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Newest Member: TryingToReform (45458)

Just Found Out Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Weak vs. Selfish
Hope20
♀ New Member
Member # 43643
Default  Posted: 8:14 AM, June 6th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

While this is my first post, I have lurked for a few months. I found out about my husband's affair (EA and PA) with a coworker about 7 months ago. Like everyone, I never thought it would happen, we were "that couple", blah blah blah.... yet here we are. After lurking, I understand how lucky I am in comparison. The affair was over before I found out. He will do anything to repair our relationship but understands that may not be possible. We have moved. The OW is out of the picture. (Sadly, I knew her, and I always knew she was broken so I am glad to be away from that.) We have been in MC and he has started IC. He is certainly trying. We haven't told anyone. I have read anyting I could get my hands which has helped. We don't want to tell people mostly because I do not want it to get back to our young children, although he is open to whatever I decide in that regard. For the most part, I think I have done okay. That said, I still cry most days.

My current struggle now, however, has prompted me to register and post. I can see the issues that built up to this- I don't think they are an excuse, but I can "see" them. I am trying hard to accept was has happened, and I know his whys may never be enough for me. But I cannot help but waffle between the fact that he is either incredibly selfish, or incredibly weak or both. (and yes I know every WS is probably both to do this!) What I think I mean by this is not just being selfish or weak in the moment, but one or both of those things as part of his core character. If he is "just" weak, I worry we may be here again down the road, although that isn't even my primary concern. I worry about his ability to help now me recover from his decisions. When he is struggling, I do not feel like I can talk to him as it may push him over the edge. But, since no one else knows, that leaves me alone. While I didn't mention this directly in MC, she thinks I need to give him the opportunity to step up and do what is needed. I think that sometimes he can, but not always. I feel like when I get the most emotional, he becomes less able to handle it. Not only does his potential weakness worry me about being able to help me heal, and his future decision making, it changes how I see him. Is he just a weak person?

Do others feel this way? Any suggestions? It is just so hard to piece this puzzle together.


Me - BS (40s)
Him - WS (40s)
Married 14 yrs

Posts: 14 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: northeast
norabird
♀ Member
Member # 42092
Default  Posted: 9:16 AM, June 6th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((Hope20))))

It's hard when you suddenly see that the person you love is deeply flawed in a way that may make them permanently unsafe, no matter how much you love them and how much they may even love you back. The one thing I will say is to not let your fear of overwhelming him and his poor coping mechanism place your won needs for healing in the backseat. He has got to step up. If he can't let you speak about your pain, if you feel you can't burden him, then that's deeply unfair to you. It is not okay for you to walk on eggshells about what you say although of course there are constructive and unconstructive ways for talking about triggers, anger, etc. I agree with your MC--you have to stop trying to handle your own pain alone and to make him bear some (most) of that burden for you. If he can't step up to do that, well, it's very sad but it's better you know, because he's not going to be a good risk if he can't and it's important you find that out.

I am sorry you are here but welcome to the best club you never wanted to join. Please stay and get as much support as you need on this difficult road. We are here for you.


Sit. Feast on your life.

Posts: 4196 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: NYC
Merida
♀ Member
Member # 42437
Default  Posted: 9:42 AM, June 6th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nora hit the nail bang on

read and re-read until it really sinks in

you cannot "nice" him back

read everything in the healing library

I am totally on board with he has to step up and embrace the gift you give him if you allow for the possibility to reconcile = he has to be able to be "pushed over the edge" if you said he "will do anything to repair"

my WH and I were lucky - we had a retrouvaille session only 5 mos from him revealing what a mess he created in 2008 - so now we are attending post sessions and it has been very helpful about how to have more constructive than unconstructive conversations so I would suggest anything and everything that gives you better communication tools.

I relate to you when you say you get emotional. I also got Gottman's book "the seven principles for making marriage work." Good points about "the four horseman" and styles of arguing...

so as we've gotten a better grasp on things like "the masks we wear" and understanding how our personality styles sometimes clash, it's allowed us to focus on how we want to change and now we have exercises to do that work together and apart.

