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User Topic: What is infidelity?
Ephimera
♀ New Member
Member # 43294
Default  Posted: 10:50 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by Ephimera at 4:26 PM, May 18th (Sunday)]


A BS

Posts: 23 | Registered: Apr 2014
TrustedHer
♂ Member
Member # 23328
Default  Posted: 10:55 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some people think that infidelity is only real if it is a PA (physical affair).

They're wrong. The infidelity is the betrayal. It's any inappropriate crossing of boundaries. It's any action that causes pain in your spouse that a reasonable person would be aware is painful. It's the disrespect for the person you pledged your life to.

Please read in the Healing Library. There's a link in the yellow box at the upper left of your screen.

I understand the book "Not Just Friends" addresses this. I haven't read it, but I've learned a lot on SI.

Be sure to take care of yourself. Drink water. Eat.


Take care of yourself. There's a great future out there. It won't come to you; you have to go to it.

Posts: 5181 | Registered: Mar 2009 | From: DeepInTheHeartOf, TX
BreatheAgain10
♀ Member
Member # 32657
Default  Posted: 10:55 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ABSO-FREAKIN-LUTELY! That is what is considered an emotional affair (EA). The Healing Library (in the menu box on the left) contains FAQ's and articles and helpful info that will answer so many questions for you both.
Welcome to the club you never wanted to join (as I have read so many other members say), but will be glad you did. We support you!


By God's blessing we've survived, but the scars are still tender to the touch.
BW: Me 34yrs FWH: 29yrs
Latest D-Day 04/29/2010
Together: 12yrs Married: 10yrs
DS:16yrs DS:9yrs. DS:Due 6/25/14
Main D-Day that hurts is #4 4/29/10
OW=Yuck!

Posts: 272 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Sunny So. Cal.
karmahappens
♀ Member
Member # 35846
Default  Posted: 10:56 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He had feelings for another woman.

Yes, he was unfaithful with his heart, at the very least.

Your hurt and pain are real and he has some work to do to figure out what is really going on with him.

You will get wonderful support here.

Welcome. (((Hugs)))

[This message edited by karmahappens at 10:59 PM, April 30th (Wednesday)]


“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom”
Anaïs Nin
Me: 45
Him: 47
Dday 8/2007
We have R'd

Posts: 3845 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: Massachusetts
Lovedyoumore
♀ Member
Member # 35593
Default  Posted: 11:05 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If he was having conversations with a woman that he would not want you to hear, he crossed the A boundary. If he talked about his personal life, your personal life, or your marriage, he crossed the A boundary. Professing love for another woman crosses the A boundary. Continuing to communicate with the other woman, crosses the A boundary.


Me 52
WH 52
Married 30+ years
Together trying to R

I tell people I am tired but really my heart is broken and I am sad.


Posts: 1526 | Registered: May 2012 | From: Southern, bless your heart
Lovedyoumore
♀ Member
Member # 35593
Default  Posted: 11:06 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he said that it was a reaction to his feeling that I didn't love him anymore, and that even if he had a relationship, he thought I wouldn't care.

This excuse is Cheater 101. Not very imaginative.


Me 52
WH 52
Married 30+ years
Together trying to R

I tell people I am tired but really my heart is broken and I am sad.


Posts: 1526 | Registered: May 2012 | From: Southern, bless your heart
Ephimera
♀ New Member
Member # 43294
Default  Posted: 11:20 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by Ephimera at 4:26 PM, May 18th (Sunday)]


A BS

Posts: 23 | Registered: Apr 2014
SBB
♀ Member
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 11:32 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If she had reciprocated it would have been a physical affair. No doubt about it.

The fact that he isn't horrified by how far on that slippery slope he went down tells me he sees nothing wrong with it.

The sad clown used this fucked up thinking to give himself permission to have EAs/PAs for years.

He had lunch with DDOW, noticed she flirted back, felt chemistry. He thought that was OK.

Went for a romantic walk and held her hand. He thought that was OK.

Went back to her place and gave her a back massage under her dress and kissed her. He thought that was OK.

He had sex with her - Oh shit - I just cheated.

But he kept his wedding ring on because taking it off 'felt wrong' (actual quote from him).

Do you see this slippery slope?

When do you think he cheated? When he saw the slippery slope? When he continued on it? When she reciprocated? Or when they fucked?

He knew before the lunch that he was attracted to her and she was attracted to him. That was when this affair started. It wasn't the first one so he wasn't at all scared of sliding down that slippery slope. He 'knew' he wouldn't go 'too far'.

A good man can't be stolen. A good man would have noticed the interest and checked himself immediately. Distanced himself. Told me about it. Horrified that someone who knew he was married would behave in this way towards him.

I did not have a good man. IMO you don't either.

What happens when the next one reciprocates?

A failed attempt at cheating is not better than a successful one. Just as an EA is not better than a PA.

The only difference is STDs. Cheating is cheating.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5609 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
Breezy150
♀ Member
Member # 42421
Default  Posted: 11:35 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Please remember that nothing about the A is your fault. Don't let him turn any of that decision back on you. Cheaters cheat because they are broken, no other reason. They are self absorbed broken people.


I am so disappointed when a liar's pants don't actually start on fire.

