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Just Found Out Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Thoughts and comments 30 days later...
JellyGirl84
♀ Member
Member # 41717
Default  Posted: 5:23 PM, February 18th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RawDeal,

Please please please tell the OM's wife. I am so glad the bf of the girl who was cheating with my WH found a way to tell me. He saved my life. I have happiness that much sooner because he contacted me. I am getting divorced and I'd rather be that than be wondering what my WH's problem is, never knowing he was cheating.


Me: BS 30
WH: 30
No kids
Divorced in June 2014
Together 10 yrs, Married for 3 of those yrs
OP: Ho worker
Divorced June 2014

Posts: 162 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: Nj
LAFA
♂ Member
Member # 31868
Default  Posted: 5:29 PM, February 18th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Raw Deal: Gently, you cannot trust the OM to tell his wife any more than you could trust him not to screw yours. It's important that the other betrayed spouse know the life she is living, that she may have been given an STD, to protect herself as she sees fit. Do not discuss this with your WW or the OM, providing them with an opportunity to paint you as a crazy jealous fool or worse. It may also have the benefit of preventing them from taking the affair underground.


When you put someone on a pedestal, they quickly learn two things. The view is mighty good from up there, and it is a fine vantage from which to kick.

Posts: 197 | Registered: Apr 2011 | From: Hawaii
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 5:52 PM, February 18th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You cannot, I repeat...You CANNOT leave it up to the om to tell his spouse. He will not be truthful and even if you were standing there making him do it he would give a watered down version.

These 2 people have lied, cheated, hid, covered up, and lied some more in the past year to get their egos stroked and their rocks off. Do not believe, trust, or give the benefit of a doubt to either one of them. It sucks I know and the pain can be paralyzing at times. But you now know that the one person that was supposed to have your back regardless is broken and needs to do some serious work on herself.

Forgive my blunt manner but I sure wished someone would have made this clear to me on DDay. Instead I willingly believed my spouse and eagerly headed down the path of R. Only to have him break NC again and again and again. If someone would have said wait hold it, this isn't What normally happens it would have saved me some heartache I think.

You are smart, strong, capable and deserve more. You won't get it though until you take control and demand it.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8789 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
mainlyinpain
♀ Member
Member # 39134
Default  Posted: 6:01 PM, February 18th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How would you know the OM would tell his spouse the truth?
A reason given a lot for telling the OS is to have another pair of eyes on the A. This BS will be watching the OM and know if he is acting in a way that she suspects he has taken the A underground, hidden it better.
As for a revenge A....who with? An old friend of yours who you will write texts to about how much you love them and how great sex is together and how you wish you were with them instead of your WW? You can't recreate what she did...I don't think you would want to. And whoever you would have an affair with is a person too.
Are you going to hurt them? Or is it just revenge sex? How many times? As many as she did? What if you develop feelings for this person? What if she ends up pregnant or you get an STD? Do you want to be that guy? Why have


DD 1 - 7/7/2004
DD 2 - 10/31/2011
DD 3 - 4/30/2013(or continuation?)(Yes)
DD 4 - 9/25/2013
DD 5 - 2/15/2014 (found phone from 2009)

Posts: 506 | Registered: Apr 2013
mainlyinpain
♀ Member
Member # 39134
Default  Posted: 6:07 PM, February 18th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How would you know the OM would tell his spouse the truth?
Another reason for telling the OS is to have another pair of eyes on the A. This BS will be watching the OM and know if he is acting in a way that she suspects he has taken the A underground, hidden it better.
As for a revenge A....who with? An old friend of yours who you will write texts to about how much you love them and how great sex is together and how you wish you were with them instead of your WW? You can't recreate what she did...I don't think you would want to. And whoever you would have an affair with is a person too. Are you going to hurt them? Or is it just revenge sex? How many times? As many as she did? What if you develop feelings for this person? What if she ends up pregnant or you get an STD?
You can't do to your WW what she did to you.
That would destroy your life for sure.
Be the man you were before this, the father you were before this. Don't invite more anguish into your life.
It may be that the idea of being with someone other than your wife becomes more and more appealing. If that happens then D. Realize you don't have to do anything right now. Make decision about anything. You have alot of options but you need to take the time to think.

So sorry for the pain you are going through.