One day at a time - you chose your name for a reason so hang in there as regardless of the outcome of the M, you will become a better person so look forward to working on that improvement

I know that is what motivates me, I want to be my best self so glad I got the wake-up call

[This message edited by Merida at 9:46 AM, June 6th (Friday)]


"The Will of God will never take you where the Grace of God will not protect you."

WH is katumus and I am not reading his posts but we talk a lot and working on listening better!

BW 45
WH 46

married 17 years
3 kids


Posts: 213 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Maryland
tfkeel
♂ Member
Member # 19517
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, June 6th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's hard when you suddenly see that the person you love is deeply flawed in a way that may make them permanently unsafe

Yep. And, no matter how much you love him/her, your only INTELLIGENT response is to protect yourself.

Because, you KNOW with your brain, even though your heart wants it to be different, that this person is going to CONTINUE to hurt you if you allow yourself to become vulnerable.

My WW would not "embrace the gift". Because, deep inside, she wanted to REMAIN as she was, and to use my looks, my earning power, my anatomy, my physique, and my "lack of attention" as her EXCUSE for cheating.

But basically, the problem was she just WANTED to cheat. She was "hooked" on the thrill, the conquest, the clandestine meetings, etc.

[This message edited by tfkeel at 9:49 AM, June 6th (Friday)]


Posts: 540 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Pennsylvania
Hope20
♀ New Member
Member # 43643
Default  Posted: 9:31 AM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all for the perspective. I know this is an opportunity for me to look at how things are and how they could be. I see things in myself that I want to address, including how easy I make things for my family. I know I am in good company here, as I see it mentioned often. At the same time, I really do like how I am most of the time and I don't want his behavior to change me. I know that is unrealistic, so I need to find some kind of balance. I don't really know how to do that. Any suggestions?

He is clearly struggling. His work has suffered. I balance my needs with the fact that if he lost his job, our situation would be much worse. With your encouragement, I have put more on him, and so far he has responded. It is still early. The jury is still out. I really don't want to see him as weak. I want this to be the time he truly steps up. Then again, I didn't WANT any of this!


Me - BS (40s)
Him - WS (40s)
Married 14 yrs

Posts: 14 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: northeast
OK now
♀ Member
Member # 14459
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Isn't the word weak just a euphemism for selfish? He is concentrating on his own needs, what he wants and dismisses the morality of the situation, or the pain you will feel if you find out. Me, me, me.

Getting her pregnant, getting emotionally involved, picking up a STD are all dismissed as minor impediments in front of the steamroller of his selfish desires.

Can't see where weak fits in. Maybe he just can't deny himself anything he really wants, even if he dumps all over his marriage.


Posts: 1748 | Registered: May 2007 | From: NC
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 10:19 AM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

When he is struggling, I do not feel like I can talk to him as it may push him over the edge. But, since no one else knows, that leaves me alone. While I didn't mention this directly in MC, she thinks I need to give him the opportunity to step up and do what is needed. I think that sometimes he can, but not always. I feel like when I get the most emotional, he becomes less able to handle it. Not only does his potential weakness worry me about being able to help me heal, and his future decision making, it changes how I see him. Is he just a weak person?

IMO, WS's aren't weak. Yes, they have issues, everyone does, but they aren't weak. Let me explain. My STBXWW had a 3 yr LTA with a coworker. After Dday she suddenly became this delicate flower complaining about how hard things were and life is tough. My WW was unremoresful. After I got myself together I realized soemthing. My WW was in fact not weak at all. It takes a very strong willed person to successfully lead a double life for so long. She was meticulous in her planning of the A. When they met, where they met, her excuses that I bought, the gaslighting. She had no problem leading a double life and lying to me for years. Now all of a sudden she's a delicate flower and life is hard because she got caught. I called bullshit on her.

Where was all this guilt, sadness, pain, and lack of energy when she was in the A. She could plan and pull jedi level mindfuckery out of her ass during the A. STBXWW, where are you going, it's 11:00pm on a Friday night. The kids are in bed and your going out? 7yrs, these are not the droids you are looking for now go to sleep while I go fuck OM. Consistent lie after lie to my face and going about life like nothing is wrong but after Dday she has a tough time doing the simple things like provide transparency, go to counseling, go NC and, own her shit.

