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Newest Member: FeebleHercules (44938)

Just Found Out Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Question of Ethics
homebrewer
♂ New Member
Member # 44686
Default  Posted: 12:26 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, so I've known something was wrong for about a month or so, but couldn't pin anything down as my spouse was deleting evidence. Lately she's been fairly brazen, leaving her phone unattended. I've been taking pictures of text messages that were not deleted. I am very confident this time (been 3 confrontations so far, with the denial and minimizing, etc.) something is definitely going on.
I cannot confirm nor deny sexual intercourse at this time.
The other male is a married coworker, who we've gone boating and camping with him and his wife, with 3 kids, a few times.

We're leaving for vacation this sunday morning, to take our 2yo to the beach.
I'm planning on confronting her about this saturday night. It'll be too late to back out of the reservations. The plan being, I want her to fully realize what she'll be checking out on if she bails on the relationship. I really want to work it out, if we didn't have a beautiful daughter I'd probably just give her the finger and leave. I haven't slept more than 2 hours since monday night, tuesday night I didn't get any sleep at all.

My plan is to confront her and make 3 things happen.
1. I'm taking her phone, which is in my name anyway, and if I can't get it, I can call and have it disabled.
2. I'm sleeping on the couch, I want her to see what an empty bed full of heartache feels like.
3. I want the co-worker's wife to know. If someone knew about my wife and her cohort, and didn't tell me, I would be exceptionally.. displeased.. with them. I would want to know.

Ideally, I want my wife to be the one to call the other wife, and tell her the whole story. I'm not counting on that to actually happen. I've made preparations to be able to contact her myself if needed. I also have all the evidence saved to a space on the internet that I can easily share with her in a moments notice; along with multiple other backups.

My question to all of you is, is it wrong of me to contact the other wife and tell her?
Do you foresee any issues with me sharing the pictures of my wife's contact with the coworker with her?


D-day: 08.25.14

Posts: 24 | Registered: Aug 2014 | From: Midwest
Tom67
♂ Member
Member # 42664
Default  Posted: 12:33 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

no it is not wrong to tell her in fact if you do he may throw your w under the bus to save his m.
Do it!

Posts: 221 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: United States
orbit19
♂ Member
Member # 43920
Default  Posted: 12:35 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Contacting the OM wife is the most important thing you should do its pretty much a guarantee that he will throw your wife under the bus.

"2. I'm sleeping on the couch, I want her to see what an empty bed full of heartache feels like."

NO she sleeps on the couch she is the one that cheated she should be punished for it


Posts: 67 | Registered: Jun 2014
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 12:37 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Please don't have your WW tell her. It will be a slap in the face on top of the betrayal. She won't want to hear this from the woman who has been having sex with her husband.

You need to tell her. Be kind. Offer her a copy of all evidence. Stick to the facts, don't give your opinion about her husband..or she will instinctively want to defend him. Call her..don't email or leave a voicemail. You want to be sure she got the message, and the best way to do that is a phone call.

Absolutely his wife deserves to know. She also, as well as you and your WW, will need to be tested for STD's.

Do not tell your WW that you are going to tell his wife. She will warn OM. He will tell his wife you are crazy, abusive, accusing all male acquaintances of having an affair with your WW,etc.

If possible, call his wife right before you confront your WW. But take her phone first, and her computer so she can't warn OM. That way the two of you can basically confront your spouses at the same time, so neither can warn the other in effort to get their story straight.

Im so sorry you have to deal with this.

Welcome to SI.


BS(me)42
FWH 45
4 kids..21,20,11,10
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Reconciling.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7413 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 12:41 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You are absolutely correct in telling the OW.
I would also tell you that you should tell her, just prior to confronting your wife. By confronting your wife, it gives her and her AP time to corroborate their stories. Do NOT ask her to tell, and do not ask her if you can tell. Just do it.

I would also tell you to do the following along with kicking her out of your bed.
She gets the couch, not you.
She gets a full STD panel, and you get the hard proof that she is negative for all diseases before you have unprotected sex again.
She Sends a NC letter/email etc to him.
If she waivers, tell her youhave an appointment with a D attorney on Tuesday, and go ahead an make that appointment, and go regardless of what she says and does.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8506 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
Tom67
♂ Member
Member # 42664
Default  Posted: 12:45 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sorry I thought YOU were going to tell the omw.
Do not tell your w you are going to do this just do it.
And yes SHE sleeps on the couch.

Posts: 221 | Registered: Mar 2014 | From: United States
Jduff
♂ Member
Member # 41988
Default  Posted: 12:46 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Heed confused615's advice:

Do not tell your WW that you are going to tell his wife. She will warn OM. He will tell his wife you are crazy, abusive, accusing all male acquaintances of having an affair with your WW,etc.