DD 1 - 7/7/2004
DD 2 - 10/31/2011
DD 3 - 4/30/2013(or continuation?)(Yes)
DD 4 - 9/25/2013
DD 5 - 2/15/2014 (found phone from 2009)

Posts: 506 | Registered: Apr 2013
RawDeal75
♂ Member
Member # 42495
Default  Posted: 2:01 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Most, if not all, of what you are all saying makes perfect sense to me. I think I'm starting to realize I should have gone with my first instinct and told the OM's wife immediately. Better late than never I guess... Everything I have done and thought so far, since Dday, has been done without consulting forums or articles on the subject, and even though I feel most of what I have done and the ways I have reacted have been "right" and sensible, I now see that some external input would have been good at an earlier stage. Also - I have not yet confided in anyone else, not a single family member or friend knows. This makes me feel very alone in the world right now, but at the same time I am hesitant to open up to any of our shared friends.

In telling the OMs wife - how did you do this? Phone call? Email? Did you at once and first contact provide all the proof (emails, SMS, photos, receipts, etc.) you had gathered on the A? Did the first contact lead to consecutive contacts with the OP's spouse? When, how?

Do any of you regret telling it? A small piece of me actually feels bad for the OM! How sick is that??!?!! I have had a few emails going back and forth between him and me to confirm the story of my WW, and to try to understand why. Why!
He seems sincere and to the best of my knowledge he has given me nothing but the truth and actually openness about the A and his own relationship. No remorse, no apology though...


Me: BH, 39. Her: WW, 39. Two kids: 3&5
Together 21 yrs. Married 13 yrs.

D-day #2 Jan 18, 2014: 12 month EA/PA (AP#3)+ admission of 5 month EA/PA in 1994 (AP#1).
D-day #1 May 2001: 2 month EA/PA (AP#2)


Posts: 54 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Europe
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 8:46 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In our situation, I actually did not tell OW's H, why? because she was a very powerful attorney in her town, and had basically threatened my H that if he told him she would sue him for Libel, and slander.....Of course when she broke NC the last time, he did send him the information as he felt he had nothing left to loose, and she was weaker than he had ever imagined. That was about 6 months in. My H was the 3 AP for her.

Don't know what happened to her after that, and honestly don't care. I do know the Karma bus will stop at her house one day and ruin her life.

When H finally told her H he basically sent some proof in an email, and apologized for his actions, and gave him the names of the other two men, that the Crazy OW had willingly shared with H during the A. He sent it from a made up email account, left it open for 48 hours, and then deleted it. Never heard back from him.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8789 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
craig2001
♂ Member
Member # 55
Default  Posted: 9:13 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As far as I know in the US, libel and slander brings everything out in court. All truths and I would that this OW lawyer would know all of that.

It is only libel or slander if untruths or lies are told.

The slander laws are different and not as friendly in the UK.

A lawsuit would have been very ugly for this OW I would imagine.


Posts: 4282 | Registered: Jun 2002
kalimata
♂ Member
Member # 42104
Default  Posted: 11:24 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RawDeal:

The reason why both the OM and your WW are pleased that you are not breaking their fantasy bubble by not exposing is that they now have the opportunity to take things underground.

I hate to tell you this, but most likely what is happening is that they have found other more secretive ways to communicate with each other.

The only way you can shatter their fantasy world and slap them both into reality is to expose the affair. I understand why you don't want to expose to too many people. This is a common request that most waywards ask. But in the end you won't be able to live with yourself unless you know that WW is TRUELY REMORSEFUL for the pain she has inflicted upon you and your family.

EXPOSE THE AFFAIR TO OMW. Its the right thing to do. Will prevent you a WHOLE lot of pain in the coming months to come. Else you will always be wondering whenever your WW ducks into the shadow.


Posts: 191 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: USA
kalimata
♂ Member
Member # 42104
Default  Posted: 11:29 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In telling the OMs wife - how did you do this? Phone call? Email? Did you at once and first contact provide all the proof (emails, SMS, photos, receipts, etc.) you had gathered on the A? Did the first contact lead to consecutive contacts with the OP's spouse? When, how?

Best way to do it in person or via telephone call. If you send a letter or email, make sure it cannot be intercepted by OM. Send enough proof just so OMW knows you are not bluffing. If she asks for more proof, offer to meet her in person and show her what you have.

OM may have access to his wife's email account, or be the primary person checking the postal mail.

In my case I let the OMW know via facebook. The message was short, and I provided a photo showing both OM and WW together as proof. The response was instanteous. She must have immediately called OM right up and blasted him.

Just get ready, because if after exposure, the word somehow gets back to your WW, you will know that she violated NC. Be prepared to stand your ground.


