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User Topic: Just realized one of the things I've lost
JustForgave
♀ Member
Member # 36038
Default  Posted: 4:13 PM, April 29th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Long story, but I'm sitting in the stands at a track meet that my daughter is not yet at. She missed the bus here because her father forgot to tell her she needed to get on it when he dropped her at school this morning. He's currently trying to get her here on time.

Years ago, I would have been confident that he'd come through. Now--not so much. She might miss her first event. And I realized I've lost a lot of my confidence in him. I spent so many years getting angry and focusing on the worst that it has become habit.

He's on this site, but I don't think he'll read this. He only comes here when I remind him to. I want the confidence back.


Me: 47
FWH: 39 (SI username: Bumbling)
DD: 10

DDay #1: June 9, 2012
Dday #2 (TT): November 29, 2012
DDay #3 (The BIG one, ALL the TT): March 30, 2013
False R: June 12, 2012 - March 21, 2013
REAL R: March 21, 2013 - present


Posts: 278 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Texas
OK now
♀ Member
Member # 14459
Default  Posted: 4:37 PM, April 29th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Loss of confidence and loss of respect; part of the same equation.
It can return with hard work and effort from the WH. Will he bother trying though?

Posts: 1693 | Registered: May 2007 | From: NC
deena04
♀ Member
Member # 41741
Default  Posted: 5:20 PM, April 29th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sorry you have to go through that. It sucks when the one we are supposed to trust the most can't be trusted.


Me BS mid-late 30s
Him WS knocking on 40 (lovemywife4ever)
blended family with lots of kiddos
together 5 years, married 8/13
D day 12/1/13
WH ONS had been 4/12
Getting ME back and moving to HAPPY - whatever that means
Filed, but may R after

Posts: 790 | Registered: Dec 2013
Bumbling
♂ New Member
Member # 38920
Default  Posted: 3:51 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm going to try to keep from getting defensive.
1. I forgot to remind her to get on the bus to the track meet.
2. I left work a couple hours early to cut across town during rush hour traffic to fix things.
3. We made it there before the meet started and she got to compete in all of her events.
4. I'm here on this site. I see a lot of reinforcement here of the idea that FWH are awful people, not worthy of respect, or trust and unwilling to put forth any effort. While there are certainly cases where all of this is true, and there was a time when it was true for me, this narrative is no longer accurate for me. It being repeated to my wife, even in the guise of sympathy and comfort, is destructive to our relationship.

Posts: 33 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 5:00 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm having a hard time sitting on my hands so I'm just gonna let this fly.

Bumbling, I am struggling with how you posted on your wife's thread. You bumped this thread after several days just to make your point. You are the reason your wife doesn't trust or have confidence in you. And its going to take a long time and a lot of effort on your part for her to regain it. Each time you flub up, even by accident, will cause your BS to falter.

Do you have posting boundaries here on SI? Because she should be allowed to vent her frustrations and hurt without worrying about sass from you. Even if she did call out your name. She is hurt. She is frustrated. Don't shame her. Don't put her "back in her place". This is her safe place. Or should be.

You should be communicating face to face with your wife GENTLY. Not via forums and social media. Show her thru your actions that you have changed. Don't give her words. Give actions.

And as far as what other BS say....yes. There are many who say WS don't deserve trust or whatever. Those people usually have multiple Ddays and TT. So yeah, they're a little gunshy. However, I know MANY BSs here. Yes they are hurt and angry, but they are kind, beautiful people. I am a WS. And those I have befriended and even met in person have been amazing. I am human to them. They don't see my failures. They see me.

"That narrative is no longer accurate for me"? Show your wife. With actions. Not words.

Give her respect. And the ability to vent. Without you butting in.

[This message edited by Aubrie at 8:02 AM, May 31st (Saturday)]


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"What if I fall?" Oh but my darling, what if you fly?


Posts: 6071 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
Jrazz
♀ Guide
Member # 31349
Default  Posted: 5:11 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

***Posting as a member***

I see a lot of reinforcement here of the idea that FWH are awful people, not worthy of respect, or trust and unwilling to put forth any effort.

A lot? Really? I've been here since early 2011 and this was pretty much my training ground for how FWS's are worthy of respect and trust and effort... the key word being "Former."

I understand that there is a lot of anger and hurt directed at Waywards in general, but after newish members have calmed down, they see that there is a lot to be learned about forgiveness for both parties here. Worthiness is key - you don't get handed a cookie for saying you're sorry and then asking what's for dinner.

