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Just Found Out Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Incoming TT
Mercilesslynuked
♂ Member
Member # 42997
Default  Posted: 6:02 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why now? I thought she had told me everything and appeared super remorseful by all accounts. Apparently I'm about to get the whole picture... She claims no new "events", but more about the inner workings of her brain which she had previously concealed beneath the veil of "IDK" and "ICR". Needless to say my mind/heart are racing and wondering what exactly I'm going to hear, exactly what there is going to be to process... I doubt I'll believe a word out of her mouth so I don't even know where to begin with this... So why now?

My plan for this is to take notes (wish I would have done this from day 1), looking for blameshifting, looking for gaslighting, looking for inconsistencies, looking for rewriting... but I honestly believe I should be looking for more. Any tips?


Never apologize for having high standards. People who really want to be in your life will rise up to meet them.

D-day 1/6/2014-1/23/2014


Posts: 174 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Colorado
tfkeel
♂ Member
Member # 19517
Default  Posted: 6:07 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Don't worry.... you already get it. More TT. That's all.

Posts: 587 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Pennsylvania
Owl6118
♂ Member
Member # 42806
Default  Posted: 6:15 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Maybe it will be worth it to hear her out as neutrally as you can.

It seems she is sincerely struggling with a lack of affect and blunting of feeling to a degree that indicates real clinical psychological distress. She is only just now starting to understand that she is is, and long has been, profoundly emotionally impaired. This dawning understanding seems to cause her great distress.

It is possible that that is what she wants to share with you. Perhaps she is coming to you for help.


Posts: 95 | Registered: Mar 2014
justinpaintoday
♂ Member
Member # 42858
Default  Posted: 6:19 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would have her write a detailed timeline so u can process sequentially as needed.


I never realized you could be in this much pain and not be dying.

Posts: 700 | Registered: Mar 2014
craig2001
♂ Member
Member # 55
Default  Posted: 6:23 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It is really hard to understand the mind of the WW.

It could be things she just remembered, actual emotional or physical details.

What she has to tell you might not seem very important to you at all, but these things are very important to her. If they are not important to you, don't discount them or make her feel guilty for telling you what she needs to.

Write them down by all means, even have her agree to what you write down so there are no misunderstandings later on about what was said and admitted to.

Dont blow up or threaten either at what she tells you, that could stop her from ever telling anything else.


Posts: 4298 | Registered: Jun 2002
Raspberry
♀ Member
Member # 42853
Angry  Posted: 7:09 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Is she volunteering this information?

Posts: 195 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: Raspberry
Skan
♀ Member
Member # 35812
Default  Posted: 7:11 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Try, as hard as you can, to be unreactive. If you become reactive, she may quit talking. Use short, non-commential phrases to encourage her to keep talking, "Uh-huh," "and then???" "what came next?" just encouraging little things to keep encouraging her to talk. If you can hold it together, at the end, simply ask if there's anything else that she needs to tell you. And then take a few days to process before you do anything else.

Hang in there. Stay strong!


Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012



Posts: 5100 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California
Mercilesslynuked
♂ Member
Member # 42997
Default  Posted: 7:27 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She is indeed volunteering these details... She did this once before and it was probably the most vile thing I could have imagined and also never thought to ask and I handled that one calmly. No blowing up, no berating, no threatening, so I am not worried about my reaction per say. I know I'll need to introspect significantly afterwards but I also know her bravery should be commended and not belittled. In the end it is the fact that she had an A that makes it bad, the details don't really change that. The action of honesty does change things though. Here's to hoping it's not too bad!


Never apologize for having high standards. People who really want to be in your life will rise up to meet them.

D-day 1/6/2014-1/23/2014


Posts: 174 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Colorado
broken1126
♀ New Member
Member # 43417
Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

@skan, like your advice. Sometimes easier said than done. I'm still waiting for TT. My DDay- 4/4/14. Found WH secret email/planning anonymous encounters + what seemed to be an EA. He won't volunteer any info and I'm trying to follow 180.
So confused and frustrated.


DDay 4/4/14
Me - BS (40)
WH - (41)
Married 11 yrs.
Two boys 8 and 10 yrs.

An arrow can only be shot by pulling it backward. When life is dragging you back with difficulties, it means it's going to launch you into something great


Posts: 18 | Registered: May 2014
SpecialK
♀ Member
Member # 42372
Default  Posted: 10:21 PM, May 27th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Can you record her? I know I don't remember a lot of what my husband told me during the "enlightening" period and wish I had. It's funny (not) how his memory of what he said and mine are so different now.

I am sorry for all of us that have suffered through the TT saga. It's almost like they enjoy twisting the knife a little at a time. No wonder it takes so long to move past this.....


Posts: 364 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Florida
Mercilesslynuked
♂ Member
Member # 42997
Default  Posted: 8:53 AM, May 28th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, that was somewhat anticlimactic; there were a few new bits about how she felt at the time, what her thought process was but nothing much that took me by surprise. This could be because I'm rapidly reaching indifference towards this which suppose is akin to acceptance; maybe I'm just the king of self delusion. The major new details were that he didn't want to take it physical and she pushed and pushed for that first kiss, from there he lost his fortitude to say no.

