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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: N P D Thread - Part 13
honesttoafault
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Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 10:25 PM, April 10th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

double post

[This message edited by honesttoafault at 10:32 PM, April 10th (Thursday)]


Posts: 1939 | Registered: Jan 2010
honesttoafault
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Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 10:31 PM, April 10th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wounded: I love that picture!! It really gave me a much needed chuckle!!

I can really relate to the discussion about "at least he didn't hit me" Geez, we put up with so much and we say that!

Me and WH always used the "he never hit me" as well. But the thing is, that was part of the rationale for why it was okay for him to withdraw when things got emotionally intense between us, because he "didn't know what he might do". And I let that be okay. In return for not being hit, I was willing to be completely disregarded.

QuakingAspen: WOW! I've felt the same way. I was always so "understanding" when he would say he needed to walk away and calm down. But then I'd get the silent treatment for days and sometimes weeks (this last time was over two months).

But, I'm realizing he's a bully and a coward. I told him in the beginning of our relationship that I would never tolerate a man hitting me, that I would call the cops. After DDay, when he was complaining that my two older sons in their 30's (from a previous marriage) were not talking to him, I told him he was lucky that they were not beating the shit out of him. I later found out that WH hit the OW on several occasions, including when she was pregnant. He is afraid of hitting me because of my sons and he knows full well if he ever laid a hand on me, I'd call the cops and press charges to the full extent of the law.

But, if I have enough self esteem for that, why didn't I have (or currently have) enough self esteem to say stop to the emotional abuse?

Perhaps it's because we get so used to it, it becomes a way of life? Or what so many of us have posted:

"At least he didn't hit me"

But they did. They killed our spirits and our souls a slow sure death. Killed my self esteem to the point that I would have to ask people their opinion if I was right about feeling hurt about something he said or did. I didn't trust myself anymore. Or if I felt upset, I couldn't even explain why, or felt defensive about it or even gave him excuses to act the way he was acting.

So insidious. Giving me all kinds of logical excuses for doing what he was doing and I bought it all.

Now, I'm realizing that what he is doing now is so very, very abusive.

And why, when I realize the things he has done, and I made excuses for in the past (and was upset about) NOW they are coming in like an avalanche of feelings and I get so overwhelmed and so very, very hurt.

People say to me why should I care? Why should I let it hurt me, but it does.

I think that over the years I was in a constant semi depression because my gut knew what my heart and mind would not recognize. The words "I love you" did not match up to the actions. There was affection, yes, but so much other stuff that screamed that it was not the truth.

Perhaps now, it's all coming together.


Thank you so very much everyone for listening and sharing your stories. I can't begin to tell you how much it helps!


Posts: 1939 | Registered: Jan 2010
Sadmumma
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Member # 42192
Default  Posted: 10:58 PM, April 10th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

*raises hand* I'm new to this part of the forum, but have found it intersting reading everyones posts.

WH certainly shows traits of NPD. Heavens, he even showed me a Psych evaulation (that he failed) not long after we started dating that even stated that he had significant flaws, including anger management and NPD. Of course, it was the 'interviewers fault' and he'd 'had a bad day'. Shit, that sounds so pathetic reading that .. to be given a heads up at the start of the relationship and not run, screaming for the hills.

Over the course of our years I tolerated constant put downs... and I'm kind of ashamed to admit that I allowed it. One before Christmas (being 8 months pregnant at the time).. we walked past a cafe where they had delightful cakes.. and I said Id love to make a lemon meringue pie, like the one in the window. We were in a crowded mall at the time, and he replied "you dont need it fat arse". Loudly. I was so hurt by that. Later, when I told him that was mean his reponse was "well you have put on weight". Um... I was pregnant!! (and I had actually lost weight over the pregnancy, cos you know I felt like shit about myself being sure WH was up to no good). And so it was over the course of our 16 years together. His insults were given under the guise of truth.... only to be backed up with "well you want honesty". The only thing is, I don't think he complimented me personally hardly ever. He complimented my cooking, to me. But told everyone else I couldn't cook or keep house... and that he taught me to cook...He complimented me as a wife to some friends... yet tore me down to others. He never complimented my appearance... yet if in social situation other men paid attention to me would get very upset .... for the most part I felt I walked on eggshells...

the kids are all scared of him. he can be mean. he name calls. I feel bad for my kids that when he did his I didnt demand better for them. I asked it, I wanted it...but I didnt demand it. I told him he needed to stop.... but he didnt care. his response, after calling miss 7 an areshole "well she is". She isnt. I need her to believe that. I'm not sure why I tolerated it for so long...

in any case, this is something I plan to explore in IC.

I can certainly relate to "he never hit me"..he used to say it too.. his ex before me said it to me as well. I now see that as a huge red flag


On any given day you have the power to say "my story is not going to end like this"
Me 41 BS
Him 41 WH
6 kids...7 weeks, 5,7,9,11&13
D day jan 29th 2014

Posts: 535 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Land down under
Rainbows
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Member # 39362
Default  Posted: 11:16 PM, April 10th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This may seem like an incredibly basic question, but are NPDs born that way or is it learned behavior?

