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User Topic: A bloke thing, or wayward thinking???
theseseatsRtaken
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Member # 43088
Default  Posted: 7:09 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So BW and I were having a chat the other night which led to a very very low couple of days for us as it really knocked BW for six. We discussed the topic of what goes through my mind when I see attractive women out and about.

What i described was that i have a sort of innate curiosity about most women i see. I am curious about what they look like naked and have more or less always been. I will picture it in my mind, and this often has led to some form of arousal. Not an arousal that gives me an urge to stray - my A's were not triggered that way (see profile). But just a general arousal because i am thinking of the female body and that simple idea has always turned me on. And what i explained to BW i would sometimes do with that energy that was built up, was store it, and use it at home. In a sense, save the arousal and channel it into relations with my BW.

BW's take on this is that it is unnecessary for me to be that curious about women and that it is disrespectful of me (to her) to undress them mentally and even more disrespectful still to use arousal that i have produced that way, at home with her.

Now, just to be clear, I am no longer very concerned with who is right, wrong etc. I only care about what BW feels and how i can address those feelings in an honest, genuine and attentive manner. I am here to put this out in front of you all to gain as much perspective as i can so that hopefully BW and i can successfully work through this difficult idea. I will take on ALL angles of feedback on this from waywards and betrayeds alike. So this is where my head was at when she told me her POV:

I dont choose to be curious about the female form. Its not something i have ever felt can be simply turned on and off like a light switch. I always had very limited experience as a young man and adolescent and by BW is only the second woman i have ever slept with. The first was a one time only thing! My curiosity about women has just always been there as long as i can remember and i feel a bit lacking in my control of that. The mental undressing i can control. I never used to, but i have been since dday as i have made the decision to try and make serious change in how i see and think about women in order to show to myself if noone else that i am capable of self control. But the curiosity still seems innate.

As far as bringing that energy home, i always thought it was a healthy way to deal with that as for most of our relationship I could never accept the idea of cheating. Its important for me to point out though (and i think this is a big area that BW struggles with) that when i bring that energy home its got no connection to the idea of image that created in in the first place anymore. Im not picturing that woman or anything like that, its simply pent up arousal that i have chosen to hang onto and channel into safe, powerful, faithful sex.

So what are your thoughts folks? Am i innately male? Innately delusional? Do i need a 2x4 here? Am i struggling with something normal? I thought this was all normal and healthy and now im facing a reality where this part of me ive always accepted as standard, my have been a major contributor to why i ended up straying.

All responses welcome.


Me: WH 29
Her: BW 31 (RomanticInnocenc)
Our son: 6 months
DDay#1 Jan 8, 2014, DDay#2 Jan 10, 2014
Being given the gift of attempted R
I don't PM with female members.
"Your character is who you are when no-one else is watching".

Posts: 115 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Australia
BrokenButTrying
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Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 7:23 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi TSRT,

Well done for posting this, very brave and honest.

No experience of this personally. I'm female though, it could be a guy thing but I have no idea. Hopefully some WH's will be along shortly to give some insight.

Did you see Aubrie's post on getting groceries? Very similar in terms of wayward thoughts/behaviour. It's just a bit further down the page and definitely worth reading.

[This message edited by BrokenButTrying at 7:23 AM, May 12th (Monday)]


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1235 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
rachelc
♀ Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 7:24 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it is unnecessary for me to be that curious about women and that it is disrespectful of me (to her) to undress them mentally and even more disrespectful still to use arousal that i have produced that way, at home with her.

I am a woman, and don't get the man thing, but I agree with your wife. Why on earth would you undress them mentally? What I do is notice an attractive man, cast my eyes down and be on my way, no thought other than that. Can you not do that? It DOES seem very disrespectful to your wife. I would not want to be with someone who does this.

i wish the men here would chime in. is this normal?


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

The conditions we face do not define us. They remind us of who we are and who we want to be.


Posts: 5262 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
bionicgal
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Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 8:29 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, I am female and a BS, so hopefully not doubly unhelpful!

I can see just being turned on in general by being out in the world and seeing attractive/interesting folks. I think that both men and women do this -- and of course it is proper to let it accumulate and then bring it home.

