this is something i struggle with too. its very hard. striving to understand, to comprehend, to "get it". but something im learning and is a very painful lesson ... i dont think its possible to "get". ever. no wrapping the head around it. just accepting that it happened. if you, i, or anyone else on this forum were the kind of person to cheat ... we "might" get it ... but we arent.
so i guess its fundamentally just something that has to be accepted. it rains sometimes. gravity exists. our wives lied, deceived us, and F'ed other guys. forgiveness isnt acceptance, acceptance is just being able to say it happened, you dont understand, you will probably never understand ... but it still happened and it is what it is.
its hard. i know.
keep an eye on her. see if she keeps trying to fix herself. thats vital. as long as shes trying to fix herself then its genuine remorse, if the effort to fix herself stops then you know it was regret.
wishing you all the best!
from 09/11 - 05/13
2 ONS, 10 sexting partners, 1 LT EA/PA
??/06/13 DD/1 - admits to LT EA, begin false R.
01/13/14 DD/2 - LTA was PA.
01/18/14 DD/3 - sexting 5 guys.
01/19/14 DD/4 - 2 ONS with different guys
I see a lot of posts about 'being conflicted'. Well, gee, that's surprising. What BS isn't conflicted? If you stay, is it the right thing to do? If you leave, is it the right thing to do? Conflict comes with the territory, for all of us. Why is SWAT being condemned for it?
Does he love his wife? I'm sure he does. Sometimes, that's not enough to overlook all that has happened. I don't know if that is the case for SWAT, but I do know that it is often the case when D happens. No one falls out of love after one day (DDay). Falling in love takes time. So does moving on. Why is SWAT being condemned by some for feeling he cannot have a happy marriage to his WW after all that has happened? He can change his mind if he feels that is the right thing for him. These scare tactics of 'another dad' or of no turning back if SS17 remarries are sad. Is SS17 remarrying the day the D is final? Is SWAT?
There is an entire forum on SI filled with people that are 'moving on', and yet for some reason everyone feels that SWAT needs to be 'scared straight'.
SWAT, there are people on this board that have D'd and remarried the WS. There are people here that have R'd.l There are people that have D'd and have great relationships with their kids. Please do what you feel is right and don't let the fear mongers get to you. I'm NOT saying I'm all for you getting divorced. I'm saying I'm all for you doing what is right for YOU.
I think people trying to scare anyone into following their path is wrong, in every instance, not just this one. I find it surprising how often it's happening in this thread. One post was made by a new member - his only post - and it's nothing but a laundry list of horrible things SWAT will deal with if he goes through with the D. It's utter nonsense. A hunter's kid was taken hunting for the first time by step-dad. Well, why didn't dad bring him hunting already? If it was such an important thing, why didn't he already do it? SWAT is a great dad. He's not going to be replaced. It's an absurd notion.
SWAT, many of us are with you. You do what is right for you. I think you wanting your relationship with SS17 to be amicable is admirable. You have kids. You will do a MUCH better job co-parenting if you get along with mom. Mixed signals be damned. If SS17 reads more into your actions than you've stated, that's on her, not you. You don't need to change your behavior out of concern for what signals she's receiving. You've been up front with her from day 1, and that's all anyone could ask of you, and it's more than you were given.
Can I ask you a question.
Why are you the one living in the barn?
I understand it is her house.
But the onus is on her to improve herself.
To stop lying.
To stop cheating.
To be able to look you in the eye as two adults that respect each other.
The only thing your wife has lost at this time is you.
She still has her family. The kids. Even her reputation is still largely intact.
You have lost more than her IMO.
I am not saying to hurt your wife but even though she is working on herself she needs to feel loss.
Put her in the barn. in more ways than just being 200 feet away from the house.
Glad you have stepped back. Now watch her.
Whether you go toward R or D, the important thing is to move forward. You're doing a hell of a job on this. You will know when you have reached that important fork in the road when you are certain as to which path you need to take.
One of the things that helped me in my processing was when I was on the low point on that roller coaster, I typed out my thoughts, feelings, and observations of my XW in a journal on my phone. It helps to get it recorded and out of your mind so that you can make room for the next set of feelings and thoughts to process. I went over what I recorded time and time again. I saw a pattern in my thoughts and feelings, and observations and it provided me the answer I needed. It took me about 6 months to come to my conclusion.
I agree that waiting is a good idea. You have a WW who screwed up royally so you need to see her demeanor and actions from here on. That said, I believe, as you do that she is remorseful which is a lot more than some WW. I also think you need to wait to see what happens with the OM. I don't think he's done yet by a long shot. Personally, I think your entire family is in danger. This is the type of nut who could go postal or set the place on fire in the middle of the night. I know you're watching him like a hawk and if there's anyone who's capable of protecting their family, it's you.
I want to throw another subject out there for you to consider......forgiveness. I'm not talking about R or D but forgiveness itself. As you work through the feelings of grief, forgiveness of her actions will subdue the feelings of resentment and bitterness that are bound to come up sooner or later. What I want to emphasize is forgiving her is something you DO not something you FEEL. When my first wife got into yet a 2nd affair, I had to pray everyday forgiveness. I didn't "feel" it at all for six months. After telling God, myself, and her I forgive you for six months, the feeling of forgiveness came and I was able to let it go. You'll know you've forgiven her when you think about what she did and there's no pain. You're a ways from this right now but I think it's important to know.
