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User Topic: How to be a Christian During this?
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 7:24 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1. This was approved by an admin.
2. This is not to attack any ones religious background or beliefs or to debate it.

I am struggling with being a Christian and doing 180 and filing for divorce.

I know it says God hates divorce, but allowed it for those who wanted, because there intentions are wicked.

I just don't know how to be a good Christian but not be a doormat...


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 7:30 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Um. Really?
I'm just blown away by this. You really don't get it.

God allows for divorce in infidelity, and abuse.
What your wife has been doing to you is both.

Plain and simple God forgives you.

As Christians we are taught to repent for our sinful thoughts, and actions. I assume that you are doing this, and asking for a guiding hand through this process? If not then do it, you find it a source of strength, and peace in this process.

God wants you to be strong, happy, and to raise your child in your beliefs. God wants you to be respected, There is a whole list of rules he gave us to follow (the 10 commandments). Basically it boils down to be a good person, treat others how you want to be treated, and do right. That's it.

You seriously need to do some work on your Co-D tendencies.

You did NOT ask for this. You were thrust into this situation, and who knows maybe it's a test from God, but God doesn't want you to be a broken down, disrespected doormat. He wants you to be a whole complete person who can do his work.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8693 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
TrustedHer
♂ Member
Member # 23328
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LS, WTF?

Get to DivorceCare. Now.

It's a program put on by churches, which is for people going through divorce.

Among other things, it offers scriptural support for those seeking divorce.

What part of being a Christian allows you to take endless abuse without fixing it, or at least moving away from it?

FWIW, I am not a believer, and I got a bunch of good things from the DivorceCare program. I can only imagine how much a believer could take away from it.


Take care of yourself. There's a great future out there. It won't come to you; you have to go to it.

Posts: 5181 | Registered: Mar 2009 | From: DeepInTheHeartOf, TX
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 7:43 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I didn't think about CoD (call of duty??? ).

I thought in more of terms of doing the right thing in God's eye. I mean of course he would love reconciliation more than anything...

But reconciliation falls on the person who committed the sin...


I feel like I answered my own question...

But how about 180? Where does that fit in. I am reading the scriptures, daily and studying them and praying to be lead.


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
outtanowhere
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Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 8:12 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

There were incidents recorded in scripture where the apostles were trying to preach the gospel but, the people wouldn't listen. So...they shook the dust off their feet and moved on in hopes of being received by others who were eager to hear what they had to say.

Why waste time in something futile? If those that were chosen by Christ (apostles) to follow Him during His time here on earth could walk away after being rejected, why should we feel it is any different for us?


BS - 58
SAWH - 61 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 38 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
He promised me Heaven then put me thru hell

Posts: 758 | Registered: Apr 2013
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 8:17 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why waste time in something futile? If those that were chosen by Christ (apostles) to follow Him during His time here on earth could walk away after being rejected, why should we feel it is any different for us?

Thank you. I think that's what I am looking for.


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 8:35 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Read the book "Love must be tough" by James Dobson. It really helped me. It has Christian undertones in it and I think you would benefit from it.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1910 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
LostSamurai
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Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 8:53 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I will check it out. Thank you for recommending that. I heard others recommend it.


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 9:18 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I read an excerpt from Mr. Dobson's book...


I haven't finish so I am not saying I know what it means entirely in his book but I am going to purchase it and read it.

[This message edited by LostSamurai at 9:22 AM, June 24th (Tuesday)]


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
ShiningAutumn8
Member
Member # 42558
Default  Posted: 9:26 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What does doing the 180 have to do with being a Christian? Are you saying youre worried by doing the 180 you are not acting as God would want you to?

I don't see anything in the 180 that conflicts with Christianity. 180 is about focusing on yourself, filling yourself with activity, friends, happiness, etc outside of your spouse. Its about gaining strength and independence and not leaning on your cheater/abuser for emotional support. Its about limiting topics and amounts of conversation with your cheater/abuser to protect yourself. Its about breaking co-dependency, and making yourself and your healing a priority.