The one that really changed things though was the day of the ONS, she went to her friends house which I knew and her friend who is super naive talked her into ending it before it went too far which I already knew and we all know how well that worked out. Of course WGF minimized it and did not give full details so the friend wasn't able to give full advice, but she was convinced that it was going to end. Here's the stickler for me, her friend has been cheated on and is genuinely the sweetest and most honorable girl and quite honestly the most naive person I've ever met; best of intentions always. Yet she still watched her put makeup on and get ready knowing she was going over there to "end it". I am 100% that there was no ill intent, no covering, no conspiring, no knowledge and no approval for what was about to occur. So where does that leave this friend? Has this crossed the boundary of being a non friend of the relationship? I'd genuinely be sad to lose this person from my life.

Lastly, our interaction last night made me realize how far from R we really are. She literally does everything that is demanded of WS's from the start, the NC, the IC, the transparency, the prioritizing me, the radical honesty, etc etc etc. However when we were going through it she didn't want to, said it was hard and she just wanted to give up. Her timeline was for lack of a better statement highly incomplete and demonstrated very little effort on this. The major events were mostly there but none of the supplementary details of thought processes, emotions, justifications, etc. She is afraid to work on it and I believe afraid to fully face the monster within. Her lack of desire to talk about it was concerning even if she did talk the evening away in the end.

I guess I need to decide what R looks like; I know I'll need acceptance which is mostly there, and a willingness to be vulnerable which is almost exclusively not there. Beyond that though I haven't really outlined my needs, worth exploring in IC today for sure. It is concerning how far down the road I am, and I don't really see the same effort to move out of infidelity from her that I have given, shouldn't the roles be reversed? Maybe not, I have no choice but to plow through this headfirst as it was thrust upon me, but it feels like she would be fine with rugsweeping the A and purely working on herself and her known issues which isn't what I need. The chasm between us on this facet grows daily as proven by last night and while I am strong, I know I don't have the strength or desire to drag her through this piece by piece, it is not my job and it is not fair to me; she needs to fix her own shit as that is the only way it will stick. Much to consider.


Never apologize for having high standards. People who really want to be in your life will rise up to meet them.

D-day 1/6/2014-1/23/2014


Posts: 174 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Colorado
Owl6118
♂ Member
Member # 42806
Default  Posted: 9:44 AM, May 28th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MN, first of all, I want to say that your own posts as well as hers show you to be a man of character and compassion. I admire you and wish you all good things.

Her timeline was for lack of a better statement highly incomplete and demonstrated very little effort on this. The major events were mostly there but none of the supplementary details of thought processes, emotions, justifications, etc. She is afraid to work on it and I believe afraid to fully face the monster within.

I am not a psychologist by any means. But from what I have read, as a layperson, I suspect that your WGF is way off on the end of the bell curve of waywards. In her I think I see a degree of psychological damage that is qualatatively something different than the normal broken waywards seem to find if they do the work to examine themselves.

I think your sentence above--"The major events were mostly there but none of the supplementary details of thought processes, emotions, justifications, etc."--is getting close to the heart of the matter. But I think it is not obstinacy or denial that is keeping her from being able to explain the emotions. I think she is finding she literally has huge gaps in her basic ability to feel. If so, this is a clinical issue of major proportions. She will need sustained professional help to get herself to recover a functioning range of emotional response. And the hard truth is that may delay her ability to give you an important part of what you need.

On the other hand, she is aware of this, and it is causing her distress. She clearly wants to do everything she can for you, and she is very upset that her damage is standing in the way of her helping you. She is trying to use her intellect, which is functioning, to provide everything she can--hence the sustained commitment to the transparency and other good actions. But I think she is in a place where she can rely on her intellect/choice/will to show you her love more than she can rely on her heavily damaged sense of empathy to give you emotional healing.

BUT--she is struggling toward you as hard as she can.


I guess I need to decide what R looks like; I know I'll need acceptance which is mostly there, and a willingness to be vulnerable which is almost exclusively not there.

This seems like the right response--respect and openness to what she can give, which is change through changed behavior, and caution about giving vulnerability, which may not be safe to give unless she can get a good diagnoses for her emotional impairment and get sustained help.


Beyond that though I haven't really outlined my needs, worth exploring in IC today for sure. It is concerning how far down the road I am, and I don't really see the same effort to move out of infidelity from her that I have given, shouldn't the roles be reversed?

Again, I think she is making every effort, but that she is blocked by her damage. She really is trying, but she really is a very damaged person. One very hard question for you may be--can her change in behavior be enough of a gift of love from her to you for you to be able to wait out her healing to the point when she can give you more.


Maybe not, I have no choice but to plow through this headfirst as it was thrust upon me, but it feels like she would be fine with rugsweeping the A and purely working on herself and her known issues which isn't what I need.

And right there is the crux of your dilemma. It's not that she wants to rugsweep exactly, its that she can't help you much more until she gets herself back to having even a working approximation of a full emotional range. And I suspect that this is caused by deep trauma that will not be reversed overnight.

I really feel for you--this is brutally hard.

The chasm between us on this facet grows daily as proven by last night and while I am strong, I know I don't have the strength or desire to drag her through this piece by piece, it is not my job and it is not fair to me; she needs to fix her own shit as that is the only way it will stick. Much to consider.

No, it is not fair.

It seems to me that at the end of the day you are being asked to do something almost inhuman. That is--to hold off you own hurt while you help the person who has hurt you heal. My God, that's a cruel thing to ask. And worse, there is no guarantee that even with all your love and support she can fix herself enough to be the partner you need and get you the healing you need.

But I think you two may not have any other road forward together. It sucks, but the next step may rest on you, and what choice you make about this awful dilemma.

All I can say is that I for one believe she does love you, and I believe she does want to get better. But this is the hard real world, and I do not know if that is enough.


Posts: 95 | Registered: Mar 2014
Topic Posts: 12

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