So Sat night we go out for a fun night of dinner and drinking and I proceed to get shit faced. I don't normally drink martinis and at first we didnt think there was any alcohol in them, well then it all hits me. After 4.5 drinks. I am wasted. Thankfully he is not. On the way home I start crying. Most of this I dont even remember but he refreshed my memory the next day. I am crying in the car and he asks why and I tell him taht I miss the AP. He gets pissed off and yells at me that it's so over and we are done, figure out what to tell the kids etc. We get home and he asks if I want to be taken to AP's house and I say YES. Thankfully he doesnt know where that is because we didnt get far he said before he turned around. Thank God I didnt direct him to AP's old house with his wife since AP would not be there but the wife would.
Anyway we get home, I proceed to puke in the toilet before going to bed. I dont remember this stuff as I thought I passed out but must have only blacked out, passing out would have better since my mouth would have been shut then. He says he is sleeping in our sons room and I yell to him that he never loved me blah blah blah. Then I tell him that AP and I had sex all the time and it was amazing. I go on and on about the sex. At some point he stays in bed with me so that I dont hurt myself as he was getting worried about how drunk I was. I then get naked on top of him and tell him to fuck me like the AP does. Nice huh? Then I say that I can't believe I left someone that loved me for you. blah blah blah
I couldn't believe all this when he told me. Just over and over about how great the sex was, how great we just fit together etc.
I apologized but the damage is done and my husband says drunken words have a lot of truth to them which is true to a degree.
I went to IC today and told him about all this. He doesnt think it was so horrible as he said it's better to get out all your true thoughts and heal together without any secrets or desires but says that he still stands by the fact that for some reason I am really angry with my husband. I just dont know if there is any truth to that.
Husband still wants to make things work but says it's getting harder and harder since I show no remorse and keep kicking him as he's down. I agree with him. Plus we are opposite sides of thinking. His brain is telling him to end the marriage but his heart is saying he loves me. My brain is saying make it work but my heart is saying I need to leave.
So I think it's best for me to go and find somewhere else to live. I hate the idea of telling the kids but I think it's what needs to be done. I need to get some clear space around me to figure out what I want. Therapist says to be honest about what I am doing. If I'm going to contact AP to tell my husband. I really dont want to contact AP but it is a constant battle. I dont really know why. yes I loved him and we had an amazing time together but it's over now and I need to focus on my marriage. But I can't let go long enough to heal.
If I spend some time alone maybe it will help me see things better. Maybe my marriage cant be saved. I cant show him true remorse. It's not there and I'm wondering if it ever will be. I havent seen AP for 2 months. If roles were reversed I dont think I could take my husband back. He is being so strong and wants to make it work because he says he loves me and our family. I do too but why isn't that enough?
I am left wondering "why is she so angry at her BH? Why do you not think he loved you?"
Figure that out.
Thing is I know he loves me and I dont need his reassurance, he needs mine.
That aside I'm impressed with how honest you are being with yourself and consequently with us.
I agree with your IC about complete honesty with your BH. I know it's what you are struggling to do but I think maintaining NC with the AP is in your best interest no matter the outcome of your M.
I understand your desire for space to get your head straight but I would be concerned about the effect of separation on your M and your kids.
How are you doing with maintaining mental NC? The more you do that the less you will have feelings of missing the AP.
Somewhere deep inside you feel if you keep dropping live grenades in your marriage, and lobbing them at your husband, then
1) He'll kick you out. And your foggy self that still wants an affair and deep lurrrvvv with your AP gets her selfish way.
2) Your "affair seeking self" kicks your "decent wife and mother self" out by convincing yourself you're so awful you don't deserve to be home and happy, or you need "time to figure things out", thus allowing all sorts of AP acting out, with him or a new flavor of the month.
Either way, you are simply creating the exit your foggy, affair addled and lurrrvvv seeking selfish self seeks.