What is un-Christian about any of that?


Posts: 440 | Registered: Feb 2014
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 9:38 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's a really good book. I read "Codependant No More" first but it didn't really click at the time. "Love Must Be Tough" really clicked with me especially Chapter 5 which was titled "Opening the Cage Door". For me, that clicked with me. It was the first thing I read that made sense to my confused and tired mind. Reading that chapter was the catalyst that helped me reach critical mass. All the advice from SI, SI members, and books I read before honestly didn't sink in until I read that book. If STBXWW wanted to leave then let her leave. Nothing I was doing was going to make her stay so open the cage door and let her go. I finally decided to let go of the outcome. I went back and reread "Codependant No More" for a 2nd time and is clicked as well.

Codependents will ALWAYS look for ways to fix a problem. We get stuck in cycles and can't get out. We try everything and then try some more. The problem is we never put that energy where it truly needs to be which is in ourselves. Once I focused all my energy on me and ignored stbxww things got better. I decided the only project I was allowed was myself.

Either STBXWW was going to keep up with me or get left behind and I left her ass behind which was the best thing I ever could have done. At the time it also was the scariest thing I had ever done. But the fear of my unknown future was finally less than my fear of staying in my then current situation even one day longer.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1910 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
LostSamurai
♂ Member
Member # 41347
Default  Posted: 9:48 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What does doing the 180 have to do with being a Christian?

I was thinking of the No Contact truthfully but then after reading this:

Codependents will ALWAYS look for ways to fix a problem. We get stuck in cycles and can't get out. We try everything and then try some more. The problem is we never put that energy where it truly needs to be which is in ourselves. Once I focused all my energy on me and ignored stbxww things got better. I decided the only project I was allowed was myself.

I guess I was looking at it as doing something that is not beneficial in a way, the NC, but, the problem really is me. The CoD is what my mind is wrapping around. Just want to fix the problem but really just hurting myself, because in reality it will never be good enough for her. If it was good enough she would of came back...


I am now nothing by a mere Ronin.

Posts: 1041 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: Maryland
blakesteele
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Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((LostSamurai)))

I wrestled with this same dilemma.

I called Focus On The Family hotline....they had a christian therapist call me back. He recommended what others have to you...get and read Love Must Be Tough.

CAUTION:

If those that were chosen by Christ (apostles) to follow Him during His time here on earth could walk away after being rejected, why should we feel it is any different for us?


We are human....and as such we are like the apostles. Often I relate to Peter on this journey....all in then...."holy crap! You want me to do that?!?!".

BUT we are called to be like Christ....to resist our fleshly self, to die to that self, and become more like Christ.

Our relationship with our wives is to resemble Christ's love of the church. He had strong words for the church and was not always happy with their actions....but he continued to choose love when the only harvest was pain and unmet expectations from that church.

He also used righteous anger to correct people when they were sinning against God.....remember the merchants in the temple. Christ also made it a point to be with the sinners....he did not abandon them. He made it clear he was aware of their sin, but continued to remind them they have today to choose differently....to repent.

With regards to CoD (of which I was one)....you have that same free will and can repent from those choices. God did not create you to be a door mat nor to ignore God-given needs and desires.


With regards to adultery....it is true this is the only sin that is cause for D according to God. But as I study it, it appears to me that the sin of adultery must be repeated in order for this to become mandatory. In other words....if my wife admits her sin, rejects and repents from it, and goes about repairing the damage her sin has caused all it touches.....God does not insist on D.

God hates D.

D pleases satan.

The family is the pinnacle of power for humans. our differences are our strengths. People confuse this with a weakness...siting "irreconcilable differences" as grounds for D.

