SurvivingInfidelity.com Forums
Just Found Out
User Topic: So, So Confused
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 3:07 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

I have been meandering on this site for a couple of days. I am light years from beginning to understand all the two-letter lingo people use on this site (wish there was a glossary somewhere).

I am a 52-year-old professional who is trying desperately to get over my wife's infidelity. For now, I'll spare the details, as it could go on a long time. But suffice to say, the hurt never leaves. And no matter how tearful I get, I can't even get a sympathetic hand on a shoulder. I have shook from crying so hard, and all I get are snide remarks about what her parents did to her when she cried.

Worse, she is taking few steps to try to put this behind us. On the one hand she keeps insisting it's over, but about once-a-week there has been a new discovery of her latest communication with "him." And I now feel I have totally lost the ability to tell her that ALL communication with him must and will stop.

I know I am dealing with a female version of a mid-life crisis here, with all she has been doing. But she refuses marital counseling, and what little counseling she has sought for herself, she has admitted she hasn't come within 100 miles of admitting to this person what she's done.

Still, I love her. I have committed myself to a daily list of goals of things that will try to improve our marriage and will be directed towards her. I don't let a day go by without telling her I love her.

But she continues to do next to nothing. She seems annoyed she even has to repeat the words, "I'm sorry." She gives every sign of someone who is desperately trying to put life back to what it was before the affair.

I even took a work leave of absence to do what I had to do to get her counseling and put us on the road to recovery. We've now been home exactly five weeks, I am back to work, but I'm not at all convinced that anything is either changed or better.

Worse, I am starting to lose my will to keep fighting for this marriage. I spend most of my time around her at home either working for her or walking on egg-shells, afraid to say the wrong thing.

I literally find myself acting like the person who committed the affair is supposed to act (at least, I think so). Which means she both gets to have the affair and seems utterly unaffected by what it has done.

Her two daughters have essentially disowned her over this, and STILL it hasn't done much except to annoy her.

I just don't know what to do next except trying to find patience I seem to be running out of, and trying to do more of what I have been doing.

But what can one do where a spouse may finally "GET IT"?


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
2oldforthis
Member
Member # 19825
Default  Posted: 3:12 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

First Welcome to SI. I am sorry you are here but there is alot of great advice here for you.


The abbreviations are in The Healing Library at the left hand of the screen. When you are in the healing library look at the top of the page and you will see a tab for the abbreviations.

[This message edited by 2oldforthis at 3:18 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)]


He did not see what he had in me, what I saw in him I did not have!

Love kills slowly.


Posts: 1639 | Registered: Jun 2008
2oldforthis
Member
Member # 19825
Default  Posted: 3:16 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Second you must read about the 180. You need to 180 her. She needs to understand that she can't have contact with the OP and try to R with you. No contact. Make sure she understands that you will not try to R with her under those circumstances. If she agrees then she needs to send a no contact letter to the OP.

Keep posting. Welcome


He did not see what he had in me, what I saw in him I did not have!

Love kills slowly.


Posts: 1639 | Registered: Jun 2008
doesitgetbetter
Member
Member # 18429
Default  Posted: 3:24 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

I'm so sorry you're here trombone!

I have to say, it really sounds like thngs are a bit backwards here. First and foremost, you probably shouldn't be chasing your WW (wayward wife). She's still talking to the OM (other man) on a weekly basis, so she's still actively involved in an affair whether they are having sex still or not. By chasing her and telling her how wonderful she is and how much you love her, you may be coming off as a clingy, weak husband. I'm not saying this to offend you at all, and I'm not saying that is what you are, but when a WS (wayward spouse) is in the affair fog, this is they type of thinking they can be doing.

So, what to do? You should read up on the 180 in the healing library. The 180 will help you not seem like that guy. It will help you get things together for your own protection, and possibly can help shake her out of her WS fog. Sometimes a WS won't wake up until they think they've lost their BS (betrayed spouse). This often quickly clears up that WS fog and helps them see what they have been risking all along.

However, not all WS's will come out of the fog soon, or ever. Some are just the kind of person that feels no regret for cheating, and makes no excuses for it, sort of like Jesse James who was married to Sandra Bullock and a slew of others.

For you own sanity, I recommend the 180, and doing it hard! Disconnect from her, do your own activities, do all the things the 180 suggests and do your best not to waiver unless you see some real changes from your WW.

I know it's hard, and I know it feels wrong to disconnect from the one you want to keep so bad, but it will be the best thing to wake her up to what she's doing.

Let me share a personal story.

