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User Topic: MC when I'm not ready for it??
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm almost 11 months post D-Day and the Year Two anger is hitting me full force. I just went through the Plain of Lethal Flatness and am sort of still in it, probably. I vacillate between loving and hating my fWH, but I've mostly gone solo with my situation. I still share my thoughts and feelings with fWH because I know it's healthy and necessary for my M to heal, but I no longer have this driving need to understand how and why he did what he did, or need him to feel a certain way, respond a certain way, etc. I just don't really care all that much anymore what's in his head. I'm just pissed. Mad at myself for letting him treat me like shit for the past seven years and horrified and pissed off that the monster inside him spun me into over half a decade of trauma/betrayal bonding that I now have to unravel. I'm an awesome person who grew up with loving parents and self-confidence. How the hell did I let some broken person take his dark, demented dysfunction out on me like I'm his personal garbage bag? The answer is we've been sweethearts since I was 18 and there was a whole lot of wonderful in him for the first 20 years. Something snapped in him in 1997, though, and he embraced his diseased relationship with alcohol. His alcohol abuse stayed lower on the spectrum until about seven years ago and then it escalated to the point where he began rage drunks. For a couple years it was just spitting venomous, scarring words at me that he "didn't remember" the next morning and would at least appear to feel bad. Then it turned into physical violence. Glazed drunk eyes staring at me with a heaving hatred and contempt of me, pacing, advancing and retreating, then launching at me with big violent strides and two raised arms that would slam into me. My fWH is a very strong man and outweighs me by A LOT. Terror? Oh, there is no definition for that word that can match the terror of my H's drunk fury. I would go flying backwards into whatever was in my path. One time it was our children's bikes in the garage and when I landed I thought I broke my arm. This happened for 18 months until I woke up one morning, looked him in the face with cold hatred and said if he ever laid one hand on me again he would choke on my dust. He magically stopped hitting me. Never again. But the drinking got worse and the harder I tried to get him to stop drinking the more belligerent he became about his drinking. Nothing broke through to him until I busted him on Labor Day in the middle of one of his all day long drinking/sexting orgies with his AP. It took his humiliation of having his wife bust him in front of our neighbors and children with a naked woman on his cell phone and a knock down/drag out fight over his phone that covered a lot of territory in the house with me screaming at him. The two of them were disgusting immoral broken drunks.

So, after a whole bunch of IC for me and my fWH, FINALLY with blinders off seeing his wretched behavior in all its horrific glory, did a 180. Stopped drinking, terrified of any interaction of any sort with women, groveling in shame and remorse, begging me to stay, begging me to give him another chance, begging me to let him earn my trust and love back. He's really, really wonderful again and after all these months I really believe he will never go back to that horrid monster he insists he killed.

Here's my dilemma… my IC is now my MC. She graduated me from therapy and is now directing us in MC. We're meeting for the second time this afternoon to start a course of therapy inspired by researcher/author John Gottman. I found the book and it's awesome, but I feel like it's 6 months or a year too soon for me. I'm still trying to reverse years of Stockholm Syndrome and right now I want my fWH at arm's length. I eventually want to find intimacy with him again and I hope to God I can fall in love with him again. But right now I'm sexually anorexic and maybe it's deeper than that. Maybe it's intimacy anorexia. With him.

Question: Do I go through this cumbaya MC, go through the actions, so that love and intimacy will eventually follow? And parallel that with reconciling in my own private personal hell that his former self was my sexual predator who performed unspeakable crimes against me? This whole thing is so absurd and surreal. I just want off this freaking crazy train.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
1Faith
♀ Member
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 10:35 AM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello WabiSabi

Sorry that you are still going through the roller coaster. It is a process, for sure.

As you have read; 2-5 years on average to heal. Lots of ups and downs.

I am glad to read that you have had some peace return to your life. I am glad that you have stopped being placed in harms way.