Right now, it's all about you. "It" doesn't keep getting worse. YOU are choosing to MAKE things worse. This has nothing to do with martinis. And everything with you not wanting to grow up and start being authentic to yourself, and those you say you love.
Divorce and go live your dreamy soulmate filled happily ever after. Or look in the mirror and tell yourself it's time to get real and make real changes in your life. You, your husband, and your children deserve better.
You confessed for this? This is your work toward change and becoming authentic? This is the best you've got?
You're selling yourself short. YOU deserve better than this particular version of YOU.
But, hey, this is just my read. And just IMHO. You do get credit for sharing ugly truths. It's not easy to do. BTDT.
You're obviously an intelligent person from your posts. You plan on putting that to good use sometime soon? I hope you do.
[This message edited by JustDesserts at 9:43 PM, February 24th (Monday)]
he still stands by the fact that for some reason I am really angry with my husband.
Uh, yeah, I didn't need a PhD in psychology to figure that out. But you're not angry with your husband because of anything he did, or failed to do. You've got a deep well of anger about...something. And you're directing it at your husband because, mostly, he's a safe outlet for it.
yes I loved [AP] and we had an amazing time together
I'm sorry you haven't yet come to the realization that your "love" and "amazing time" had little to do with AP the man, and was mostly just a way of you self-medicating whatever deep-down-damage is causing you to be so angry at your husband. Hasn't your therapist told you that? It wasn't him. It was you. And until you figure that out, it's going to continue to be you...in every relationship you ever have.
I most likely said "you never loved me" because it's a game I've always played when dating. Shove them away so they come back.
If I spend some time alone maybe it will help me see things better.
After this, do you still think you're basically a good person?
Because I gotta tell you, in my universe, good people don't do what you just did.
He is being so strong and wants to make it work because he says he loves me and our family. I do too but why isn't that enough?
[This message edited by SlowUptake at 5:31 AM, February 25th (Tuesday)]
"Do not say a little in many words but a great deal in a few." Pythagoras
There are two kinds of people in the world.
Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data.
If you were here, I'd be torn between hugging the broken WS that I can see and smacking the foggy WS in front of me. Its often said that regret is being sorry about being caught, remorse is the gut wrenching discovery that you just destroyed your BS as you acted out your broken WS life. From the tone of your last post, I'm not sure you have even found yourself at regret, never mind remorse. Sad ...
I believe that JustDesserts is correct when he says your actions and your words reflect the reality that you are simply creating the exit your foggy, affair addled and lurrrvvv seeking selfish self seeks.
Swinging 2x4's isn't my usual style but it could be that only blunt messages stand a chance of getting into your foggy head cause its apparent that nothing else is.
So, lets start with the first issue of your drunken talk. It seems that you are grasping to the old Roman saying that WINE makes Truth or the French saying of "A drunk mind speaks a sober heart" in order to justify your actions. The infamous thought of "if it came out when I was drunk, then it must be true" theory is a whole lot of crap. Always was, always is. Especially for a foggy, affair addled WS! Look, nobody is arguing that the base emotions that you might have expressed in your drunken stupor don't exist. Of course, they do. You just ended an affair with the AP and are struggling with letting go. We understand that crap, after all, BTDT.
But and its a big but, you need to remember that alcohol lowers your inhibitions and distorts your reality. Since our brain chemistry determines who we are, alcohol with its stimulant / depressant chemical properties does not simply let out our true, unchanged selves, it changes who we are. Alcohol can makes us happy, woozy, enthusiastic, gregarious and loud. It can also turn us into angry, mean spirited drunks too. It is a complicated drug with all sorts of good and bad effects. But it does not make us genuine. It just makes us dumb.
You need to stop hanging your decisions on the alcohol and start taking responsibility for your thoughts and your actions. Its not your drunken self that needs straightening out, its the sober you. You need to figure things out and you won't have much time to do it in. Your H isn't going to stick around forever in a forgiving and accepting manner while you struggle to figure things out. You need to stop dicking him around and get your act together. And not just for his sake, but really, at one level, for yourself. The broken barbie doll that you are will never get fixed if you don't find some strength to make a decision, stick with it and get on with healing. And I can just picture you saying " but I don't know what to do?".