BS me 41
WH 42 his whore was my friend
Married 24 years
Finally finding R?
3 kids 3 grand kids
DDay 1 -Jan 2 2014
DDay 2 -Feb 20 2014 A went underground fo


Posts: 544 | Registered: Feb 2014
Ephimera
♀ New Member
Member # 43294
Default  Posted: 11:55 PM, April 30th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by Ephimera at 4:27 PM, May 18th (Sunday)]


A BS

Posts: 23 | Registered: Apr 2014
SBB
♀ Member
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And I know people can make mistakes.

I agree with you but I disagree that this was a mistake. This was a choice and one he made repeatedly.

The only thing that stopped this becoming an affair is her lack of interest. What happens if the next mistake/choice he makes reciprocates? He doesn't think making moves equals cheating - they all tell themselves that until they're having sex.

I have to ask are you certain he isn't lying to you about it not becoming physical?

The sad clown told me that during our first S he had taken his office gopher out to lunch and told her he was attracted to her (he was 40, she 23 - he's the CFO and she's had been an office junior in his team for 4+ years). He told me she rebuffed him but escorted him to his hotel while he dropped his work stuff off before they went out to drinks. I believed him.

We had a 3m False R then 20w after S he told me he was ready to introduce this child whore to my then almost 5 and 2 year olds as his GF. She now lives with them.

I now know he was lying to my face - gave me half truth to assuage his guilt and to feign transparency. It was likely an LTA for the entire time they've known each other. Absolutely EA - PA later.

This is not at all uncommon. His complete denial that this was a repeated attempt at an affair concerns me. As does the fact that his story is not completely believable.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5609 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
simplydevastated
♀ Member
Member # 25001
Default  Posted: 12:28 PM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some people think that infidelity is only real if it is a PA (physical affair).

^^^This!

Ephimera, do an online search for different types of infidelity and show it to your husband. Some articles are better than other, as usual, but it may open his eyes to what infidelity is and where/when it can happen.


Me - BS, 39 (I'm not old...I'm vintage)
Two Wonderful children - DS10, DD7
Married, for now... (4+ D-Day - listed in profile.)

Posts: 5854 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: In the darkest depths of hell!
Ephimera
♀ New Member
Member # 43294
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by Ephimera at 4:27 PM, May 18th (Sunday)]


A BS

Posts: 23 | Registered: Apr 2014
Hope2B
♀ Member
Member # 40474
Default  Posted: 4:48 PM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes, it's infidelity. Plain and simple. If he had to hide it from you, that means he knew there was something unacceptable he was doing. If the OW had reciprocated, he would have most likely taken the next step toward a physical affair.

He said that he just wanted to feel the emotion of love and the OW as a person did not matter.
This is bullshit. He is lying to you. Of course the OW as a person DID matter! As for feeling the emotion of love, well, that emotional connection changes one way or another.

I believe that as love grows and develops in a marriage, you lose that first emotional-high time of "falling in love, being in love" feeling, where your every breath and heartbeat is tied up with the other person. Love becomes more quiet, mature and enduring. Your hearts may still beat as one, you are a part of one another, but it's not at the intensity level of when you first got together. It's impossible to sustain that beginning level for any length of time without burnout.

Life happens to help bank the flames that you first felt with such intensity, and for an enduring love, the "I'm so in to you. I'm so HOT for you! Must. Have. You. Now." takes more of a back seat because you connect on a deeper and more mature level.

But I continue to wonder if I'm holding him back from his real love, and if he won't be happier with her. And I love him so much that all I want is for him to be happy.
Sadly, all I can say is that if you really and truly feel this way, it would be best to let him go. However, I would first encourage both of you go to counseling--individual as well as marriage counseling, before you make any such decision.

[This message edited by Hope2B at 4:51 PM, May 1st (Thursday)]


Me: early 60s
Him: 65 yrs old, LTA w/a pro$titute
Married since 1980, no children
DDay: Feb. 25, 2013
Trickle Truth Days: Sept 10, 11, 13, 15 (2013)
His affair--says it was only 8 times 1x/mo, then found out it was 7 YEARS 2-3x/mo or maybe ever 4x/mo

Posts: 359 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: out west/west coast U.S.A.
SBB
♀ Member
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 5:05 PM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But I'm also certain that if she had reciprocated and they were getting into a relationship, my husband would have told me.

Gently, just like he told you that he was aggressively courting another woman?

No.

You are now minimising - I too told myself I was making a big deal out of nothing. So I waited until he fucked someone else - actually, I waited until he confessed.

No one here is saying you need to divorce him because of this - we are warning you that unless you/he address this and NOT try to sweep it under the carpet (it's called rugsweeping and most of us do it) that you'll be back here with another DD and exposed to STDs.

This is a pretty extreme courting - to keep going rejection after rejection? Does it not make you wonder if he's tried this before?

Have you checked his phone records?

I repeat - this was not a mistake, it was a choice.

This was a betrayal - he was actively pursuing another woman. He told her he loved her. He only confessed because you found out and confronted.


I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5609 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
Ephimera
♀ New Member
Member # 43294
Default  Posted: 5:22 PM, May 1st (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

[This message edited by Ephimera at 4:27 PM, May 18th (Sunday)]


A BS

Posts: 23 | Registered: Apr 2014
Topic Posts: 16

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