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Reconciliation Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Can this Work
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 10:02 AM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello All, thanks for all the comments. They Help!

We are trying to reconcile after my WW had an emotional affair/that turned physical with a man she met through AA. Kissing/Holding hands. She is a recovering Alcoholic, 90 days sober and working the steps with a sponsor. She has been very honest, and still thinks about this other man who is also married. I have come to understand why the affair happened, they share so much in common and my lack of support emotionally while she was drinking is her reasoning behind it. I am close to being in a better place, Im working in IC on letting go of Control which has always been a big issue of mine. We attend MC weekly, have a great counselor and think a lot of issues are being resolved. During the drinking stage, I wasn't getting what I needed it felt as if she was having an affair with the bottle and leaving me left alone. I didn't communicate well during that period and now paying the price. I love her deeply, I am trying to trust her again. And she is honest with me I believe. The problem is that she sees this man frequently, even though she has changed her regular meetings to avoid him, he still shows up at the new ones occasionally. I struggle with that. She says that she loves, me and is not In love with me. She has asked for space to and time to work things out on her own, and decide if she wants our marriage to work or if its to late. She is spending a few nights a way from me and the kids, and trying to figure stuff out. I fell somewhat alone, but getting stronger everyday. Just don't really understand what she is going through, and if it is even possible for her to reconnect in the marriage when she still sees him occasionally. She says they don't talk, but he is still there. His wife found me and contacted me, and now tries to find out what meetings she attends so she can push him to avoid those. I don't know if that is healthy….All comments appreciated!

Thanks!

ME 44
Her 39
2 kids 5 and 8
DD 5/4/2014
OM 54 and in AA
Verbal NC date 5/18/2014
Still sees the man at meetings some


Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
Crosswordnut
♀ New Member
Member # 42842
Default  Posted: 10:35 AM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I prefer women's AA meetings and your wife might like them, too. I assume her sponsor is female.

Posts: 6 | Registered: Mar 2014
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes, her sponsor is a woman. In fact its a new sponsor, the last one had questionable moral issues.

Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
TheIrishGirl
♀ Member
Member # 43496
Default  Posted: 12:27 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Glad to see you're all in C, and hopefully you'll get good help there. What I have to say comes off a little harsh, but I want to highlight it to make sure you see everything you said clearly.

This jumps out to me:

. I have come to understand why the affair happened, they share so much in common and my lack of support emotionally while she was drinking is her reasoning behind it.

Your emotional availability isn't why she had an A. She had options there- seek support from a professional, seek out a female AA member to build ONLY a friendship with, tell you what she needed FROM YOU to feel supported, ask for a D before setting out on an inappropriate relationship that turned into an A based on her willingness to blow through the walls of your marriage.

she sees this man frequently...She says that she loves, me and is not In love with me. She has asked for space to and time to work things out on her own, and decide if she wants our marriage to work or if its to late.

She's using this space and time to spend it with him and assess her options (as she sees it, there's a potential future either with OM or you)- and asking you for the space ahead of time ensures that you'll be ready and waiting once her AP either turns her down or shows his true colors.


Me: 31, BW Him: 38, WH
2 children (ours) 7/11 & 3/14
D-day 4/18/14 I saw his 'other' email

Posts: 713 | Registered: May 2014
somethingremorse
♂ Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 12:32 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My first thoughts were exactly what Irish wrote.


Me: WH (40s)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 746 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
20WrongsVs1
♀ Member
Member # 39000
Default  Posted: 12:39 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We are trying to reconcile

Sorry, but no, "you" are trying to R. She is...

spending a few nights a way from me and the kids, and trying to figure stuff out.

It takes two to R.


fWW: 42
BH: 52
DDay: April 21, 2013
Sweet DS & fierce DD, under 10
"Between stimulus and response there’s a space, in that space lies our power to choose our response, in our response lies our growth and our freedom." V. Frankl

Posts: 1252 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Redneck land
rachelc
♀ Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 12:45 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Time to put your foot down. She's either in the marriage or not. she's stringing you along and that is emotional abuse. She's what we call around here as "cake-eating."

She makes a choice and if it's you, it's automatic NC with her AP and throwing herself into finding out why she chose this awful coping mechanism, no matter what state your marriage was in.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5500 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 12:51 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We have a MC session Friday, Im hesitant to make any decisions on how I should react to this before the session. Am I off base thinking that way?

Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
Chinadoll30
♀ Member
Member # 43131
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH's affair was based around addiction as well. I can tell you that they use the affair as a new drug. Can't drink and all the "good" feelings that come with it, so they substitute the A to get them high and feel "good" about themselves. Also, when you have let down your family the way they have, it is easier to look at someone new than at the wreckage they have created.
A couple thoughts: she can and should be finding meetings where he is not. Women's meetings, a new location, etc. there is NO excuse to still see him. If he walks in to a meeting, and she truly wants to R, she should be walking out. Immediately. Not sitting in the same room as him.
I also find the "time away" highly suspicious. If she wants to be in the marriage, she needs to do the work. If she doesn't, she needs to leave. I know this is a horribly tough decision to make, but it sounds as if she is leaving her options open. That should be unacceptable to you. And shows that she is not truly interested in R.
Good for you for recognizing control issues. All spouses of addicts/alcoholics have them. Either from FOO or from living with active addiction. Have you read "codependent no more"? Or "the dilemma of the alcoholic marriage"? Any of the al-anon literature can help. I am so sorry you are dealing with this. I HATE being married to an addict. It's like being married to 2 different people. One when they use who is selfish to the extreme, a liar, a waste of space. And another when they are clean and willing to promise you everything for putting up with the other person. It is no fun. I feel for you. Truly.


"We must see all scars as beauty. Okay? This will be our secret. Because take it from me, a scar does not form on the dying. A scar means 'I survived'." -Chris Cleave

Posts: 339 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Philadelphia
Schadenfreude
♂ Member
Member # 43075
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tell the MC she's still seeing him at meetings, says she isn't in love with you, still thinks about AP, needs space from you, om's BW is trying to keep him from WW, and she is moving out for a few days. Then ask if counseling is worthwhile at this point. From what I've read here, most MC's won't do counseling while WS is still enamored of AP.

You seem to be beating yourself over he head for not enabling her when she was drinking. She'd never love you as much as she loved the bottle, no matter what you did or didn't do. Her A decision was hers alone.

Ask if a three person marriage has any reasonable chance of success.


Posts: 892 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Midwest
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 1:11 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for all the comments! I really am struggling with the whole thing. I kind of understand the need to be alone, work on things. It may help me as well if I can stop thinking negative. I struggle mostly with the the seeing the other guy at AA meetings. Sure seems that if you want your marriage to work you would take every measure needed to avoid the contact, if you know it creates anxiety for your spouse. The other thing I forgot to mention is this other man is someone she would not give a second look to on the street. Had they not had the same situation, (Struggling marriage, both addicts) ect. She wouldn't give him the time of day. So I am not sure if that makes it better or worse.

Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
rachelc
♀ Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 1:20 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Heayheart - your last post just makes the point that it could be anyone. However, she needs to establish NC with him. they can't be friends, they cant' attend the same AA meetings. Nothing! And is she transparent with her phone and computer.
Her need to be alone stems from her need to feed her addiction. Believe me, she's NOT working on figuring out her feelings towards you. She deep into the addiction of the OM and likely feeding that addiction.

Stop allowing her to create anxiety for you by continuing to see her AP.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5500 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
Chinadoll30
♀ Member
Member # 43131
Default  Posted: 1:24 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I believe that your struggle with her seeing the other man is really an internal struggle within you. Can you accept that she is CHOOSING not to be in your marriage? It is hard to accept. But it reads as if you know, in your heart, what the answer is, you are just having trouble accepting it. And I completely empathize. It sucks.


"We must see all scars as beauty. Okay? This will be our secret. Because take it from me, a scar does not form on the dying. A scar means 'I survived'." -Chris Cleave

Posts: 339 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Philadelphia
Chinadoll30
♀ Member
Member # 43131
Default  Posted: 1:24 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I believe that your struggle with her seeing the other man is really an internal struggle within you. Can you accept that she is CHOOSING not to be in your marriage? It is hard to accept. But it reads as if you know, in your heart, what the answer is, you are just having trouble accepting it. And I completely empathize. It sucks.


"We must see all scars as beauty. Okay? This will be our secret. Because take it from me, a scar does not form on the dying. A scar means 'I survived'." -Chris Cleave

Posts: 339 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Philadelphia
LA44
♀ Member
Member # 38384
Default  Posted: 1:38 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have come to understand why the affair happened, they share so much in common and my lack of support emotionally while she was drinking is her reasoning behind it.

No. No. No. Her A did not start bc you were emotionally unavailable to her while she was entering sobriety.

Chinadoll also mentioned replacing one addiction with another. That "feel good" endorphin they get from drinking? - that rush of the A - all come from the same place in the brain - frontal lobe, I believe. It's all connected.

Your wife's primary focus is on staying sober IMO. Her second objective should be working on rebuilding the trust she broke with YOU!

You are supporting her sobriety, going to IC, attending MC. You are doing a hell of a lot and then what? She stays out a few nights a week bc she needs space? She needs to figure this out? Come on. In addition to AA, (female meetings only) your wife also needs to be in IC to deal with the issues that led her to drinking that led her to an A. Again, this is all connected and likely traces back to some childhood issues/chaos. She needs to deal with that.

My Dad has been in AA for 35 years now. He swears by the male/female only meetings. He always says that the last thing needed when getting sober is a new romance. No one is healthy and everyone is lonely and thinking they are unique. Thank goodness Dad got sober and Mom gave him a chance to be back in the family. You are actually providing two gifts at this time. YOU have a lot on the line right now. YOU are doing your part. She is, as rachelc put it, is being a "cake-eater".