IMO.

[This message edited by Jrazz at 5:14 PM, May 30th (Friday)]


We are what we repeatedly do, excellence, then is not an act but a habit. - Aristotle

Posts: 16458 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: California
plainpain
♀ Member
Member # 40139
Default  Posted: 5:19 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you, Aubrie. This makes me all kinds of uncomfortable, and I am not sure how to express it without calling anybody out or getting in the middle of a marriage. It feels all kinds of inappropriate. That makes me angry. This is not a place where people come to be shamed or silenced.

This is a safe place, where feelings are expressed, where sympathy is given, by people who have BTDT.

Before the A, I would have bet my life on my H. Now, even though he has changed the narrative of his life, I have to recover from the fact that he has altered the entire narrative of mine. Everything I believed true about him was a lie. He was not who I believed him to be. The man I believed he was would never have betrayed me. So now I know he is capable of that - he is capable of anything. He is capable of dropping all kinds of balls - no pun intended. My blind confidence in him was smashed by his deception, selfishness and brutal abuse of my love and my trust.

That should not be at all surprising that this would require extensive time for healing.


Me: Believer; 40s
Him: Liar; 40s
Married 19 years
1 year EA/2 month PA/incidental infidelities I can't begin to process
OC born 2014
OW:21
In successful R, but still in just plain pain.

Posts: 774 | Registered: Jul 2013
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bumbling,
Don't forget there are hundred of hurting people here who too can identify with your wife.

As well, there are FWS who can identify with you.

If you go to a church, you would basically know it's nothing but a big A.A. meeting. A lot of dysfunctional people with pains, discomfort and real hang ups.

This is like that except it focuses on one category. And people fall on one side or the other but I can tell the honest goal is to get things better than what they were for BS, until a certain point.

Once that point has been crossed they give up, because they tried everything they could, but were left with no options. You should feel good that she has a place to vent, and even though, yes, you will feel attack, you should realize, you are not being judge as in being labeled that forever. There will be a time that you won't be even consider a WH, but just a simple husband, provide that you do what is necessary on your part.

By hurting the spouses, you have to figure YOU lost a lot of what was given out of love. Now it's time to prove that you can do what it takes and then some.

Also, if she posts things on here, I would recommend take it as ammo to better arm yourself to do better in the future. It's hard not to get defensive, but realize, who's the source...

[This message edited by LostSamurai at 5:37 PM, May 30th (Friday)]


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1029 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
MovingUpward
♂ Guide
Member # 14866
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, May 30th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

*Posting as a member

I see a lot of reinforcement here of the idea that FWH are awful people, not worthy of respect, or trust and unwilling to put forth any effort.

Well I think that you might be confusing FWS and WS. There are many stories here about unremorseful spouses. I don't know your story nor your wife's to the extent that I have any expertise on how remorseful you've been nor if she see's you as a FWS like you do. What I can see from her short post is that she is still trying to heal. She lacks the confidence in you still that she once held for you.

That is a fact from her mouth. That isn't something that a poster put in her mind. Learning to trust again. Learning to be vulnerable after being deceived. Having the person you love the most in the world break the biggest promise that anyone has ever made to you is traumatic. Her last discovery of your affair was only a year ago in what often takes 3-5 years to heal from. I see from your posts that you went to great lengths to correct your forgetting to tell your daughter about the track meet. I can sense from you that you desire to have your marriage back and to not want to lose your spouse. For this reason, you should be ready to keep helping her heal. Keep proving to her how you've changed and you're wanting this marriage to work. For your actions with and around your wife will set the tone for your future together. The stuff here won't do that if your actions positive. I hope that you continue to take the opportunities to help her heal. That is what she sounds like she wants.

[This message edited by MovingUpward at 5:39 PM, May 30th (Friday)]


AKA Moo

Think of the haters in your life as sandpaper; they’ll scratch you up time and time again but in the end you’re polished, smooth, and spotless..while they end up useless

We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give.


Posts: 51533 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Big Blue Nation
Hope2B
♀ Member
Member # 40474
Default  Posted: 3:00 AM, May 31st (Saturday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

plainpain, I loved the way you worded this!
Before the A, I would have bet my life on my H. Now, even though he has changed the narrative of his life, I have to recover from the fact that he has altered the entire narrative of mine. Everything I believed true about him was a lie. He was not who I believed him to be. The man I believed he was would never have betrayed me. So now I know he is capable of that - he is capable of anything. . . My blind confidence in him was smashed by his deception, selfishness and brutal abuse of my love and my trust.

