Just Found Out
User Topic: I Was Lying to Myself
New Member
Member # 38233
Default  Posted: 9:29 AM, March 21st (Thursday)

My last post was sadly titled, "Am I Lying to Myself About Being Okay." Well, for all of you home gamers out there, the answer is a resounding YES! It has now been two months since D-Day. I cried for seven hours straight the other day. I seem to be worse off and I'm seeing a therapist every week.

Her life seems to be getting better without me in it. She's now slimmer than when we met. She never wore dresses or changed her hair even though I practically begged her to over the years. Now she has a new wardrobe, new hair, she turned down a $20k promotion in favor of a $10k raise and for her company to pay for her to go back to school.

All the while she swears she wants me back. OM is gone, but a new player has entered the ring. Cell records show calls every night between 10-12 that last from 1-4 hours and texts repeatedly throughout the day. I found out on the day that I had been strongly considering going back. I confronted and she told me it's ____ her OTHER ex-boyfriend whom she hasn't spoken to in over 10 years. "I know how it looks, but I swear nothing is going on."

I asked her to stop talking to him if she had any inkling of wanting to get back together. She tells me (in the voice of her therapist) "I've made enough unhealthy concessions in this marriage over the years. You're just going to have to trust me. You left the house and can't have it both ways."

I've been depressed a lot lately. Even thought of suicide, but I'd never leave my daughter that way. The old me would've never allowed a relationship to break me down this much. It's like I don't know who I am anymore. I can't control my emotions. I went to her apartment at 2 in the morning last night. I told her that she had one chance to prove to me nothing was going on. Sign on to all of her email accounts and hand me her phone. If she let me check it then I'd know she was trustworthy and we could go from there. She asked me to leave and said "It won't help anything. You won't change your mind." I begged four times and then left.

I guess I officially can't trust her. It kills me inside.
(Sorry this is so long. Thanks for letting me vent)

D-Day: January 2013
Me, BH: 31
Her, WW: 31
Married 10 years
Kids: Daughter, 3
Divorced: Sep 2013

Posts: 46 | Registered: Jan 2013
Member # 16953
Default  Posted: 9:43 AM, March 21st (Thursday)

Bro you need to detach quickly. The way you are acting is feeding her NPD. And giving her control over this whole situation. She thinks she is some sort of prize that needs to be won. Fuck that shit !!!!!! You want her attention ? Detach and 180 her ass hard. File for D. Right now your letting her call the shots here. That needs to change ASAP. Get your ass to a therapist and unburden yourself man. If you show her that you are moving on without her it certainly will get noticed. You may even find that you like being without her and the insanity she creates. Whatever you do stop being her victim. Man up and stop allowing her to run the show. You cant threaten or nice her into changing. Thats shit just dont work. She will only change if she gets a good look at what life will be without you. And she may even not give a damn too. But either way the focus must be on your healing. Yeah this shit sucks. But you gotta get yourself out of that funk and fight back.

You cant eat soup with chopsticks.

Posts: 5730 | Registered: Nov 2007
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 10:00 AM, March 21st (Thursday)

Reread Stronger08's post several times. Stop focusing on her and focus on yourself. Your M doesn't define you, her A doesn't define you, whether or not you stay married or not doesn't define you, YOU define you.

She doesn't want you back, she wants the ability to cake eat and she is enjoying the fact that you are still pining away over her. She is keeping you primed in case she does decide she wants you back but that will NOT be a M of equals. She will still be using you and will have OM on the side as she sees fit. She sounds completely and utterly unremorseful. It's okay to mourn the loss of your M but please remember that you were an individual before you got married and you will be an individual afterwards.

If she is unremorseful and still as you have seen talking to OM even if it's a new guy and obviously is in some type of relationship with him since she kicked you out instead of giving you transparency then time to move on with your life. Go find a lawyer today or tomorrow and file.

Find your anger my friend. Also Nice Guys adn nice girls for that matter most certainly do NOT finish last. People that allow themselves to remain victims after the perpertrator has shown their true colors may think they finish last but eventually they can and do become strong enough to know that the nice guys finish last line of reasoning is complete bull shit.

You can do this, find some anger, 180, detach, go see a lawyer. Take your power back for yourself. Yes this sucks and it will suck for a long time but it gets easier as you detach and yes their is life after an A and dealing with a WS.