I have a relative who has always been very anti-180. He feels he can love his wife back into his arms. This cousin spent a year dating his wife while she was living on her own and, and the wife was carrying on several affairs at the same time. The cousin knew about this, but thought he could love her back home. After a year or so, she did come back home, but only for legal reasons. Turns out she found out she stood a great chance of losing custody of her kids since she had "abandoned" them for a year, so she moved back in to sleep in the guest room. She continued to carry on several more affairs and never laid a hand on the cousin. Now, another year later, she has decided she stands a good chance at custody and has filed for a divorce, and still refuses to leave the house. He definitely couldn't love her back home.

Me, I did 180 mildly. I was never very good at it, but I at least did some things. Today, it's been almost 5 years since I found out about my H's (husband's) affairs, and we are reconciled and happy with each other. My H stopped cold turkey, dropped everyone and everything he was doing because he saw me becoming distant and that made him realize he was losing me.

Post here often Trombone, you will get the best advice you will ever hear from people who have walked in your shoes and been down this path. Good luck to you.


DDay - Dec '07
Me - BS
Him - FWS
Us - Committed
May 18, 2010 - I forgave him fully!
"Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction." Isaiah 48:10

Posts: 3859 | Registered: Feb 2008
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 3:26 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

OP R 180 - I have a lot to learn, don't I?

Look, we did the no-contact letter - I made her throw away her cellphone from all the lying she did on it. Has not helped.

I have asked her to reverse the roles and see what she would think. That has produced the ultimate "flat-spot" on her face. She doesn't even begin to get that, at least in part because she knows I would never do that.

These days, all confrontation seems to do is that latest charge, "All you want to do is argue and fight." When the truth is, "NO, I WANT YOU TO COME COMPLETELY CLEAN, ACT LIKE A PERSON WHO HAS COMMITTED A WRONG, AND START WORKING FAR HARDER THAN I AM TO PUT THIS BACK."


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
7yrsflushed
Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 3:27 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

welcome to the site no one wants to join Trombone. I feel your pain as does everyone else here. Please take time to read through the information in the healing library. There is a ton of good info there.

As another BH, betrayed husband, I understand how you feel. Please understand that you can only control yourself. Your wife does nto soudn remorseful at all. You can't nice your WW, wayword wife, back to your marriage or back to you. It sounds like the A is still going on or at a minimum there is still contact. If that is true then your wife is still in the FOG and not really your wife anymore. Please read up on the 180 in the healing library. This will get you focused on healing yourself.

Also keep posting, there are a ton of good peole around here and everyone has been through this as well so they all have good advice. Please keep posting, vent, as needed, ask questions, and keep reading. This is a safe place for you to find support.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
D hopefully official any day now, off to check the mail again.

Posts: 1880 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
2oldforthis
Member
Member # 19825
Default  Posted: 3:29 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Op/ other person,
R/ reconcilation

the 180 is in the Healing Library. It is a firm hard approach to someone who is not helping in the R


He did not see what he had in me, what I saw in him I did not have!

Love kills slowly.


Posts: 1639 | Registered: Jun 2008
7yrsflushed
Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 3:38 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

These days, all confrontation seems to do is that latest charge, "All you want to do is argue and fight." When the truth is, "NO, I WANT YOU TO COME COMPLETELY CLEAN, ACT LIKE A PERSON WHO HAS COMMITTED A WRONG, AND START WORKING FAR HARDER THAN I AM TO PUT THIS BACK."

She can't. She is still in the FOG of the A so she isn't capable of rational or logical thought right now. If you want to get her attention, give her NO atttention. It will suck but you should detach big time. It is so counterintuitive and goes agaisnt everything in your being but so far you trying to save the Marriage has not worked out for you right.

So start working on yourself. Do stuff you want to do without her, workout, get a hobby, take some lessons, go to counseling for yourself, go see a lawyer. The intent it to get yourself to a safe place so you can stop the hurt. The only thing you can control is yourself. Your wife may or may not come back to the marriage but once she realizes you have removed yourself as option 2 to the other man she will have no choice but to wake up if she is going to wake up.


ETA(edit to Add): if the Other Man was married tell the other man's wife. also will help blow up the Affair.

[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 3:41 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)]


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
D hopefully official any day now, off to check the mail again.

Posts: 1880 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
kansas1968
Member
Member # 32214
Default  Posted: 3:50 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

I agree here. The 180 and a HARD 180 is the only chance you have of saving your marriage. You are rewarding her for the affair by being so frightened of losing her, you are pampering her.

If she won't or can't snap out of this, then you are much, much, better without her. She will reoffend if she doesn't have to face the concequenses of her affair.

See an attorney, get advice on where you are financially and what you can expect in the divorce. Ignore her as much as you can and start getting out of the house frequently.

You don't have to tell her anything about your comings and goings. Until she is fully focused on you, she will continue to focus on him.

I am so, so, sorry, but that is the brutal truth. You can not appear needy. That only encourages her to continue her bad behavior.

She may come around, realize what she is going to lose, and get to work on reconcilliation.