Well, I think your wrong. I think you know what you want. I also think that your just scared and afraid to face that truth. However, the truth is that life has a way of holding a mirror up whether or not you like it. Sooner than later you have to face up to it. Just read your own words.
confused43- I confessed to my husband a month ago. He wants to work on things. I do too. Only my heart and feelings aren't into it. ... I still have feelings for AP. Not sure why but I do... My brain is saying make it work but my heart is saying I need to leave. I need to get some clear space around me to figure out what I want.
I think more than your drunken rant, these words reflect your true self right now. Your mind wants a relationship with your husband but your heart and soul don't. And its that cognitive dissonance between the two opposing thoughts that is paralyzing you. You don't need to figure out what you want, you have that figured out alreay, you just need to get yoru mind past your husband and marriage. You don't want to face up to the truth that you really want the AP. In your heart and soul, you really want that good time fantasy back and IMHO, you are sabotaging everything in a subconscious attempt to get it back again.
confused43 -I still have feelings for AP. Not sure why but I do... My brain is saying make it work but my heart is saying I need to leave. I need to get some clear space around me to figure out what I want.
So, why don't you follow your heart? Why drag on this sham of a marriage and the sham of Reconcilion? If your heart and soul and mind are in conflict, then perhaps you need to make a decision. Which road do you want to follow? What type of person do you want to be? Do you want to be authentic to yourself or are you willing to live a lie?
Come on... make a decision. Its not that hard to do.
Myconfused43 - IC told me happy people in marriages rarely cheat. There is something in your marriage that you were missing that led you to this. So while he says I do have personal things about me I need to work through, I also need to figure out where my marriage was not what I had wanted.
My last word on this statement is that you really really need to find another IC. He's right, happy people don't usually cheat. Unhappy broken people do. In most cases, the unhappy things in a marriage are really reflections of the broken things within yourself. Before you concentrate on fixing marriage issues, you need to fix yourself. After all, your brokenness is what defines you right now. Broken like a clock with a missing spring. And if you can't see that, especially in those moments when you are all alone, then nothing we are going to say or do will help.
confused43 -I'm not here to prove myself since I need to only do that to my family and myself.
We never asked you to prove yourself to us. Never did and never will. We want you to prove yourself to yourself. We want you to be honest with yourself. We want you to find happiness and joy in life.
We're not asking you to just clam up and stay married because you had an affair. Especially since you had one. Having an affair is a sign that there is something within yourself that just can't find the right stuff in your marriage to make you happy. And you either have to find and fix that broken piece inside you or else you will live a lie forever. If you think and feel that the path to finding your happiness means leaving your marriage, then do it. Don't leave your H dangling. Not fair to him and not fair to you.
Wisdom from Gamine - Make a decision and discipline yourself not to waver. Don't be someone who stands for nothing. Stand for what you decide and back it with the full force of your character and conviction. DECIDE. CHOOSE. COMMIT. PERIOD.
This was one of the very first pieces of advice I was given when I found myself here. It connected in a way that nothing else had ever done. It offered me a way to find my honor, my dignity, my self-respect back. It said that everything I wanted could be mine again by simply being someone who stood with character, conviction and honour.
Make a Decision for what you want. Choose inside to make it happen. Commit yourself heart and soul. And then never waver. Period.
And it all starts with being honest with yourself for what you want and then making the right choice.
Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused, donít listen to your heart, its fickle, listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong - HUFI
[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 7:35 AM, February 25th (Tuesday)]
Huffi and JD have already said what I was thinking, but worded it much better than I ever could.
The one thing I want to add is a comment about the title of your post....to me, it sounded like it is written by someone who is a victim in their situation. ...you may be a victim, but you are doing it all to yourself. The only one causing all this is you.