Certainly if any of the 4 deadly A's are present (adultery, addiction, abuse, abandonment) God expects you to use your free will and protect yourself and those you are intrusted to protect.....but that "protection" takes many forms. Formally agreed to separation, healthy 180, support groups and fellowship, etc.

I wrestle with my own sin....sexual sin of using porn.

I gave up asking my wife "how could you" at the point I recognized my sin for what it was. I had my answer on "how she could"......


....because I did.

We are all sinners. God understands that. He tried rules and regulations in the Old Testament. They did not work. He then sent his only son to die for us....and proclaimed "No one comes to me but through my Son."

We have to choose Christ as our savior.

We have to choose to recognize our sins and sinful nature.

We have to choose to repent and try to do better.

We have to forgive ourselves for our short falls.

We must learn the difference between being condemned and being convicted.

CoD sucks for this....because our twisted minds can make a strong case that we have been doing the christian way of M all of our life. And that is a lie. It is because CoD is not how God designed love to work. Love is NOT always saying yes, turning a blind eye to the pain our spouse causes us, ignoring the facts that our spouse is hurting themselves.

Love Must Be Tough was a key book to start my journey to becoming more healthy.

Codependent No More was another step to this goal.


Keep the faith brother. This trial of trials is a tough one. But trials prepare us for more blessings.

God is with us all.


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 3962 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
Faithful w/Love
♀ Member
Member # 33128
Default  Posted: 10:44 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trust in God and he will lead you.

I had a very hard time with what you are talking about for years while my wh was in his LTA and I knew about it. I didn't want to disappoint God and I knew he hates divorce, but that was my CoD talking, it was an excuse to try to fix the problem. But, what I didn't see what that I was the problem standing in God's way. My wh is not for me to fix, it is himself and God. But, wh has to reach out to him and ask for God to be in his life and lead him.

We are now separating again at the end of this week. Yes, I am sad and heart broken that my wh still does not get it. That he doesn't see the GIFT God gave him as a wife and mother to his kids.

I know I did EVERYTHING humanly possible to fix this but he never saw me standing there waiting and now I have to love me and my kids enough to know that God is in charge and follow him.

Learn to love yourself and be humble.


BS(ME)40 WH(HIM)38
DD 20 and DS 15
Separated Aug 2012
Moved back home Oct 31 2013
Separated again June 2014. Heading toward divorce.
False R. Still Lying.

"You never know how strong you are until being strong is all you have left"


Posts: 2782 | Registered: Aug 2011
blakesteele
♂ Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 10:48 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But the fear of my unknown future was finally less than my fear of staying in my then current situation even one day longer.

Change occurs when the pain of same is greater than the pain of change.

My first 2 months were horrible. I was fighting like hell for a M that was dead, for a woman that had zero interest in me or her family, and for coping skills that completely and uterly failed to work.

Why did I do this? Because I was not feeling enough pain to change then....I was in shock.


At 3 months out I found anger.

At 6 months out real rage.

God is fine with this. I needed to do this to protect myself and start to protect my girls.

8 months out my wifes fog started to lift.

I believe it did because I had sufficiently broken my CoD ways so as to allow her pain to increase past the threshold needed to change her old ways.


Its a process. some waywards never change....OM dumped my wife and found another woman to get into within 2 months. He is not recognizing his sin, he is not remorseful, he is not repenting. BUT, he has today to choose differently. I pray he does....for himself, for his wife and his 5 kids.

Some betrayed never change....they D, blame the wayward for all of the problems in the M, and take their CoD self (or other issues) into another relationship.

Change is hard....but it is healthy.


Took me a while to get what God meant when He says "Rejoice in EVERYTHING".

I am finally getting it.

My 3rd DD of 3 weeks ago was incredibly painful to endure. But it felt strangely.....good. Good in that I had that opportunity to put to the test what I think I have learned over the past 2 years. That my wifes actions are not about me...they affect me, the affect our family...but they are not about me. A CoD thinks all other actions are about them...and that they can make things right, fix things.