Hugs to you in this terrible time. Someone will always be here, online, for you, any hour of the day or night. BSs have a lot of trouble sleeping!


Me - BS
Him - FWS
DD - December 14, 2010
Married 43 years 1/14/2011
Affair lasted 7+ years
Affair had been over for 2 years before I found out. OW sent me a letter.

Posts: 1302 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Kansas
jtom
Member
Member # 35322
Default  Posted: 3:54 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Iam sorry you find yourself here, but you will find this site a source of strength. NOW Ive been in your shoes so dont take it personally about what Iam about to say. That being, TIME TO MAN UP!Immediately start the 180 an make an appointment with an attorney an file for divorce. Thats right file for divorce. You dont have to go thru with it, but its time to take the play away from her an knock her off the fence! Also if the OM is married contact his wife have a face to face meeting with her an TELL HER, give her all the information you have. Show your wife you mean business. Its time to go nuclear. You might be surprised what happens.


ME(BH)HER(WW)LTA AT WORK.DISCOVERED AUGUST 2010. TWO SONS.DIVORCED HER. "THE BEST PREDICTER OF FUTURE BEHAVIOR IS PAST BEHAVIOR"

Posts: 88 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: somewhere in texas
nowiknow23
Guide
Member # 33226
Default  Posted: 4:03 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Welcome to SI, trombone. I'm so sorry you have to be here, but very glad you found us.

From what you've described, it seems that your WW (wayward wife) is still in her affair.

I have committed myself to a daily list of goals of things that will try to improve our marriage and will be directed towards her. I don't let a day go by without telling her I love her.
The cold hard truth is that there is nothing you can do to "win" her back. You are putting so much effort into making the marriage better. What is she doing? By the sounds of it, nothing. She doesn't want to talk about it, doesn't want to comfort you, and mocks your pain? What a cold and hurtful response.

Please read up on the 180 in the Healing Library. I will bump a few threads up to the top of the Just Found Out forum for you to read, too.

For now, stop trying to "nice guy" her back to the marriage, and instead focus your time and energy on your own self care. Drink plenty of water. Eat, even if you don't feel like it. Work some exercise into your day - a walk, a run, a bike ride - whatever works for you.

Keep posting. We're here for you, trombone.

(((((hugs)))))


You can call me NIK

"Sometimes it takes a good fall to know where you really stand."
-Hayley Williams


Posts: 24767 | Registered: Aug 2011
RyeBread
Member
Member # 37437
Default  Posted: 4:15 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

I'm sorry hear what you are going through. This is a great place for advice and insight. Lots of other men here are facing what you are facing. You are not alone.

Worse, I am starting to lose my will to keep fighting for this marriage. I spend most of my time around her at home either working for her or walking on egg-shells, afraid to say the wrong thing.

I literally find myself acting like the person who committed the affair is supposed to act (at least, I think so). Which means she both gets to have the affair and seems utterly unaffected by what it has done.

I would suggest you might think about this question:

"What are you doing for you?"

She is going to have to do the work to repair what she has done. You can't do that for her.

I found with my WW (wayward wife) if I allow her to walk on me she will. Its in her character to do so and sounds like your wife is the same way. You deserve better treatment than that. If she won't work on making restitution for what she has done, you may need to reconsider the relationship.

It's tough my friend and I totally understand that. I'm going through coming to grips with that myself.

[This message edited by RyeBread at 4:16 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)]


Let him that would move the world first move himself. - Socrates

Posts: 1030 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Midwest
1985
Member
Member # 28171
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

You sound exactly like I was in the early period right after DDay. Let me tell you the first major hard lesson you have to learn.
You cannot "nice" her or "love" her into acting rationally. At my DDay in 1985 there was no internet and thus no great place like SI to get advice so I foolishly broke my back trying to do anything and everything I could think of to show her love and caring and convince her that her life with me was really quite good etc etc. And the more I did, the more abuse I got in return.
You see, that kind of action makes you look weak and pathetic to the Wayward. She knows that if roles were reversed she would be by God busting your chops, making you crawl and making your life a living hell. And since you are behaving just the opposite to her, in her currently screwed up state of mind you look weak and pathetic. And she knows she doesn't want a weak and pathetic man because Mr Wonderful OM (Other Man) is oh so macho and perfect.
That is where the 180 comes into play. You don't have to be cruel or even mean to her. You just need to demonstrate that you can forge a life of your own; that if she doesn't want you, you will be ok; that you will not grovel and beg because you have self confidence. Now, all Betrayed Spouses (BS) here know how painful and difficult it is to really execute a 180. We all know the feeling of loving the WS (Wayward Spouse) so much that doing a 180 scares you to death because of fear that it will drive her away for good.
But -- she is already halfway gone! She cheated. She betrayed. She shows no remorse or empathy. WHY? Because she feels that she is so powerful she doesn't need to. She cheated, treats you like shit, and you still bend backwards, sideways etc to try and make her love you. She doesn't need to act rationally, remorseful or loving to have you there as an option or a backup plan to OM.
What is needed, if she is ever to be brought back, is to make her realize that you WILL move on without her. That you CAN do it. That she actually might have to pay for her actions with losing you and the life you have and can give her. And that is what the 180 is all about. A wake up call to her. Some people use moving out; or filing for separation (S); or even filing for divorce (D)to give the wake up call. Those will work but obviously are a bit more drastic than the 180. They can be a step 2 if the 180 isn't sending a strong enough message.
I know how terrified and distraught you feel at the moment. Just know that the situation can be turned around. Your marriage can be salvaged. But to do so you first have to get her to where she is forced to consider that there is a very real probability that she will lose you as a husband, at your choice of timing, if she doesn't reverse course and get her act together and start acting to help you heal while also working at fixing herself. And that won't happen from trying to "nice" her there.
Peace to you .