Not sure about the "undressing" part though -- that, to me, sounds like some kind of remnant from adolescence. I have heard of men who struggle with porn use doing something called "bouncing the eyes." Here is a link to info about it:
http://newlife.com/bounce-your-eyes

So, I think my main point is, it is likely normal, but maybe not the healthiest thing for you.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2058 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
Unagie
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Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 8:32 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I remember this topic being discussed before. I'll try to find the link for the discussion. To address it though I dont think its a guy thing I think it's a you thing. I can accuse my xSO of many things but never this. Did he see and acknowledge beautiful and attractive women? Yes of course he did. Did he then proceed to picture them naked and become aroused by the idea of the female form nude? Nope and yes I've asked.

This sounds like a personal issue and perhaps something to be discussed in IC. Why do you have a need to picture women nude? Why does your mind go there?


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

"To be loyal to myself is to allow myself to grow and change, and challenge who I am and what I think."


Posts: 2760 | Registered: Oct 2012
theseseatsRtaken
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Member # 43088
Default  Posted: 9:41 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rachelc:

Thank you for your reply. Mentally undressing people prior to Dday was, i think, always my way of soothing my curiosity about that which i had never fully experienced. I most certainly CAN choose not to do it, and i do choose that now. I think the idea that what you do in your mind is safe and not cheating or disrespectful is a very seductive concept and one i feel guilty of being sucked into. I am quickly learning that this is not he case and that betrayal can extend into the mind also.

Unagie:

I agree, i want to bring this up in my next IC session this week. I plan to. Your questions also happen to be the same as my own. Why do i need to picture them? Why does my mind go there?


Me: WH 29
Her: BW 31 (RomanticInnocenc)
Our son: 6 months
DDay#1 Jan 8, 2014, DDay#2 Jan 10, 2014
Being given the gift of attempted R
I don't PM with female members.
"Your character is who you are when no-one else is watching".

Posts: 115 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Australia
tired girl
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Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It would seem that when you see an attractive female your mind immediately makes that female a sexual object. Have you always done this with females? Do you only do it with certain females? You may want to examine that aspect of it.


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5068 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
badchoice
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Member # 35566
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Guy here -

I do not believe that this is something that is innately male. I think it boils down to objectification, turning people into objects for your own use. I believe it is something you can change, by changing the way to look at people and women in general.

I think it is a very subtle thing. Looking at a person and finding them ascetically pleasing is one thing, this:

I will picture it in my mind, and this often has led to some form of arousal.

is very different.

Does that make sense?


Me: fWH/BH 46

Separated transitioning to D


Posts: 730 | Registered: May 2012 | From: L.A.
MartlArts
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Default  Posted: 3:02 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Female here ~ early in our M, my H used to be the same way ~ I don't know that he actually mentally undressed females as you stated, but he used to be quite the one for turning his head to watch an attractive female walk by. It lessened through the years, probably as a combination of both emotional and physical maturing.

Yesterday morning in church (we have a casual dress code), a young woman was 2 rows in front of us wearing shorts that in my mind were a bit too short for church. She looked really cute in them, I would have to say. Whenever we stood to sing, I was watching my H's eyes out of the corner of my eye. I was pleased to note that he kept his eyes fixed on the music projected on the screen. Not sure if that was a deliberate decision on his part, or if he really didn't make note of her. But I'm fairly certain 20 or so years ago his eyes would have been popping back and forth between the screen and the young woman in the shorts.


excerpt from an awesome quote "Forgiveness - the finishing of old business that allows us to experience the present, free of contamination from the past."

Posts: 1003 | Registered: Jul 2012
Owl6118
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Member # 42806
Default  Posted: 3:10 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What i described was that i have a sort of innate curiosity about most women i see. I am curious about what they look like naked and have more or less always been. I will picture it in my mind, and this often has led to some form of arousal.

So what are your thoughts folks? Am i innately male? Innately delusional? Do i need a 2x4 here? Am i struggling with something normal? I thought this was all normal and healthy and now im facing a reality where this part of me ive always accepted as standard, my have been a major contributor to why i ended up straying.

I can't speak to normal, I imagine as with all things there is a range or distribution of behaviors.

But I suspect you are definitely on one side of the curve. I am probably over on the other.

I am a straight man with a definite immediate awareness of the women around me. Often I have seen a woman and instantly found her attractive. But it doesn't proceed reflexively to next imagining her naked or imagining sex with her. It just kinda stops at "Huh--wow, she's hot." Finis. Doesn't really continue to "I wonder what... etc" Never have.

