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Wayward Side Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: cheat while in love
islesguy
♂ Member
Member # 38090
Default  Posted: 1:05 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS Welcome

My BS says that if you are truly in love with someone you would never want to kiss another person and it wouldn't be possible to cross that boundary. I don't know how to respond because I know how much I love her but yet I did this over and over again.

I really don't want to go back to a discussion all of my issues and why I would want to cheat with another girl. I feel like I have an understanding there and although related I really want to focus on the question I ask below.

I really want to know what you think. Do you think it possible for you to be in love with someone and yet cheat with someone else?


Me: WH
Father of 3 beautiful girls

* I am a RS (Recovering Scumbag)
* Do as I say, NOT as I did. :-(
* I acknowledge the grace I have received. I know do not deserve it.


Posts: 228 | Registered: Jan 2013
painfulpast
♀ Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS here - imo, no. When you love someone, you want them to be happy. You want to do whatever you can to make that happen. You consider how things will affect your relationship with them, because it's the most important relationship you have, and you protect it, and them.

When you cheat, you may want to keep your wife - you may like being married and admire her as a person, but love? No, there's no love when cheating, for anyone.

Again - my opinion


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1898 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
somethingremorse
♂ Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 1:14 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You should check out this thread from yesterday: "In and Out of Love"

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=537488&HL=42047


Me: WH (42)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 608 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
nokidding
♀ Member
Member # 16242
Default  Posted: 1:14 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS says that if you are truly in love with someone you would never want to kiss another person and it wouldn't be possible to cross that boundary.

That's the stuff they tell you in movies and crappy romance novels. It's not real life and it can, and does, happen.

It's about compartmentalization. My FWH would lay down his life for me and our family, of this I have no doubt. But a little something on the side?? Well, that's not REALLY hurting anyone, is it?

Counseling would help you two navigate the waters here.


Fuck Barbie....and her shoes.

Posts: 2591 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: SE PA
islesguy
♂ Member
Member # 38090
Default  Posted: 1:22 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks somethingremorse,

That was also my thread but I didn't feel satisfied with it. I probably should have just continued that one.


Me: WH
Father of 3 beautiful girls

* I am a RS (Recovering Scumbag)
* Do as I say, NOT as I did. :-(
* I acknowledge the grace I have received. I know do not deserve it.


Posts: 228 | Registered: Jan 2013
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 1:24 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I guess it depends on your definition of love. There are people in love who have open or polyamorous relationships. There are people who are in love that harm those they love all the time. My view is when you are committed to someone, and have taken mutual steps to exclusivity and monogamy, then I could see how going outside of that relationship wouldn't be seen as "loving" by the partner. This debate comes up a lot on SI. I think it's anecdotally obvious that love doesn't prevent cheating.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3999 | Registered: Dec 2011
cdnmommy
♀ Member
Member # 30182
Default  Posted: 1:25 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really want to know what you think. Do you think it possible for you to be in love with someone and yet cheat with someone else?

I really don't think so. I have no doubt you can have feelings of love for someone and still cheat, but "being" implies presence, care, and concern. Cheating certainly doesn't qualify.

I find it hard to separate the feeling of love from the action of being loving. My H, on the other hand is, or at least was, able to compartmentalize the two. If your BS is like me, then you won't be able to explain it, except to say that what you believed and how you acted did not align.


Me: BW
DDay: Oct 2010 + 6 weeks false R
2.5 (+?) year A with married coworker/my "friend"
1 great kid.
Reconciling and healing

Posts: 1741 | Registered: Nov 2010
islesguy
♂ Member
Member # 38090
Default  Posted: 1:28 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nokidding,

It's about compartmentalization.

So, you feel that someone in love with someone can compartmentalize cheating, especially when the BS is not aware, so the WS doesn't see the damage of the cheating.


Me: WH
Father of 3 beautiful girls

* I am a RS (Recovering Scumbag)
* Do as I say, NOT as I did. :-(
* I acknowledge the grace I have received. I know do not deserve it.


Posts: 228 | Registered: Jan 2013
steppingup
♂ Member
Member # 42650
Default  Posted: 1:53 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WW cheated on me more times than I want to remember but she would always say, "I never wanted to hurt you, I have always loved you".

