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Wayward Side Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Eye Contact
solus sto
♀ Member
Member # 30989
Default  Posted: 7:41 PM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Back in the days when sex was had, eye contact was minimal---and it's for this reason that I draw a very distinct line between sex and intimacy. Yes, of course, sex can be intimate; I did not experience that in my marriage. (I also did not realize this for a very, very long time.)

For me? I stopped attempting to make eye contact because there was nothing to connect with. It was less painful. And yes--there was FOO stuff for me, too. (I married someone who rejected me as I always had been, it was perversely comfortable.)


BS-me, 52
WH (Trac-fone), 53, PD
2 kids-DD25, DS18
multiple d-days
DIVORCING
Alone, most strangely, I live on~Rupert Brooke

Posts: 8852 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: midwest
sosorry5454rl
♀ Member
Member # 37637
Default  Posted: 8:36 PM, May 13th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nope for me too. Interesting to learn this is so common. For me I have to assume it's due to past FOO issues as well as self conscious issues with myself. This has been a life long issue. Definite struggle for me during intimacy but also in conversation. I tend to look everywhere but at BS. He points it out often. I feel this is due to shame for what I did to him that I struggle looking him in the eyes. Thanks for sharing the thread!


WW(me) 41
BH 50 (5454real)
Married 10 years
Currently in R and plan to stay there and succeed
DD 21, DS 19, SS 22, DS 8, DGS 2

Posts: 61 | Registered: Nov 2012
heartbroken2012
♀ Member
Member # 38089
Default  Posted: 7:28 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We had a lot of eye contact during intimacy before the A. It was wonderful.

After I found out about the A, I COULDNT look at him during sex. I hardly can now (even after 19 months or so), but I am trying to look at him more....

looking at him during it....its very painful.


BS(Me) - 32
WS(HUbbie) - 40
OW - 44 (a ugly, old, white trash horse faced Coworker)
Affair was 2 months long
3 kids - 5yr old, and twins 8 months
Dday - 12/25/12 (lots of signs before I should have seen)

Posts: 551 | Registered: Jan 2013
Williesmom
♀ Member
Member # 22870
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In my last post-D relationship, he once said to me "LOOK at me when I'm fucking you". I didn't realize that I wasn't looking at him.

It progressed to the point that I couldn't look away from him. Powerful stuff.


You can stuff your sorries in a sack, mister. -George Costanza
There is a special place in hell for women who don't help other women. - Madeleine Albright

Posts: 7772 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Western PA
Sammy2013
♀ Member
Member # 41040
Default  Posted: 7:48 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS here. Before I found out about WH's SA and what he had been doing we had a lot of eye contact. We were very intimate. I haven't asked him if he did the same with his other partners. I probably don't want to know. Now, I have a hard time. Sometimes we feel close and maintain eye contact. Other times I just can't. Because if I look at him I see OW that I knew performing these things with him. So I keep my eyes closed and use the stop sign technique, etc. he knows something is wrong, asks me why I couldn't look at him. I tell him. It's getting better I guess. Last Sunday was the first time I was able to be intimate with him and it was just the two of us in my head. Major eye contact then. I'm hoping I have more times like that. Trying to stop giving OW head space. It's difficult though.


WH -37; BS (me) 38
Married 12 years, 3 kiddos
First DDay 9/13. 3 more since then (trickle truth sucks). 6 years of Prostitutes, 2 affairs in 2013, SA diagnosis now with 1 relapse so far (massage parlor with happy ending 2/14).
Waiting, observing,

Posts: 210 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: Southeast United States
knightsbff
♀ Member
Member # 36853
Default  Posted: 9:17 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wish I was normal. Wonder what being a normal person feels like. Must be nice.

I've been thinking this a lot lately. I hate not trusting my brain, my thoughts.

Back to your question though. I have read on here about eye contact during sex. I have never had it before, but I have never been able to experience intimacy before either. After d-day and much reading on SI I have tried to maintain eye contact with knight. Sometimes it has increased intimacy. I think this is something he needs to be in charge of because sometimes it's impossible if he's fighting mind movies or intrusive thoughts.

I think if I could have come to understand my brokenness without having an A and learned about my barriers to intimacy and worked with IC/MC then having eye contact would have been easier for both of us. As it is we are working on it.


FWW 40's
D-day August 27, 2012
3 kids and 2 dogs

I edit often because I make a lot of typos. ☺️


Posts: 1499 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Deep South, USA
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 9:30 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Definite struggle for me during intimacy but also in conversation.
Ah! Me too! I read your post and it clicked.

I can sit and listen to someone talk all day. I can make eye contact, listen intently, the whole bit. However, the second the conversation turns and the focus is on me, eye contact is gone. I get uncomfortable. I look past the person a lot. It's an inferiority thing. (And I know everyone in Chicago is going to be looking for this now.)

