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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: N P D Thread - Part 13
ThoughtIKnewYa
♀ Member
Member # 18449
Default  Posted: 12:23 PM, March 30th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, (((tribe))).

Since it's been quite some time since I posted about this situation, allow me to give some background: My MIL and SIL are NPD. SIL is married to a Wounded Warrior, but they haven't lived together in years. He's basically just a paycheck to her. SIL keeps him from communicating with the rest of the family. I had him as a FB friend until she found out and blocked me. I guess she probably also used the old smear campaign to keep him from talking to me. In my past posts about this situation, the tribe has called SIL "pure evil". I don't disagree.

So, I started a second FB page for job searching and I was on it last night and went to SIL's page to block her (We've been NC for some time). I noticed a lot of communication and ILY's with this one guy. It took me a minute to realize that this wasn't her main page- her H and my MIL are not her friends on this page. I found a lot of pics of her wrapped in just a sheet, etc. One of the pics of SIL and OM also had her oldest son in the middle of them. He had a strange name, like a stage name, so I'm assuming he knows she's married, but has probably been fed the whole "staying together for the kids" crap. Since I've gained some skills from being here, I was able to figure out his real name pretty quickly.

SIL has been pretending to go out of state to meet one of her military wife friends for about a year, that I know of. I questioned her motives, when this began, because it's unlike her to go out of her way to see a female. Now, I know that she's been going to a completely different state to see this guy. I think my MIL probably knows, I KNOW her kids know because one of them was in one of the photos of them. There are shots that were taken at SIL's house, as well as shots taken at OM's house.

So, here I am, wanting to take back my maiden name because I DO NOT want to be associated with this crap. I don't want to bear the last name of whores. I hate it for my H, I really do, but we've had many problems that were directly related to his family and their insisting that I just look the other way when this APPALLING behavior is happening all around me.

I downloaded all of the pics and took screen shots of the conversations that made it very clear she's dating this guy. I guess I'll just sit on all of that unless there comes a time when BIL needs it in a D? I can't give it to him now because they will just turn it all around on me and it will, somehow, be my fault. She hasn't bled her H dry, yet. She wants his VA loan and half of his retirement, and the family justifies this by saying that she needs to be able to support her kids, so it's OK. I'm supposed to just get in line and support this shit.

Never. Gonna. Happen.

I just needed to vent and to tell SOMEONE what's really going on without having to deal with all of the gaslighting and manipulation. Thanks for listening.


Posts: 11403 | Registered: Mar 2008
ThoughtIKnewYa
♀ Member
Member # 18449
Default  Posted: 9:38 PM, March 30th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he admits to more stalking behavior, and I am a little perplexed about why he'd be disclosing this stuff to me now, besides looking for a reaction and probably trying to build the fear. Geez Louise what a creep I've wasted too much time on.
Yep. And yep. He's trying to scare you, I think. Don't let him- they really are pathetic and truly powerless, when exposed.

Posts: 11403 | Registered: Mar 2008
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:27 AM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The trick is to pretend he's not pathetic & exposed. You want to keep that to yourself.
Act bland, unknowing, like your old clueless self
(minus the old reactions to baiting/hoovering)
while you get your distance & plan your escape.

TIKY - those (so-called) people make me nauseous.
Rainbows! You done good!

Welcome to the (((TRIBE))) noobs -
We're the best people you never wanted to know!


Posts: 6425 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Quakingaspen
♀ Member
Member # 41153
Default  Posted: 1:37 PM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Isn't there some flower or fish or something that throws its guts out to attract prey?

TIKY and jj, thank you, I'm actually getting pretty good at this NC stuff. It is easier to be bland and naive when I don't have to do it so much. TIKY, sounds like a hot mess!

Yesterday I was informed via email that he's decided we should separate for the next two years and then see where we're at (?!). I'm seriously considering not reading email anymore. And yet, irrationally, I feel the sadness creeping in, that this is really happening, that this is really over. All the dreams I had tied to him, to us working out.

... but then again, I can also let go of the constant doubt that my dreams would ever happen, the fear that the end would not justify the means.

Those dreams aren't going to happen, but the new ones have a better chance, because I can make those happen myself. Right?