Me-BH 63
Her-fWW 63
DDay: June 1985. 5 years after A ended
DDay June, 1985
DDay June 1985
Still married - actually in love
2 grown kids; 4 grandkids

Posts: 591 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: Midwest - large city
nomistakeaboutit
Member
Member # 36857
Default  Posted: 5:48 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Hi Trombone,

First, here is the link to learning about the 180:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/faq_bs.asp#FAQ11

I provided the link, because to me, it is a bit hard to find on this site. Since everyone is saying "do the 180", I wanted to be sure you have direct access to it.

The only other thing I can offer is total empathy for your frustration, a frustration caused by your wife not being remorseful. I experienced the SAME thing. Blank stares. I felt like I had been transported to some parallel universe. I remember saying to my xWW (ex wayward wife), "you don't seem to be feeling this."

I also tried to get her to reverse the situation in her mind, to help her see, but that didn't do it either. Instead, she did what they call here, "blame shifting". She'd say crazy things like, "you always spent too much time with the kids, to the exclusion of everything else." ( Uh. Excuse me? You mean you slept with another man because I spent too much time taking care of our two year old son and five year old daughter? )

Sorry. Back to you. So, if you don't mind, I'm going to be blunt, so prepare yourself. You're faced with a really fucked-up situation. Your wife cheated on you. She's not particularly bothered by the whole thing. Her attitude is more like, "What, you want to talk about the affair, AGAIN!!?? I already SAID I was sorry. What do you want, a pint of blood!!??"

She does NOT get it, at all. She betrayed you and doesn't even feel that bad about it. To be more precise, she is not doubled-over in remorsefulness. So, here's the blunt part. She may not want you right now. She may want him. She CANNOT have both. You will not share her. If she chooses to maintain contact with the OP (other person), she is choosing to risk losing you. Once she really knows this, it will either change her behavior, or it won't. You need to be prepared for either outcome, which is torture, in and of itself.

Keep posting with updates and questions. You hit the infidelity help motherload when you found this site. Good luck.

[This message edited by nomistakeaboutit at 5:59 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)]


Me: BH 56.........Her: WW 43
DD: 6..........DS: 4
Married for six years.
DDay: 12-25-11 Divorced: 7-15-12
...................................
"It's like a nightmare within a nightmare, which in and of itself is a nightmare!"

Posts: 935 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: U.S.A.
nomistakeaboutit
Member
Member # 36857
Default  Posted: 6:11 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Trombone,

Please read 1985's post again, carefully. If you want to save your marriage, he has shown you the way and explained everything perfectly.

And again, being very blunt, you may not be able to save your marriage at this point, because your wife may not want to be married to you any longer, but your best path has been pointed put to you by people who have recommended implementing the 180. 1985 put bright lights on the path for you and explained why it is the best path to take.


Me: BH 56.........Her: WW 43
DD: 6..........DS: 4
Married for six years.
DDay: 12-25-11 Divorced: 7-15-12
...................................
"It's like a nightmare within a nightmare, which in and of itself is a nightmare!"

Posts: 935 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: U.S.A.
trebleclef
Member
Member # 33488
Default  Posted: 6:32 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Sorry you have joined our club T.

You CANNOT "love" or "nice" or "beg" or "chase" an unrepentant spouse back into the relationship. You have no control over their feelings or actions. Only your own. And unfortunately those things usually only serve to make you seem weak and even less desirable.

Be "hard to get". Draw large lines in the sand and insist on consequences. Get tough. Refuse to be a third in your marriage. Refuse to have ANY relationship with her unless she is 110% remorseful and PROVING it every day with every decision and response that she makes, because anything less will be doomed to failure. Reconciliation is not for the faint of heart and it takes TWO determined, committed, and courageous people, and even then it often doesnt "take". She is nowhere close.

