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DDay 2 after 6 years

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runsmiley posted 10/19/2017 14:26 PM

im a 41y BS, met when I was 16/ he was 20,, dated a year, he cheated twice but thought it was age/immaturity. Broke up, remained friends and rekindled ten years later.

Now married for 13y, four kids and I'm a SAHM.

In 2011 we had a mutual friend that was going thru a rough breakup and had medical issues w her baby. I told him they were becoming too close.

DDay 1 was 9/2011 when I found sporadic FB messages between them for months with him asking for videos of self pleasure, how he would delete them even though it was slim chance they would be found all on our wedding anniversary when he was working so we couldn't go out.
He initially denied any of the messages were sent by him, swore on our kids lives, then admitted it, but said it was only an EA, they never met and the flirting got way out of hand.

He promised NC, wanted to work on R, went to MC. I found a few random texts between them a few weeks after and he promised it was over.

Things drifted on over the years, things seemed ok, busy caring for the kids and then he seemed to be pulling away.

DDay 2 was two weeks ago. First I found that he got a massage whe he told me he was going to the chiropractor a month ago. It was a friend of his sisters that he cheated on me over a weekend when I was 16. We've seen this woman at SIL's at parties, she's a licensed therapist and the texts between them were professional but he lied/ommited.

Also found texts with the EA OW. Most were generic but he asked if he was bringing him coffee when he worked one night. He asked her plans night and she said she was supposed to give someone a massage but they (he) never committed. He replied that was typically how it went.

When I asked him about the massage he didn't immediately answer until I gave him a look. He told me he got it, but kept it from me bc I would feel entitled to get my own massage or go out w the girls. I know his appt was at 8 bc he texted when he arrived and he texted me at 9:15 he was on his way home.

He said he didn't talk to OW anymore. That she texted him a few months ago (about buying a new house. Denied any flirting. Then slowly a little TT but only what I kept pushing him with what I had evidence for. I told him he was at least fishing for attention and banter. He told me it was so hard giving up his friendship w her bc they were such good friends. He was willing to do whatever it takes to make it work and that his family means the world to him.

I know he regrets being found out. We had DD get sick at the end of our talk so haven't finished. I told him NC meant absolutely none and if he was hiding something it was wrong.
He deleted her contact from his phone without me asking since this happened. He's in law enforcement so he works sporadic hours. his days are pretty accounted for, he eats meals w the guys he works with (verified w texts) typically, but I know it doesn't take long to meet.

He says he wants our M to work. Wants to take me out, talk and work on our relationship. He's been seeing an IC for a few months sporadically. He's had a bunch of health symptoms (chest pain that's taken him to ER 4 times, arm tingling, feeling ill). The drs haven't been able to find anything medically.

how do you handle plans and such w the kids? We're supposed to go away for a fall festival in two weeks w another family. Holidays, etc. at this point I'm taking it day by day for a bit and seeing what he shows me. Our youngest has some medical issues that a requiring a lot of appts and lots of kid juggling.

I don't think I ever got the entire truth the first time. I'm not totally against working towards R if he can be honest. But I'm not sure he ever will be.

[This message edited by runsmiley at 2:35 PM, October 19th (Thursday)]

nekonamida posted 10/19/2017 14:35 PM

Ask him to take a polygraph. His answer will tell you a lot. Do you have full access to his phone, email, and social media accounts? If not, get it and don't allow him time to delete anything. Run a text recovery program on his phone anyways. There are tons of ways that you can uncover the truth or prompt him to confess.

tessthemess posted 10/19/2017 14:36 PM

There's more, you know it in your gut.

Does he have location services on his gmail account? Is he fully transparent with his phone and devices to you?

You know that he'll only admit to what he has been able to be caught with, and that's troubling.

I was in a similar situation, until I discovered (thanks to her) that it had indeed been physical. Your husband seemingly has been more respectful towards you than mine to me, but I went about it all the wrong way.

Expect nothing, don't hold out hope. Make a plan for yourself. You can't change him. He needs to know how serious you are about this. Can you get a VAR for his car (voice activated recorder)?