The key is to get to know people and trust them to be who they are. Instead, we trust people to be who we want them to be - and when they're not, we cry.~David Duchovny

WS-SA/NPD
D-Day: Too many in 17 years of marriage. LAST time 10/17/2013.


Posts: 120 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: A little bit closer to Reality
Kajem
♀ Member
Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

QA,

Yes they have a better chance to happen because they're not being sabotaged by someone who can't stand to see you becoming successful!


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 4856 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
cantaccept
♀ Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 5:44 PM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi everyone, I hope it is okay to ask this here. Has anyone ever read Melanie Tonia Evans?

Just wondering about the program that she offers and if anyone tried it and what you thought. Did it help???

I am finding a bit of strength and clarity in her articles. I would so like to get a handle on the pain. I am trying so hard but it just is such a constant ache.

The head knows the truth but the heart is still in pieces.

Any opinions would be appreciated. I cannot afford to spend money on anything that is not worth it. This would be a big splurge for me right now.


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1253 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
ThoughtIKnewYa
♀ Member
Member # 18449
Default  Posted: 10:14 PM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've read some of her stuff, but not purchased the program. A lot of times when people ask this type of question, my advice is to just sit with it for a month or so. If you still think you would benefit from it, then do it.

Edited to fix a typo caused by a wireless keyboard's low battery (just skips a letter now and then)

[This message edited by ThoughtIKnewYa at 10:15 PM, March 31st (Monday)]


Posts: 11403 | Registered: Mar 2008
soverybetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 32948
Default  Posted: 10:23 PM, March 31st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Tribe,

It has been awhile since I posted but I really need to get this off my chest. I haven't had to deal with xnpdwh since the divorce in 2012 and have been very happy with NC. But he is showing his npdassholeness today!

Back story: In August 2013 My grand child was removed from her mom and stepdad by CPS due to verbal, emotional, mental and physical abuse. She was placed with me because the grand child told of all the things that have been done to her and the scary situations they put her in. Mom and stepdad tested positive for drugs also.

Grand child begged me to contact gpa to ask him if he would testify at a custody hearing regarding the 12 years of abuse he saw while we were married. He said he would and also said he wanted to see her when he got back into town. We never heard from him again until Saturday. He emails me to tell grandchild Happy Birthday, that he loves her and thinks about her everyday. (I call bull crap cause he has never tried to see in since I left him in 2011 and never has bought her a present in her entire life). So, I pass on to her what he says in his email and she just rolls her eyes because she knows that he never contacted me in 8 months to see her and has never asked what happened with the custody case.

I get another email today asking if he can take her out, can he see her, does she want to see him blah blah blah. Still not asking what happened and where she is living. I reply with where she is living now. (far away from him) I get another email asking for a phone number, email addy or address so he can contact her. I pass the info on to grandchild and she tells me to email him with "why the sudden interest" so I do that. Holy Hell Batman!! I got back an email filled with venom about how I am making it difficult to see her and that I am playing games.

Guys, I have been a woman of few words in these emails but I am NOT going to give information about my sweet grandchild to anyone without her wanting them to have it. By the way, she is a teenager so she can make these decisions for herself. I have bit my tongue while having to deal with him because it all pertains strictly to her. I do not want to create any drama and cause her to not see him if she wants to so I am cordial but brief.

This last email pissed me off so much that I had to sit and let my temper cool before I responded and explained to the dickwad that the question was from her, I am being cordial and I am telling her exactly what his emails say. But...I also told him that I would be happy to never hear from him again and the he is a NON-F*ck*ng FACTOR in my LIFE!!!

I know that I should have let it go but who the F**k does he think he is to screw with this child and act like his not seeing her is somehow my damn fault? I am her gma and I will protect her from anyone who treats her like crap. I am the one who took care of her, helped raise her, bought all of her birthday and Christmas present (and put his name on them), held the birthday parties, went to movies with her and 10k other things a good grandparent does when they truly love the grandchild. I don't "pretend" to love them when I need to look good to others. I am the one she turned to when she couldn't take the abuse at home anymore, I am the one who went to court against my own daughter to protect my grandchild, I am the one who held her when she cried because her mom didn't even fight for her, I am the one she used to block her mom and stepdad from seeing her in court because she is so afraid of them, I am the one who helped her when she had to go into the judges chambers and talk to him about where she wanted to live. Her f'in gpa didn't do shit for her but now suddenly expects me to give him all the information to contact her without her approval. Hell the F&ck NO!