I'm asking because the ex was adopted. His adoptive mother is NPD, and adoptive family had a lot of dysfunction.

His bio family is pretty dysfunctional, too. I believe he inherited bipolar and alcoholism since both seem to run in that family, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if there are a few NPDs there, too.


There is always a rainbow after every storm.

Posts: 401 | Registered: May 2013 | From: California
honesttoafault
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Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 11:33 PM, April 10th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rainbows: I don't know if NPD is inherited, I believe from what I've read it's mainly from FOO issues. Research indicates that the tendency towards depression, anxiety, bipolar, and possibly alcoholism can be inherited, though.

Posts: 1939 | Registered: Jan 2010
TheAgonyOfIt
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Member # 39114
Default  Posted: 1:11 AM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've read that some believe there is a neurological basis for NPD, so maybe its like so many things... Nature and nuture. There is also evidence apparently that grey matter in NPDs brain is different, explaining in part the cognitive as well as emotional shortcomings. From my personal experience, I totally believe the brain damage theory! And I'm not being entirely flippant! There are serious flaws in this man's logic and reasoning!


Me BS 49, ExWS: narcissist! Jekyll Hyde. Left in secret early July, moved states. Now homeless but getting it together. Necessary but difficult(!) transition! Sad sad sad but hopeful.

Posts: 554 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: theagonyofit
Kajem
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Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 5:52 AM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

think that over the years I was in a constant semi depression because my gut knew what my heart and mind would not recognize. The words "I love you" did not match up to the actions. There was affection, yes, but so much other
stuff that screamed that it was not the truth.

Interesting, I spent several years being depressed after DD4 was born. XH had the insurance info for mental health and was asked several times to get me the info-I knew I needed help! He never got the info for me. I happened to run into one of the secretaries from his office in medical docs office-she gave me the mental health number to call.

Yesterday Dd3 told me that he said he was worried about me because I was depressed and suicidal at that point in my life. He was worried I would commit suicide. Dd asked me about it last night. I was depressed, not suicidal.

So I asked her what she remembers: I was always tired or energetic, there was no balance. I had lots of migraines and needed to stay in a dark quiet room. When he went away to his annual decertification (2-3weeks) we had a great time.

Makes me wonder if he was withholding mental health help so I would become suicidal! No one but him thought me suicidal! Crazy maybe but not suicidal.

Makes me said my kids saw it so young and I didn't.

Hugs to the new members - Welcome.


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 5069 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
jjct
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Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:10 AM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I totally believe the brain damage theory!

O hell yes.
They're "color blind".


Posts: 6580 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Lola2kids
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Member # 32789
Default  Posted: 12:19 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

His insults were given under the guise of truth.... only to be backed up with "well you want honesty".

^^^^This exactly.
He would criticize me in the most awful terms and then say: "well I'm only being honest, why are you getting upset?"

Oh the last 10 pages of this thread have me nodding my head so much my neck is sore.


BS: (Me) 47
Kids: twins DD(10)
D-Day April 18, 2011
Him:out Sept. 11, 2011
He moved to Europe June 27, 2014.
"They say that absence makes the heart grow fonder but I am growing more and more fond of his absence"

Posts: 1386 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Ontario, Canada
Lola2kids
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Member # 32789
Default  Posted: 12:20 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Double post, crap.

[This message edited by Lola2kids at 12:20 PM, April 11th (Friday)]


BS: (Me) 47
Kids: twins DD(10)
D-Day April 18, 2011
Him:out Sept. 11, 2011
He moved to Europe June 27, 2014.
"They say that absence makes the heart grow fonder but I am growing more and more fond of his absence"

Posts: 1386 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Ontario, Canada
ChoosingHope
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Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 4:35 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello Tribe,
I have some news that I was somehow nervous to post. I've had so much bad news since the S, and even when things look good at last, STBX manages to attack and push me back a few steps.

Anyhow, after many years of not working and being a SAHM, I found a job. A good job, near my children's schools, with a good title, and it should even be interesting.

I think it proved to me that the rest of the world is still working as normal. That if you work hard, you'll usually be rewarded and understood and appreciated.

Also, the 9-month, $25k custody eval is complete. The evaluator agreed that STBX should have no overnights with the kids until he admits he has problems (NPD and SA and prob. alcohol abuse), and that he blames me instead of facing his problems, and that his high-risk SA activities are, well, high-risk.

It said a lot more than that about him. None of it good, really.

It recommended sole legal custody to me. We will see how the judge views it all.

-Hope


Posts: 1695 | Registered: Oct 2011
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 7:11 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Still thinking about this. The report said he has sociopathic tendencies. No empathy. Lies. Admits that he will say anything to get what he wants. Easily frustrated, which leads to violent outbursts. Dishonest. Led a double life and doesn't - even now - seem to understand that this is wrong. Doesn't seem to understand the impact of his action on his kids.

I could go on and on.

