D-day #2 Jan 18, 2014: 12 month EA/PA (AP#3)+ admission of 5 month EA/PA in 1994 (AP#1).
D-day #1 May 2001: 2 month EA/PA (AP#2)
Last night WW called her brother to give him a heads up that she had something important to tell him. It made him worried like crazy, but she wanted to tell him in person with me there so she did not even hint what it was about. That fact that she broke down and cried during the call made him understand that it is something very serious though. There is no going back now...
I'll let you know how it goes, and if it stills feels like a good idea after the talk.
[This message edited by RawDeal75 at 9:57 AM, February 21st (Friday)]
It sounds like she is doing everything to R, I dont see how telling her brother will help, and I can see it backfiring.
Her brother might never understand the reasons she did this like you do and he might not ever think of her the same way.
I think, if his WW is willing to tell her brother and is experiencing the pain of personal shame about her behavior, it's a positive sign of both her remorse and her commitment to be accountable to her BS.
Why should her brother think of her the same way? I wouldn't think of my sister the same way, I'd be disappointed in her actions. I would love her no less, but I'd sure as hell tell her to do her damnedest to make it up to her Betrayed if he was willing to try!
Part of the repentant Wayward's journey, at least to me, is being forced to confront the dismal human costs of his/her affair. For a time, it seemed a Free Trip to Fantasyland- Wine! Roses! Romance! Ego boosts! Exciting secrets! Sexual adventure!, etc.
Yet after exposure, the gigantic bill comes due. If there is to be Reconciliation, the Betrayed pays the huge emotional down payment. It costs them everything they have; their trust, self-esteem, their happy marital memories, sometimes even their sanity.
Yet the Wayward has to make the monthly payments. The interest rate is huge, and they're horrified to discover they're going to be making payments for years, possibly even the rest of their lives. Waywards don't lose everything at once, but over time, they sometimes lose more.
Experiencing a partial loss of respect from family members is painful, but that pain can help immunize them from future affairs. More importantly, being willing to experience shame before family helps demonstrate to the Betrayed Spouse that the Wayward is repentant. This makes a deposit in the Betrayed's empty "Can I ever trust my spouse again?" account.
If the Wayward's family believes in the sacredness of marriage vows, they will have a newfound respect for a Betrayed Spouse who is willing to forgive the unforgivable acts of their Wayward family member. This, too, helps, as they can reinforce Wayward accountability in the future.
I personally think it's a positive gesture. I do hope it leads to many more like it.
“No, Lord,” she said.
And Jesus said, “Neither do I. Go and sin no more.”
Also, my wife was so drunk (fell off a stool at 4am after doing shots just prior) that she apparently doesn't remember details, other than that it was fairly quick and that they had sex, so I haven't had much detail. The mouth thing I don't have a huge prob with as she doesn't think she did (and if it was a v drunken, tear your clothes off quickie then I would veer towards they prob just got on with it, if you see what I mean). However, I haven't attempted the one thing I know that they did do - have intercourse - so maybe that particular battle is ahead of me.
On the revenge sex thing - having had drunken one night stands with strangers before I met my wife, after the initial thrill, even before they were over I used to often find the novelty wearing off, but maybe that's just me. Anyway, my wife seemed to enjoy her's so maybe there's hope for both of us on that front.
As said before, the actual logistics of setting something like that up sounds pretty depressing to me and would prob just make me feel worse (and think about how my wife was able to do it). Not sure any woman would want to be on the receiving end of someone having sex like that either (could get emotional). However, I can't say that I don't share your curiosity - and if the chance fell right into my lap while drunk as it did for my wife, I'd probably just take it now so maybe I should get slightly off of my high horse.
Part of the problem, I think, is that if you're a woman looking for meaningless sex, you're not going to be short of men who'll oblige. Whereas the other way around, I think it might be a bit harder to find someone to jump straight into bed with you.
Anyway, good luck!
Take one day at a time. It is good to see your wife upset over the terrible decisions she made as well as the remorse she is showing.
You are right that the affair be brought into the light. Even if only to her brother.
That is how affairs get killed. By exposure.
Not let the OMW know and give her evidence so she can deal, with her husband and their marriage.
Both your wife and the OM need to feel consequences. Because if they do not feel pain they will just do it again.
Remember she lied for almost a year. Emotionally and physically she gave herself to the OM and lied to you. She opened the marriage up without asking you.
She risked you and your children for her own desires. You do not get anymore selfish than that........
Now do not take up her offer of your own fling.