Do I go through this cumbaya MC, go through the actions, so that love and intimacy will eventually follow?

Like with anything - MC is a process too. I would suggest trying it for a few sessions to gage your feelings. To see what you are or aren't getting out of it.

I would not say the objective of MC would be for love and intimacy to return. That may or may not happen. It could be a bi-product that you start to feel closer to your FWH but it may not happen either.

Curious, could the objective be that you are going to invest some time in figuring out if you can or even want rebuild a different marriage when so much hurt has occurred?

Hang in there. One way or another you will make it through to the other side. You will, I promise.

Hugs and prayers.



"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1182 | Registered: Apr 2013
tired girl
♀ Member
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 11:04 AM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hear a lot of anger in your post towards your H about the way you were treated in your M. Does your H know that you feel this way?


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5044 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
seethelight
♀ Member
Member # 43513
Default  Posted: 11:22 AM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wabisabi

There are many psychologists who are now starting to recognize that cheating is a form of emotional abuse.

Your husband in the past was also physically abusive.

You have a right to be very angry and I think your anger is healthy.

My psycholgists told me that when I started to get angry about my husband's cheating he was less concerned about me than when I was sad.

The anger is a self protective mechanism.

I agree with the advise to try a few sessions to see how things go.

You don't have to continue, if you don't feel it is productive.

I am sorry you are here. It is very confusing to have someone you love dearly treat you so badly.


“If two people truly have feelings for one another then they don’t have an affair. They get a divorce and they sort out their feelings. You are accountable for the people you hold hostage in a marriage when your mind and heart refuse to fully commit

Posts: 1348 | Registered: May 2014
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:01 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1Faith… That's a good way to look at it. I feel less pressure if I remove the expectation of a certain response. Just thinking of it the way you suggested has me feeling lighter and more mentally nimble. Thank you.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:05 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TiredGirl… for the most part, my H does know, but I try to tell him in a compassionate way that is productive. But since there's not a good way to reveal my deep rage and hatred that's stewing deeper down without crushing him he doesn't fully understand the true levels of my emotions. And the honest revelations of emotions that I do show him never seem to stick in his head, anyway. He dumps what he can't process and my hurt and anger are a result of behavior he's truly ashamed of. Therefore, he dumps it out of his head.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
tired girl
♀ Member
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 12:11 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Then MC could be a really good place for you to process these emotions with him. A good MC will help to get these emotions across so that you feel heard and he can process them.


Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5044 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:12 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

seethelight… it is abuse. Because I've been abused for so long I know abuse when I receive it. At least now I do. I did then, too, but on a subconscious level. Now it's an active radar and I've become sort of a crack shot at sensing it. Infidelity smells, looks, and feels like abuse. The same as my sexual abuse, verbal abuse, and physical abuse. I can tell you it all hits similar emotional pain receptors. Unfortunately, my H thoroughly nailed all categories.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:13 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TiredGirl… "Then MC could be a really good place for you to process these emotions with him. A good MC will help to get these emotions across so that you feel heard and he can process them."

That's exactly what I'm hoping for!!


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:14 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah!!! I just hit 50 posts. That means I've been promoted in SI, right?


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
seethelight
♀ Member
Member # 43513
Default  Posted: 3:43 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wabisabi:

Why not try the counseling for a few session?

Discussing the physical abuse should definitely be on the agenda.

Letting off some steam about it with the guidance of a counselor will be helpful


“If two people truly have feelings for one another then they don’t have an affair. They get a divorce and they sort out their feelings. You are accountable for the people you hold hostage in a marriage when your mind and heart refuse to fully commit

Posts: 1348 | Registered: May 2014
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 12:22 AM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

seethelight… it was an absolutely amazing counseling session. I was wound up in an emotional ball and my therapist could tell. She drew me out and let me vent. She could see I was holding back, so pulled it aaaaaall out of me. My therapist brilliantly interpreted everything I was saying and feeling to my H as it was pouring out of me to make sure he understood the depth of my pain and the grievousness of what he did. The whole experience blew me away. I swear I would hand over every asset I own to have that experience. If my H didn't get it before he certainly gets it now. It was powerful. I stand corrected for questioning my therapist's experience and skills. She was brilliant.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WhatsRight
♀ Member
Member # 35417
Default  Posted: 9:25 AM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am a true believer in seeking help even if you don't feel ready – specifically BECAUSE you don't feel ready.