Somebody PLEASE make this somebitch go away and forget he was ever a part of my life!!!! I don't hate him anymore (I know is seems like I do right now), I had finally gotten to a place of piece and non hate but I will never forgive the swarmy bastard because not only did he cheat on me but he did it in front of my grandchild and she knew it. She watched him abandon me when I was sick to spend time with the gutter slut in our garage. He also abandonded her because he spent all his time with the gutter slut when the grandchild would visit on weekends.

I am just SO F*cking done with slime balls screwing with my grandchild and blaming me for their f'ups.


Me-53
DDay 10/16/2010 DDay2 5/22/2011
Divorced 8/23/2012
I will get stronger and better but no matter where he goes, there he is....

Posts: 1202 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Texas
ThoughtIKnewYa
♀ Member
Member # 18449
Default  Posted: 12:34 PM, April 1st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((svb)))I saw this on this thread somewhere, but can't remember who wrote it: YOU know the truth. I thought it was brilliant. Regardless of what he says or does, remember: YOU know the truth.


Posts: 11403 | Registered: Mar 2008
Rainbows
♀ Member
Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 1:45 PM, April 1st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Many hugs and thanks to everyone for the support and warm welcome. Sending light and happy thoughts to the tribe.

I had an eye opening weekend. My mom came into town this weekend for the first visit in a long time. I haven't always had the best relationship with my family and usually blamed myself for the conflict. I guess I've always been too close to the situation to really see it clearly.

Since my separation, I cocooned myself from all of the negative and destructive people in my life. Other than my Ex and the D, I haven't had much personal drama lately.

Over the weekend, I finally saw how my mother creates drama and blames me when she isn't the center of attention or getting her way. If she doesn't want to do something, she just throws a fit and even admitted she creates no win situations.

This may seem obvious, but I finally realized that my ex is a lot like my mother and the dynamics were parallel. I never wanted to think of her that way before because I've always idolized her and put her on a pedestal. With both relationships, I've never felt good enough no matter how hard I tried.

Is it common for the child of a npd to turn around and marry one? And how do I break that cycle? Ugh, sometimes I really hate these moments of revelation.


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 390 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
Kajem
♀ Member
Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, April 1st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rainbows.

I joke saying that I married my mother and I dated my father. Maybe the next guy will be a good match.

We gravitate toward what is familiar. Well at least I'm told that, and I believe it. When XH left I was on my way to being healthier when I met XSO. He was NOTHING like XH in some ways and a lot like him in other ways. There weren't sparks or chemistry it was comfortable. I felt taken care of, supported and not afraid in any way. He had a temper -(like XH) never directed at people but he would throw a tantrum for being frustrated with himself (not like XH). He was kind to everyone he met-unlike XH. Get my drift?

I feel like he was NPD but very much less degree than XH. XSO is a little boy in many ways. Just like my dad, there was always someone (girl/woman) taking care of him. His reason for ending the relationship was that he wanted to be taken cared of, I have 4 kids (3 were in college at that time) and he couldn't see himself ever being first in my life! This after being together for 8 years. He was also being propositioned by a girl half his age. My dad left my mom for ow at around the same age over 30 years ago.

So I married my mom and dated my dad. Next one (if there is one) will be just for me!

Can, I have MTE's NARP program. If you can't afford it, join her website, and follow her on blog radio. NARP is a condensed version and specified of her radio program. She often runs specials like free trials for feedback, so keep up with her. It is hard work freeing the emotions and shifting. She's very easy to listen to and very knowledgeable. If you like new age medicine it's good. If not it may be a lot of hokey nonsense.

TIKY - that's my quote, actually my therapists! She gave me a card with the words Kajem knows the TRUTH! The reason was XH was rewriting (twisting) everything around to him being the victim! In therapists words " if he said the sky was orange, Kajem would forget she knows the truth and look to see the orange sky". She was right, I would check before saying anything to him. Now I just say " yeah right!" Because it's important to him to be right! The truth is important to me not his rewrite.