To me the "Love" she spoke of is the same kind of love you can attach to other family members like Sister, Brother, etc.

But the "love" she felt for me the day of our wedding would surely be too strong to allow her to cheat, so I have to believe that the "love" she speak of is not the romantic love but just the Agape type of love that we should show others in general.

That said, you should not be able to cheat on someone and AGAPE them at the same time, that is twisted in my opinion.

For some, the curisoty, or thrill of "having" another person is far too tempting when character and boundries are not well established.

Its almost like, before the marriage certificate is printed, the two people need to have a "boundires in Marriage" class.

Of course "PAINFUL PAST" always hits the nail on the head.

[This message edited by steppingup at 2:00 PM, August 1st (Friday)]


Her (WW 40s) Me (BH, 40s) very young DS & DD

“Whatever follows after DD is much more crucial than the infidelity action itself” Quote by SI Member Melian40

"I'm a good man, not an option" - Steppingup


Posts: 498 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: CALI
steadfast1973
♀ Member
Member # 24719
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My fwh loves me. And he ever wanted to hurt me. But, he did. He was blinded by his own pain. (At least, the avoidance of it.)


Me- 40- BS Him- 36- WH D-day#1 5/25/09 3 mo. EA d-day#2 11/06/13 Prostitute 11/5/13 in R
"I've seen your flag on the marble arch, our love is not a victory march, it's a cold and broken hallelujah."- Leonard Cohen

Posts: 2286 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: Midwest
nokidding
♀ Member
Member # 16242
Default  Posted: 2:45 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, you feel that someone in love with someone can compartmentalize cheating, especially when the BS is not aware, so the WS doesn't see the damage of the cheating

Yes, 100%. It's isn't all about compartmentalization, but that is a huge part of it. It's how good, honest people, make really poor decisions. Lack of boundaries, not withstanding.

I don't doubt for 1 minute that my FWH didn't love me the whole time. Oh sure, there was a ton of marriage rewrite, and fog, the whole 9.

It isn't different for the televangelists that praises the Lord 90% of the time, and spend the other 10% in a strip club.

He truly did not see what he did as harming me, our family, our future, and himself. And he's a pretty smart guy, trust me


Fuck Barbie....and her shoes.

Posts: 2591 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: SE PA
nokidding
♀ Member
Member # 16242
Default  Posted: 2:52 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm sorry, I also wanted to add. This is not a Get our of Jail Free card. It doesn't absolve you of any wrongdoing.

You have to own 100% of your decisions, and 50% of a broken marriage.

I am just trying to explain how 'The Recipe' works


Fuck Barbie....and her shoes.

Posts: 2591 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: SE PA
Brentwood
♀ Member
Member # 27465
Default  Posted: 3:07 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nokidding, did your FWH do what you needed him to do to help you heal? I ask because I want to believe that my FWH also loved me. I know he compartmentalized. But he won't do what I need to heal so how can I believe he ever loved me?

Sorry to T/J islesguy.


Me BW (59) What?!?!
Him BH (59)

Posts: 168 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: S. California
bionicgal
♀ Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 3:13 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

There seems to be a sentiment that you can't love someone and hurt them at the same time.

If you buy that affairs are more self-destructive, and more a harm to the self than the spouse, then it is entirely possible to love your spouse and cheat on them. I happen to believe that my H loved me during his affair, while he was acting extremely unloving. I also strongly believe that his AP still loved her husband. (The AP even purported to love me, but that is another matter; I know she cared about me.)

Now, is the love one has in an affair for one's spouse necessarily healthy or fully developed/realized? No. Of course not. But, as my husband so adamantly explains, the affair was not about me, so his feelings about me at the time had so very little to do with it.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2054 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes, I believe you can cheat whilst still loving your spouse/SO.

I agree with the compartmentalization. Also, immaturity, selfishness, FoO issues, and other poor coping mechanisms play into self soothing, having nothing to do with your relationship and everything to do with the WS themselves.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 9792 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
painfulpast
♀ Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 3:52 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I disagree with those in the 'compartmentalization' camp. I love my husband. I couldn't shove him in one box in my brain and then open another. Why? Because I love him, always.

To me, if you're able to shove someone out of your mind to the point that you allow another to replace them, even in spurts, you don't love them. You may love the thought of them, or the stability of the relationship, but not them, not at that moment.