I equate it with myself and my situation with fitness. I know I should begin to exercise routinely again. But I don't really FEEL like exercising because I have not done it in so long. But, I cannot wait until I feel like exercising again before I start back. I will not feel like exercising again until I have pushed myself to begin the process.

The very fact that I don't FEEL like improving myself lets me know that that is exactly what I need to do.

We can't wait to go to church until we feel right with God – in many cases, going back to church will help us feel more "right" with God.

Just my humble perspective.


"Noone can make you feel inferior without your concent." Eleanor Roosevelt

I will not be vanquished. Rose Kennedy


Posts: 1889 | Registered: Apr 2012
seethelight
♀ Member
Member # 43513
Default  Posted: 9:37 AM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wabisabi

I am relieved to hear that the counseling session went well, and that you found an excellent counselor.


“If two people truly have feelings for one another then they don’t have an affair. They get a divorce and they sort out their feelings. You are accountable for the people you hold hostage in a marriage when your mind and heart refuse to fully commit

Posts: 1348 | Registered: May 2014
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 10:15 AM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Few things. IMHO

I'd use a neutral MC, not your IC. Someone ur IC and his IC briefs and stays in touch with about your delicate situation

Harsh question- if you don't want to be intimate, affection with this man again, hat exactly are you looking for in a marriage? He'd be more like a Room mate, friend.

Is he no longer drinking? Drinkin would be 100%off limits w me. Physical harm totally off limits.

You've got a lot to get over and it will take a while. My H doesn't drink much, but one time he was drunk and I embarrassed him in front of his lover (no idea she was at time)
He grabbed my arm and bruised it throwing me against wall.

I saw an atty next day. Took pics and told him he is no longer allowed to drink near me and if touches me again, goodbye. No second chance


Posts: 351 | Registered: Dec 2013
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 7:20 PM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WhatsRight… I'm definitely a firm believer in that now. Inspired by all the great feedback I got yesterday I approached our MC session with that attitude. Sort of like show up, put energy into it, and see where it goes as it plays out. I had no idea I would have so much processed out of me. I could feel it as it whooshed out. Very powerful and a moment where I felt truly a champion for myself.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 7:21 PM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

seethelight… me, too.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
WabiSabi
♀ Member
Member # 43489
Default  Posted: 8:24 PM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hatemyhusband… I love (not sure that's the right word?) my therapist so much that I trust her judgment and guidance and am following her lead. Since I'm a huge people pleaser I will qualify my endorsement of her as not a love fest, but rather a deep connection with another human being that speaks to me and heals me on a soulful level. I know when I leave after my hour or two with her I've had a lot of moving pieces shifting and healing deep inside me. I have been to four therapists and she blows the other three away. Also, because of having spent so many weeks/months with me she knows the scope and magnitude of my abuse, so she's wiser to what I need as we work on healing our M. My therapist completely gets what my H did, she sees his faults, and she sees what's good in him, and what I want in all of this is what is driving this ship. It's all on the table and we're all on the same page. It's also the only way this is going to happen since my H refuses to go to any therapy without me right next to him and he doesn't want multiple therapists. He's too scared.


"Harsh question- if you don't want to be intimate, affection with this man again, hat exactly are you looking for in a marriage? He'd be more like a Room mate, friend."


I'm not sure which order to place these in as far as the weight they carry in my decision to stick this out, so I'm going to just list them.