Unfortunately his kind of behaviour won't stop without crashing. I'm so sorry.

H3LL0 posted 10/19/2017 14:42 PM

He promised NC, wanted to work on R, went to MC. I found a few random texts between them a few weeks after and he promised it was over.

Things drifted on over the years, things seemed ok

So as the BS, dealing with a cheater is very much about boundaries. You my dear have not established your boundaries yet... unless letting him continue this is part of your boundary??

You know he's still at it... you may feel powerless but you must establish your boundaries. He doesn't respect you because you're allowing him to do this in his mind...

1. NC means NC AND you must audit it... He needs software installed on his electronics to track his internet, phone, text and chat usage. There are products that will alert you if they un-install it as well.

2. He needs GPS enabled tracking so you can see when and where he goes at all times.

3. If he deviates from scheduled activities, he needs to call you right away.

4. You need to establish consequences for failure and stick to them.


You have to remember, that you weren't this psycho who didn't trust her husband and had to know where he was at all times. You are not crazy either to demand this stuff. It is very reasonable for the purpose of re-establishing trust.

If he balks at this or calls you a stalker or crazy then he really doesn't respect you..at all.

runsmiley posted 10/19/2017 15:03 PM

I

take a polygraph.

Since he's a detective I assumed he could pass it? Where would I go about having him take one?

I've been making a list of what I need. NC letter. All PW including Apple ID.

I'm trying to figure out the best way to check his phone. He left his Apple Watch out and no messafes have been deleted, by him, just after a month it seems.

runsmiley posted 10/19/2017 15:55 PM

Does he have location services on his gmail account? Is he fully transparent with his phone and devices to you?

You know that he'll only admit to what he has been able to be caught with, and that's troubling.

I was in a similar situation, until I discovered (thanks to her) that it had indeed been physical. Your husband seemingly has been more respectful towards you than mine to me, but I went about it all the wrong way.

Expect nothing, don't hold out hope. Make a plan for yourself. You can't change him. He needs to know how serious you are about this. Can you get a VAR for his car (voice activated recorder)?

Unfortunately his kind of behaviour won't stop without crashing. I'm so sorry.


I don't know about Google location services. I'm not familiar w it. He has an iPhone and Apple Watch and uses gmail.

Our conversation ended bc of DD being sick. I plan on bringing my list of what I need to him tonight. NC. All passwords. Transparency.

Im considering the VAR.

runsmiley posted 10/19/2017 16:39 PM

So as the BS, dealing with a cheater is very much about boundaries. You my dear have not established your boundaries yet... unless letting him continue this is part of your boundary??

You know he's still at it... you may feel powerless but you must establish your boundaries. He doesn't respect you because you're allowing him to do this in his mind...

1. NC means NC AND you must audit it... He needs software installed on his electronics to track his internet, phone, text and chat usage. There are products that will alert you if they un-install it as well.

2. He needs GPS enabled tracking so you can see when and where he goes at all times.

3. If he deviates from scheduled activities, he needs to call you right away.

4. You need to establish consequences for failure and stick to them.


You have to remember, that you weren't this psycho who didn't trust her husband and had to know where he was at all times. You are not crazy either to demand this stuff. It is very reasonable for the purpose of re-establishing trust.

Yea, that conversation is going to continue tonight. I need to look into what to put on his phone.

His work is all over. I worry it will be hard to track him or know what he's doing. He's on the phone and getting texts all day.

Suggestions for setting boundaries and enforcing? If he doesn't do what I need he's telling me it won't work. But how does the TT relate to That? Do i tell him to leave or tell him it's over?

thatbpguy posted 10/19/2017 16:49 PM

I don't think I ever got the entire truth the first time. I'm not totally against working towards R if he can be honest. But I'm not sure he ever will be.

In a case like this a few things become very clear:

1. He doesn't truly love you.
2. This conduct will continue- I can safely give a 100% guarantee.
3. It's unlikely you have, or ever will have, the real truth of all his betrayals.

So then we ask another question:

Is this the man you want to spend the rest of your life with?

