SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I go through all the ways I'm supposed to handle this bullsh*t I've been served up and asked to swallow - I go to IC, MC, I adhere to the rules of engagement, I try to stay positive about the future...

But the pain of WH's deceit still drags me down that dark hole.

I often find myself settling on this thought:

the ONLY WAY I will ever feel like things are fair is to do what WH did.

I want to experience what WH did. The excitement, the cheeky, flirty secrets kept between another man and myself, the ESCAPE from this life for just those stolen minutes...

I know this is totally stupid. I'm NOT sneaky and I'm NOT a liar, so I could never do it.

But I truly am stuck on this idea - I don't see how else to make things FAIR. For him and for me.

-He would get to feel the utter devastation he caused me, which he completely deserves and which he is still completely clueless about.

-I would get to feel the excitement of having an affair - a titillating secret just for myself - just for the sake of boosting my fragile ego (fragile thanks to WH).

And I would get the satisfaction of knowing that WH and I would then be EVEN. I often picture myself facing my WH if he ever found out I had an affair, and I KNOW I would feel zero remorse, because any affair I had would be a direct result of what WH put me through. "If you wanted me to stay faithful, YOU should have stayed faithful. This is only happening because of you, so suck it up."

I have ALWAYS said to my H over the years (before and during his affairs, when I had no idea how deeply these words should have struck him): "Don't forget - whatever YOU get to do, I get to do, so choose wisely, honey..." Interestingly, he doesn't recall me saying that now that he's been found out...

The thing that makes me feel like a trapped animal getting beaten daily is that I know it would solve nothing. I know it wouldn't be real - I would only be doing it to make up for what he did.

The truth is, I only want one guy, and that guy turned out to be a sh*tty, selfish person who gets to skip through life doing whatever he wants and will NEVER, EVER know the forever pain his choices caused me, and who will have gotten away with stealing something from our marriage which cannot ever be replaced - even if I got to do the same shady, selfish stuff he did so we could be "even".

Sigh.

Things will never be even, will they? He got away with years of selfishness and deceit and now he gets to still have a faithful, honest person standing by his side.

The inequity just takes my breath away sometimes...

I hate this life he chose for me.

No. It would become a competition of who hurts the most... And a cycle of revenge... You'd just take turns hurting each other... Fighting over whose pain is more profound... Trust me, I am watching this with my sister and BIL. It's not fun. Not for them, or anyone who has to be around them.

(tigrislilium),

I wanted to do the same thing too in a way but not for the reason to hurt but to free myself and for validation.

Problem is if we do that, then we are no better than those who hurt us. In reality, what you really want is Justice. Adultery is one of those debatable things where you can say there is never justice served or someone get's hit by the Karma bus.

Either way, the best thing for you is to walk away from this thought all together. Talk about it and get it out, so you don't act on it.

"This is war, and the battlefield is never even." -LS

Praying for you.

I'd be lying if I said I haven't felt the same. My WH had much more sexual experience than I did when we met, and now he can add the infidelities to that list. It sucks.

Here's the thing- even if you did it, you still wount be 'even' because he did it first. He did it because he wanted to. You would be copy-catting, and yours wouldn't have the same excitement/escape because it wouldn't be for excitement and escape for you, it would be payback.

Life isn't fair, but some things that are even across the board: we all have to live with the choices we have made. He got to have new and exciting and strange. The dividend on that is shame, remorse, hurting the one you love, and forever wondering if the other shoe is about to drop. You get to look yourself in the mirror and not want to vomit. You get to keep things sacred in your life that should be sacred. You get to walk the talk and know that you have been true to yourself. Yes, your WH gets the benefit of that, but you should chose not to have an A because you're not the kind of woman that participates in As, not because your WH earned it (you're right- he didn't).

I think it is a logical progression for most BS's to have the same thoughts of a RA at least pass through their minds at some point. I certainly thought about it myself. But I could never go through with it myself either. One of the hardest things to deal with in all of this is the feeling that there is no justice. It definitely is not fair. I have decided to draw a line in the sand and work for the future and try to leave all the negative thoughts in my past. But I have an extremely remorseful WW that has done her work and realizes that she made the mistake of her life. She realizes and is thankful that I gave her a second chance and also knows that there will not be another strike or its over with no questions asked. I am sure it would be much more difficult with someone who is not remorseful or a repeat offender.

He would get to feel the utter devastation he caused me, which he completely deserves and which he is still completely clueless about.

My IC told me this is a normal feeling to have.

Also, needing the validation of having their ego fed after the total destruction of one's self esteem after learning of an affair of a once trusted spouse.