1. You wrote perfectly a week or so? ago what's at stake if you leave your M. Your words were that you would watch your children's lives crumble. My children's lives would crumble.

2. Peggy Vaughan (and others) have said not to make any major life changing decisions for two years.

3. This is also answering your next question… he's no longer drinking. He's an alcohol abuser who binged badly when out socially, and is not an alcoholic. So he just stopped cold turkey.

4. I'm taking a day at a time with the hope that one day I will have the desire and emotional health to be sexually intimate with him again.

5. He stands before me with a terrified face promising to give me all the time in the world for anything I need, including not touching me intimately if that's what I need.

6. I love him and want a happy and healthy M one day. I deleted the word "again" in that sentence, because I'm not sure how healthy we ever were. But we were happy.

Every day is a day of being true to myself, listening to my heart, and being patient for where I am in that moment. Right now I'm recoiling from all that he has done to me and the only way he is safe to me is if he doesn't get to come inside. I'm a fortress locked up while I heal myself. And, as far as any future abuse goes, I have a wrathful Poseidon inside me that will come out with a discharge so fast and so powerful my H won't have the next breath in his lungs before I nail him to the wall. And. He. Will. Be. GONE. Poof. In unrecognizable pieces. Because I'm awake. For the time being I'm just me. I'm Andrea. I'm a mom adoring her children, but more importantly a 45 year old woman finding her identity and value and getting to truly know and love herself. Meanwhile, my H is my friend and roommate while he courts me and earns my trust and love back.


Wabi Sabi… the beauty in imperfection. Struggling every day to find it.

Me: BW (45) Him: fWH (48) 3 kids M 21 yrs
7 mths INTENSE Sexting A w/COW (they sickly fantasized about ME)
D-day: 9/2/13
TT: Until 12/2013 (I read their deleted texts/Vomitted)


Posts: 116 | Registered: May 2014 | From: Midwest
Skan
♀ Member
Member # 35812
Default  Posted: 8:34 PM, July 22nd (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm so very, very glad that you went. And that you are re-discovering the awesome woman that you were, and that you are, and that you are in the process of becoming. For survivors of abuse, having someone to connect to, that they can trust, is non-negotiable. I'm glad that you found that person. (((hugs)))


Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012



Posts: 4915 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California
FixYou71
♀ Member
Member # 42654
Default  Posted: 4:19 AM, July 23rd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was going to reply the same as others...to go with the outlook that it's just a trial to see what it's like and how you like it. Sooo glad you went and got so much out of it. Sounds great to have a sort of mediator to help relay those things that are so deep inside you.
I have heard it mentioned a few times that couples shouldn't have the same C for IC and MC. In your case, because of the extreme degradation and vileness of what was perpetrated on you, I think having the IC who knows your situation intimately is best for you. I would imagine it would be much more excruciating to have to explain all the details of what happened again to another stranger, hope they get it and then worry if they're even good enough to handle the MC sessions effectively. Yours definitely is a heavy, heavy situation.
I had a little flutter when I read how much it helped you. I imagined your relief at having help relaying to your H the devastation and the feelings that came out of it. The one thing we all as BSs want more than anything is to know our WS 'gets it.' It is so pertinent for healing. They need to know the depth of the damage. They need to be able to feel our pain as if it was their own. They need to be familiar with all the nuances of our pain that cause different invasive thoughts and fears. It is an incredibly lonely and isolating feeling if they don't. So glad you're on your way to him getting it.
(((WABISABI))).


BS: 43
H: 49
Dday #1 Oct 2007 (Porn for 2 yrs)
Dday #2 May 2013 (Porn for 5 more yrs))
Dday#3 May 2014 (finally admitted to drunk kissing OW in 1994: the 2nd drunken kiss with another woman during our M)
DD 21 and DS 17
Married 1993

Posts: 451 | Registered: Mar 2014
Topic Posts: 26
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