Take out all the biggest guns you have and use them immediately. (They lose their impact quickly with time. ). It may or may not bring her around, but it's your best bet.


True remorse isn't followed by a "but".

Posts: 1809 | Registered: Sep 2011 | From: Alberta
Tred
Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 6:48 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Trombone,

Another alternative to the 180 is just divorce her. Seriously, in some cases it's what's needed for a wakeup call. There's a real good discussion here:
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=469167

By the way, the thread is not pro-divorce (nor am I), it's pro-betrayed spouse, and why they should consider divorce as an option right away. It might give you some good ideas. I'm sorry you are here.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3847 | Registered: Dec 2011
brkn_heartd
Member
Member # 30396
Default  Posted: 7:42 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

Trombone,
First, I am sorry that you need to be here. However, there is lots of wisdom and help here.

In reading your story, it sounded similar to mine. My Husband was very similar in his response for several months. I acted very much like you while he was so foggy. I finally couldn't take the pain anymore. I found I too, was like you and didn't feel like fighting anymore.

I hadn't found this site yet, but did manage to figure it out. I was ready for a divorce. I had the bills split, ready to get an attorney, etc. He knew when I told him, that I was ready and I was finished. He then finally got it. We did go to counseling, but it has taken a while to heal. He has since changed for the better, but it has been a hard road.

Only you know when it is time to lay down the hard line. It took me a few months, but an event happened that killed my love for him and made it easy to take the next step.

Hugs to you and know you are supported here.


Me-51 BS
Him 58-WS
Married 31 yrs, together 34
Affair Aug-Dec 09
official D-12/14/09
broke NC 1/31/10
second D 3/19/10

Posts: 1563 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Northwesten US
jimbo25319
Member
Member # 31891
Default  Posted: 8:39 PM, November 20th (Tuesday)

So you've tried be the nice guy and love her back into the marriage.
In the words of the guy on the front page of this site; how's that working for you?

You need to 180, detach, and start focus on healing YOU. Better yet, really hand her the smackdown and file for D.

Your WW doesn't get it, and will not until you do something that really gets her attention. D papers seem to do the trick.


Posts: 480 | Registered: Apr 2011 | From: Maryland
stronger08
Member
Member # 16953
Default  Posted: 3:57 AM, November 21st (Wednesday)

Welcome brother. I see that everyone has given you great advice thus far. I really suggest you take heed to what has been said to you. From my own experiences and what Ive seen on this board over many years the only thing that works is swift and direct action. As was said you can not love her back into the M. In doing so it shows weakness, and weakness is what the WS feeds off of. The more you try, the more brazen she will become. The one single thing that will get her attention is if you draw a line in the sand. You tell her you will no longer put up with her shit. That she has to decide what she wants the M or her OM. Right there and then she must make her decision. Do not give her a time frame to make up her mind. Let her make a decision and act on it. If she chooses OM, tell her to pack her bags and get the fuck out. Consult with an attorney ASAP to find out your rights and responsibilities. Do not support her one bit. Not emotional, financial etc. She is not your friend and if she wants OM then she must accept that you will no longer be her source comfort in any way, shape or form.

If she chooses the M, make sure you have a defined list of what you require in order to attempt R. This must include NC in any form with the OM. Just as important as your list of requirements is what consequences will happen if she does not comply. I suggest you take the firm stand of immediate D action. Keep in mind that infidelity is war. Take no prisoners, show no quarter. If D is on the horizen take that same approach. She, her A and the OM are the enemy. Do not give aid and comfort to the enemy. Have a battle plan in place and follow it to the letter. Do not waver and make any deal with her. Unconditional surrender is your only recourse here. She must submit or get the fuck out.

I personally compare a WS to a terrorist. And if you think about it they are. They are emotional terrorists who are trying to hold you hostage in order to get you to agree to their demands. Do not negotiate with terrorists ! You must also think long and hard about what has transpired. If R is on your mind please think about the long term. R is really hard work that must be done by both partners. Neither you nor she can carry the load individually. You must ask yourself can you really forgive ? Because you can not R if you carry any burden of her A. You will never forget what has happened, thats just fact. But one can forgive and have a better M afterwards. Please think about what I have said. R is a gift from the BS to the WS. And there is no shame if you can not give that gift. You are under no obligation to R with her. She knew the risks when she entered into an A. She chose to have it anyway. Therefore do not think she is entitled to that gift. If you offer it, she must earn it. She will most likely attempt the old "I dont know what I want" bullshit. If that is the case you must assume that she opts for the OM. She is either all in, or all out. No gray areas in this. Do not alow her to stall the enevitable.