I should add that it also said that I sometimes lack confidence in my decisions, that I am overly deferential, and basically that I squash down my anger bc it doesn't fit with my self-identity (as a nice person). So then I may react with anger. Also that I am probably slower to forgive and forget than most once I determine that my anger is justified.

But then he said that my anger towards STBX is JUSTIFIED, given the circumstances. Wow.

Also that I am an honest person with a good conscience. I have good energy. Good mother - no criticisms there. Warm and nurturing. Able to form strong healthy and long-lasting bonds with people. Not controlling. Bright. I know the difference between right and wrong, and I get along with others, compromise, etc.

I don't know what will happen in court. But I feel so vindicated. Mostly, the evaluator really didn't blame me for staying with STBX, or not seeing his problems earlier. I blame myself though, and my attorneys sometimes imply that there is something wrong with me to stay so long (abused wife syndrome, I deny the obvious, etc.) so it was sort of weird to see that the evaluator didn't blame me.

Anyhow, I'm also a little embarrassed to type all of the decent things about myself.

That's what living with a NPD will do to you.


Posts: 1695 | Registered: Oct 2011
Kajem
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Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 7:14 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((((Hope))))))

How wonderful for the job and the custody evaluator giving the recommendation for sole custody!!! I am doing the happy dance for you tonight. Awesome news.

ps. I LOVE your new name!!! Says a lot about where you are on this crazy journey.

Hugs,
K


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 5069 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
ThoughtIKnewYa
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Member # 18449
Default  Posted: 7:16 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((CH)))

Posts: 11667 | Registered: Mar 2008
GreatRoleModel
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Member # 36809
Default  Posted: 7:58 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Awesome news!!! (((CH)))


BS (me)
XWS (him) NPD
DIVORCED!!!
It takes a village to deal with the village idiot!

Posts: 331 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: NC
Quakingaspen
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Member # 41153
Default  Posted: 8:22 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((CH))) That is awesome and amazing! Thank you for sharing.

And why, when I realize the things he has done, and I made excuses for in the past (and was upset about) NOW they are coming in like an avalanche of feelings and I get so overwhelmed and so very, very hurt.

Honest, I am right there too. Overwhelmed and hurt. It all kind of dumps like a truckload on me sometimes. I've started to try and think like Scarlett O'Hara,"I'll think about that tomorrow."

As for nature or nurture, I am pretty sure it is an interaction of both. Prestone's dad: pretty sure NPD; Prestone's mom: PD/major codependent/passive aggressive. Their relationship fell apart early on, they stayed together for 15 more years (that's right, let's teach dysfunction!), Prestone was emotionally isolated and adrift through his formative years. MIL ignored/covered for sociopathic behavior from an early age, admitted to being relieved to hand off responsibility for Prestone to me at our marriage.

I think there are some people who just can't be helped.


I've seen enough.

WS-SA/NPD
D-Day: Too many in 17 years of marriage. LAST time 10/17/2013.


Posts: 122 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: A little bit closer to Reality
cantaccept
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Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 8:26 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Awesome Ch, I am so happy for you. One more step forward.

Sandra Brown, anybody else read her writing??? Not the mystery author, she writes on the partners of psychopaths. I am finding it so helpful.

Today I have felt better than in a long time. Such a simple thing, breathing, breath deeply, conciously, make your belly move. It really helps with the intense anxiety.

Also, she spoke of therapeutic avoidance, avoid the things that you know cause triggers. It is the total opposite of everything else I have read or heard. Today I gave myself permission to avoid. I took a different route home, a bit longer, but I came home calm. Usually I trigger on the drive home, driving by so many reminders of the pain and deception, telling myself, they are just places, but still I come home so aggitated, anxious, irritable, it takes me an hour to calm.

Today, I avoided and I felt better. I don't know if it is a long term solution but just for today, I am better. I am calmer.


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

Divorced 8/5/14


Posts: 1338 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 8:58 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you everyone. I still have to wait for trial, and to see if the judge agrees with the custody evaluator. But it's pretty damning.

So, I think it's nature and nurture too. My MIL was a real Narc. Awful.


Posts: 1695 | Registered: Oct 2011
Compartmented
Member
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Funny  Posted: 10:15 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Choosing:
The evaluator agreed that STBX should have no overnights with the kids until he admits he has problems (NPD and SA and prob. alcohol abuse), and that he blames me instead of facing his problems, and that his high-risk SA activities are, well, high-risk.
This is one of the best things I have heard all year. I mean it. I'm soooooooooo happy for you! Truth prevailed. This hopefully will make a huge difference for your children. AND, congrat's on the job!

You deserve all the goodness and happiness coming your way!!!! Yippee!!!!


Posts: 1257 | Registered: Aug 2010
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Default  Posted: 10:20 PM, April 11th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cant:
Sandra Brown, anybody else read her writing??? Not the mystery author, she writes on the partners of psychopaths. I am finding it so helpful.
I have read some of her book, "Women Who Love Psychopaths". Sorta' scary! It's chilling to read it in black and white.

Posts: 1257 | Registered: Aug 2010
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