever should. I am here, just trying to pickup the pieces.

At least the current man "only" cyber-cheated.

"Love means never having to say you're sorry."


Posts: 840 | Registered: Jan 2013
industriousbee
♀ Member
Member # 41324
Default  Posted: 10:53 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sisoon, this has been on my mind lately. I am leaning towards choice.


Married 8 years
ME BS 30
HIM WS 33
DD 1.5 years old
DDAY 11-13-12

Posts: 116 | Registered: Nov 2013
Lovedyoumore
♀ Member
Member # 35593
Default  Posted: 11:00 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I made a mistake when I was mislead after the EA DDay. I believed him.

He made a very corrupt, selfish choice to let the A go past our marital boundaries. No matter what the reasons, he made a choice every day.


Me 52
WH 52
Married 30+ years
Together trying to R

I tell people I am tired but really my heart is broken and I am sad.


Posts: 1466 | Registered: May 2012 | From: Southern, bless your heart
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 11:09 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Can we just say action? Whether it was a mistake or choice by the Merriam's definition, it was a deliberate action. It was intentional 100% of the time. No accidents. If someone wants to minimize by equating it with unintentional or accidental acts, then tell them it wasn't their "mistake" that is the reason for [insert how you are feeling here] it is the deliberate actions that they took that are the reason for [insert how you are feeling here].


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3910 | Registered: Dec 2011
Dreamland
♀ Member
Member # 40488
Default  Posted: 11:11 PM, January 28th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hate when they say that they made a mistake... It just makes me so upset and angry.. Really sticking your dick in some sluts vagina is a mistake.. Right dude ... That was a decision.. A conscientious choice....


Me-BS 50 Him-WH 47, DD17
Together since 1993, Married 19 yrs
DDay 3/12,4/12,7/12 EA-PA OW - 25 single husband chasing bastard whore

Posts: 515 | Registered: Aug 2013
chetristezza
♀ New Member
Member # 42233
Default  Posted: 12:01 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"Mistake minimizes it.". I don't think so. I think mistakes can be far from minimal. Ask someone that lost a family member or suffered horribly from a doctor's "mistake", or a lawyers. People can lose their lives as well as their lively hood and careers from being on both the giving and receiving end.

How it's described by anyone else but someone who is harmed is meaningless. It is what it is and if my husband views his actions as mistakes is so irrelevant to me. The fact he did them is the only focus for me right now. I don't value anything that comes out of his mouth right now. Splitting hairs on meaning would just be pointless when it's all just shit.


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
iwillNOT
♀ Member
Member # 40605
Default  Posted: 2:07 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I believe that our words can shape our thoughts. Saying exactly what you mean is important.

If you say a thing often enough, it shapes your attitudes. You might begin to believe your own BS(as in bovine excrement.) He chose daily to pursue something he knew would devastate me. It was purposeful, intentional, planned and calculated. He needs to name it for what it was, a choice where he weighed the pros and cons and my hurt was an acceptable "con."

Say it, own it, believe it.

[This message edited by iwillNOT at 2:08 AM, January 29th (Wednesday)]


Me: BS, 43
Him: WH, 44
Together 21 years
Married 14 years
Kiddos 2,6,8,10
Dday#1 2004, 3 years after EA/PA co-worker MOW
Dday#2 8-6-13, 13 months EA/9months PA with co-worker MOW - caught not confessed
Rugsweep now, pay later. Ask me how I know.

Posts: 499 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Midwest
Ostrich80
Member
Member # 34827
Default  Posted: 3:57 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know this bs wanted to believe it was a mistake and not a choice. My answer is different now then it would have been on DD. I so wanted it to just be a mistake like ws said it was. I know better now. I would rather hear him say, I made the choice to cheat. That would be the honest response.

[This message edited by Ostrich80 at 3:58 AM, January 29th (Wednesday)]


BS..me
WS..him
Been with him over half my life
4kid
DD1 10-01-09 DD2 02-12-12 discovered it never ended
OW..nothing special. Just your average skank
Status..#$%@????

Posts: 5020 | Registered: Feb 2012 | From: midwest
refuz2bavictim
♀ Member
Member # 27176
Default  Posted: 4:24 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I chose to remain faithful.
My H chose to cheat.
My friends chose to betray me.
Unfortunately, my fwh made the mistake of not erasing some messages. Oops!
MOW made the mistake of thinking he was the kind of person who doesn't make those kind of mistakes. Double oops!

I feel pretty comfortable with my understanding of who owns what.



BS:ME DDay: 7/18/09 Last of TT 7/11/10
MOW's EA/PA all were my "friends" but one


Posts: 2372 | Registered: Jan 2010
astudentoflife
♂ Member
Member # 25821
Default  Posted: 6:14 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As a WS I am very careful to always refer to my ONS/affair as a choice and never use the word mistake. I concur with most on this thread that words have meanings and I believe the word mistake is for something like putting and x in the wrong box on a math exam, not for the action I took.

I do that for my BW peace of mind and my piece of mind that I am aware of my behavior and I am not "forgetting" how I got there in the first place. It is part of healing I believe. Ownership.

[This message edited by astudentoflife at 6:16 AM, January 29th (Wednesday)]


WS:52 Male
BS:47 Female
Working towards R and forgiveness.
Also working on domestic abuse issues (9 months abuse free, working hard for more)
My wife is my greatest teacher and best friend.


Posts: 320 | Registered: Oct 2009 | From: Florida
astudentoflife
♂ Member
Member # 25821
Default  Posted: 6:18 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For a little chuckle, I just put "piece" of mind when I should have put "peace"of mind.

Oooops, now that IS a mistake.


WS:52 Male
BS:47 Female
Working towards R and forgiveness.
Also working on domestic abuse issues (9 months abuse free, working hard for more)
My wife is my greatest teacher and best friend.


Posts: 320 | Registered: Oct 2009 | From: Florida
2yrsblind
♂ Member
Member # 41974
Default  Posted: 6:37 AM, January 29th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh how I agree with this. I never understood the "mistake" angle. WS woke up every morning looked the BS in the eyes and said I love you all the while ploting the days events that included banging their AP. Then they did it over and over again.

I stand firmly behind the thought that the only mistake made is thinking one could handle the guilt or being caught. The A, nah, that's no mistake.


The most damaging lies told are those we tell to ourselves--my grandma

Posts: 95 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Midwest USA
Topic Posts: 43
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