Take it for what its worth, which is just one more data point on the curve.


Posts: 67 | Registered: Mar 2014
Actionsoverwords
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Member # 41949
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SAWH here.

While I think it is normal behavior for both men and women to look at someone attractive and have a fleeting thought, what you are describing sounds like what I do on a daily basis.

I cope with my emotions, feelings, whatever I am facing, with objectification, violence, or sex.

Have you taken a self-assessment for SA?


Me: WH, 30's
Her : BW, 30's, (determinata)
Children: An amazing son.
I am a sex addict, working on myself, and facing the wreckage of my actions.



Posts: 271 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: New York City
theseseatsRtaken
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Member # 43088
Default  Posted: 7:21 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some very confronting stuff here. Particularly from actionsoverwords. I have never considered SA because I have such limited experience. I feel a little naive suddenly. I have always sorted myself out far too often (daily, sometimes more) throughout my life. What I consider the scariest part of this is if I do have an issue with SA, it would be excruciating for my BW with whom I have always struggled to maintain a healthy sexual relationship. I wont go into detail as she is on here too. Strangley, its currently the best its ever been. A matter for her and I to discuss I guess. End of the day if thats a possibility then ill go and do what I need to to test for it. Ill bring it up In IC on Thursday. If I have any issues that could threaten R or make BW feel unsafe then ill do what I have to. I really appreciate all the advice.

[This message edited by theseseatsRtaken at 7:33 PM, May 12th (Monday)]


Me: WH 29
Her: BW 31 (RomanticInnocenc)
Our son: 6 months
DDay#1 Jan 8, 2014, DDay#2 Jan 10, 2014
Being given the gift of attempted R
I don't PM with female members.
"Your character is who you are when no-one else is watching".

Posts: 115 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Australia
Branca
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Member # 42837
Default  Posted: 8:22 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello theseatsRtaken,

I have been reading some of your posts and also your BW's. Seems like you have a fair bit in common with my situation.

I just wanted to encourage you and say I am proud of you for your humility and what seems to be a genuine willingness to seek the truth and a better way, even if it means acknowledging your current habits have to change.

I hope this will give hope to your dear BW.

I've had an interested situation lately with my WH, where I found a facebook conversation between him and a guy friend of his. They were teasing each other about their previous girlfriends (back when they were teenagers), and making jokes about what it was like having sex with them then, and wondering what it would be like now, and joking that they might like to hook up with these ladies again (these women who are now respected members of the community). They used terms that I consider disrespectful. The nature of the discussion was disrespectful to those women and also to these men's current wives. Their discussion primarily focussed on the women as sex objects and not as people with feelings and other qualities.

I have no problem with my WH reminiscing or even the odd tease about a former girlfriend, but the nature of their discussion horrified me. Because it symbolised an attitude and a lack of honour, integrity and respect that I was surprised to find in my husband. I'd thought he had more class - higher standards of behaviour.

When I first raised the issue with WH, he tried to minimise and excuse his actions as harmless. He acted like I was blowing it out of proportion, or like I just have no sense of humour. Well, for me, a joke or innuendo about hooking up with a former girlfriend is NOT funny at all because WH actually did hook up with another former flame (although, like you, he claims no sex).

He thought that because it was a private conversation and those women weren't 'listening', they'd never feel hurt and therefore it is ok. To me, this is like saying, 'I only need to have honour and integrity when someone is watching'.

He has since acknowledged that this way of talking was not really acceptable, and may even be harmful (though I think he's still struggling to see why). He is aware at some level that his behaviour wasn't in accord with his deepest values. This is connected with whatever it was in him that allowed him to cheat.

When he took that step to behave in a way that didn't accord with his deepest values (whether talking about women disrespectfully or flirting with OW), he somehow minimised it and/or excused himself so that he could ignore the contradiction.

Just thought this might be relevant for you in one way or another.

You've said 'innate curiosity'. I have innate curiosity about people in general, and if I am truthful, have probably imagined both women and men without their clothes (on the odd occasion). But this has never led to arousal. But I know guys are wired differently and for them images may have a more direct impact on arousal. Anyway, it is possible to appreciate a human being's fine physical qualities (or, indeed their character qualities) without having it link to sexual arousal. Just something for you to think about.