JustForgave, I'm not as confident any more either, that WH will come through. You're not alone with these thoughts!


Me: early 60s
Him: 65 yrs old, LTA w/a pro$titute
Married since 1980, no children
DDay: Feb. 25, 2013
Trickle Truth Days: Sept 10, 11, 13, 15 (2013)
His affair--says it was only 8 times 1x/mo, then found out it was 7 YEARS 2-3x/mo

Posts: 345 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: out west/west coast U.S.A.
Bumbling
♂ New Member
Member # 38920
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Moo, I appreciate your intent and your tone, I really do. Even on this page I'm seeing people sow more seeds of doubt in my ability to improve things and to be trusted.
"Will he bother trying though?"
"It sucks when the one we are supposed to trust the most can't be trusted."
I think their intent was to comfort my wife by sympathizing with her and confirming that she's neither alone nor crazy. There's value in that. But the first implies I'm too lazy and unengaged to bother (neither are true) and the second takes my wife's soft words ("not so much," "lost a lot of my confidence in him") and made them harder and more absolute ("can't be trusted.")

Maybe it's subtle, but it's caustic to our marriage.

I totally understand that I've broken her trust. I lied to get what I felt like I needed at the time, and I'm completely open and honest with my wife now. I'm working on fixing the damage I did. This situation stung for me because I've always been pretty good at getting things done, and I've always been an involved and supportive dad. It's part of my identity I've been proud of. For the damaged trust to splash into that part of my life hurt.

As for Plainpain's assertion, "This is not a place where people come to be shamed or silenced," I have no intention of silencing or shaming my wife for having feelings I helped create or expressing herself, and I appreciate the intent to make this a safe place. If you can see some truth to my perspective that some of the words on this page are increasing my wife's doubts in me, and that such a thing is likely to hurt our connection, it naturally leads to the idea that I have to push back against those voices of doubt to fight for my marriage to succeed. I'm not trying to say STFU to anyone, I'm fighting for my marriage.


Posts: 33 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 5:21 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it naturally leads to the idea that I have to push back against those voices of doubt to fight for my marriage to succeed. I'm not trying to say STFU to anyone, I'm fighting for my marriage.
Well call me crazy but I wanna know why you feel the need to jack TWO of your wife's threads to make your points. No offense, but she gets enough of you at home. Fight for your marriage at home. SI is a community where people from all different backgrounds get together and talk. You're going to hear things you don't like. You're going to read opinions that may or may not line up with your actions. Why do you feel the need to come on your wife's threads and correct everyone and prove where you are showing her fears wrong? Why don't you just put your head down and show your wife with your actions the changes you've made.

You cannot control other people. You cannot silence other people. You control you.

When we came to SI I became an active poster. My husband lurks. He read a lot of stuff and talked about some threads that struck fear in my heart. Because even though I was doing A, those thoughts and threads made him think B. Oh well. I put those doubts in his head. He had every right to question. Ultimately, he watched my actions. My words and actions lined up. The doubts in his heart started to settle down and finally disappear. "The voices" here didn't win. They didn't overpower him. He was a big boy and saw for himself that one person's opinion, while strong, didn't necessarily line up with the action at home. I had to give up control. Give up the fear. He is free to make his own choices. Just like your wife. Do you think she is incompetent to make her own informed choices? Just trying to understand your drive to "be right" and "prove" stuff on *her* threads.

Seeing spouses comment on and take over the other spouses threads really grinds my gears. Makes me wonder if that is the same dynamic at home. One yells above the other till they cant hear themselves think.

JMHO


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"What if I fall?" Oh but my darling, what if you fly?


Posts: 6071 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
Unagie
♀ Member
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 5:43 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bumbling please understand that when your wife comes here to vent people will say what they want as a way to help her feel better and validate her. They don't give a damn about validating you because you are the one who caused her to have a need to come here and vent. There are plenty here who have said things about my xSO that I would never have said. I didn't sit here and immediately go hey they're right im gonna think just like them now. Your wife has lost her confidence in you. She has lost the ability to believe in what you say. That pretty much equates to she can no longer trust you. Shocker! So youre not doing it now? Youre not giving her reasons to not trust you? Great. Eventually in a few more years she just might have that confidence again until then deal with it. You don't like what people here are saying figure out why because its not because they're causing issues in your marriage with their comments. They hit a nerve find out the real reason why.