You are still in the fog of being in love with AP and - I can tell you, it has been a year for me and I understand a lot of people say lurrve on here but I do know I did love my AP. Would I want him back? No! In the end he was a not the person I thought he was and wanted. I realize that now and I wouldn't want him back but I did love him. If you would have asked me this at 3, 6, and 9 months out each time the answer would have been different. At 3 I would have wanted him back, at six maybe, at 9 is when I started to realize a lot of things. Now - No! Do I miss him? Occasionally; but I don't want that life ever again.
My husband and I have made great progress and he does not know. I have made great progress for the most part. I still have a way to go; I still fbook creep every now and then but as someone told me on here - what you don't know you don't know. So I am doing my best to not check. Instead I am trying to put energy into my marriage and family. At first it was hard - thoughts of the AP consumed me. Now I honestly like to do nice things for my Husband. We had a great VDay dinner I made and stayed in without kids. This weekend we had no kids and had alone time as well. At the beginning sex was pretty bad for me with him. Things have improved a lot and I look forward to it.
I think you are not giving yourself time to process all that is going on. I think you need to not drink and if you really want to save your M try to work on things with your husband. Try to do nice things and be caring, dont' move out unless you feel you really need to and are done. That puts distance vs. closeness in the mix. Tell the truth but in a way that is concerned or caring. Try to do nice things, try to push AP out of your head (it is hard but gets easier). Give your self some time; you may feel different as time passes.
I cannot be the only one who would have given different answers at the beginning, 3 months, 6 and nine months out. I even feel at a year I am so much stronger than three months ago.
I know it is hard but try your best to not make a rash decision because you are so confused.
I was told never make an important decision when you are scared, angry, confused or stressed. Those are the times when you will make the wrong one. Make a decision when your head is clear and you have thought it through.
I wish you the best!
[This message edited by pastthelies at 11:37 AM, February 25th (Tuesday)]
You mentioned you still have feelings for AP. Let me share something with you. My BH said there had to be something about OM that attracted me to him, and I said "I thought he was a good person." BH's response? "If he was a good person, he wouldn't have tried to steal another man's wife." This is what I would like you to think about your AP. Your AP was involved with you--a married woman. What kind of values must someone have if they do that? None at all. And those lack of values would potentially cause him to be unfaithful to you. Do you really want to throw away your marriage for that? Do you really want to throw away your husband, a man who is willing to accept you for your brokenness and move forward with you after everything you did to him--and still continue to do? Many WS' are not as lucky as you to have a BS so willing to R.
Step back from the fog of the affair and realize your AP was nothing but a douche who took advantage of your brokenness. It took me a very long time to realize this fact and reach indifference about OM. I hope you do the same before its too late.
[This message edited by rekindle at 8:30 AM, February 26th (Wednesday)]
Don't leave him. It's going to be a big mistake. You're not going to work on yourself because there will be no incentive to. You will have removed yourself from a painful situation, and you'll likely go back to your wayward ways.
I know because it happened to me. I left and didn't do nearly as much work on myself as I should have.
Stay for as long as you can until it either works out or it becomes unbearable.
Divorced and still trying to figure out why I was so crazy for so long. I do know this however: lies and deception lead to unhappiness.
[This message edited by SI Staff at 10:42 PM, February 27th (Thursday)]
Confused, You may ignore what I say, but go to the Betrayed Men's part 18 Thread. Go to page 13 and read the 13th post down onward. See what men in your husband's shoes think about this. That's something you can't ignore.
I find too often here that people say stuff like "just leave your poor husband/wife already and move on" as if it's that easy. then add kids to the mix, and emotions and stir. Itís interested how many people really do what they say the first time. I think if you keep getting shit on then yes you eventually have to face the truth but often you have to see the big picture when your spouse is still messed up or in the fog.
