She said she's only seen one worse- clergyman at church whose wife in clergy had affair w another clergyman. Entire congregation knew, kids knew, etc
Our kids do not know. Her H and family does not know. Ours doesn't either. Just a few of my friends know. I've kept it to myself bc of kids. Mine and hers.
Bc of the "connections" recovery will be challenging, therapist says.
It sure is. Every day I'm hit in the face with ten reminders. But I'm ok. I'm pushing thru
I am so saddened when I read about OW/OM that were "friends of the family".
Though we live in a small town, My wife's OM is fairly "unto himself". I only knew of him pre-A because he is a joint owner in a small business. Which is more or less how their affair launched.
Several times I question our decision to stay in this area....
I can't say I feel your pain as I don't know the pain of double betrayal, others will be along soon enough to authentically empathize with you. I would ask if moving is an option?
I am torn......some of my triggers I felt I had to physically go to and face head on.....others I can heal from mentally going there.
In your sitch......I just don't know how people should process through it.
Dang.....not much wisdom from me. Prayed a prayer for you all right now.
God is with us all.
Her H and family does not know.
why doesn't her husband know? It helps to have another set of eyes on things in the beginning.
This is horrible, the double betrayal.
I didn't have that but yesterday experienced about 18 triggers. They're like little zings. I'm tired of it. I hope you find peace.
[This message edited by rachelc at 7:24 AM, July 11th (Friday)]
me (WW/BS): 48
4 kiddos in mid 20's
Please remember that there is no OW namecalling in the Reconciliation Forum.
We spent countless hours with them, go to the same church, go to the same gym (and gym classes), our kids were friends, we looked after each other's houses while on vacation, etc., etc. We were even planning a vacation together.
But, this is a pretty common story. I am surprised that your therapist even blinks an eye at it.
For me, it has been insidious in the fact that we cared for them, and I knew that she and her husband had real affection for my husband, and I encouraged it & took a lot of pleasure in that. I didn't know that she had had a crush on him for years, and that when she saw a weak moment for him (bad time career-wise, personally, and in our marriage) that she'd pounce like a feral cat. (ha.) I didn't know that he was so desperate for an ego boost that he'd become infatuated with someone he had never had an attraction to when she started flattering him, and making him feel "understood." I thought we were just close friends, acting like a support for each other. And really, we were. The affair was just two broken folks who had a radar out for broken, and when they needed a selfish escape, they acted on it. It is crazy making, because my husband kept thinking that because we were friends, she must be "like me." After the affair, he could point to almost nothing he liked or admired about her.
I will say this - I do not miss her. I realized after this happened, that she was really just a good mirror. She reflects those around her, but there is no real substance there. She is narcissistic, and not a good friend, wife or mother. She is likely an alcoholic, and I just hope every day that her kids have a fighting chance. I realized that our friendship with them, while a lot of fun, was pretty surface. I thought we had this great connection, but it was always fueled by a bottle of wine and snarky gossip about mutual friends/acquaintances, and picking on my husband. I miss talking music and books with her OBS, but at a year out, I mostly don't miss them in my lives, and really came to the realization this week that she was no friend of mine, ever really.
And seeing her is getting easier. I see her a few times a month, I guess. I don't go out of my way to avoid her, but I haven't had to come face to face with her in a small setting, yet. Think of each viewing as an innoculation -- making you stronger. She only has the power over you that you let her have.
Our kids know we are not friends with them any more, but not why. (Which has turned into more of a mystery than I'd like. My 10 year old presses me on the "why" all the time. ) He has a sense it has to do with her as she has snubbed him a few times (b&tc%!!) while the OBS is always very nice to him.
I am sorry the OBS doesn't know in your case. I couldn't handle that, myself. We actually met one day about a month after dday - kind of for closure. It was sad, but I am glad we did it.
I hope for peace for you - it does get easier.
[This message edited by bionicgal at 9:38 AM, July 11th (Friday)]
I edit, therefore I am.
Our kIds know now and have cut all ties with them.
It's a special hurt the double betrayal. ... infiltrates everything.