D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1912 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 10:01 AM, March 21st (Thursday)

2nd to what stronger advised.

"I know how it looks, but I swear nothing is going on."

"I've made enough unhealthy concessions in this marriage over the years. You're just going to have to trust me. You left the house and can't have it both ways."

OMFG, Response: "Honey, you can have as many men in your life as you choose. I choose not to be one of them. When you can decide that you only want one and that one is me, call. I might answer."

Detach, 180 kids and finances only. She is desperately trying to get you back under her thumb under her terms.


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2992 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 10:01 AM, March 21st (Thursday)


Listen to stronger08 friend.

Reading your post makes me remember the pain. Emotional I expected but the physical pain was a huge surprise.

Please know you're not alone.

Please know you're going to get through this.

Please know its not always going to hurt this bad.

You can't make her be remorseful nor work towards R. You need to go total NC and 180 on her arse like yesterday.

Please friend. Save yourself. She is a lost cause. I could quote every single thing you said she said here and make comments on each one but I'll cut it short - she is still cheating brother and you know it.

Ignore her words, watch her actions. Her actions are screaming at you.

This is something that worked for me. Imagine the pain she has/is inflicting manifesting in physical wounds. Now look down at your body and decide if you want to keep being wounded.

Let.Her.Go. There is nothing you did to cause her to cheat, there is nothing you can do to make her wake up, there is nothing you can do to make her remorseful, there is nothing you can do to make her fight for your M.

You CAN, however, save yourself here.

The work and time it takes to detach s absolute agony but its so worth it. I remember being given lots of support and advice in my early days and I honestly could not see any light down the tunnel. I was in a black, black hole and thought I would be there forever.

I was forged in fire - I am the strongest person I know. This is not the worst thing that has ever happened to me and I have survived much much worse than this. I was enraged that this bullshit had me on my knees. It took me a long time to get over that aspect.

But... the sun is shining on me again. I am happier than I have been in years. I am free, finally.

I'm so very sorry. Gaslighting, TT is crazy making and rocks you to your very core. I was so badly gaslighted I wondered if I had lost my mind - that is precisely the purpose of gaslighting. To make you feel like you are losing your damn mind.

You're not - you just can't fucking believe what you're seeing. I get it. I couldn't either. I believe it now though.

I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5609 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
Member # 25015
Default  Posted: 2:13 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

Serial cheater. No sympathy, no empathy, no morals. Run!

Posts: 716 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: michigan
Member # 14833
Default  Posted: 2:21 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

Buck up cowboy....




The secret of life is enjoying the passage of time...

James Taylor

Posts: 5983 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: A better place
Member # 37437
Default  Posted: 2:34 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

I'll second, third, fourth, and fifth what everyone has said about detaching.

Your WW is very focused on herself and blameshifting the hell out of you talking about how many "concessions" she's made. I know you're hurting right now and you have every right to hurt like that. You've been trampled on by her, it F'n hurts bad.

At this point she may be moving on and things are seeming to pick up for her. And that very well may be. But do you want to have someone that unremorseful in your life? She'll run your self-esteem and self-respect through the mud if you let her.

Get your eyes on the prize my friend. That prize is YOU!!

Let him that would move the world first move himself. - Socrates

Posts: 1030 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Midwest
New Member
Member # 38702
Default  Posted: 3:44 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

Normally I don't respond to guys because being the 3rd generation female BS in my family, I am kind of hating the entire male species right now....

but the last line you say she said "it doesn't matter, it wont change your mind" is a blinding neon sign that says "IM HIDING STUFF FROM YOU, AND IM GOING TO USE YOU AS THE REASON YOU CAN'T CHECK IT"

It's my husband's go-to "I'm lying to you" line. He's no longer allowed to say it if he even thinks of hoping to R.

sounds like you should listen to the other guys here.

BS (me) 27
WH (him) 31
Married almost 6 years
DDay 1/2/13 ONS on 12/26/12 with exgf/best friend of 15 years
Kids: 3, ages 5, 3 and soon to be 1
Too soon to tell what will happen

every whisper, every sigh
eats away at this heart of mine

Posts: 32 | Registered: Mar 2013
Member # 13447
Default  Posted: 3:52 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

I'm so sorry for the pain you're in.