[This message edited by Branca at 8:25 PM, May 12th (Monday)]


Me: BW, 36
Him: WH, 36
Married 13 years
2 children aged 9 and 5

DD #1 26 August 2013 - EA on FB and phone with a former flame OW#2 for about 8 months
DD #2 30 April 2014 - EA/PA for 10 months in 2011 with OW#1
Hoping for R


Posts: 119 | Registered: Mar 2014
Branca
♀ Member
Member # 42837
Default  Posted: 8:36 PM, May 12th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BTW, I just asked WH if he ever did that 'undressing mentally' and he said no, it's not a habit he has.

He did say that occasionally, if he saw a really overweight couple on the street, he'd wonder how they make love!

His problem is more about making crude comments and jokes. Words jump out of his mouth - with friends and strangers alike, that make a sexual innuendo... and it can make people uncomfortable even though they brush it off as a joke.

But it shows that crudeness must be at the forefront of his mind for those comments to come jumping out so easily.


Me: BW, 36
Him: WH, 36
Married 13 years
2 children aged 9 and 5

DD #1 26 August 2013 - EA on FB and phone with a former flame OW#2 for about 8 months
DD #2 30 April 2014 - EA/PA for 10 months in 2011 with OW#1
Hoping for R


Posts: 119 | Registered: Mar 2014
gotmylifeback
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Member # 32693
Default  Posted: 1:43 AM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TheseseatsRtaken,
I'm glad to see that you are asking questions and wanting to know if how you think and feel is “normal.”

I don't want to sound sexist or like I am trying to stereotype people, but I think that men by nature are more visual than women. When I was married to exWW, I would notice attractive women. I noticed if they had on a short skirt or were wearing a low cut shirt. There are many women in society that will dress to gain a man's attention so it is impossible to avoid them. And there were many times before when I would take that second and third glance. I guess there was a part of me that believe in the idea that one could “look but not touch.” I never once considered crossing boundaries to be intimate with any of these women. But, I did not have sexual fantasies about them. I also thought that it was ok to look at porn as I had realistic bedroom expectations with exWW.

However, when dday hit, I saw no remorse and I quickly filed for divorce. Even though I know that her affair was not my fault, there are still times when I feel like “if only I had done _____.” One of the things that I have thought about is the fact that I could have easily focused more on exWW instead of looking at porn or looking at other women. Even though I was not “mentally undressing” them, I should have kept my eyes and mind more on the ex.

Now that I am in a new relationship, my convictions have become even stronger. My current wife was married before and she had a husband who blatantly would check out other women. And it was usually women who had a body and appearance that was completely different than hers. Knowing that this was a sensitive area for her when we began dating, I made it a point to keep my eyes more focused on her. Even when she is not around, I am not taking that second and third glance if I see an attractive woman. Porn was something that I cut out of my life before we began dating and to be honest, I don't miss it one bit.

As our relationship has progressed, I gotta say that our level of connection and intimacy is better than it ever was with the exWW or with anyone else in my past. Part of that is due to our personalities and mannerisms being more similar. But I believe that it has also been the result of me making a conscious effort to truly have eyes for only her. Even when she is not around, I still keep my blinders on. It took some getting used to, but it has been worth it.

I believe that to some degree, we as men can control our minds. My current wife is the most beautiful woman in the world to me. There will always be someone with a bigger chest, tighter body, etc. But my wife is beautiful inside and out. She appreciates me protecting my eyes and heart for her and our marriage. I know that this is a sensitive trigger for her so I don't even want it to ever be a problem in our relationship. I can control myself and it is within my power to protect her. This is not something that came natural to me. I'll be honest, it took some time and effort to change my way of thinking. But it has been more than worth it and in a way, I feel more free. I am able to focus more of me back to my wife. If I see a woman with a big chest I tell myself that my wife's chest is perfect for me (which is the truth).

I even guard my eyes and mind when watching television or movies. Again, even when my wife is not around. Victoria's secret commercials or female nudity in movies. It takes little effort to close my eyes, look away, or change the channel. Yet, my wife is very appreciative and it is a simple way to show her how much I love her. You would be amazed at how unnecessary most nude scenes are in movies.