There are great articles in the healling library to assist you in whatever course this takes. I suggest you read up on all of them. Good stuff in there my friend. Keep up your health and strength. If you need a little help getting there, seek it out. Get some IC and/or meds if needed. Keep posting and reading. We are here to assist you my man. I know it seems like you dont have any energy to do what I have spoken of. But its there. Deep down inside we all carry one last reserve of energy, dignity and drive. Tap that reserve if needed. Good luck brother. I hope this works out for you.


You cant eat soup with chopsticks.

Posts: 5591 | Registered: Nov 2007
Laura28
Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 5:46 AM, November 21st (Wednesday)

Hi Trombone

Everyone has said it. I know it's scary but you need to stand up for yourself.

At present you are sharing your WW (Wayward Wife) with others. Is that what you really want - to live the rest of your days like that??

You tell her you will no longer put up with her shit. That she has to decide what she wants the M or her OM. Right there and then she must make her decision. Do not give her a time frame to make up her mind. Let her make a decision and act on it. If she chooses OM, tell her to pack her bags and get the fuck out
.

Do this please. Demand your rights. Giving her "time" will get you nowhere.

When I confronted my FWH (Former Wayward Husband - he has earnt the "former" title by staying faithful for the last 2.5 years) I had found out in the previous 2 weeks that he had been screwing three OWs (Other Women) for the previous 16+ years. One for 8 years. I had no idea.

I was scared silly.

But the night I confronted him I said Choose me or fuck off. Your whores may be prepared to share you with me but I will never share my man with another woman.

I didn't realise how much I meant it until I said it.

I would rather be alone than stay with a man who would not commit 100% exclusively to me.

BIG HUGS

Laura


Married 32yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 60yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA 16+ years).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2744 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
allhopegone
Member
Member # 37465
Default  Posted: 8:23 AM, November 21st (Wednesday)

I know just how deeply you are hurting. I'm right there with you. So, I hate to be so blunt but you need to hear this loud and clear.
If you have any hope of saving your marriage STOP what you are doing. It will NOT work and will very likely make things worse.

I say this from experience. I did not find this place until nearly 16 months of doing exactly what you are doing.
During that time I knew something was wrong in my marriage, I had no idea it was an A. After discovery, I found these wonderful people on this site, but still thought my situation was different than theirs. I thought that somehow I could love or reason her back. IT DOES NOT WORK! Quit loving her! (at least let her think you have) Let her lose the security of that love. She's feeding on it and using it against you.
I was looking for a magic bullet and suspect you are to. There isn't one. I regret not having known this earlier, it may have saved my marriage.

Do a Hard 180 brother!


Posts: 91 | Registered: Nov 2012
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 1:31 PM, November 27th (Tuesday)

Update #1 - I want to thank everyone for their words of encouragement to me. It is clear that I have found the right community. Since my last post, the following has happened:

*My wife and I came to an agreement on things we would do, be and share to one another, with each asking and sharing what they most wanted and needed at this time. I felt very good about the arrangement;

*Within 24 hours, my wife had broken every aspect of the agreement by going and seeing this man again, and going off by themselves late at night;

*I had started pieces of the 180, and am now moving quickly into it. And whether it was the latest episode, this support group, or some of each, this "working far harder than she is" has come to a SCREACHING halt;

*But the latest episode has still brought about a brand new round of pain. But instead of despair, I have decided it is time to, at least emotionally, move on in life.

*Because of my profession, I cannot, without a lot of work and guidance, file for divorce. But I have told her that it remains an option - and now more than ever. And yes, I have now consulted with an attorney about my rights and standing.

*She remains in the household for now. But I am just going to use as much of the 180 as I can and see where it goes from here.

Thanks again to all. I will keep you posted.


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
standinghere
Member
Member # 34689
Default  Posted: 10:18 PM, November 27th (Tuesday)

But what can one do where a spouse may finally "GET IT"?


She has to do that work. All you can do in your circumstances is to protect yourself, emotionally, financially, physically, and socially.

That is why putting in place good boundaries is important.

She will either stop, work to save what she had, or continue and burn it all to the ground.


BH - Me - Late 30's (now late 40's)
WW - Her - Late 30's (now late 40's)
4 Children
Her - Love of my life...still is.
Reconciled - Partly...she can't get over it.
Her - Thunderstruck by what she did.

Posts: 926 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: USA
0115
Member
Member # 31740
Default  Posted: 10:29 PM, November 27th (Tuesday)

(((Trombone))) you're doing good!! It's so hard. Stay strong...I'm pulling for you!!


BS (me) 49
FWH 49 newbeg2011
Married 29 years
Very Long LTA
DD 01/15/11-6/30/11
The hard work is done...let the healing begin.

Posts: 1003 | Registered: Apr 2011
Heavy Sigh
Member
Member # 34243
Default  Posted: 11:30 AM, December 2nd (Sunday)

If you are in politics, people forgive divorces.