I have comments to make about what others have posted here and will try to do so a bit later. I was letting it all absorb. I really do appreciate MOST of the comments. I know I messed up with my rants but thankfully my husband is trying to see the light at the end of the tunnel just like I am.
[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:46 PM, February 28th (Friday)]
I can't take it back and I've talked to my husband about it. He is obviously very hurt by my words and actions.
I don't expect you guys to use "nice" words to me necessarily but I think some of the comments are really unnecessary.
SlowUptake: I don't seem to find anything useful out of your posts. Questioning my "good person" stuff again is old news. We don't agree, I get it. I get that you don't think I'm a good person but move on and leave me alone please. I mention my immature behavior of pushing guys away to get them closer as a game i used to play when I was younger. I get that it's immature, but I did it the other night and owned up to it. I don't need you calling me a 15 year old, I already said I hate that about myself. I answered the question when asked too, not avoiding it. I think I've answered all questions honestly when asked, even when I know the response I'll get it since it's sometimes stuff not in the best interest of R....but I own it since I did it.
I do appreciate the tough love comments also...not really the ones that are so simple that just say "leave your husband already" but ones that help to dissect what is going on and help me to dig deeper into what it is that I'm doing and wanting. I do have an inner conflict going on. My head and heart are not on the same page. But I do believe as others have said that time will help and that's what I'm doing is taking it day to day. I'm not moving out right now. My h and I are working on things daily, hourly even at times. I do think more time away from AP will help me get over him and start to feel the remorse that I do truly want to feel and own. Once I can feel that that chapter with feelings for AP is truly over I think I can be better able to R. I know my husband will not wait forever and I am trying to do what I can and be authentic about it. I'm not really into the fake it til you make it camp. That is hard for me to do and feel ok with. I do need to pick and stick to it though as Hufi said. I pick working on my marriage and I know I need to try harder. I am trying find out how. I think if my husband did the 180 on me it would probably help me, but do I want to suggest it....ugh NO. but yes I think I need a dose of reality at times because I get lost. yes I am still in the fog and I know it and I do still fight the feelings I had for AP.
My h and I are spending more quality time together, getting out for walks, or lunch and talking about things we want to do. He wrote me a letter the other day with some harsh but true stuff in it. I really admire his strength in trying to work through this. It cant be easy that's for sure, and especially after my drunken rant on Sat night. One thing that sticks out though is that he said one of hte things about me he loves is my honesty and giving heart. And while he knows that that quality was lost last year in my betrayal he is happy that I confessed and am being honest him now. Well he's not "happy" I confessed as we'd both wish it never happened but you know what I mean. Iíve told him to please keep writing to me. He is better able to express himself this way I think.
He told me he will not wait around forever waiting for me to wake up. He is setting some time tables for himself to see if improvements are made as he needs to see progress.
I really do want to get to the point of making major progress but I also dont want to push what I'm not ready for and fail. I believe it just takes time like pastthelies mentioned. Hopefully for me also it will get better with time and lots of effort by me. My husband said if I don't show him by actions then he will have no choice but to move on. I'm so thankful that he is willing to see my wrecked self but know that I do still have worth to him. My self worth is so shattered and low and to have him see hope gives me some also.
For all the people that post I'm sure there are a ton that just lurk, many are afraid to post because they don't want to get a beating. My take is this.....be honest with the point you are at as there are others in your same shoes that need the help just as much. If I didn't post that I still had feelings for AP then I'd be lying and I know I can't be the only one with feelings for their AP still at 1 month past Dday. Iím sure Iím not the only one to have a drunken night of verbal bashing etc. We shouldn't be afraid to post it, feel it, and own it. Doesn't mean we are proud of it but it does mean we aren't as far on the path as we would like to be and hopefully will be, so just be careful not to push away the people that really need the help the most.
Again thank you all for your comments, they are much appreciated and I can tell that thought was put into them. I hope to have no more drunken rants posts.....e.v.e.r!
BSs get banned from this forum if they post on stop sign threads.