We all hung out together. We had all went on a big family vacation with them the month before DD. The guys had also gone a guys trip with some other guys while the affair was going on. I was thinking of talking to fWH about having OW and her BS be listed as guardians of our kids if something ever happened to us.
I am so THANKfUL that we live in a big enough town and we live on the opposite side of town as OW and her family. OW and fWH are now on opposite shifts also. I am still sort of waiting/scared of when we run into them again... I pray that that I don't have the kids when that happens. They all loved OW and her BS...
But to answer the "real" question, I guess I didn't know her that well. I never dreamed she would do this to me, her H and her kids. I *thought* she was a good person, a little young and immature, yes, but never THIS.
I think you need to tell her H. It is better to have two sets of eyes watching the situation than just yours. In our situation it never would have worked to not tell. My FWH called OBS the day he told me and blew the lid off of everything. No more secrets, no more lies.
Me- BW, 28
Him- fWh, 34
Mostly R'd, minus a few scars...bought a house and got a puppy...And baby makes 3! She arrived August
My FWW's OM was a friend of mine and hers. She's worked together with him and so have I. We became pretty good friends through the years and I never had reason not to trust. At least no reason that I knew of.
But, I obviously thought she cared for my family, that she would protect my family, and I certainly did hers.
And this what I think is why I have it "easier" without the double betrayal.
7 kids have been hurt by the affair that is a part of our life now. I don't think I am minimizing when I say I have it "easier" because my wife did not know his kids, nor did he know ours....that our familys knew nothing of each other prior to their choices.
A trigger for me was our family dog.....they walked with her in the park 1 block from our house. He snuggled and played with her. It is extremely painful to think about even 2 years out. And that is how I feel about a DOG!
Flip side of this.......how painful is this for the wayward to have to face? In your sitch Hatemyhusband, your husband must deal with the fact that he destroyed a family he bonded with too. Or maybe better said....the fact remains he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its intirety is up to him. But the pain of his choices is within him NOW....he may turn a blind eye to it, but pain is within him. Like playing hide and seek with a baby...the baby puts a napkin over his face and thinks he's hidden! I know it was his choice...but the fact must be he is struggling hard with this pain too....consciously or subconciously. More so than a wayward who never really "knew" the other family.....right?
Yes, I know my wife knew he had 5 kids...OM knew my wife had 2 daughters. (their physical affair would start after dropping respective kids off at school and stop after picking them up) But there is a very big difference between "knowing of" and "knowing them".
Pain all around.
I don't know if it helps....but this pain that you are feeling? The painful fact that even innocent children where no match for temptation and sinful desire? It was helpful in IC for me to own the truth that my wife and the OM never shared love for each other...if they had they would not have been so eager to help each other destroy so much, including parts of themselves.
My wife not knowing his wife or his kids, him not knowing our girls or me....would actually make adultery easier for them. "Kids are resilient" would be an easier thought for them since the kids remain "surface level" in identity. This would help the wayward in this sitch as they thought thoughts such as "This is my soul mate...wouldn't it be better to be married to him and model this relationship for my girls than the dreadful, dead one I am stuck in with my original man?"
The ADDED "deterrent" in your sitch, hatemyhusband, of both waywards intimately knowing all affected was not even strong enough to get your husband to find the courage to search out his "whys" as to his own thoughts, feelings and actions.
It is quite the opposite of him thinking "she is all that and a bag of popcorn".....quite the contrary, IMO. His brokenness and pain is so tremendous that he actually sacrificied MORE to get his "fix" than I did. OW is NOT a factor in your husbands choice to commit adultery. She was available...end of story.
REMEMBER: Adultery is first and foremost sin. Sin, by its nature, is singularly selfish. Even if done in group settings.....it comes down to personal choice as to how they feed their personal desires. The first lie that is told for sin to be chosen is one the person choosing to sin tells themselves. I know....I am "that guy".
Please please please keep that thought present in your mind. I could see the temptation to think really bad, untrue thoughts in your sitch....believe her egg salad was better than yours and thats why your husband choose her over you. It is NOT THAT WAY. He choose as he did because of how he was coping with life....not out of a choice to love the OW.