If you are in the clergy, then I guess it depends on your denomination/faith.

Although I doubt the OM wants her except as a bit on the side - or she would already have left - it's possible she will leave anyhow. I'm also concerned that her behavior could push you to despair or worse, since you're having to watch her do this.

So if you are in the clergy or whatever, you need to get that process of counseling etc going right now.


Posts: 1917 | Registered: Dec 2011
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, December 26th (Wednesday)

I once again want to thank everyone for their posts and support, especially during the time of my initial post just over a month ago.

Sadly, this will not have a good ending. I was following through on the "HARD 180" so many of you suggested, even taking steps to implement new parts of it each week.

But even though affair #1 has ended, my wife is now getting ready to move in with a different co-worker.

While one part of me shakes my head at this new development (and I won't lie - it hurts, as I thought things were starting to look up), the other side of me finally understands what I am really up against here.

Both of her two daughters have essentially disowned her. But like so many that do stuff like this, right now she doesn't even care.

I have consulted with an attorney, and he will be working to serve papers by the end of the week.

It is a sad ending for what could have been a DAMN GOOD marriage. But it takes two, and the other one is so flighty that there is nothing left to grasp onto.

But because of your advice, I am moving forward. I start a new career just after the 1st of the year - am moving out-of-state, and looking forward to where life is now going to lead me.

Thanks again to everyone. I only wish that more of these stories had happier endings.


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
atsenaotie
Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 9:53 AM, December 26th (Wednesday)

thanks for the update tbone.

I only wish that more of these stories had happier endings.

The ending to your story is not yet penned, only the introduction. Write a good ending for you and your DDs.


LTA BS 53
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Separated and Divorcing

Posts: 4107 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 5:54 PM, May 14th (Tuesday)

NEW UPDATE

I felt I owed my friends who supported me during an extremely tough Fall another update. I have not posted since the day after Christmas.

The next day after I posted was my wedding anniversary, but it was the only time my attorney could meet with me. I let my WS know that I had her to thank for spending my anniversary that way.

I also knew that my existence, as it was, could not continue. based on all that had happened. So besides talking to an attorney, I resigned my post (yes I am in the clergy), and moved to another state near where I had originally (back in October) found some solid counselors. I moved in mid-January and signed a lease shortly thereafter.

In mid-March, I got a knock on my door one afternoon, and without warning, it was my WS - with her car and all of her belongings. She asked to move in with me and promised that she brought nothing and no one with her from the past.

I laid some conditions on her, including attending JOINT counseling, a willingness for me to check her phone anytime I wish, and being allowed to work through the steps of restoration for someone put through absolute hell.

While she still has trouble ever talking about such things, I learned that the steps I took (thanks to you folks) lifted the "affair fog" from her. In its place was put a guilt any normal person should feel, and which should have kept her from ever doing something like that, but which she had evaded - at least for awhile.

I found out later that members of her own family - a family that itself was rife with a history of affairs - had found out about what she did and had virtually crucified her, as they looked up to her as having the only good relationship of any of them.

My daughters still won't talk to her - in fact, since I agreed to "take her back", now they won't talk to me.

But the affair, all contact, and the "mid-life crisis" crap that seemed to have accompanied it is over.

This would have a happier ending except that I have been unable to find any kind of gainful employment, inside or outside of my field. But I volunteer, have built a circle of friends I never previously had, stay physically active, go to concerts, watch sunsets, cook, clean and live.

Although our marriage was never fully dissolved, my WS has now proposed to me and wants a marriage ceremony sometime this coming Fall. We'll see.

Again, thanks to all of you - I could not have gotten to this point without all of you.


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
FeelingSoMuch
Member
Member # 38814
Default  Posted: 6:35 PM, May 14th (Tuesday)

Hi Trombone,

I'm only about three months out from d-day. I'm happy to hear that you're going for joint counseling. It's helped me tremendously and I don't think reconciliation is likely without it. I also strongly suggest individual counseling. It's helped me.

As far as a "happy ending," I'm sure you know, too, that it's far from over. There's a lot of work to be done and happy ending that includes reconciliation and your daughters is possible.

I wish you all the best. Stay strong and keep posting here.

Once again, the best thing that's working for me that I recommend to others is joint and individual counseling. Both are important.


Me: BH
Her: WW
Together since 2001, married since 2007.
D-day: Feb. 20, 2013.
Broke NC: 2 phone calls since
Today: In MC and IC, attempting R.
It got easier: They no longer work together.

Posts: 509 | Registered: Mar 2013 | From: Canada
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 7:03 PM, May 14th (Tuesday)

The reason I moved where I did is because I had found a fantastic (individual) counselor back in the Fall. I knew that whether or not I would ever have marriage or reconciliation counseling, individual counseling was essential. And it has continued (and helped) to this day.