It is your wife that wants to level the playing field. That way she can give up on feeling the guilt. She can call it even and now not have to discuss the issues that lead her to cheat and lie to you.
Do not take the easy way out nor allow her to take the easy way out.
You deserve better from her so make sure you get better from her. Hold her and yourself accountable in your marriage or it is all a sham.
I hope your weekend went ok.
You will be cleaning up her mess. MaKe sure she helps you.
Was she tested for std's???
[This message edited by happyman64 at 12:14 PM, February 23rd (Sunday)]
Lots have happened since my last post. Enough to split inte several post to simplify reading about them.
WW told her brother and his wife. I was there during the talk. It was initially horribly emotional and nerve-wrecking, but it turned out really good. WW did a good job and was open about the A and included just the right amount of information, not really withholding on anything, not flinching when giving what I felt and knew were honest answers. The brother was extremely upset, disappointed and angry with her and could not believe his ears.
I got a lot of love and support which felt really good. So did the "grounding" of the A in someone else's reality that I have talked about before. WW has not managed to show enough empathy about the pain she has caused me, and the only time she has really broken down and cried has been when thinking about the risk of not getting to spend all of her time with the children, or when she feels the shame over what she has done from someone else. Having to speak the words to a third party and listen to herself telling the story aloud worked wonders and I think she took a baby step in the right direction.
I would recommend doing something similar if you end up in a situation like mine.
It can also give you someone to talk to who knows exactly what you are going through (if both parties are willing of course, which we were in my case). You can also help each other collect proof and double checking the facts of the A.
Speaking of STDs we were tested and negative for all diseases.
I think we are now at a stage in our process when pretty much everything is out in the light of day. There may still be a couple of lies and half-truths out there, but I do feel the only reason they are not discovered yet is that my WW told them in the beginning and forgot about them, I haven't asked about anything related to them so they have not been brought up again. I am starting to realize what a toll this takes on my WW too and I remain hopeful we may find a solution that works for us. Having said that though, see number FOUR below:
The brother was extremely upset, disappointed and angry with her and could not believe his ears.
It also lets the Betrayed finally have a positive feedback loop. It helps so much to know you have allies of personal importance to the Wayward advocating your case and/or sharing your outrage / disappointment.
I'm really glad you had this little victory. I hope you've many more to come!
I totally get the need to go back the scene of the crime thing. As long as you can stand to do it. I was the same way I wanted to reclaim my H in many ways. More to with physical and emotional stuff than places and so forth, but his A happened out of town, and his need to travel to that town no longer existed, had it been in my own backyard, it may have been different.
Take your time with healing, and don't let it upset you if you end up having some days here and there where you hate your W, or what she has done, and can hardly stomach looking at her. It is all part of the healing. Take time for you.
Secondly, I managed to restore the erased text messages on my WW's iPhone. There were lots of them. LOTS!!! Over 2000 (two thousand!) between Nov-Jan. Very explicit, very hurtful, very everything. Even though she had told me before that they texted a lot, and that some texts were sexually explicit, nothing she had said prepared me for what I saw when I restored the messages. It was like re-living Dday again, and it became to much to handle.
I had to go through a similar second D-Day, although the texts were not particularly sexual. Months after confession, the OMW emailed me all of my WW's texts during the affair-- though not her husband's half of the exchange. It was pretty grueling -- mostly because it gave a specific voice to an affair I'd experienced mostly via my wife's cold behavior towards me and via my imagination.
Having a timeline of texts-- knowing what kinds of things my WW was saying on particular days was a new trauma. Seeing what kinds of lovey-dovey bullshit she was texting on the two nights I was closest to suicide was especially hard.
When she saw them, and read them anew, it only horrified her all the more. She was so ashamed and disgusted with herself, particularly since she was now seeing the OM's amoral self-centeredness through clear eyes.
I know you both aren't there yet. But I do hope, with time and commitment, you can reach that place. You are taking the right steps. Be strong as you can be, even in the midst of new traumas like this. Keep proving you're the Better Man. You can't make your Wayward Wife become a better woman, but the more she sees your strength and momentum, the more she might realize what she is at risk of losing forever. And this, often more than anything else, can prompt her to change to be worthy of you.
I'll keep posting updates and thoughts. I hope they can help someone else also.
Thanks for sharing. I have followed your posts since I found the website. Our situations seem to be pretty similiar. How were you able to get the texts back from the Iphone? My WW and OM switched to trackfones in December and I found those messages before DDay but I would like to retrieve the Iphone ones as well.