This has been proven to occur time and time again through a majority of our own situations. This is predictable wayward script behavior. I myself was the unknowing spouse and when the OM's wife was about to expose the A to me, my XW did a campaign of "she's such a crazy bitch" right before the exposure and I bought the gaslighting effort hook, line, and sinker. I really thought the OM's wife was crazy and was in full denial. Now I am forever grateful to her for exposing the truth.

When you do tell, be as calm and factual as you can. Expect her to be VERY emotional. At the very least you have evidence of an emotional affair. It typically is the tip of the iceberg that reveals a full on physical affair.


Divorced - 5/23/14
Already in my New Beginning - :)

Posts: 490 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: texas
homebrewer
♂ New Member
Member # 44686
Default  Posted: 12:53 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not really worried about STDs, the other couple has been together since middle school or something. Probably wouldn't be a bad idea anyway, be like salt in a wound for my wife, if anything. Sorry peeps all the acronyms are very overwhelming at this point, you all use too many, it hurts my dyslexia

About the bed, I had considered trying to make her sleep on the couch, but 2 things, I can't, and won't, force her to leave the bedroom. That could end up misconstrued as "physical abuse" or something that could turn against me if a divorce should occur. Secondly, her sleeping on the couch wouldn't have the same affect as her being in our bed alone for the first time in 10yrs this Sept. I try to pick my battles wisely.

I hadn't considered calling the the other wife right before confronting mine. I may have to revise my plan, it's a good idea.

There was a 4th item I forgot to list, but it is more optional than required.
I want to attend marriage counselling when we return from vacation. It's optional because if she refuses, then divorce it is. The guy that sits behind me at work is still going through a divorce and I got his guy's information earlier.


D-day: 08.25.14

Posts: 24 | Registered: Aug 2014 | From: Midwest
BtraydWife
♀ Member
Member # 42581
Default  Posted: 1:08 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

won't, force her to leave the bedroom. That could end up misconstrued as "physical abuse" or something that could turn against me if a divorce should occur.

Um...no it can't. ???????
First time I heard that one. Kinda bizzare but you are hurt so, ok.

You are right to pick your battles but you are picking the wrong ones. Your actions will not get the reaction you are looking for.

You are trying to nice her back and it will fail in an epic fashion. See my 2 long posts in the thread called
Just found out yesterday

You are making classic mistakes and that doesn't have to happen.

Your bargaining makes me sad for you. Please help yourself by reading. You'll see why and how your ideas aren't going to work. We want to help.

Reading your posts is like watching a horror movie when the victim goes into the room the killer is hiding in. Our "NO!" comments are out of concern for you, they aren't us being combative.


Also don't fool yourselves about stds. It's not punishment for her. Lots of married people have stds. The % of the married people with stds is higher when one of them is a cheater. Which is this case exactly.

[This message edited by BtraydWife at 1:13 PM, August 28th (Thursday)]


Me-BW
Him-WH
DD-March 2010
TT for 6 months
Unremorseful for 3.5 years

Delay is the deadliest form of denial. - C. Northcote Parkinson

Your standards aren't up for negotiation just because he/she can't meet them.


Posts: 1758 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: United States
orbit19
♂ Member
Member # 43920
Default  Posted: 1:16 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"Physical abuse" thats bullshit tell her to sleep on the couch

her sleeping on the couch will have much more of an affect than her sleeping in the bedroom

her still sleeping in the bedroom alone is not a consequence for her actions she gets a warm cozy bed and you get a shitty couch.

I think you are trying to nice her out of the affair you need to be willing to blow up the marriage to save the marriage


Posts: 67 | Registered: Jun 2014
confused615
♀ Member
Member # 30826
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok..the other couple has been together since middle school. BUT...the husband is a cheater. The chances of your wife being the only woman he has cheated on his wife with is very slim.

Your wife has had sex with another man..STD testing is not about punishment or embarrassment. It's about making sure you both are healthy. She has had unprotected sex with a man you know is a cheater.

Get tested.

Asking your wife to sleep on the couch after finding out she has had a sexual relationship with another man is not abuse. An affair? THAT, my friend, is abuse. Emotional abuse, obviously. But having sex with someone else is putting your health, and possibly your life, at risk. THAT is physical abuse. We have more than one member who has HIV because their spouse cheated.


BS(me)42
FWH 45
4 kids..21,20,11,10
M: June 2001
D-Day: 8/10/10
Status: Reconciling.

..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.


Posts: 7413 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Indiana
homebrewer
♂ New Member
Member # 44686
Default  Posted: 1:39 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I suppose you're all right. One of the reasons I chose my partner, was because she was so strong willed. You all make it sound so easy, but what do I do, if I tell her to sleep on the couch and she refuses?


