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Reconciliation Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Earning Forgiveness
Doubts
♀ Member
Member # 40209
Default  Posted: 6:31 AM, August 6th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Exactly how does W.H. earn forgiveness? Just by being a good husband and hoping it all goes away and nobody talks about A?

Posts: 67 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: CA
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:18 AM, August 6th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Not running from it... They go get help to find out why they are so weak of a person they could not be most open to you. They know why they could not keep a vow. They no longer fear. They find the right words to comfort you.. They behave far more open... Nothing is hidden.. Filtering is ok but the right kind of openness. They give you the most heartfelt apology.

They understand now love is a choice and make that choice. Quality time, service, gifts, affirmations, and touch.

They change because they no longer want to be "that person".

They get your pain and understand it will take some time for you to handle it. They take your anger with grace. They endure it to know if they are most quality you can make a choice to forgive...

This is about you too. Look at yourself hard and make sure all you did that could have been different is not repeated. Learn what forgiving means... It takes years for the final part to come.. In the heart.

It will never come without both you being wise to make sure he earns it by his own choice. He changes and you see it... You chane to help him be more safe with sharing with you...

If he has bad values and cannot change, be brave and take refuge to know your faith will pull you through... then have courage to be independent and only be with someone who wants to enjoy life with you, these are the people you want in life... They are welcome in your world... Those who do not make the best effort to love you... Well that is their choice and it is ok to make them not part of your life.

Peace be with you.

[This message edited by trynhard at 7:24 AM, August 6th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 2697 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
BtraydWife
♀ Member
Member # 42581
Default  Posted: 10:27 AM, August 6th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Uh....no. That's not how.

Will he read with you? I recommend
How Can I Forgive You by Janis Spring


Is he wondering what it will take for you to forgive him or is this a question you have?


Me-BW
Him-WH
DD-March 2010
TT for 6 months
Unremorseful for 3.5 years

Delay is the deadliest form of denial. - C. Northcote Parkinson

Your standards aren't up for negotiation just because he/she can't meet them.


Posts: 2336 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: United States
Doubts
♀ Member
Member # 40209
Default  Posted: 8:09 AM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He basically lays low and tries to make it so we never mention his A. He has been a good husband, same as before his A. Let's pretend it never happened and get over it. It was over a year now, I just don't want to get past this. When I mention the A I am just trying to hurt him.
So you can see how confused I am.
Btrayd Wife I have read many books and some have been helpful, but he won't read them. He reads a couple of pages and calls it good.

Posts: 67 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: CA
rachelc
♀ Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 8:16 AM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

have you guys gone to marital counseling or individual counseling? You have a right to ask for anything - you can say: a year of MC/IC, read this book, we talk an hour a week on this or I am gone.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5482 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
JimmyB
♂ New Member
Member # 43976
Default  Posted: 11:29 AM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A year and a half from my last DD and I have only gotten "I apologize for the things I've done, I apologize for lying to you", as an apology from my WW for 25 years of betrayal including at least 4 affairs including a pregnacy and an abortion. While I have been unfaithful as well I made a full confession, she was always caught, never confessed, answered all questions and gave her a very detailed written apology and request for forgivness. I guess what I'm saying is that for more that the minimal amount of forgiveness, what is required for my own healing, a sincere apology, signs of remorse and a request for forgiveness would be the minimum, that would be only the start.


ME: 55 Madhatter, 1 short term PA (kissing only)
WW: 52 Madhatter, 25 year PA (off and on, same OM) 7 year EA, first boyfriend
Married: 33 years, 1981
My DD#1 6/1988, DD#2,3,4,5 1/30/2013
Her DD 3/2013

Posts: 31 | Registered: Jul 2014 | From: Ohio
blakesteele
♂ Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 1:28 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He basically lays low and tries to make it so we never mention his A

Um......yeah. That's not changing. That smells of more under-investing in his M and commitment to you, more "hey, look, it's all good" crap. Same stuff that adds to a persons ability to chose adultery as a viable option.

BUT so much of this is a process. Hopefully he is reading and in therapy. I like the reading together thing...but wife not into that so not part of our journey.


Back to forgiveness.....

Not earned.....it is given. Greatest benefit is to the one giving it, NOT the one recieving it. Forgiveness, like so much of this journey, starts with a choice by the person who was wronged. Then it is a process to actually do it. If the offending party continues to offend....the wise person distances themselves from them, but continues to seek forgiveness towards them.

It sure is nice when the offending partner recognized it....but that's hardly required.
Truthfully, my wife hardly cared if I forgave her or not that whole first year....she was so under invested in her M to me and our family and so hung up on him. Like an addict seeking a drug.

I read Janis book and was counseled by my pastor on forgiveness for MYSELF. Nice to be appreciated by my wife....but it really is for the person choosing it.