"Being in love" first moved them to promise fidelity: this quieter love enables them to keep the promise. *CS Lewis*

Posts: 11229 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: Just a fool in limbo
Member # 35295
Default  Posted: 4:08 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

When a betraying spouse is not willing to make their lives an open book to the betrayed, yet claims that they want to save the marriage, but continues behaving in a self serving manner, hyper-vigilance escalates. The constant need of the betrayed to protect themselves from being deceived again, leads to days consumed with attempting to find evidence that they are, if fact, being told the truth. Their lives begin to revolve around policing the activities of the betraying spouse. Their whole sense of safety in the relationship has been shattered and the continued unwillingness of the cheater to be accountable to their spouse is crazy making. The behavior and verbal claims of the cheater are inconsistent, often serving up lies to appease the anxiety of the betrayed spouse and maintain control over their illusion of intentions. When the anxiety and hyper vigilance of the betrayed spouse reaches a tipping point, demanding answers - often, blame is once again thrust upon the faithful spouse when confronting the betrayer about their lack of accountability. They are accused of being too controlling, crazy, untrusting and then guilted into backing off the pressure, shamed into forgoing accountability because they are the ones driving the cheater crazy. The inability of the betrayed spouse to control the behavior of the betrayer throws them back into feeling helpless, returning to character logical self-blame, and the PTSD cycle continues, looping over and over again. The betrayed begins to doubt their own sanity because their intuition does not match up with the illusion they are being fed. Not "always", but most often, refusal of accountability is a sign that the affair has not ended, and the betrayed continues to be gaslighted. This cycle of infidelity abuse follows closely the domestic abuse cycle.

Read Why Your Spouses Infidelity Isn't Your Fault

Posts: 148 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Illinois
Member # 31891
Default  Posted: 11:22 PM, March 21st (Thursday)

Retain a lawyer.
Have her served.

Seriously, how much longer are you going to allow this to go on.

Posts: 480 | Registered: Apr 2011 | From: Maryland
Hearthache again
Member # 28564
Default  Posted: 2:38 AM, March 22nd (Friday)

It doesn't matter if they are a WW or WH they all say the same things. She is deep in the fog I am surprised she is not blind.

I never had to 180 my H but changes didn't start really happening until I made myself number 1 in my life.

Good luck.

Married-12 years together 13
Kids 4: 15, 12, 8, and 3
DDay#1 9-26-2008 Dday#2 4-26-2010
We have R!!! But I still hate the number 26!

This too shall pass
I edit a lot because that stupid box is so small!

Posts: 871 | Registered: May 2010 | From: Michigan
Member # 37895
Default  Posted: 7:54 AM, March 22nd (Friday)

You are getting the same advice here but I am going to be a bit tough.... Buckle up.

I was once where you were with an ex and I nearly killed myself almost crashing my car while crying and begging him to change in a phone conversation.

You say you can't control your emotions. I agree. But you can control your actions. You know she is starting up a new relationship. She told you she wouldn't reveal the details.

Then you begged four times.

That is the point at which you have to take some responsibility for the emotions you went through. Begging your wife to do anything is a recipe for misery. Stop. Just stop. Walk away from her and file for divorce.

At this stage you have a choice about how much more pain you are going to endure. Walking away will hurt but it will also start the road to healing. It will be a finite process. It will free you from being her victim.

Really, from now on, it is about how you behave not how she behaves. Time for you to decide how painful this has to be.

[This message edited by jemimapd at 7:56 AM, March 22nd (Friday)]

Jemima Puddleduck is a trusting soul....
DD 1 Dec 2012; Divorced 11/13; 2 children
Me: BS (47) Him: WH (52) Her: 3 PA's
Ex bought a house, The Money Pit With Mold That Will Never Be Finished. He's living in the basement.

Posts: 726 | Registered: Dec 2012
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 6:31 PM, March 22nd (Friday)

Time for you to decide how painful this has to be.

Too true.

I may have reached a point where I'd piss on him if he was on fire.... eventually!!

Posts: 5609 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
Member # 37740
Default  Posted: 9:22 AM, March 23rd (Saturday)

Maybe it's time to talk to a lawyer.
She's not going to change.

BH - 64
fWW - 60

"Affairs are not mistakes, they are a series of deliberate choices." - CrappyLife

Posts: 484 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Upstate NY
Member # 35526
Default  Posted: 12:40 AM, March 25th (Monday)

I begged four times and then left.