These efforts on my end have helped to produce a new marriage that is more fulfilling and satisfying than I had with exWW. Instead of being able to be aroused by anyone, my libido now only gets turned on by my wife. And she gets my libido going like I am a teenager, except that my libido is directed only towards her. Intimacy in the bedroom has been deeper and more meaningful than I have ever experienced.

The mental undressing i can control. I never used to, but i have been since dday as i have made the decision to try and make serious change in how i see and think about women in order to show to myself if no one else that i am capable of self control. But the curiosity still seems innate.

This is a great start. Keep going. For you, it may take more time and effort; possibly with the help of a therapist. Many on SI will talk about “doing the work” to better themselves and to change the things that led to an affair. You have been given the gift of reconciliation and what better way to show your willingness to save the marriage than working on guarding your eyes and mind? This is an area that is a big trigger for her right now. Refocus your time, thoughts, and curiosity back to your BS. It will help her and it may open up the possibility of a closer, more intimate, and fulfilling relationship for you.

I know that many men would think that I am somehow denying my natural urges. That it is just a guy thing; that's how we are wired. Or they might say that my wife is just being too controlling and oversensitive. I beg to differ. For me, it has been more than worth it. And yes, it is a choice that I choose to make each day; for myself, my wife, and my marriage. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.


Her-Unremorseful, Wayward ex wife
Me-No longer a betrayed husband

Happily remarried.

"You are what you do. A man is defined by his actions, not his memory." - Kuato in Total Recall


Posts: 598 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: between Oz and Wonderland
JustWow
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Member # 19636
Default  Posted: 6:36 AM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was thinking exactly what actionsoverwords said. I am the BW of an rSAWH.

His CSAT refers to the behavior you described as scanning. Using those mental images when needed, scan, store, retrieve.

SA is an intimacy disorder. It is not, at its core, about sex, it is about using sex to medicate some other underlying issue.

And having difficulty having real, true intimacy (sexual or otherwise) with the person closest to you rings true to SA as well.

It doesn't have to be a death sentence, for goodness sake, it is a diagnosis. With a recovery program. Which is good. If this simply boiled down to a difference of opinion between you two, it is a huge one, and there mightn't be a cure for that

go to :

www.sexhelp.com

The self assessment is there, as well as a listing of Certified Sex Addiction Counselors (CSAT) there. If the assessment makes you believe this might be an issue, I cannot say enough how important it is that you receive counseling from a CSAT rather than a "regular" therapist, most are not adequately trained to deal with SA. At best it can be a waste of time and money, at worst they can help you make your problem worse.

My vote is not a bloke thing, not a wayward thing, it sounds like an SA thing to me.

[This message edited by JustWow at 6:37 AM, May 13th (Tuesday)]


BW - Reconciling

edited for typos (I always have to!)


Posts: 3630 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Midwest
sadone29
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Member # 38597
Default  Posted: 8:28 AM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SAH would undress and imagine sex with any female in the vicinity (that was desirable to him). This includes all of my friends.

But that's him! No one here can label or diagnose you. I agree that sexhelp.com is a great website if you're concerned. I hope you figure things out for you and your BW.


DDay Feb. 28, 2013
"I am pretty sure enforcing the boundary is the most important part of the boundary"- Jerry Seinfeld

Posts: 769 | Registered: Mar 2013
RippedSoul
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Member # 40055
Default  Posted: 9:29 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TSRT,

Betrayed spouse of a SLAWH (sex and love addict) here. SA, like all addictions, has a spectrum and will escalate with time. Obviously, I'm not qualified to diagnose you and am not even pretending like you might be one. I did, though, want to discuss some of the things my WH has done/said throughout his life.

Many SAs start masturbating young as a way to escape feelings of inadequacy, anger, pain, betrayal. They're seeking comfort; they're trying to fill a hole inside of themselves. By the time he made it to adulthood, when I met and married him, everything for my WH had a sexual connotation. Although we both belonged to a conservative religion, he was pretty open with the innuendo--which wasn't normal for our faith. But he'd been in the military for 4 years, so I figured he'd become less inhibited by that. I also, in my naivete, figured "all guys" as open and honest as my WH were that way. Popular culture tells us that men think about sex 24/7, so . . . If he saw an attractive woman, he'd say, "I'd 'do' her"--as if that were a compliment to her or acceptable to me.