My goal remains to grow better not bitter from this trial.

God is with us all.


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4041 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
BtraydWife
♀ Member
Member # 42581
Default  Posted: 1:41 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hmmm....you have yourself an unremorseful rugsweeper.

He has not been a good husband. His behavior is an attempt to keep you from holding him accountable. His actions say that he's not willing to help heal you or your marriage. It's not a priority for him. His #1 priority is his comfort.

Imagine him saying to your face that you don't matter at all to him. That's exactly what he's saying with his actions. His words are only true if his actions match and his do not.

You aren't anywhere near the forgiveness stage. He's still in denial and hoping you'll just shut up about it.

He will never say those words to you though because he's too cowardly. But he tells you with his actions or with his inactions. Listen to his actions, that where the truth is.

He continues to hurt you by not meeting your requirements. He's done the opposite of what he should do to earn your forgiveness.


Me-BW
Him-WH
DD-March 2010
TT for 6 months
Unremorseful for 3.5 years

Delay is the deadliest form of denial. - C. Northcote Parkinson

Your standards aren't up for negotiation just because he/she can't meet them.


Posts: 2336 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: United States
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 2:17 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have to second what btraydwife said.

Forgiveness is a gift, and when you choose to give it, or if you choose to give it, it will be when you have healed, and you feel your M has reached a point of healing. Where there is more good than bad. That being said with the bit you have shared, you won't reach that point without some major changes.

The situation you describe is not R. It is a soul sucking painful thing, and can destroy your spirit. You deserve more, but only you can demand it.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8786 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
blakesteele
♂ Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 6:02 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Forgiveness does NOT mandate that R be offered. R is a gift to a WS. Forgiveness is really a gift to the person achieving it (choosing it).

Peace

[This message edited by blakesteele at 6:03 PM, August 7th (Thursday)]


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4041 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
hopefull77
♀ Member
Member # 43221
Default  Posted: 7:33 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Forgiveness is given in layers....
I just ordered a book called EVERYBODY NEEDS TO FORGIVE SOMEBODY
I am not sure what is holding me back to forgive....not sure if is ego based or what....my H has done and is still doing the hard work....I actually believe he will never make that choice again...but it is fear that holds ME back....fear is exhausting and intoxicating....but I am close and I can feel it...
I wish you peace


me-BS
him-WS
3 adult children 1D 2S
married-1977
LTA 06-2010 - 11-2012
D-day - 11-11-2012
status - reconciling and very hopeful
"Let Go of Control; Let God's Life Flow" ...Richard Rohr



Posts: 675 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: sunny california
peaceBmine
♀ Member
Member # 44060
Default  Posted: 8:30 PM, August 7th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm a firm believer that FORGIVENESS can never be EARNED. It is a gift...and only a gift.

WH can earn the right to stay home and fight for our marriage and maintain a relationship with me and our children, but he can't earn forgiveness. I am choosing to offer this gift of forgiveness to him and I'm choosing to forgive REGARDLESS of his actions. His actions just determine my future actions and our relationship, but have not impact on whether I forgive. Forgiveness is more for my benefit than his.


Me (BS)- 42
Him (WS)- 44
Married 21 years
3 beautiful daughters (18,16,14)
DDay- 4/23/14- 6 month EA turned PA just before DDay

Posts: 343 | Registered: Jul 2014
ScarlettA1
♀ Member
Member # 43533
Default  Posted: 12:50 PM, August 8th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think so. I think forgiveness is only up to the betrayed spouse. It is a gift. Being a wayward I know I will be talking and making amends for my affair for a very long time. I hope someday my husband can forgive me and I hope I can forgive myself. I am responsible for repairing myself and my marriage. Forgiveness will be a bonus.


Be Wise, Be Kind, Be True

WW 47(me)
BH 49
dday 3/19/14
11 mo EA/PA


Posts: 51 | Registered: May 2014 | From: United States
whattheh
♀ Member
Member # 40032
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, August 8th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For me forgiveness has to be earned. For example if my fWH insisted on rugsweeping he would not be trying to earn forgiveness. So in my book he would not be worthy of forgiving until he has proven himself worthy and made more progress.

I don't consider forgiveness a gift. Its more of a process in our case and the process benefits both parties. Our first step was really about acceptance. I haven't fully forgiven but it is within my sight. I feel it coming. Maybe it's my personality but I'm unable to just forgive without work on fWHs part or it wouldn't be real for me.

We read janis springs book together and found it interesting.

[This message edited by whattheh at 1:11 PM, August 8th (Friday)]


BW- mid 50's (me)
fWH-late 50's
M 33 T 35
DD-Early 2013 PA 2010
In R but I have PTSD...

Posts: 586 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
Topic Posts: 14

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