Posts: 191 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: USA
kalimata
♂ Member
Member # 42104
Default  Posted: 11:32 AM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

One last thought:

DO NOT WARN ANYONE THAT YOU ARE GOING TO EXPOSE.......JUST DO IT.

Otherwise what will happen is that it will give OM and WW chance to concoct their stories to align.

DO NOT WARN.........EXPOSE EXPOSE EXPOSE

Stand back and watch the shyte hit the fan.


Posts: 191 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: USA
RawDeal75
♂ Member
Member # 42495
Default  Posted: 12:27 PM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You are all amazing for taking time out of your days to respond to the desperate questions and musings of an unknown person. Thank you! It is truly helful to know there is so much support, love and wisdom out there.

I now know I will tell OM's wife.

I will also take the high road and not pursue a revenge affair. How would I have done that anyway? Spend months and months on finding the right (and willing!) person, butter her up with emails, phone calls and sexual invites until she accepted to have an affair with me? Risking to send both her and me on emotional rollercoasters, and potentially destroying another persons life and trust. I don't think so. Stupid thought, and disgusting.

Another thing I have just decided to do is to try to accelerate the remorse and feeling of guilt in my WW. I still do not see that enough, still feels she "can have me if she wants me", and the only things triggering real emotions in her is the risk of her losing custody or when I accuse her of lying. What I want to do is to give her an ultimatum : if she truly wants me and for me to allow her to start building up my trust in her again I will want her to expose the affair and exactly what she has done to her own parents and brother. I expect to do so this weekend. This would be one of the worst things imaginable to her, and would really be a test of her love for me. Has anyone done something similar? Did it work? Any ideas around this?


Me: BH, 39. Her: WW, 39. Two kids: 3&5
Together 21 yrs. Married 13 yrs.

D-day #2 Jan 18, 2014: 12 month EA/PA (AP#3)+ admission of 5 month EA/PA in 1994 (AP#1).
D-day #1 May 2001: 2 month EA/PA (AP#2)


Posts: 54 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Europe
painfulpast
♀ Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 5:13 PM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm glad you're telling OM's wife. She deserves to know. I told via FB, followed by a phone call.

As far as 'testing', why bother? Then it's just a game of who can outdo who. If she wants you, you'll know it. If not, then tell her to leave. If you want to see how she really feels, don't challenge her with a 'do this, or lose me' game. Just take yourself away. You'll see really quickly how she really feels, and it will be all about you, not whether or not she finds what you've asked for less distasteful than you leaving.

Tell her that she isn't really remorseful, and that you don't see a future with her arrogant attitude, and you want her to leave. Then start the 180. That will help you to detach from her (a good thing regardless of the outcome here). If she wakes up and sees what she's losing, great. You will have your answer. If not, great - you have your answer. Don't drag silly challenges into it. If you want her parents to know, why? If so, then tell them together, or have her tell them, but don't make that the only condition of R. It will take much more than that.

And please, don't change your mind on telling OBS.


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1898 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
Hosea
♂ Member
Member # 42422
Default  Posted: 6:07 PM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What I want to do is to give her an ultimatum : if she truly wants me and for me to allow her to start building up my trust in her again I will want her to expose the affair and exactly what she has done to her own parents and brother. I expect to do so this weekend. This would be one of the worst things imaginable to her, and would really be a test of her love for me. Has anyone done something similar? Did it work? Any ideas around this?

My wife was completely contrite, which is a luxury you do not currently have. I told her I expected her to tell her parents because I felt they deserved to know why I'd behaved erratically over the prior few months. Though it was difficult for her, my wife called her mom and told her.

Her mother was disappointed in her, but said, "We love you, honey. Unconditionally. We're here for you, and we hope you both can get through this."

Here's the thing. You are trying to force your wife into a state of humiliated brokenness. Yet this isn't something Betrayed Spouses can control or force, and it might backfire by making your Wayward Wife feel resentment towards you as she clings to her own protective instincts and whatever delusions of grandeur she harbors from her esteem- boosting affair.

True brokenness- the sort you can build a future on- comes solely from within the heart of a convicted wayward. How? If we knew, we'd bottle it up and make a fortune selling to the booming Betrayed Spouse market.

"PENITENCE - Goodbye Obsession, Hello Contrition!"

Only God or conscience can truly convict a Wayward of their misdeeds. It rarely happens overnight, and, to my knowledge, it never happens through coercion (especially by the Betrayed Spouse).