I have learned, as you will, that we can only change ourselves. And that change is only possible through God who works within us.

It is scary at first...to realize I am in a relationship with someone that can hurt me so deeply. But it is freeing....as you realize you have plenty of work to do on yourself....you no longer have your spouses shit to shovel too!


I have faith and hope that someday we will achieve what God has planned for all M's. That two become one and the harvest will far exceed what either of us could accomplish on our own.


That time is NOT now...but endurance/perserverance is a virture God values highly. He is not into suffering for sufferings sake...He wants us to recognize that pain is an opportunity to grow into something more than you were.


I may not be where I want to be, but thank God I am not where I was!

Peace.


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 3962 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
Faithful w/Love
♀ Member
Member # 33128
Default  Posted: 10:49 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And everything that Blakesteele wrote is SO TRUE!


BS(ME)40 WH(HIM)38
DD 20 and DS 15
Separated Aug 2012
Moved back home Oct 31 2013
Separated again June 2014. Heading toward divorce.
False R. Still Lying.

"You never know how strong you are until being strong is all you have left"


Posts: 2782 | Registered: Aug 2011
blakesteele
♂ Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 10:49 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Faithful w/Love)))

Moving post...thank you for sharing.

Peace.


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 3962 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
RyeBread
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Member # 37437
Default  Posted: 10:58 AM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My 2 cents.

If you believe that we are all God's children then I try to look at it like that. You want your own children to be happy and free from opression and abuse. I think God is the same way. God wants us to be happy and I am willing to bet that he understands that sometimes we have to separate ourselves from those that create environments of unhappyness when the offender is unwilling or incapable of changing. God puts it on us to make that decision. and I think that is because its the only way we can truly grow. I believe that God is a lot more empathetic and understanding of your total situation than you realize. If you make a decision that you feel is truly in your best interest without malice, hate, or vengance in your heart then you have nothing to worry about IMHO. You did what you felt was right. If others have an issue with that, then they need to check themselves and stop judging because they don't know everything you have been through. That is their problem.


Let him that would move the world first move himself. - Socrates

Posts: 1030 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Midwest
Lovedyoumore
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Member # 35593
Default  Posted: 12:01 PM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You have permission, even from God. I think the allowance to end marriage after infidelity is a grace giving measure. Due to the insidious nature of infidelity and the huge betrayal, a Divine wisdom knows that divorce was preferable to losing your soul because your pain would drive you away from Him. A cheating spouse brings you into an abyss that encircles you with darkness. Divorce is to save the betrayed, not reward the wicked. Quit beating yourself up on this.

Whether or not you are a Christian, staying with a non repentant or remorseless WS, changes who you are and probably, who you were meant to be. Staying with someone who abuses your goodness is not good for your soul or your life of service. You do not have to be a door mat. Release yourself and your soul to get away from an abusive situation, the whole situation.


Me 52
WH 52
Married 30+ years
Together trying to R

I tell people I am tired but really my heart is broken and I am sad.


Posts: 1526 | Registered: May 2012 | From: Southern, bless your heart
GotPlayed
♂ Member
Member # 41294
Default  Posted: 12:15 PM, June 24th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi LostSamurai, Christian here, and have big struggles with this as well. Bullied as a child, I was very bad at boundaries, and WW having CSA issues, she learned to survive by boundary violations, which brought us to a dynamic where she cheated on me and I tried to forgive while she was still foggy and unremorseful. D'ing now.

Seeing both a secular IC and my pastor. I suggest you get in contact with your pastor/minister/priest.

Definitely go to DivorceCare. I went and may do it again next year to refresh. Among many other things it explains the Christian rules on when divorce is a) Allowed, b) Advisable and the only Christian thing to do, and c) Forgivable. Spoiler - as someone else has said, once D is final, you're completely in the clear, both sin-wise and to marry someone else as a victim of infidelity (with all the healing and giving time caveats). The rules are more complex for WS than they are for you - essentially BS can remarry whenever, WS has to wait until you remarry to even consider someone else (don't fret though, they didn't while they were married so don't be surprised if they won't). This is scripture-based.