This painful fact also helped me own that nothing I could have done would have deterred my wife from harvesting the fruit she was so intent on growing. Couldn't have chose to love her better, more sex, nicer car, date nights, fun, excitment.....nothing could have deterred her from her path outside of something from within her.
This is one of the reasons it is so critical for a WS to aggresively search for and work through all of their "whys". If they are interested in accepting R, it is equally important to share that journey with their BS. It appears most waywards cope with life by concealing and hiding from it. The fact that they were able to do so all the way into adultery speaks to just how much of a challenge they have laid before them.
I pray Mr. Hatemyhusband is sharing his journey with you.
God is with us all.
[This message edited by blakesteele at 10:45 AM, July 11th (Friday)]
I've instructed her to avoid me and H and each time I run into her face to face, I will share her info with one person of my choice in town. (7 mo and she missed parties, dropped our gym, skips school functions). So far, I don't ever see her
Her H has cheating, drug and drinking issues. He's a loose cannon. I don't need the drama. Let them cheat on each other but stay away from my family
The "other set of eyes" advice I question. Why do I want anyone stopping my H from an A or starting again? He chooses this, he's gone. He wants that, he's gone. He can have it. I don't want anyone w me that wants to be elsewhere
I'm strong. It is easier to move but I live two mins from works. My kids are excelling in school. I love my town. I'm never sacrificing what I dreamt ---for him, her or the fall out of the A. Not an option. I'll force her out before that occurs, by telling her school her nastiness.
My H chose this path for 2 years. My friend chose to bait him, use me and set this up. He allowed himself to be tangled in her web. I warned him she was having a crisis and distanced myself from her. She hated I called her out on inappropriate behavior and worked my H to turn against me.
Now, she holds no power. I do. He sold her out on DD, giving me every dirty perverted detail. He spilled lots that he didn't need to. After confronting her and letting her know I know the level of low she stooped to, and all she could lose, she got the pic loud and clear.
Lastly, I permitted her to contact my husband whenever she felt like it bc the day he takes the call, the day our M is over and I no longer play the nice way.
[This message edited by Hatemyhusband at 3:51 PM, July 11th (Friday)]
The OW in my situation is a co-worker of H. I worked at same company in a different division and knew her for years. Luckily I have moved on and don't have to see her anymore on a regular basis.
She chased my husband full force and he fell for her crap!! I saw red flags, ignored at first then investigated and discovered! It took my WH a long, long very painful time to come clean. I still to this day do not have the whole story. I choose to move on! I had to get her out of my head!
She was never sorry, remorseful and treated me bad, after all I did for her! I still have to see her sometimes. I pretend she doesn't exists as best I can, as does my husband! She is still trying to get his attention when we end up in the same place. When we are around she talks extra loud and turns around in her seat constantly starring our way. She is hard to pretend to miss sometimes, as she is a very loud and look at me type person.
The good thing, when she is around (and other times) my husband is so loving and touchy and sweet. Always holding my hand or putting his arm around me. He makes me feel so loved now a days whether she is around or not! When she turns around in her seat she gets to see how well we are healing and how loving we are to each other. This makes me feel good!! She can watch all she wants!!
Flip side of this.......how painful is this for the wayward to have to face? In your sitch Hatemyhusband, your husband must deal with the fact that he destroyed a family he bonded with too. Or maybe better said....the fact remains he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its entirety is up to him.
This is true for me. I don't know if it adds to the discussion, but I wanted to let blakesteele know he's right on the mark.
If I was willing to risk my BW, my M and my kids, destroying the life of another family came pretty easy. I hurt so many people that are close to me, people who have taken me in as family.
he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its entirety is up to him.
t/j: there's no way my WS has even considered this. He looked blank when I asked him about it.
so then what?
Sigh...I have so far to go on this topic.
I was even going to be sat next to him on the plane!
Lives on the same street, 2 houses away. Walk to school every day.
Its just horrible, a special kind of horrible.