That's it. If it's yes, then help him work on himself while he continues to betray you and learn how to cope. If it's no, then start seeking your escape plan, retain an attorney who specializes in divorce, leave and start the process.

nekonamida posted 10/19/2017 19:11 PM

Since he's a detective I assumed he could pass it?

There are few professions in which someone is taught to pass a polygraph and detective is not one of them. CIA and FBI tend to teach people how to do that. Google "polygraph" + your location to find one.

harrybrown posted 10/19/2017 19:19 PM

how would he like it if you were the one having the A?

he would go crazy!

He is still lying to you by not giving you all the truth.

Tell him that you can't heal without him telling the truth and having boundaries.

oh and by the way, when did you schedule your massage?

NoMercy posted 10/20/2017 07:28 AM

From what I've always seen, heard and read, there seems to be a very high incidence of infidelity in the law enforcement field.

He's got tons of opportunity to get away with all kinds of things and I think it would be extremely naive to believe his story that he's never cheated physically.

I've known many cops over my lifetime and I have to be honest, from everything I've seen, they'll cover each other's asses come hell or high water. So really, don't take to heart too much what his fellow officers tell you about how he eats lunch with them every single day and how he's always at the station reading his Bible.

You can certainly consider a polygraph that YOU book with a polygraph administrator MANY miles away. I wouldn't trust one that he and his cronies set up so if you're going to go the poly route, don't involve him in the process at ALL until he's strapped in the chair. His fellow offices will very lickely give him tips and tricks on how to pass one if you do book one, so that could be an issue.

I have to agree with your statement that you'll probably never get the whole truth from him.

H3LL0 posted 10/20/2017 12:09 PM

Regarding lie detector tests, they are completely subjective and not scientific. They are based on the interviewees physiological responses to the questions they are asked and not necessarily their answers. One who has great control over their bodies or who really believes their own lie can bypass. One who has a heightened sense of morality can also flag false positive. In my opinion, the best thing about the lie detector test is the reputation it has and the moral issue of having to answer formally for their infidelity. I do agree with having it performed outside of that particular county and you arranging it, not him. Great work must go into your discussion with the interviewer of what exactly you are looking for and the more information the interviewer has of what you know to be true can be used during the interview to extract more information and baseline responses provided.

If he doesn't do what I need he's telling me it won't work. But how does the TT relate to That? Do i tell him to leave or tell him it's over?

That's a wonderful question and not one that we can answer for you. I can tell you for me, no job or financial situation would keep me in a relationship where my wife is cheating. I moved my family across the country at risk to my job to get away from the toxic environment she was in. This is where the boundaries that I have you such a hard time about are so important. He doesn't want to stop cheating, its a drug hormonally. You must plant your feet to the point he realizes how serious it is. Some wake up while others say no and go their own way. What are you willing to put up with? I told mine to get out of the house and leave the children while she was still cheating. (she was with a 2x convicted child molester). She would lie about being finished but still contact men. I didn't have the backbone to physically kick her out (she threatened me with abuse accusations) So I resorted to voice activated recorder to catch her admit I had never abused her and being a hacker, every time she reached out to a man, I'd copy their texts and provide them to our pastor, counselor and some of her closest friends (who were not for her doing this) I did that 4 times and she became physically enraged and battered me. Punched me in the nose, bit my chest and tore off my shirt, clubbed me in the head with a metal object and the fourth punched me and tried to stab me with a pen. Each time she did that, I stood there and put my hands to my side or behind me and took it. After she was done, I prayed for her out loud begging God to reach her and heal our family. I told her that I was her husband and would never lay a finger against her to harm her even if she killed me. Asked her to think about our children though with me dead and her in prison for the rest of her life. There is no excuse for domestic abuse either way. I'm not a very large man but am tough enough physically and mentally to handle it. Not an excuse but I know her and knew that this behavior was not who she was and that she was in the fog and just like a drug addict, I was taking her away from her drug. She accused me of mental abuse for telling others and I told her under no circumstances as her husband would I allow her to whore around with other people while she was around our children or under my roof. If she wanted to do that, she needed to put on her big girl panties and leave. Being a penetration tester I told her that I would watch everything she was doing electronically and would tell anyone who would listen should she continue and if she didn't like it to leave.