Granted it is tough for a WS but they were strong during the A so don't fall for the weak bullshit once they are busted. R is hard work. The WS should be carrying their own load and you should NOT be walking on eggshells. He chose to have the A now he can be man enough to deal with the consequences.

Your WH is not weak. He just needs to man up and resolve his issues. Yes individuals are different but there are many WS's that come to this site and man or woman up and do the work needed to fix this shit. Yes it's hard but guess what they are working their asses off to fix what they broke. Anything less than 100% effort is a copout by your WS. He put 100% into the A didn't he, but somehow can't figure out how to put 100% into R? Call bullshit on him and hold him accoutable for owning and fixing his shit. Of course that is just my 2 cents. Take what applies and leave the rest. I agree with your MC. He needs to step up and do the work. He should be pulling his own weight in R. I wish you the best.

[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 10:23 AM, June 11th (Wednesday)]


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1914 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
BrokenheartedUK
♀ Member
Member # 43520
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, Hope20 and welcome. Yes, it's no choice between your WH being incredibly weak or incredibly selfish or frankly, both. But, I suspect that it's also something along the lines of a "breakdown" kind of thing when people act in such a bizarrely uncharacteristic way. It's good that he's agreed to go into IC.

While it is important in the reconciliation part of this that he is there to support you, the main person to support you is you. Are you also in IC? You could use a little professional boost at this point. At the end of the day, he can never walk down the lonely road to recovery that you and you alone have to endure. There is no getting around that fact unfortunately.

You do you.

Hugs.


Dday: 4th of January, 2014
WH 50
BS 49
18 years of marriage...three children
One affair PA/EA
"You didn't see me I was falling apart, I was a television version of a person with a broken heart." The National

Posts: 250 | Registered: May 2014
Hope20
♀ New Member
Member # 43643
Default  Posted: 11:55 AM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all. I was so scared to post anything. I just didn't know what to expect. Your perspectives are so helpful.

It is hard to recognize the behavior was so many things, including selfish and weak, as well and intentional. As was said, there was a lot of effort put in to the A and there should be much more put in to fixing it. I have to acknowledge he is "deeply flawed" as norabird said. That is hard. I clearly did not know him or what he could do. I don't recognize who this person has become.

I don't know if he can be strong enough to help me heal. I hope so, but I also see how broken he is. I just don't trust my own judgement anymore to know anything for sure. Through this, I have remembered how strong I am and I know I will get through this. That said, I don't want to do this on my own. I WANT him to step up. I am afraid he won't.

I am not in IC yet. I am hopeful though. It would be nice to feel a little less lonely on this journey. I do like our MC.


Me - BS (40s)
Him - WS (40s)
Married 14 yrs

Posts: 14 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: northeast
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know if he can be strong enough to help me heal. I hope so, but I also see how broken he is. I just don't trust my own judgement anymore to know anything for sure.
He may or may not be able to assist in your healing. The thing is you WILL heal though. There are things he can do to assist but ultimately your healing comes down to the decisions and choices you make as you work through things. I and many others are prime examples of people that really wanted our WS's to help us heal but in my case WW couldn't do it. I was forced to figure out how to work through this on my own. Well not completely alone because I had SI but I focused on me and what I needed. It may not seem like it now but you will make it through this as well. Whether your WH does the work to make it out the other side with you remains to be seen.

While he figures out how to work on him I would encourage you to focus on you. IC helps alot but if it's not an option then please post away. It really does help. Post as often or as little as you need. This place really is great for helping you through. I wish you the best and I hope your WH can step up and do what he needs to do to fix himself and help you build a new M if that is what you choose to do.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1914 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
Gotmegood
♀ Member
Member # 41407
Default  Posted: 4:39 PM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey Hope- If I may interject this thought: perhaps you aren't struggling so much with 'is he a selfish person or a weak person' , but perhaps you are wondering who the fuck is this man? This man you thought you knew as well as you know yourself. We all, as adults, have accepted the fact that crappy, unfair stuff happens every day to innocent people. You certainly never expected that HE would be the perpetrator of this immense pain you feel. That HE could behave so callously with your love, your trust and your feelings. Whether he did it out of tremendous selfishness or weakness is, in my opinion, trivial. It is only important that HE find out why and how it came to be that he acted out in that way.
Further, I would caution you not to worry so much about 'pushing him over the edge'. Look, you've got a lot to go through, with or without his help. Focus on you. My guess is that Mr Weak or Mr Selfish hasn't been putting you first for a while; certainly not while he was plotting, lying and deceiving with his A. You are number 1 now. You deserve to have all of the focus on your needs at this time, and that begins by your deciding that you are deserving of it. IC for you honey. It's a gift to yourself. I hope he mans up for you, but with or without him you get healthy and whole again. Don't baby him.