It's right to have demands. If she wants to reconcile, consider carefully what demands you make, and in what order you make them. First priority, after telling OM's wife, is total openness (email, gps, etc.). Total disclosure (no tickle truth). Etc.

You want to expose the truth, destroy the fantasy, and give the affair no place to hide. I would let these first actions do their work-- during this time, your wayward might become more convinced of the selfishness and depravity of her actions. If she has a heart, soul, and real love for you, this can eventually lead her to see you as the undeserving victim of her evil, reckless choices. If this happens, you will no longer fight to break her, she will start fighting to protect YOU from even more pain. Confessing to her family MIGHT even be seen by her as a way she can EARN back a bit of your trust and respect. She might DESIRE to prove to you that she is WILLING to suffer her family's disapproval for YOUR sake.

It can happen. But if you try to make it happen, it very likely never will.


John 8:10-11: "Then Jesus stood up again and said to the woman, “Where are your accusers? Did they not condemn you?”

“No, Lord,” she said.

And Jesus said, “Neither do I. Go and sin no more.”


Posts: 106 | Registered: Feb 2014
nuance
♂ Member
Member # 28793
Default  Posted: 7:04 PM, February 19th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

correct the imbalance

You will never correct this. An RA won't do it, a D won't do it. The only way to make it "fair" would be for you to have an exact mirror affair while you were married to her and she never cheated on you. Obviously this will never happen.

It will always be unfair. Unfortunately it will take a long time for you to accept this.

You should tell OM's BW and keep your WW in the dark until you do it. Otherwise she may warn him.

Do you have access to all her accounts and passwords including phone, internet, banks? I would install a key logger as well.

[This message edited by nuance at 7:05 PM, February 19th (Wednesday)]


Dday May 2000. R'ed.
People suck.

Posts: 1226 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: California
RawDeal75
♂ Member
Member # 42495
Default  Posted: 6:26 AM, February 20th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Another slew of good comments, thanks Hosea, mainlyinpain, painfulpast,JellyGirl84 and everybody else. I see that I have once again failed to explain what I want to do, what that would accomplish and the background to it. Asking mynWW to tell her parents or her brother would not be an ultimatum as such, but rather an opportunity to earn some of my respect and trust back. It would also put the A "out there" in a way, make it "real", give it an existence outside my mind and my WW's. A third reason would be that the only time my WW REALLY seems to realize what she has done is when she explains the A and her actions in her own words, articulates them and cannot hide behind euphemisms etc. Telling the story to a loving/caring third party in my prescence would create a situation in which I believe she would understand her own actions and what they have resulted in, without being forced into humiliation and brokenness.

[This message edited by RawDeal75 at 10:04 AM, February 21st (Friday)]


Me: BH, 39. Her: WW, 39. Two kids: 3&5
Together 21 yrs. Married 13 yrs.

D-day #2 Jan 18, 2014: 12 month EA/PA (AP#3)+ admission of 5 month EA/PA in 1994 (AP#1).
D-day #1 May 2001: 2 month EA/PA (AP#2)


Posts: 54 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Europe
TheWrongedMan
♂ Member
Member # 42009
Default  Posted: 12:59 PM, February 20th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi,

I wanted to reply as our circumstances are similar (same age, DDay) though I have been 'luckier' than you (you can the general idea from my sig below).

However, even though my wife's was a drunken one-off and she confessed immediately, the thing we have most in common is that I have been feeling exactly the same as you have (so you are clearly very justified in doing so!).

My wife and I are generally getting on well and she seems remorseful, and in my 'lucid' state I know this is positive. However, after a while I start to think that she has gotten everything she wants and has now 'won' and now I'm carrying the can for it all. Basically I think she's gotten off lightly, though I know making her suffer (for want of a better word) will be counterproductive. I also doubt sometimes how sorry she really is. I think part of the natural state of the cheater is to detach and try and forget what they've done (which is kind of understandable I suppose, though I think it will catch up with them sooner or later). This whole process is like a vicious circle.

My wife has also suggested that I might want to even the score, and I have been in nightclubs a couple of times at around 3am or 4am and v drunk, and when I thought about it, I actually ended up sending some pretty angry texts to my wife about how the idea made me want to 'puke'.

If I'm honest, my number one motivation for cheating back would have been to 'save face' in our marriage, followed by evening things up so we can move on and the actual pleasure of doing it.