I get nervous. Maybe the listener thinks I'm stupid. Maybe they think I'm just cluelessly spouting junk. That I'm not as smart as them. That they're just being polite and listening but they aren't taking it to heart.

And I'm getting better. (I think) I can speak my mind, my heart, my convictions. May be nervous, voice may shaking, but I speak. And I think the eye contact thing is a bad habit I never connected the dots to till now.

As far as the intimacy thing, Ive got it figured out. Now I just have to figure out how to fix it.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6315 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
knightsbff
♀ Member
Member # 36853
Default  Posted: 9:56 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can sit and listen to someone talk all day. I can make eye contact, listen intently, the whole bit. However, the second the conversation turns and the focus is on me, eye contact is gone. I get uncomfortable. I look past the person a lot.
Me too. My mind almost goes blank when the focus turns to me like I don't even know the answer to questions about myself.


FWW 40's
D-day August 27, 2012
3 kids and 2 dogs

I edit often because I make a lot of typos. ☺️


Posts: 1499 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Deep South, USA
Wayflost
♀ Member
Member # 41583
Default  Posted: 10:02 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Slight t/j:

I think if I could have come to understand my brokenness without having an A and learned about my barriers to intimacy and worked with IC/MC then having eye contact would have been easier for both of us. As it is we are working on it.

This is something I feel every day.


Me: WW
Him: BH (totalheartbreak)
Both: 30s

Posts: 424 | Registered: Dec 2013
pastthelies
♀ Member
Member # 39269
Default  Posted: 10:05 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

There was definitely eye contact at the beginning and even before our kids were born then it slowed down because life took over. When my A started there was not much eye contact I felt not in love with my H and didn't want that intimacy from him then.

My AP and I had eye contact all the time - intense and intimate. Kinda makes me sick now.

It has been 15 months NC and at first I didn't make any eye contact. Now as the months go on we are both making more eye contact. I think it is a sign of intimacy and closeness. Glad I am finally getting to that point again. I was not sure I ever would.


Posts: 65 | Registered: May 2013
Owl6118
♂ Member
Member # 42806
Default  Posted: 10:07 AM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'd like to thank very much everyone who has posted--this has given me a lot of food for thought.

I have not shared my story on SI because it doesn't really fit--I am working hard on healing a marriage which has been wounded by my emotional absence due to a years-long major depression, but which has not suffered infidelity on either part. I came here because those of you who have suffered infidelity have learned so much about how relationships work, where they go off track, and how to heal them. I want to thank you for sharing your wisdom as I try to learn how to heal us and turn us away from the road that leads to worse things.

I have always seen eye contact as one of the most wonderful and intimate parts of sex. I love it. My wife, by contrast, is eyes closed. This conversation has helped me understand that this difference is a clue or signal to things I need to explore with her.


Posts: 70 | Registered: Mar 2014
abbycadabby
♀ Member
Member # 27428
Default  Posted: 7:34 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm late to this topic (as usual) but holy crap. I took some time to think about this before posting. I don't think I've EVER looked a sexual partner in the eyes during the act. I don't always close my eyes either- I can be quite visually stimulated. Other times, like over dinner or something, I see SO looking at me and I'll make eye contact while we're talking, but if he lingers too long I feel uncomfortable. I've even said, "what? why are you staring?"

Moreover, it's not just SO that I get this way with. I'm reluctant to hold eye contact for too long with anyone, except close family.

Because of things in my past and pervasive self esteem issues I have difficulty with intimacy and making myself vulnerable.

Wow. I need to work on this. Great topic.


Posts: 1272 | Registered: Feb 2010
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:21 PM, May 14th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS here.

I think this is a really interesting and oft-ignored aspect of intimacy.

I know that for me, before the affair, eye contact during intimacy was something I liked to have. It lets me know that my partner is there, present, and not thinking about something/someone else.

It's different now, but I can't quite put my finger on the difference. I actually avoid eye contact now during regular day-to-day contact...but I cannot for the life of you tell you why, other than it 'feels yucky'. Maybe I just don't want to look at her, and making eye contact is the most pure form of 'looking at her'. But 'during the act' I still want eye contact...maybe now moreso than before the affair.

It's weird.


I keep my mind on my future/and my eyes on the sky/I don't really smile much/If you were there you'd know why.

Posts: 2175 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: City in the Midwest/Best In The Whole Wide World
RightTrack
♀ Member
Member # 36976
Default  Posted: 12:01 AM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My eyes are always tightly shut. I can't (obviously) speak for my husband. I've never thought of this as an intimacy issue, it just lets me focus on the touch and my feelings. We have broken through the HB barrier; I feel like our sex life is better than it's ever been and I've never opened my eyes. This seems like a deeply personal and individual issue and I wouldn't worry about what a book says or what's "normal".