Yes, the story is far from over. But hopefully the next chapters won't contain so much pain.


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
Ashland13
Member
Member # 38378
Default  Posted: 8:44 AM, May 15th (Wednesday)

The posts that talk about changing how you interact with your W are right, unfortunately. I will share something I only learned very recently-that whenever I did as you are, ExH was filling with even more resentment towards me. I was pushing him further away, if it was possible.
But I was so stuck in my own mind, as he was/is in his, that I couldn't see or feel that happening.

You seem like I was, where I didn't really live for myself, I lived for the M and the life I had within it. I was/am a stay at home mom, the proverbial house wife with dinner always on the table and routines and schedules. He made up my world as did our daughter and so it's been like I had to grow new organs to learn to 180 and all that goes with it.

One thing that really helped me was to realize that he-and probably your wife-are very far gone into their own minds. They are not thinking about the people they betrayed, while we are trying to hold onto the lives we had and don't want destroyed further. (I don't hold on anylonger but as a betrayed person we do in the beginning).

Once you can grasp that she is kind of living in her own universe-I say to myself that my ex husband is on his own planet where he's the governor, chief of police, principal-where he is ruler and nothing else mattes-this helps me in great amounts to be able to see that I was not accompishing anything good.

He's happily gone to the "other side" and lived with the other woman for a long time while we suffer and your wife has been doing who knows what while you suffer. As you move through stages in your discoveries and thought processes, chances are good that anger will come and it's a good motivator. For if your wife sees you with pity or an emotional wreck, chances are good she will get annoyed, though it's hard to imagine.

Something else that helped me to realize is that all the while I was being the loving wife, my husband was off completely detatched from me and the life we made for 20 years, searching for...other things. Maybe this will help, to realize that you and she are not currently on the same page and as long as she's set on "other things", you could drive yourself bonkers wanting to fix the marriage, while she has no intention.

I'm sorry to be so long and hope am not too shocking, but this is some advice I've gotten or things I had to learn also.

One other important thing-interaction with the other guy probably will only result in more hurt for you and talking to her about the other guy could just anger her, as I had happen. She sounds similar to my ex husband, who has no remorse or guilt and is enjoying his lala land while his family suffers.


Ashland 13

A person is a person, no matter how small. -Dr. Suess

Perserverance and spirit have done wonders in all ages.

-George Washington


Posts: 2187 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: New England
trombone38444
New Member
Member # 37565
Default  Posted: 6:46 PM, May 16th (Thursday)

Thank you for your post, Ashland13.

Even back in the Fall, when we first started attending (then separate) counseling, my wife admitted that she had never pondered the thoughts or feelings of anyone else. She even told me (when we were still sleeping [and only sleeping] together, that she saw me asleep one night and wondered how strange it felt to actually wonder how I might be feeling.

Obviously, at least in the short-term, it didn't help. But it did tell me that she has a conscience there somewhere.

You have to understand - she was the one that, amongst all her siblings, tried to make the right choices as a younger woman. Through the years, she has often told me of the steps she has taken to avoid even the possibilities of impropriety. It was what made this even more devastating.

But while there are those who go through a mid-life-type crisis and never come out of it, her feelings and her expression of guilt tell me that there is some hope.

Still, I've been blind-sided by the things she has done often enough so as to put as much into place as possible to make sure it doesn't happen again.

If there is growing resentment in her, she is as free to leave and go back to her own life as I first intended back at the turn of the year. There is the side of me that is remaining somewhere between cautious and convinced that it may still be just a matter of time.

But there must be something operating inside the head of someone who gave up two good jobs, an established social circle, and many things she does not now have to come down here unannounced and ask to move in with me.

Again, I am not her, but by the time we got to the end of January, in my mind, it would have been much easier, based on what she had done up to then, to just stay with this man, sign the divorce papers, and put this episode behind both of us. The fact that SHE is the one who chose to do that (without my beckoning, encouragement, or even suggestion) is worthy of at least allowing the string to play out - if only for awhile.


A warm greeting to you.

Posts: 14 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Georgia
tooanalytical
Member
Member # 22306
Default  Posted: 7:19 PM, May 16th (Thursday)

Trombone

I wish you well. As a BH, I realized I centered my world and worth around my FWW and that is why the betrayal hurt so much. The good news is that once I suffered in the dark valley alone I starting centering my life around God and my joy returned. My wife is back but in second place now where she belongs. Our marriage is life-giving and we work some ministries together but I have set my boundaries and wouldn't hesitate to leave at the first offense.


Me BH 44
FWW 44
Married 21 years
D-Day Apr 29, 2008
Children: 19,17,14
EA/PA - 1 year
Status: R

Posts: 279 | Registered: Jan 2009
Topic Posts: 34