I have heard people on some forums claim that the spouse having a revenge affair, finally woke them up and put them on the right remorseful path. A path that would mend the pain.

The thing from my perspective is that since the wayward is sort of expecting a revenge affair, the discovery of an affair won't blindside them, and thus won't really hurt them the same way.

So to my mind to have a revenge affair won't help much to achieve the end of showing the wayward how it feels to be blindsided by an affair.

But having an affair because you want to feel the same exictement of sex with someone knew or you need the ego validation or to feel equal in the marriage once again.

I don't know, I think it could help the marriage.

After all, the faster you heal, the faster the marriage heals.

Also, I am astounded to hear SOME people insist that an affair IMPROVED their marriage

Seems counter productive to me. Counseling is the way to improve a flagging marriage, not an affair.

But some insist it saved their marriage.

So who knows, maybe if the faithful spouse has an affair that will improve the marriage even more than if only one person gets the ego strokes of an affair.

I wish there were some studies to provide some more information.

In the end, though, my husband's affair did not improve my marriage. So that claim does not apply to me.

I don't see how else to make things FAIR. For him and for me.

Honey, who ever told you life is supposed to be fair was selling you a lie. There is no "getting even." It just doesn't work that way.

Spend some time reading the Madhatter's thread in the I Can Relate forum for a glimpse behind that curtain. It's not pretty. It's not fair. It's just digging that dark hole deeper and deeper.

(((((tigrislilium)))))

So then in addition to your being eviscerated by his A, you get to be devastated by the wreckage of your own behaviors. Not sure how that's appealing or would help you in any fashion. Seeing a RA as an option is a distortion when you feel desperate for more control. Glad you know enough not to do it. Sorry for the pain that drives you to think about this.

I don't understand the term Revenge Affair. Sounds like a fancy label for "Affair" to me. Adding the word Revenge doesn't protect you from STD's, unseen collateral damage, or unexpected consequences. The word Revenge isn't a shield.

Like Tred says

I don't understand the term Revenge Affair. Sounds like a fancy label for "Affair" to me. Adding the word Revenge doesn't protect you from STD's, unseen collateral damage, or unexpected consequences. The word Revenge isn't a shield

Here's my advice. It's a little unconventional, but as always, take what you need and leave the rest.

Indulge your fantasy. Don't have an actual RA because that has horrible, ugly, messy consequences that you really don't need or want right now. Have a fantasy RA.

Tell your WH you need time alone to heal yourself. If he complains, shrug and tell him you're doing it anyway. Then draw yourself a nice warm bubble bath, or lock yourself in your bedroom with your favorite music, whatever helps you relax. Then let your thoughts run wild. Don't censor yourself, this doesn't have to be a realistic scenario because it's not real. And it can't be embarrassing because no one will ever know about it but you. Get into it, feel the passion, feel the ego boost, let yourself feel good.

Do this as many times as you need to, and don't feel guilty. In time, you'll get to a place in your healing where you won't need or want this fantasy anymore. But right now, your reality is painful. Give yourself a small break from it that won't cost you your dignity.

Something no one talks about around here....the "hall pass". It might be something that those who are considering a RA would consider instead.

I have told my H that if there is ever anyone I am really interested in getting with, that I will redeem my "hall pass". I would NOT be cheating, therefore I will not be compromising MY integrity. I would do this in a small way to make him have the mind movies and insecurities for a change. But the bigger part would be to have fun, excitement, and validation for myself. After the devastation of my self esteem and the humiliation I have felt...I feel like I can be a little selfish too!

It would only be a ONS with no further personal contact as that is what he did. If he had had 3 ONS, I would get 3. If he had had a long term affair, I would have hall passes whenever I want--without emotional connection as that is NOT something I would want or think is healthy for a marriage.

Having said this....I probably will never ACT on my hall pass, but I like the justice it provides me to have it.

Don't forget - whatever YOU get to do, I get to do, so choose wisely, honey

I think you need to ask yourself why it's ok to justify YOUR actions based on what someone else does. Do you have your own values? why base them on someone else's simply to get even. There is no even in pain. Believe me, i'm there. My husband had two affairs after mine. He degraded himself and went against his own values because he needed validation. As much as it hurts me, he can't forgive himself.

If you do it simply to prove a point, is that really the kind of person you want to be? What's your greater need? To make someone else feel the exact same pain you're feeling? Or, is it something else?

Something no one talks about around here....the "hall pass". It might be something that those who are considering a RA would consider instead.