It took awhile, but I don't believe him anymore.

Hugs,

[This message edited by Kajem at 9:25 PM, April 1st (Tuesday)]


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 4856 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
cindergirl
♀ New Member
Member # 42966
Default  Posted: 10:07 PM, April 1st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rainbows, pretty sure it's pretty common for a child of NPD to turn around and marry one.

NPD seems to have permeated our society at every turn. I can't seem to escape these emotional vampires. I married one for sure (divorced him 5 years ago), and I'm pretty sure my mom is one.

As for how to break the cycle, I imagine the best way is to familiarize yourself with their patterns and be on the lookout for them. They're everywhere. I became as much of an expert on NPD as a layperson can. I devoured books and articles. More than anything, I was working to unravel the web of untruths that had slowly become my reality. I lost myself in an NPD spouse and it's been hard work regaining myself. Since familiarizing myself with the ways of NPD, I can spot them out in the real world--clients, social acquaintances, etc. and have learned how to guard myself from them and shut them down.

Maybe you all can relate. I finally figured out how to summarize my marriage to an NPD: It was like living in a maze where the walls were constantly moving, and, though I didn't know it, there wasn't an exit anyway. (Until I divorced the whacko. Except I still have to deal with him. Kids.)


The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek. -Joseph Campbell

Posts: 37 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: United States
Rainbows
♀ Member
Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 3:11 AM, April 2nd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Kajem and Cindergirl, thank you for the information. It was a jarring revelation that I married my mom. It makes me sad to pop the illusion I had of her, yet my relationship with the ex is starting to make a lot more sense. Right down to the way I feel with both of them.

I totally agree with the description of it being a maze where the walls were constantly moving and there is no way out.

I will start to educate myself. I need to break this pattern.


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 390 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 12:01 PM, April 2nd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This may seem obvious, but I finally realized that my ex is a lot like my mother and the dynamics were parallel. I never wanted to think of her that way before because I've always idolized her and put her on a pedestal. With both relationships, I've never felt good enough no matter how hard I tried.

Rainbows: It's very much like Kajem said:

We gravitate toward what is familiar.

When we grow up in a family where a parent has a lot of personality order traits (if not full blown, but enough to make it dysfunctional to a large degree) that is what we get used to and feel is "normal". We grow up thinking that is the way it is for everyone.

My mother is probably BPD (Borderline Personality with a lot of NPD traits thrown in for good measure) I was "trained" to know how to put up with her antics and to try to survive. I really didn't know how family dynamics actually worked.

My xWH#1 was a "controlled" alcoholic. He was a "happy" bar drinker who would come home blasted at 1 or 2 am, say, "I love you" and fall asleep. I was so busy raising the kids and working that I didn't have time for friends and ironically any free time was taken up with taking care of BPD mom. After xWH#1 left, and I started hanging with more "normal" people (is anyone really normal? lol) I realized that the way I was living was NOT normal.

It's the same old frog in the pot of boiling water story: Put a frog in a pot of boiling water and it'll jump out. Put a frog in a pot of cold water and slowly heat it to boiling and the frog stays in and dies.

You slowly get used to increasing emotional abuse and soul sucking behavior that you feel it's normal.

I had it from both BPD mother and NPD WH that of course I felt this was "normal" and I was the one who was wrong. I was the one who wasn't giving enough and therefore I was BAD. I was the worst, most selfish person in existence. It didn't matter how much I gave, it was never enough. Of course these soul suckers give enough crumbs or some rewards that you keep going.

Sometimes I think it's more like Operant Conditioning (BF Skinner). The reward is not given every single time, but enough to keep the subject doing the desired action.

Added to this, these NPD's often isolate you demanding more and more of your attention, that you end up living on their crumbs. My WH did it in such insidious ways saying that I could do whatever I wanted but if I did x, he would know we weren't close, or saying such things as don't wear that outfit because I love you and don't want anyone else looking at you. Once that was in effect, it was expected and anger or silent treatment would ensue if I didn't do the things he wanted.

I feel like such a shell of a person now. I don't know who I am anymore. He built me up, and then eroded me and built me up until I depended more and more on his validation. He made me question my own validation (as did my mother on her end)

He used such "logic" and twisted and turned everything that I questioned myself and my feelings that I don't even trust them anymore.