D-day: 08.25.14

Posts: 24 | Registered: Aug 2014 | From: Midwest
Tearsoflove
♀ Member
Member # 8271
Default  Posted: 1:40 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would not have your wife call the other wife. I would not want the OW calling me under any circumstances. I once called her husband and she had set up his voicemail and I couldn't get her voice out of my head for days. Further, if your wife calls, she will likely spin and minimize using whatever bullshit story they've already concocted. Your best bet is to call the OM's wife yourself and offer evidence at a time when your wife cannot call the OM to warn him or set up a story.

Oh, and during my husband's second affair, I gave the OW the opportunity to tell her husband herself thinking that would lessen his pain. Wrong. It allowed her to spin her story. He told me afterward he wished I had called him directly and not given her the chance. He would have preferred to catch her off guard with the facts I gave him instead of her having a chance to minimize or distort them.


"Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand." ~Homer Simpson


Posts: 4089 | Registered: Sep 2005
Badhurt
♂ Member
Member # 41947
Default  Posted: 1:52 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'll also add that your wife needs to find a new job or you will be in limbo land with your gut twisting while she is with OM for 10 hours every day of the week.

If you are taking her phone, she can get a burner phone. If she keeps the phone after you download everything you can get cell records or at least have a chance to monitor. A burner phone will make that impossible.

MAKE SURE, as others have said, that you do not give her warning. You must make contact with OM wife and be sure you either spoke to her directly or got your e mail or FB message before saying a word to your wife.

Workplace affairs are the hardest to stop. if OM does not throw her under bus when his wife finds out, you can tell him you will expose it at work to the HR Department.

read the thread called "Fool me Once" and that is what you may face if she stays in that job.


Posts: 1097 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Eastern USA
homebrewer
♂ New Member
Member # 44686
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hear you, but the problem is, my wife makes considerably more than I do. I doubt she'd be able to find another position that makes a similar amount. I believe that my stressing about money issues is what started this mess in the first place. I can't prove that thought. My state of stress induced depression is what I think caused my WS to pursue her emotional needs from the go-lucky co-worker. Maybe, not but again I can't prove it, and she'd never admit to it.

She's not going to get a burner phone, she has an iPhone issued to her by her department; the coworker has one too. I have a photo of her chat messages with him where they both express regret that they couldn't message on it, so they could save the messages from each other.
She has to have that phone for work.

WS: Now I wish you were texting me on my iPhone. I don't want to delete your text.
WS: Sorry if that's weird.
WS: Too weird?

OM: If what was weird?
OM: O...keeping the txt. No that's not weird
OM: I've wanted to keep some of yours

WS: :)

[This message edited by homebrewer at 7:35 AM, August 29th (Friday)]


D-day: 08.25.14

Posts: 24 | Registered: Aug 2014 | From: Midwest
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 2:04 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Also don't fool yourselves about stds. It's not punishment for her. Lots of married people have stds. The % of the married people with stds is higher when one of them is a cheater. Which is this case exactly.

TRUE STORY - See my name? Yah I have seen just about everything and believe me, genital warts, are not something you want.....

The ONE thing you know for SURE is that your wife is an accomplished liar. Accept this fact. When you do it makes it easier to react/plan/prepare.

This shit hurts like hell. We KNOW. We also know that most cheaters work from almost the same exact script. It is amazingly predictable what they will say and do.

So with that said, let me say this..... NO ONE not a s single on of us that has successfully Reconciled (R) and healed our Marriage (M) did not do it by being the nice guy (letting her stay in the marital bed). You have to decide what you are willing to tolerate and what you aren't. When you do that then you can draw your line in the sand.
If you haven't seen an attorney then do it ASAP. Before confrontation if you can arrange it.
I know you are getting advice from a guy at work, but each situation is different, and while you can find out generally how it plays out should you need to D, it's best to have that info from a real attorney, not the guy in the cube next to you....

As far as kicking her out of the bedroom, you tell her she is no longer welcome in your bed until she stops this shit, and proves she is disease free, and makes some real and lasting changes. If she refuses, then you can sleep on the couch, but then take the time to move her shit out of your room, and resume control of the bed.

When you have your confrontation, try to keep your emotions in check, no yelling, no screaming, no crying. Just very flatly tell her what you expect. This cuts through a lot of the wayward spouse (WS) fog.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8506 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
megahertz
♂ Member
Member # 44306
Default  Posted: 2:12 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My state of stress induced depression is what I think caused my WS to pursue her emotional needs from the go-lucky co-worker.

You can be certain that your mental state did not cause your WS to have an affair.