Posts: 630 | Registered: Sep 2012
Schwaina
♀ New Member
Member # 37009
Default  Posted: 1:21 AM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aubrie,

Can I suggest reading "The Passionate Marriage" by David Schnarch? This book is great in getting couples to connect through touch, hugging and eye contact (especially during sex). It also focuses significantly of the importance of differentation in relationships. Some of the concepts are terrifying for us who may be struggling with allowing emotional intimacy to develop with others but I can tell you first hand doing what he suggests really has worked well for my and my BS.


Posts: 9 | Registered: Oct 2012
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 9:12 AM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Because of things in my past and pervasive self esteem issues I have difficulty with intimacy and making myself vulnerable.
Yeppers.

I feel like our sex life is better than it's ever been
True to a point.

This seems like a deeply personal and individual issue and I wouldn't worry about what a book says or what's "normal".
If it was *just* an intimacy thing, sure. I'd chalk it up to "preference" or whatever. However lack of eye contact is an issue all across the board in my situation. And thus needs addressed. I *need* to be able to maintain eye contact in conversation. I *need* to be able to make eye contact with QS in our most intimate moments. And when I can't because there is a feeling of dread, discomfort, and downright sick to my stomach, that is an issue that needs fixed. Its not normal.

Thanks for the book recommendation Schwaina. Ill look into that.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne


Posts: 6315 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: South, Y'all!
thecosmogirl
♀ Member
Member # 39707
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've always believed eye contact during sex/intimacy is crucial. It means you are engaged in the other person. To me, it means you want to be with that person.
I used to love looking at my WH and see that he was looking back at me.
Now? Nope, not a chance I'm going to get that close. Sex, is just a physical release. There is nothing intimate or loving about it. I refuse to look at him. I refuse to kiss him during also and turn my head if he tries to kiss me. I still see him when my eyes are closed but, I see the old him, the one I fell in love with. I don't want to see the monster he is now. Funny thing is he was probably always a monster but, my mind helps me pretend he was genuine. It's still good because, duh, it's sex.


Me: BS
Him: doesn't matter anymore...or does it...

Being very, very careful

D-day 14 June 2013


I'm smart, good looking and gosh darn it, people like me!


Posts: 168 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: trying to figure it out
sosorry5454rl
♀ Member
Member # 37637
Default  Posted: 8:43 PM, May 15th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Some really good stuff in here. The self esteem, the feeling self conscious of being stared at or watched, and definitely when the topic turns to focus on me it's like I shut down completely. Great feedback and great topic. Thanks Aubrie! Didn't realize this issue was so prevalent!

[This message edited by sosorry5454rl at 9:00 PM, May 15th (Thursday)]


WW(me) 41
BH 50 (5454real)
Married 10 years
Currently in R and plan to stay there and succeed
DD 21, DS 19, SS 22, DS 8, DGS 2

Posts: 61 | Registered: Nov 2012
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 10:06 AM, May 16th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Which eye you talkin about?

Try looking at the left eye at first, if you're struggling. In most cases, it's the non-confrontational one. ie - if you look into the left eye, the one being 'looked at' subtly 'feels' less defensive.

Some make a study of eyes, and eye-movement: NLP.
I've studied it, but it's "not me" - as it is used as a manipulative tool...Tony Robbins, others. I understand there's a teevee show about this (or was?) - where a guy manipulates people using this.
Just "knowing" it's out there helps (avoid this particular manipulative tactic).

The 'right eye' is subtly more 'direct', or aggressive. It is a good thing to know when dealing with aggression - looking into the left eye of an aggressive (or even argumentative) person is a subtle "de-fuser".

When people note that my eyes are red, I just tell them; "Hey, you should see 'em from this side!"

It's Friday! Ok to bring beer in here and celebrate the great peeps in here who are dealin with healin?

I SALUT you!

See the eye? Sez "I'm goin somewhere!" "Deerectly!"



I think once eyes are turned to the task of looking within, even - or maybe especially - where it's not comfortable,
things that "are without" become easier to see.


Posts: 6653 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Jovie
♀ Member
Member # 41956
Default  Posted: 10:20 AM, May 16th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Pre- A our intimacy was lacking so I don't think we really kept eye contact at all.

More recently I had been trying to, but wasn't very consistent with it. It is somewhat uncomfortable, but I think it really increases intimacy.

This post popped into my head last night as we were being intimate (is that weird?, lol!)and I made it a point to make eye contact. It was glorious and definitely intensified the connection. I hadn't thought about the importance of it so much, but now I think it's going to be brought to the front of my mind from now on and I'll continue with it.


Me - WW, 33
Him - BH, 37
Dday - 12/16/13

Posts: 214 | Registered: Jan 2014
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