Our whole M (until A season), my WH has almost always touched me sexually; seldom just sweetly. As much as I (luckily) have enjoyed much of our sexual relationship, I truly yearned for some sweetness. Couldn't he just come up behind me and kiss my neck? Ever? Did he have to grind me into the counter (whilst washing dishes)? For the first 15 years of our M life, we probably averaged sex once a day, yet he'd still toss out the frigid word if I just wanted to love him but be less sex-kittenish. With 4 bright, active, dynamic children each nursed for a year and two years apart from each other, I was understandably tired. And with his military deployment sched or his grad school one, I was, quite frankly, exhausted. Even so, when I'd catch him looking at or jerking off to porn, I'd feel so devalued and embarrassed and unworthy and inferior. And I can count on two hands--in 23 years--the number of times I told him "no."

Once we found out about the SA, everything clicked, but there was still more pain on the horizon for me. Learning to be transparent had him confessing things to me that maybe should have been shared with a sponsor or a therapist alone? I'm not sure I'll ever forget that he'd "masturbate inside of me." Cool. What I told myself was building intimacy in our M was reduced to that. Gee. Thanks.

Part of SA is the objectification of women. Women who are even moderately attractive are objectified. They are undressed. They are fantasized about. Their most simple gestures (bending over on a golf course to pick up a ball) are sexualized. Women who are less attractive have little to no worth because they have no sexual value. They are non-entities.

Even if "all" you do is mentally undress women and it has nothing to do with SA, it's wrong. There's no place for it. Appreciating beauty is different. I love beautiful people, objects, movies, songs, animals, views. I'd be denying myself for no reason if I stopped (or asked him to stop) appreciating the beauty in this world. But, IMO, the only person you should allow to arouse you is your BW. She--your mate--is the one who deserves the intimacy, the bonding, the love, the privilege of your attention. She and she alone.

I've tried to be honest but gentle. I've tried to convey the pain--without wallowing--involved in this disease or some related behaviors. I'm NOT trying to imply that you're bad. I hope you and your BW can find hope and happiness and healing. Your post, to me, is a very promising start.


BW: 49; SLAWH: 46; M: 23 yrs
DD#1--11/30/12 (prostitute #1)
DD#2--1/29/13 (AP, escorts #1 & #2)
DD#3--9/13 (trolling MILF site)
DD#4--10/8/13 (EA with AP cont'd)
DD: 20; DD: 18; DS: 16; DS: 14
PS: I've NEVER NOT edited my posts

Posts: 460 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: California
Actionsoverwords
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Member # 41949
Default  Posted: 9:04 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some very confronting stuff here. Particularly from actionsoverwords. I have never considered SA because I have such limited experience. I feel a little naive suddenly. I have always sorted myself out far too often (daily, sometimes more) throughout my life. What I consider the scariest part of this is if I do have an issue with SA, it would be excruciating for my BW with whom I have always struggled to maintain a healthy sexual relationship. I wont go into detail as she is on here too. Strangley, its currently the best its ever been. A matter for her and I to discuss I guess. End of the day if thats a possibility then ill go and do what I need to to test for it. Ill bring it up In IC on Thursday. If I have any issues that could threaten R or make BW feel unsafe then ill do what I have to. I really appreciate all the advice.

I apologize if I came off as confrontational. I just recognized a lot of myself in what you were saying and your rationalization for some of your behaviors.

As a prepubescent child, before I even had one sexual partner, I was already obsessed with women and girls and their bodies. Pornography and masturbation was already a regular thing in my life.

I've hid behind my addiction and childhood trauma as a lot of the reasons as to why I hurt my various partners and my wife and am still struggling to accept responsibility.


Me: WH, 30's
Her : BW, 30's, (determinata)
Children: An amazing son.
I am a sex addict, working on myself, and facing the wreckage of my actions.



Posts: 271 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: New York City
redsox13
♂ Member
Member # 43391
Default  Posted: 9:49 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I certainly look at women and on occasion I will think of what they would look naked. Not sure how unusual that is - frankly - I think not very.

What you can do is be aware of your wife and her feelings. I make it a point to never do it in a way that would be noticed by my wife - that would be disrespectful. But not looking at all - not sure I would find that possible.


BS - 45
WW - 43
In R for 5 years, still hurting but finally letting go

Posts: 262 | Registered: May 2014 | From: nh
Topic Posts: 21
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