However, what would the reality of this be? Walking around clubs being blown out by women I don't really want to sleep with would make me feel far worse, and when I was out and drunk I also started thinking that if my wife were out here trying the same, she would have sealed the deal by now (not that I tried anything but you can see my drunken 'logic'). Or trawling the internet for someone to have sex with? I basically said to my wife about this, 'Sorry, but the sort of women who will f&ck a near stranger at the drop of a hat don't grow on trees', which kind of put her in her place in more ways than one.

As for sex, I suppose I don't relate as we haven't had sex since it happened (she has suggested it), though we've done the whole hysterical bonding. I feel like I don't want to give in and do the one thing I know he did too soon.

I don't really have any advice for you as I'm currently going through the same experience. However, that's what I've been turning over for a while now and I hope some of it chimes with you. Good luck!


BH: Me, 37
WW: 37
Together: 17, married 7 (what a cliche)
DD: 10/1/14 V drunk ONS, confessed immediately, repentant
Kids: None (though we were trying)

Posts: 82 | Registered: Jan 2014
RawDeal75
♂ Member
Member # 42495
Default  Posted: 11:59 PM, February 20th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WrongedMan, I am so sorry you are here. But thanks a lot for sharing your story with me and all the other BS here. It saddens and sickens me to hear and understand that there are others out there having to go through the same horrifying experiences and emotions I have had recently. At the same time it strengthens me to know that what I feel isn't completely weird, wrong, or unnatural.

For us sex worked just a day or two after D-day. It was on my wife's initiative, and I appreciated her trying even though at first I was completely grossed out by the idea of being close to her and even disgusted by her body. It was actually very good and intimate. It took another couple of days until I could kiss her. I had (and to a certain extent still have) major issues with her mouth as I knew, and couldn't get out of my head, exactly what she had had in it. Since then HB has really kicked in and we now have lots of sex. Fantastic, intimate and full of love. At least that's what it feels like. Strange!

As you can see from my posts in this thread I still have a hard time completely getting the idea of an affair of my own out of my head. Besides the childish idea of correcting the imbalance where the point would actually be lowering myself to WW's level so that she would not have to be alone living with what she has done and feeling sub-human about it, there is still a part of me that is genuinely interested in what it would be like. My wife and I met young and she is the only one I have ever had sex with. And up until the A I was her only one. So you can see there is another level to it too...

Good luck with everything! I feel your hurt. Let us know how things go. I will continue to comment on my own progress. The big thing coming up for us is my WW telling her brother and his wife this weekend. I willbe there to and I am extremely nervous about it.


Me: BH, 39. Her: WW, 39. Two kids: 3&5
Together 21 yrs. Married 13 yrs.

D-day #2 Jan 18, 2014: 12 month EA/PA (AP#3)+ admission of 5 month EA/PA in 1994 (AP#1).
D-day #1 May 2001: 2 month EA/PA (AP#2)


Posts: 54 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Europe
TheWrongedMan
♂ Member
Member # 42009
Default  Posted: 2:13 AM, February 21st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, ta for replying you seem to be doing really well! Have to run as in uk and have work but will post more on weekend. As for HB my attitude is that I want to so you might as well enjoy it while it lasts (plus it obviously does help with bonding too)! Good luck!


BH: Me, 37
WW: 37
Together: 17, married 7 (what a cliche)
DD: 10/1/14 V drunk ONS, confessed immediately, repentant
Kids: None (though we were trying)

Posts: 82 | Registered: Jan 2014
self-rescuer
♀ Member
Member # 35059
Default  Posted: 6:19 AM, February 21st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

we had our first MC session today. It felt good, but not great. not sure about the therapist. It was a woman who every now and then seemes to sympathize a bit too much with my WW. Could have been an over-interpretation on my part though.

If you feel this MC is biased toward your WW than you must find a different MC. Yes, your WW must be heard in your sessions but any MC who is experienced in matters of infidelity will not give the WW a pass.

As many on these boards will agree, a counselor who does not have a clear understanding of the extraordinary pain suffered by the BS will do much more harm than good.

Bottom line - no " sympathizing a bit too much" with you WW allowed. The shock of the affair can be likened to a gun shot wound. It needs to be addressed first. Issues WW may have had with the marriage have no relevance at this point - NONE.


BW 53 WXH 56 & still bewildered
D-Day 9-15-11
Divorce 3-13-13

Just trust yourself, then you will know how to live.
~ Goethe


Posts: 506 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: the south
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