BH: 52
WW: 47 (four APs)
3 kids: DD14, DS12, DD10
D-days: Oct 2012, May 2013, Oct 2013 and July 2014

Posts: 61 | Registered: Jul 2014
Badhurt
♂ Member
Member # 41947
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Does not matter whether you can confirm or not on sexual intercourse. You can bet it has happened. Take Tushnurse's advice and get tested.

The fact that you have had three mini confrontations with her has given her warning that you are suspicious. But instead of being more secretive, she is being more brazen because right now she has all the power in the relationship. She probably believes that even if you catch her you will not leave her. And she has backed you down three times. Money or not, until you change that dynamic you will not be able to stop a workplace affair like this.

Assuming the OM's wife is going to be an unhappy camper when she finds out, she may stop this affair and become a second set of eyes for you. Hopefully, he will be so concerned about saving his own relationship that he will throw your wife under the bus. The worst case scenario is if she does not care or they are in some sort of open marriage. By the way, you are in an open marriage right now but not of your choosing.

Your wife should be furious at you as soon as OM tells her what you have done. Your response is the following:

"I refuse to be in a marriage with three people in it. I cannot control your behavior, but I can control mine. And if you do not agree to the conditions I need to feel safe in our relationship after what you have done, I will have to end our relationship"

Your demands are
TOTAL NO CONTACT - that means if she stays in that job absolutely no contact other than work related issues. No lunches, dinners, and no after work get togethers with co workers if he is present. you will have a very hard time enforcing this. You will need a VAR in her car and a GPS on it.
TOTAL TRANSPARENCY of her social media. You get all passwords. EVERYTHING.
COMMITMENT TO YOU AND YOUR MARRIAGE

If she refuses any of this you need to provide her with real consequences because now she has none.

Do not believe a thing she tells you. You know already she is lying.

My state of stress induced depression is what I think caused my WS to pursue her emotional needs from the go-lucky co-worker. Maybe, not but again I can't prove it, and she'd never admit to it.

The above is bull shit. What caused this is her poor decision to fuck another man instead of working out the problems with you.

you have clear choices here since you know basically what is going on. but you have to do the work and even though it hurts, it is the only way you may stop this affair and save your marriage.


Posts: 1097 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Eastern USA
trustedg
♀ Member
Member # 44465
Default  Posted: 2:49 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would agree with others here, you tell the OM wife, she does not want to hear from the OW (your WW).

Do not tell your WW that you are going to tell his wife. She will warn OM. He will tell his wife you are crazy, abusive, accusing all male acquaintances of having an affair with your WW,etc.

If possible, call his wife right before you confront your WW. But take her phone first, and her computer so she can't warn OM. That way the two of you can basically confront your spouses at the same time, so neither can warn the other in effort to get their story straight.

Don't let either know you are contacting the OM wife, they will have time to warn, cover up, make up something, you don't want that.

STD testing - if he is screwing your wife he has probably screwed others. If you wife is screwing around, it might not be her first either.

This is good advice too -

"I refuse to be in a marriage with three people in it. I cannot control your behavior, but I can control mine. And if you do not agree to the conditions I need to feel safe in our relationship after what you have done, I will have to end our relationship"

Your demands are
TOTAL NO CONTACT - that means if she stays in that job absolutely no contact other than work related issues. No lunches, dinners, and no after work get togethers with co workers if he is present. you will have a very hard time enforcing this. You will need a VAR in her car and a GPS on it.
TOTAL TRANSPARENCY of her social media. You get all passwords. EVERYTHING.
COMMITMENT TO YOU AND YOUR MARRIAGE


BW
WH - 1 yr PA, 25 yrs ago
ONS, 35 yrs ago (came out TT a few days after DD#1)
DDay 12/2012

Posts: 134 | Registered: Aug 2014
BlueBlueEyes
♀ Member
Member # 43949
Default  Posted: 2:52 PM, August 28th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

^^what they said! Your situation has such similarities to all of ours. I've never been more mortified than going in to test for stds, but the medical people are professional and they've heard it all. My Dr. said the other women are pretty blasť about it and that it was nice to see someone who was being proactive with her health though the issue wasn't my doing. That helped some. As a wife, if I'd cheated and my husband told me to take the couch, I'd figure that was better than hit the curb. I called the police to remove my husband as soon as I found the emails. Shocked him and me but was the best thing I ever did. I'm sorry you are going through this. We all hate it but are pretty thankful to have each other for advice. It's hard to think clearly when you're so upset.


BW - 49
WH - 50
Married 30 years
Beautiful Son, Daughter and 2 Grandsons.

OW - multiple, just found out about ALL of them, Husband coming out of years of fog due to multiple childhood and military events.

Hopeful but cautious


Posts: 194 | Registered: Jul 2014 | From: Texas
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