Me: faithful wife 62.
Him: WH 64 , prostitute 20 yr old
DDay: 8-13-2013
Status: boinging up and down like a yo-yo

Posts: 499 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Florida
4everfaithful83
♀ Member
Member # 41761
Default  Posted: 7:28 PM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WOW - NoraBird you never disappoint! Couldn't have said it better myself!

Sending you strength tonight. You are not alone.


Always know if the juice is worth the squeeze...

ME: 31
WBF: 27
Together 7 years
1 doggie
DDay: June 24, 2013
IN R...


Posts: 565 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: Pennsylvania
1Faith
♀ Member
Member # 38975
Wink  Posted: 7:46 PM, June 11th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

R is hard work. The WS should be carrying their own load and you should NOT be walking on eggshells. He chose to have the A now he can be man enough to deal with the consequences.

7 years is spot on. Your WH invested a whole lot of time and energy into his affair, into his lies. Time to man up and face the music. The good days (whew for him...things are going well) to the bad days (yikes...she is still really pissed (as you should be)). Sorry...no road map for you here buddy because I certainly didn't get one.

Your WH's ability to take it all in and understand and empathize where it is coming from will be the key in your moving forward. Consistency. No wavering.

Many of us, the BS, try to "fix" things and don't want to rock the boat by sharing our true feelings. "let's put the ugliness behind us".
So we stuff our feelings down to try to fast track our healing and our way back to "normal" and "safe".

In reality by ignoring our feelings we are only prolonging the inevitable.

We have to feel it all. The good, the bad, the really ugly in order to process the truth and ugliness of THEIR infidelity. It is like a infidelity cleanse. You have to get it out in order to feel better. It is like having the flu...once you get it out...you can start to feel better.

The weak timid response from the WS is, IMO, sometimes a conscious or unconscious decision to manipulate. "whoa is me...feel sorry for me...look how sad I am...I'm trying and don't know what to do.."

Be aware but be true to yourself right now.

You deserved to be heard. For you WH to understand how YOU feel now.

Be strong and know that you and your feelings matter.

Good luck. Stand tall.

[This message edited by 1Faith at 7:49 PM, June 11th (Wednesday)]


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1224 | Registered: Apr 2013
Hope20
♀ New Member
Member # 43643
Default  Posted: 9:06 AM, June 13th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Since you were all so kind to share your thoughts, I thought you might want to know I took some time to write out some of my thoughts for WS. I gave him the letter last night. It was about as harsh as I have been - I was brutally honest. It basically highlighted where I thought he was falling short. I know he believes he is working hard, but I wanted him to understand how much more I really needed him to step up. We will see what he does with it, but we had a great (although emotional) conversation about it. We discussed being a priority and how selfish the behavior has been even leading up to the A. Only time will tell, but my sense is we really made some progress.

The best news to report, however, is how much better I feel this morning! I feel "lighter." It felt good to really think about what I needed right now without censoring myself. At this point, I will take those good moments when they come. So thank you all for the nudge.


Me - BS (40s)
Him - WS (40s)
Married 14 yrs

Posts: 14 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: northeast
BrokenheartedUK
♀ Member
Member # 43520
Default  Posted: 12:00 PM, June 13th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You go girl. Enjoy the good moments when you can.


Dday: 4th of January, 2014
WH 50
BS 49
18 years of marriage...three children
One affair PA/EA
"You didn't see me I was falling apart, I was a television version of a person with a broken heart." The National

Posts: 250 | Registered: May 2014
Topic Posts: 15

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