I have told my H that if there is ever anyone I am really interested in getting with, that I will redeem my "hall pass". I would NOT be cheating, therefore I will not be compromising MY integrity. I would do this in a small way to make him have the mind movies and insecurities for a change. But the bigger part would be to have fun, excitement, and validation for myself. After the devastation of my self esteem and the humiliation I have felt...I feel like I can be a little selfish too!

It would only be a ONS with no further personal contact as that is what he did. If he had had 3 ONS, I would get 3. If he had had a long term affair, I would have hall passes whenever I want--without emotional connection as that is NOT something I would want or think is healthy for a marriage.

Having said this....I probably will never ACT on my hall pass, but I like the justice it provides me to have it.

and I would not be married to someone for which justice was this important. How is having a hall pass healthy for a marriage? You WOULD be cheating and it WOULD compromise your integrity.

I agree with what a lot of the others have said, in that it doesn't even the playing field, and it doesn't make things fair. It won't change the fact that what your WH did was unfair. It will still be unfair, no matter what, and I am sorry for that.

Having an affair of your own is only going to add to your pain, tigrislilium. My affair was over 18 years ago, and I still consider it the biggest regret of my life. I can't think of a single thing that I have done in my entire lifetime that has caused me to become more disappointed in myself than that.

Please don't go there.

I'm glad you are here talking to us.

[This message edited by LosferWords at 11:16 AM, June 10th (Tuesday)]

I have told my H that if there is ever anyone I am really interested in getting with, that I will redeem my "hall pass". I would NOT be cheating, therefore I will not be compromising MY integrity. I would do this in a small way to make him have the mind movies and insecurities for a change. But the bigger part would be to have fun, excitement, and validation for myself. After the devastation of my self esteem and the humiliation I have felt...I feel like I can be a little selfish too!

Excellent post, Ripsinmychest.

Yes. An affair is humiliating and robs the faithful spouse of self esteem.

IMO, the hall pass is a great idea.

What I find really befuddling is the way some wayward spouses claim that a hall pass affair or a revenge affair is worse than the original affair.

But that just says to me that the original wayward knew an affair would cause their spouse pain, but did it anyway.

And, it's also a sign of the original waywards self absorption.

Also, a hall pass affair is not really an affair.

It's more like an open marriage type of agreement.

And, I agree, too. A hall pass affair needs to be a one and done type of thing.

I see a lot of judgment here going on against the idea of a revenge affair.

But personally the concept that it might save the marriage and make a less than remorseful wayward more empathetic is not a new one.

And, really is it any different than claiming that an affair can IMPROVE a marriage?

The fact that there are so named "madhatters" posting here who claim it ruined the marriage more means nothing other than it ruined their particular marriage.

Like I said, an affair did not improve my marriage.

It was fine before, IMO, and by my husband own words to his friends.

His friends, BTW, were shocked by his affair, too, because he always claimed the marriage was great.

seethelight = you've posted on this before on how you've read that RA are a way to even the score and save the marriage. I've not read ONE book or ANYTHING that has mentioned this.

It adds to the pain and makes the marriage near impossible to recover from. Ask ANY MH here.

t/j = So you have your hall pass. Now all you need is someone else to play your game. Maybe someone else with a hall pass? Craigslist? Ashley Madison? Because there is no chance at all in your getting even scheme that there isn't a faithful significant other that is going to have their world nuked by your activities?

end t/j

*** As a member ***

I think the term "hall pass" is a minimization and cutesy term to justify one's own cake eating behavior. I don't buy into that.

seethelight = you've posted on this before on how you've read that RA are a way to even the score and save the marriage. I've not read ONE book or ANYTHING that has mentioned this.

It adds to the pain and makes the marriage near impossible to recover from. Ask ANY MH here.

Hey Rachelle:

Have you read all the fidelity books ever written?

But, never mind, you just gave me an idea for a book.

I could gather all the revenge or "hall pass" affair stories I have seen posted at various forums, and write a book about how the "hall pass" affair suddenly turned around an unremorseful cheater.

Also, My own wayward offered me a "hall pass" affair as a way to try to get past this....on dday.

He later changed his mind.

But, I have heard other betrayeds mention that their wayward offered a hall pass.

Sorry that you haven't read about similar situations, but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

Yes. Common wisdom is that a revenge affair will destroy the marriage.

But, common wisdom in INFIDELITY BOOKS SEEMS TO BE THAT AN AFFAIR CAN IMPROVE A MARRIAGE.

But it hasn't improved mine. And, it hasn't improved countless other peoples' marriages, even on this website.

So, conventional wisdom may well be conventional wisdom, but that doesn't guarantee that it's the right wisdom for everyone.