If your goal is to ease up on your "control" issues as you noted, then your wife needs to start incorporating some boundaries into her life so that YOU, her husband - feels safe and able to move forward with the GIFT OF R. Remember that - YOU ARE GIVING HER A GIFT by working towards R after this great betrayal.

Good luck Heayheart.


Me: 44
He: 47 WH
Married: 15 years
D Day: December 2012
Affair: Fall 2009 - Dec. 2011
R is not linear

Posts: 2593 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: Canada, eh
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 8:14 PM, June 16th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think it might be that she doesn't know if she wants to work on this marriage. Seems unfair that she gets time alone to figure out what she wants, she says I'm driving her crazy by contacting her via text. I think it might be time to start preparing for divorce but shutting down emotionally.

Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
FixYou71
♀ Member
Member # 42654
Default  Posted: 1:33 AM, June 17th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's important that you really listen to what is being said here by experienced posters.
Your objective right now should be to sit down and make a lost of requirements that SHE must meet in order for YOU to offer HER R. You lay it all out.
-Absolutely no contact with the AP.
-No AA meetings where men attend.
-No texting, email, phone or otherwise communication with any other men unless strictly business related with no fluff involved.
-You must have full access to all her electronic devices (phone, tablet, computer) including passwords to all methods that could possibly used to communicate with other men (forums, social media, websites, games, other texting apps etc)
(Full access includes reading all past texts and emails etc. Even if it means recovering deleted items in order for them to be read)

There are many other requirements or agreements that are options for you.
Many SI members require face time communication and/or picture texts to show where they are at any given time (to help the BS to know the WS is being honest about their location). A lot of members use a location app on their cell phones in order to see where their WS is whenever they want.
You may require she does IC and MC (sounds like this is already happening) and reads books on the subject of infidelity. (Not Just Friends and How to help your spouse heal after an affair are two top titles here)
I'm sure I'm leaving so many out but you get the idea.
It's important that you explain the consequences of NOT meeting your requirements and follow through if broken otherwise they mean nothing.
She should be willing to do all of these. If she is remorseful these will not be things she will be defensive about. She should be agreeable to anything that would help you feel safe and that she is not participating in A related behavior.

Please stop taking credit for her decision to betray you and your marriage, not excluding your.children. SHE did this. SHE has to take full responsibility for all of the affair. Right now the A should be the focus in MC. Other marital issues will have their time to be dealt with once the A is addressed.
As for her IC, she must find her 'why'. What is broken in her? What allowed her to knowingly put everything in harms way? Until she figures that out and works k n it you cannot trust her in your M.
Many suggest the BS immediately go to see a lawyer and learn their options. Even if you never go back, making initial contact and getting that info can help you making decisions later.
Many also suggest taking half the $ and throwing it in a new bank account to cover yourself in case things go bad later.

I realize this probably seems overwhelming. I hope you can begin to realize that you are not the cause even if you weren't the best husband. There were so many other options for her as another poster mentioned. She could have divorced you, talked to you abound how serious the M problems were for her and requested counselling etc. An A is wrong. There are no excuses.
Please read about the 180 in the healing library (yellow box upper left) if you haven't. Read all you can there. You'll find a lot of good info.
I'm sorry for what you're going through.
(((Heavyheart)))

[This message edited by FixYou71 at 1:42 AM, June 17th (Tuesday)]


BS: 43
H: 49
Dday #1 Oct 2007 (Porn for 2 yrs)
Dday #2 May 2013 (Porn for 5 more yrs))
Dday#3 May 2014 (finally admitted to drunk kissing OW in 1994: the 2nd drunken kiss with another woman during our M)
DD 21 and DS 17
Married 1993

Posts: 471 | Registered: Mar 2014
Heayheart
♂ New Member
Member # 43490
Default  Posted: 11:31 AM, June 17th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So from what I am hearing here, it looks like I should stand firm on absolutely no contact, not even in the same room at an AA meeting.

Posts: 29 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Tx
Chinadoll30
♀ Member
Member # 43131
Default  Posted: 11:46 AM, June 17th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I asked my WH, an AA member, and he said the same as all of us here: you can not R if there is continuing contact. She needs to choose.


"We must see all scars as beauty. Okay? This will be our secret. Because take it from me, a scar does not form on the dying. A scar means 'I survived'." -Chris Cleave

Posts: 339 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Philadelphia
Stillnotoverit
♂ New Member
Member # 43708
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, June 17th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She is still seeing him period. Went thru this too. AA and all that stuff is just a drug to get over another drug. Affairs abound there, it's a caustic meeting place for broken people to justify their brokeness. I think at one time like unions it was a good place. Bit now I sent 10 meetings 6 different meeting halls, no booze bit every other drug imaginable outside and yrs lots of hookups. We never went back got her in IC and it's good.

Posts: 41 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: Tennesse
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