Just my 2 cents but I'm hoping you reconcile....even if you have to divorce first to do it. As a matter of fact, I think you should divorce; I'm a firm believer that even if you reconcile, there needs to be horrific consequences for this kind of betrayal so that the person never wants to do it again. However, your two lives are way too intertwined socially, historically, in family, etc. for you to be completely free. I've read both of your threads and I see that this whole thing is a comedy of errors on her part. The actual sexual stuff, compared to others' stories isn't the worse scenario I've seen. It's just the trickle truth and timing has been awful. The journal and her visiting him after NC, both are just bad in themselves but the timing couldn't have been worse. My point is she should suffer the indignity of divorce as well as what she is already going through with the collective anger of her family. Her picture being out there for everyone to see adds to the shame in her life as well. It's a good thing in a sense because as I said earlier it precludes she will never do this again. But understand, she feels horrible and is under tremendous pressure. People have been know to commit suicide from less. My point is, as deserving as she may be of all that's happening, you may need to show a deeper love by eventually taking her back for her sake. Every woman I've known or read about that was taken back after such a huge transgression, marvels at the love of their husband for years to come. When you choose to love them even through your own pain, it really makes an impression. I'll shut up now.
Anyway, praying for you guys.
WW has wanted to talk for awhile now. I believe she thinks we can sit down and drink some coffee and chat. Well that's not gonna happen. I've got questions that I want answers to. I'm going to ask them today. She probably isn't going to like this conversation. Actually I'm sure she isn't. But I need to look in her eyes when I ask them. This may not be the right time or even the right thing to do. But I'm sick and tired of being like this and I can't stand being in between r and d. I know I filed and all but most of you are right. In my heart it isn't what I want but my head says I need to. I'm hoping and praying this talk shuts one of them up. I'm starting to feel like I'm two different people and I don't like it.
So I am approaching this like I do most things. Straight ahead with my gun drawn. It is a fight and I intend to win. Wish me luck, no matter which way it goes. Today is the day it ends.
Heart says not to, but your pride tells you have to. I get it.
Which is most important to you ?
DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. ONS that occurred 3 years earlier. Lied to for 3 years.
Every truth comes to light in a long enough timeline.
I appreciate the hugs. I'm just sick of having doubts and being indecisive. That isn't me. I don't had doubts and I fight for what is right. So being wishy washy and whiny isn't my style and I'm wholeheartedly sick of it. It ends today be it good or bad.
it precludes she will never do this again.
Nothing does this. I don't believe in 'once a cheater always a cheater', but there is nothing on earth that ensures that someone will not cheat.
But understand, she feels horrible and is under tremendous pressure. People have been know to commit suicide from less.
Wow. Just wow.
My point is, as deserving as she may be of all that's happening, you may need to show a deeper love by eventually taking her back for her sake
Respectfully, the only thing SWAT, or anyone, needs to do is what they believe is right for them. I was disheartened and surprised by the amount of people trying to use guilt over the children to get SWAT to stay with his WW. Raven, you've taken using guilt to a whole new level. It makes me sad that the 'members' here are using such tactics to get SWAT to do something they want him to do. And prefacing it with talk of the need to shame her? There is no need to shame anyone. The A happened. SWAT is now in a position he never wanted to be in - forced to decide to stay with his wife given all that she's done, or divorce and all the negatives that come with it. Shaming is not part of the equation. They either reconcile and work toward a healthier relationship or they divorce. Advising shame and then warning of suicide? Again, wow.
SWAT, you know what is right for you. R or D, and I have complete faith in you and your ability to behave with honor and dignity regardless of what you decide.
Oh how I would like to say my head. Cheating is such a foreign concept to me. But sadly my heart. It just keeps coming back to I love her so much. I never would have thought I would say that either. I've always had such a strong reaction to people who cheat and I always said I would never accept it but here I am.
I don't had doubts and I fight for what is right. So being wishy washy and whiny isn't my style and I'm wholeheartedly sick of it. It ends today be it good or bad.
Don't beat yourself up. This mess has made all of us act in ways that just 'aren't us'. It's nice to see you continue to move forward. You've really been more than impressive in how you've handled all of this. I sincerely mean that.
And for what it's worth, I don't think you've been whiny, at all. I think you've been remarkably strong from the start.
Go with your gut. Ask away.
I've read both of your threads and I see that this whole thing is a comedy of errors on her part.
No. Twas not a comedy, nor were they errors. They were manipulative hurtful decisions.
The actual sexual stuff, compared to others' stories isn't the worse scenario I've seen.
I'm sorry but I don't understand what this has to do with anything. Even if the statement had any bearing, it wouldn't apply to SWAT IMO. His WW did things with OM that she specifically wouldn't do for SWAT. Now...and if the future saw them in R, SWAT would likely not want THAT since it was for OM. What a horrible trigger.
I know I'm projecting a little here SWAT so I apologize. You are doing fine and don't beat yourself up if it isn't "settled" once and for all today. Don't give yourself a deadline. If you aren't ready to lock in your answer, don't. I mean nothing is irreversible going forward right? Well, besides cheating, so don't do anything like that.
I am sorry, but only time will tell if she has the strength and character to do this. There isn't a short cut. She might think she has it, and not. Or, the reverse. So, try to have patience. You aren't weak for watching and waiting. In fact, it may require more strength than anything you've ever done. You can do it.
I edit, therefore I am.
I just don't want you to beat yourself up if the "end" is not the outcome of your conversation. Hoping that your talk goes well and that you find some peace.
[This message edited by Restartting at 12:18 PM, June 17th (Tuesday)]
Scubadoo, thank you for your support. I'm sorry for your pain as well. You've landed in a great spot. The people here on SI are awesome and always have your back.
Well I'm off to see the wayward.