I guess the biggest thing that finally got me to "see" was that he married OW overseas, had 3 OC's with her, told our 2 sons, lied, gaslighted, TT'd, and then lately has been blaming me for turning the kids against him and they are messed up because of MY reaction to this: depression, sadness, grief, etc.

And I started to believe him.

But I guess what they called cognitive dissonance kicked in and now all I feel is confused, alone, and like I was put in the real world without a compass. Like I was lost in some sort of alternative reality and don't know what to do IRL.

I don't know if I'm making any sense.


Posts: 1938 | Registered: Jan 2010
Kajem
♀ Member
Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 1:29 PM, April 2nd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You're making plenty of sense! You were conditioned to believe the NPD reality. You loved him and trusted him enough to believe him when he said the sky was orange. You took his word over your own voice for so long your inner voice is just a whisper. Without them to validate their reality, it doesn't exist. Because it really doesn't exist and you feel that you're in a different reality.

You know the truth!!! You know what's real and what's fake!

It's like deprogramming someone who was brainwashed! And our brains were washed with some toxic crap. It will take time and NC for the cracks to show themselves. Please give yourself that time and nc.

Hugs
K


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 4856 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
cindergirl
♀ New Member
Member # 42966
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, April 2nd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rainbows, presumably you do not want to completely cut your mother out of your life. May I suggest a book for you? Disarming the Narcissist by Wendy T. Behary is an *excellent* book for understanding NPD and learning to cope with the narcissists in our lives. Honestly, it's an excellent book for anyone to read, regardless of if one has personal relationships tainted by NPD. I learned a ton about myself and my own coping mechanisms and would recommend it to virtually everyone.


The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek. -Joseph Campbell

Posts: 37 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: United States
Rainbows
♀ Member
Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 4:35 PM, April 2nd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honesttoafault - my dynamic was very similar to what you describe right down to the isolation. I saw it more clearly with the ex because of his blatant smear campaigns.

My mom has always been more subtle. The way she isolated me (and all of my siblings) was to point out flaws in our friends and tell us that they weren't good, honest or whatever. She always made us feel as though our friends were really our enemies.

Cindergirl you totally read my mind. I've been sitting here wondering if there's a good book I could read to start wrapping my head around this stuff. I don't want to cut my mom out, but need to learn healthier ways to interact with her. It was so devastating chasing her for approval and love again. I felt like I regressed this weekend even though I could see the insanity of it.


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 390 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
Rainbows
♀ Member
Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 9:19 AM, April 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here's a weird question that occurred to me. If my mom and ex are both NPD, and probably at least one of my siblings (my oldest brother is similar), how do I know I'm not npd, too?

My brain loves to analyze, but isn't there a chance all the conflict with those two people could be coming from me? Or that I might have those traits, too?


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 390 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
cindergirl
♀ New Member
Member # 42966
Default  Posted: 11:52 AM, April 3rd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rainbows, the general rule of thumb is: If you think you might be a Narcissist, then you are probably not. People with NPD virtually by definition feel that there is nothing wrong with them and any problems they have are the fault of the world or the fault of other people. So breathe a sigh of relief. That you are self-critical enough to examine yourself and worry that there might be something wrong with you, too, means you are highly unlikely to suffer from NPD. :-)

Regarding the book, it's the only one I know of that is written from the perspective of learning how to work with the narcissists in our lives. Most literature out there is more about learning to recognize and avoid persons with NPD, not work with them. I wanna say I picked it up for about $10 on Amazon.

ETA: Also, despite that we all know females afflicted with NPD, it strikes men at a significantly greater percentage.

[This message edited by cindergirl at 11:54 AM, April 3rd (Thursday)]


The cave you fear to enter holds the treasure you seek. -Joseph Campbell

Posts: 37 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: United States
Rainbows
♀ Member
Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 12:54 AM, April 4th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you again, cindergirl. You've been really helpful.

I always try to check in with myself first to see if I'm causing the problem. That's why this weekend was so poignant.

I downloaded the book and am really looking forward to reading it. It sounds perfect because I need tools for dealing with them (especially since I'm still not done with the D).

Thanks again for all of your insight.


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 390 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
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