I learned (and my pastor confirmed) that D is justified in cases of infidelity, and I am under no obligation to take her back (the pastor's words). I am however advised to not see anyone (even though after D is final it won't be a sin for me) for at least a year or more, both for my healing and to give God the opportunity to work in her heart in case she changes. I agree with this advice and I'm following it.

As for books, here's a couple of resources for you that have helped me:

"The Gift of Forgiveness" by Charles Stanley. This book puts Christian forgiveness in context of consequences. Of particular interest for me was the idea that pain, consequences and forgiveness are three different things (note your WS will very likely not be aware of it, and resent you, at least in the beginning - and that's ok, not being a doormat equals not being liked sometimes, particularly by those who did us wrong or abused us). Also I learned from there that forgiveness is for yourself, not for the WS - in fact, you can forgive without ever telling WS. It can heal both, but it's WS's responsibility to heal, and if you decide there has to be (fair) consequences for WS's actions (divorce in your case), that focus on WS reconciling with God (regardless of whether she/he can reconcile with you), it is not unchristian to enforce them. It's well sourced with scripture.

"Boundaries" by John Townsend. A Christian take on healing codependency, and very concrete and applicable in its examples, with tons of scripture to guide you. Many times these problems we have as BS's (a problem saying no, a problem setting limits), are a result of poor boundaries of our own as well. Essentially we have done them a disservice by being doormats. Like a child looking for boundaries, they have acted up and our "doormattiness" has acted as enabler. It's not unchristian to set boundaries and consequences.

Dave Ramsey (yes, the Christian money guy). One of his videos in the Financial Peace university talks about Money and relationships. And because money is always such a clear issue (lack of boundaries tends to result in lack of money or bad cashflow), his talk on Money and relationships was to me very illuminating to me regarding boundaries. WS's tend to have money issues because of their overall lack of self-control.

You will also be happier and find other relationships that are suboptimal and need to fix. I'm finding this out about my father, after reading all three. He has boundary issues of his own, and I am beginning to understand why I am the way I am - and finding that very uncomfortable conversations with my dad need to happen soon.

What I'm learning is that, Christian or not, being the leader of a family sometimes puts you in the very uncomfortable position of putting consequences on people, not just your kids. It's certainly the least desirable part of being the leader of a family, but we are looked upon by providence to provide that.

I've also learned that if we understand Christianity as putting up with whatever is done to us, we simply don't understand Christianity. We are looked upon to do the right thing, and apply the same standards to others (particularly our family) that we apply to us. It's difficult. It's uncomfortable. You'll be called judgemental and a series of unseemly things - that's a fact. Even (especially, actually) by your WS. But see John 15:18.

If we Christians believe what our WS's did was evil (they're not evil people, they just did an evil thing), they will hate us when we put consequences as long as they are engaging in this evil. And as they come out of the fog they will (or will not) appreciate us more for standing for our beliefs, especially if they're also their beliefs. If they don't, God will deal with them in His time, not ours.

Finally, something that has helped relieve my anger is knowing that my justice will not come in my time, but God's. I trust Him to do the justice part, which I may never see or be a part of. I just put the consequences that regard to my own healing (I left, I'm going through with the D with a lawyer in a fair, problem-solving way, I'm keeping my kids 50/50 and doing a good job of it).

Hope this helps. PM me if you need one-on-one.


Master of my Fate, Captain of my Soul.
BS 42, WW 41. 18y married
DD: 11/5/13
DS10 Autism, DD8
OM: Reformed wife-beater ex-con
D filed 1/14/14 by WW (never warn them, they'll get ahead)
Married a powder keg

Posts: 755 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: California
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