All this to say is it could be that your husband needs to change his job. LE at least on the road, has revolving schedules in every and any kind of hour not counting private jobs to get additional overtime. There are other areas, federal or other types of LE that don't have that type of schedule. Based on your description, he's not going to jump on that bandwagon without some serious "encouraging" on your behalf to let him know how important that is to you. But understand, it could be at the cost of your relationship. What are your boundaries though, what are you willing to live with? I'm not saying it has to be his career but what will it take for him to stop cheating... or for him to want to stop?

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 11:53 AM

Does he have location services on his gmail account? Is he fully transparent with his phone and devices to you?

I hve his gmail account into, but not sure about the location services. I can't seem to figure it out. He put himself on find my friends. I was hoping to grt access to texts via Verizon messenger. But when I requested to set it up it said the f
Verification was wrong. He the text and got pissy. Said I'm looking for things that aren't here. Im driving myself crazy trying to find something. He got to work 15m later and texted me the pw to the Verizon account but theres nothing on it except number of minutes and texts. It's a business account and he's not the person in charge.

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 11:56 AM

1. He doesn't truly love you.
2. This conduct will continue- I can safely give a 100% guarantee.
3. It's unlikely you have, or ever will have, the real truth of all his betrayals.

I'm still not sure on this. There's a good chance he doesn't love me the way I need. Im pondering my next moves. We have four little ones and I SAHM so need to get my ducks in a row.

tessthemess posted 10/23/2017 11:57 AM

On his gmail account click on the little box of squares to the left of his icon (top right hand of the screen) go to maps. click on the three lines (the menu) beside the search bar and click on 'your timeline'. Provided he did not turn off location settings you should be able to see everywhere his phone has ever gone back in history.

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 11:58 AM

I've known many cops over my lifetime and I have to be honest, from everything I've seen, they'll cover each other's asses come hell or high water. So really, don't take to heart too much what his fellow officers tell you about how he eats lunch with them every single day and how he's always at the station reading his Bible.

The lunch info is based off texts from his phone. I agree there's a high amount of infidelity in LEOs.

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 12:09 PM

All this to say is it could be that your husband needs to change his job. LE at least on the road, has revolving schedules in every and any kind of hour not counting private jobs to get additional overtime. There are other areas, federal or other types of LE that don't have that type of schedule. Based on your description, he's not going to jump on that bandwagon without some serious "encouraging" on your behalf to let him know how important that is to you. But understand, it could be at the cost of your relationship. What are your boundaries though, what are you willing to live with? I'm not saying it has to be his career but what will it take for him to stop cheating... or for him to want to stop?

He's a detective and only works there. He's has a good amount of flexibity to come home when I need help w juggling kids, but he was working a lot of OT. He had been offered a promotion working 40hrs, but making less than his current salary bc of the lost OT. I told him to take it bc he's been so burnt out the last year or so (his best friend died 2 years ago) that the pay cut was worth his quality of life.

As far as boundaries, he's NC, answering questions (questioning if it's the total truth), answering my questions,giving me passwords, on find my friends, telling me his plans, going to church w us.

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 12:22 PM

On his gmail account click on the little box of squares to the left of his icon (top right hand of the screen) go to maps. click on the three lines (the menu) beside the search bar and click on 'your timeline'. Provided he did not turn off location settings you should be able to see everywhere his phone has ever gone back in history.

Thanks. Turned it on now. I checked his gmail and it didn't send a notification. Hope it doesn't later. There's nothing in the timeline though.

runsmiley posted 10/23/2017 13:36 PM

On his gmail account click on the little box of squares to the left of his icon (top right hand of the screen) go to maps. click on the three lines (the menu) beside the search bar and click on 'your timeline'. Provided he did not turn off location settings you should be able to see everywhere his phone has ever gone back in history.

So I turned it on via google, but his location isn't showing up. Any idea what I need to change on his phone? Would changing it on his Apple Watch work?

H3LL0 posted 10/23/2017 14:17 PM

Google can be your best friend for some of this... something like enable google location services on iphone...

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