I view love as something that can fade in and out. Not in spurts, like an A, but in general. When someone becomes so disenchanted with their life, whether that's why they had the A, or the fog makes that happen, during that time, there is no love for the BS. There may be a feeling of obligation, or duty, to them, but love? Nope - I don't believe it and never will. That doesn't mean that the love can't return, but if you 'forget' that you love someone to such an extent, there wasn't real love for them any longer anyway.

Sorry - I know people will disagree. I don't know if that's because the thought of their spouse not loving them is too much, or because they truly believe that there is love during an A, but I don't. It's too harmful, too disrespectful, too selfish and too damaging.

The only time I would say that there can be love AND an A would be a ONS. That is one event. I do believe a person can get caught up in a moment and still love someone else. Doesn't make it right, but I think it can happen.

However, when a WS looks straight at a BS and lies, that's not compartmentalization. They are being faced with both the BS and the AP in that moment, and every moment when a lie is told. There is intentional, willful betrayal time and again. Why? Because the WS is so concerned with themselves that the BS doesn't matter. That isn't love.


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1898 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 4:19 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't feel you fully understand compartmentalization, painfulpast.

A mistake I made early on in this painful journey of healing from infidelity was believing because I wouldn't be able to do or feel, or think the way my WS did, than it isn't possible for them to really be able to do, feel or think the way they do. The truth is, just because I can't feel and do something doesn't mean a different person can't.


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 9792 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
misskirby
♀ Member
Member # 34594
Default  Posted: 4:19 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I absolutely believe that you can cheat while in love. I know that my fwh loved me through his many affairs. The thing is, what each of us believes defines "love" is different. Is that the way I would have wanted to be loved? Hell no. But I don't doubt that in his mind, it truly would not affect me or our family. Does he see how fucked up that is now? Yeah. But between foo issues and just plain selfishness, that was love to him.

Love is not the same thing to you as it is to me, or as it is to anyone here. Love to each of us is a personal thing. Not to go off on a tangent, but I think that's something that people go into marriage not realizing. I say I'm in love with you, you say you're in love with me, ergo we love each other in the same way. That's just not how it is. To me, love meant many things, one certainly being not cheating. To fwh, love meant not hurting me by letting me find out about his cheating. That's something we had to come to terms with after Dday, and not just the cheating bit.

Anyway. Not saying that that excuses any cheating. Not making excuses for him or you, or anyone. Just saying that I do believe that it's possible.


Me-BS, Late 20's
Him-WH, Late 20's
M 9 years, together 14
DS and DD
D-Day 1/16/12

"Long is the way And hard, that out of Hell leads up to Light" -John Milton, Paradise Lost


Posts: 212 | Registered: Jan 2012
bionicgal
♀ Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 4:41 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

if you allow another to replace them, even in spurts, you don't love them. You may love the thought of them, or the stability of the relationship, but not them, not at that moment.

You are assuming that affairs are about love, which they aren't. They are about escape for the most part - like a drug.

I disagree with those in the 'compartmentalization' camp. I love my husband. I couldn't shove him in one box in my brain and then open another. Why? Because I love him, always.

I am learning that because I can't conceive of something, doesn't make it untrue for someone else. If you hang around the Wayward side, you'll see wayward after wayward saying "it wasn't about my husband" and "I always loved my BS, it was about me." These folks aren't suffering from a mass delusion. I have seen it too many times to think it is an excuse, rationalization or a lie.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2054 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
nokidding
♀ Member
Member # 16242
Default  Posted: 5:44 PM, August 1st (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Compartmentalization can be healthy too. Think about your work life versus your home life. There are folks I have worked with for years, that have no clue I am a mother. I rarely talk about my children, have no photos in my office.

Don't get me wrong. It's not because I don't love my children. It's because it doesn't impact me at work and, frankly, my kids aren't that remarkable. Side note: they are AMAZING, but not in a Wow, that's interesting, kind of way.

Conversely, when my mother asks about my work life, I turn into a petulant teenager, complete with sighs and one word answers. It's because I just don't want to talk about it.

My point? We all compartmentalize.


Fuck Barbie....and her shoes.

Posts: 2591 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: SE PA
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