[This message edited by Unagie at 5:45 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday)]


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

Do not let others be your reference for who you see in the mirror.

Stop allowing people to hurt you, because you don't love you enough to walk away.


Posts: 2644 | Registered: Oct 2012
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 5:57 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMO, Bumbling and JustForgave - I think a boundary needs to be established - no posting on each other's threads.

[This message edited by MissesJai at 5:57 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday)]


FWW - 40
I'm big on personal responsibility. Own your shit. ALL OF IT.

Posts: 5769 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 5:58 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

JustForgave.
It all comes down to trust IMO. Once trust is violated it never comes back completely.

Where I am at right now. In my situation. I dont see how love can exist without trust. And since trust is broken. What does that mean for the future M?

Bumbling.
People come here to talk because its a SAFE place. You just took that away from JustForgave.

Let her have a safe place to express herself and receive support from others who have a common experience. We all know to not put too much weight on the opinions of others here. But still we value other points of view. We use each other as sounding boards.

It seems you dont like some of the posts you see in reply to what JustForgave wrote. And you want to intercede. To me that sounds like you are trying to control not only what JustForgave says but what she hears as well.

Your affair took control of her life away from her. Now she needs to sort it all out and make some choices. Its not right IMO that you should seek to control her again.

If you actually love JustForgave then allow her to make her own choices.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3374 | Registered: Sep 2007
WarpSpeed
♂ Member
Member # 32051
Default  Posted: 8:03 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

and made them harder and more absolute ("can't be trusted.")

I'm curious, how much reading are you doing on this site?

You put the betrayed spouse through over NINE months of trickle truth. Having a poster describe a wandering spouse with that track record as someone that "can't be trusted" is a pretty mild rebuke.

Those "caustic" comments are not the problem. Cheating and nine months of trickle truth are the problem.

I'm a betrayed spouse. I have a pretty long track record of posting on the Wayward forum in SUPPORT of Waywards working to rebuild their marriages. There are lots of folks just like me that want to see healing for betrayed spouses AND waywards.

Here's a suggestion, do with it what you will.

One of the things my wife and I have really worked on since getting remarried (she divorced me without me knowing there was an A) is "Listening with good intent". We had gotten into a habit, pre A and pre divorce, of making all sorts of negative assumptions. Now, we actively say to ourselves "What is the best possible way I can "hear" that statement." The truth is that most of time the best version of how you can hear something is really the intended message.

So, in this case here was the comment you had issue with "It sucks when the one we are supposed to trust the most can't be trusted."

What is the best possible way to hear that if you assume the poster is saying it with good intent.

Here's my take. "My wife must still be feeling a lot of pain for this track meet issue with our daughter to strike a nerve in such a way to create a post like this one. That poster says I can't be trusted. My wife posted this thread about lacking confidence in me. I know I'm trying to make her feel safe, but this tells me that the work is far from done and I'll keep on working at it because I love her and don't want her to feel this pain."

You CAN read that "can't be trusted" post and take that away from it if you choose to do so. Or, you can be defensive as you have been.

you choose

best luck

[This message edited by WarpSpeed at 8:07 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday)]


Me: BS (51)
Her: fWW (50)
Married 26 years
Two sons in college
Empty closet and note on bed Jan 2010, She filed for D Mar 2010, D final May 2010, Actually had D-Day and found out why it all happened July 2010. Remarried on 23rd Anniv Aug 2010

Posts: 1489 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Dallas
20WrongsVs1
♀ Member
Member # 39000
Shutup  Posted: 8:37 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

JustForgave, sorry, I don't typically post in General without an explicit invitation from the OP, but the gates appear to have been stormed.

A WS drains, and overdraws, the confidence bank on DDay. Your eroded confidence in WH is totally understandable, especially after several months of TT and false R. I'm sorry you were triggered by what was, probably, an honest mistake that he ultimately rectified. But I'm also detecting optimism in you, because you said you want the confidence back! What can he do to rebuild that?

Bumbling: see what I just did there? I validated her feelings, apologized, and found a silver lining. Is that something you think you could try, instead of defending your actions and interpreting support for your BW as destructive and caustic?

For the damaged trust to splash into that part of my life hurt.

Yeah, it does, and I've felt the same exact way, but choices have consequences...and blowback is one. This thread isn't about supporting you, though. If you want to be understood, c'mon over to Wayward.


fWW: 42
BH: 52
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1046 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
Topic Posts: 17

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