I'll be plain, blunt, and deliberate.

Do not beg. Ever. For anything.

Your marriage needs an enema. Your remorseless-as-fuck WW is waste that must be evacuated and flushed.

File for divorce and have her served.

Go stone-fucking-cold when it comes to dealing with her.

A woman who openly fucks-around on you and gives you blatant cold-hearted bullshit about it.
Hmmmmm? How difficult could it be to find something better than this?

Not difficult at all, my friend. Not difficult at all.

I Divorced Her.

Posts: 363 | Registered: May 2012
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 6:50 AM, March 25th (Monday)

Get rid of her honey.


There is nothing you did to cause her to cheat, there is nothing you can do to make her wake up, there is nothing you can do to make her remorseful, there is nothing you can do to make her fight for your M.

You CAN, however, save yourself here.

My God!!! You are young!!!!

You have your whole life in front of you.

There is a wonderful honest faithful woman out there who needs a man like you.

Time to send this silly woman packing, get yourself a new life and go find her.

Goodness me. If I was only 20 years younger I would kick my FWH to the curb and send you my number

Just kidding!!! I really am too old honey but I know that you would be quite a catch. A faithful man - a rare gem!!!! Such a lucky girl who manages to snare you!!!

There's a wonderful world out there waiting for you. Put this crap behind you and go out and live!!!

And give that girl a chance to find you!!!

Chin up honey



[This message edited by Laura28 at 7:01 AM, March 25th (Monday)]

Married 32yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 60yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA 16+ years).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2754 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
Member # 23890
Default  Posted: 7:23 AM, March 25th (Monday)

You want her attention ? Detach and 180 her ass hard. File for D. Right now your letting her call the shots here. That needs to change ASAP.

Stronger is right on the money! In fact, we are all giving you the same advice... Why is that? I'll tell you...

When you ignore and abuse someone and they come to you begging for more... it ain't attractive - actually it's proof you are too good for them! So now she has a new look, a second OM pursuing, and you crying on the door stop. She isn't going to stop and consider her actions when this is the case. Now, if she were looking a D papers and you were aloof, unavailable, getting on with your life... that might give her pause to wonder just who she is, and what she is doing.

You can cry all you want here, at the therapist, in the car, at home -- we all get that; crying is part of the rollercoaster. But do not let her see you cry. Do not beg! No woman I've ever met wants to be married to a man weaker than her. Right now - she sees only your weakness.

You want things to change - it starts with you!

"We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us." Joseph Campbell...So, If fear was not a factor - what would you do?

Posts: 4133 | Registered: May 2009 | From: New England
Member # 36888
Default  Posted: 10:44 AM, March 26th (Tuesday)

I looked for a button where I could upvote stronger08's comment, but I just couldn't find it. He is spot on.

YOU need to look out for YOU! If you are feeling depressed, get to a doctor NOW! Your wife is not really acting like a remorseful wife. She is not looking out for you, so YOU HAVE TO LOOK OUT FOR YOU! Sorry for the caps, but you have to take control of your life. I know it hurts, I know what the feeling is like. I know that pit of the stomach ache, the sorrow, the sleepless nights, having trouble focusing.

She won't give you what you needed to heal so now you have to help heal yourself. You can do it. Before you met her you had to have survived on your own, take the love she had given you, take the pain she dished out to you, take it all in an embrace it. There is nothing to be ashamed of, you did not cheat. You need to take it all, look at your life and find out how you move on. It will be without her, but you can do it, don't give her the power to control YOUR destiny. I know it is tough, and that you love her, when you joined your lives together it was to help each other, to make each other happy, to enjoy the good times, to help each other through the bad times. Now you have to stop helping her and supporting her. Take that energy and put it towards YOU!

You have a daughter, take care of her, take care of yourself.

Please do that. Also talk to us here. We have people that have been through just about everything possible. We are here to help.


Posts: 214 | Registered: Sep 2012
Member # 34262
Default  Posted: 6:36 PM, March 26th (Tuesday)

You say you have a daughter. Look at this from her future perspective:

My mother was a cake eating remorseless WW who flaunted her affair in my father's face for NINE years before he filed! That just taught me(his DD) that it's normal to be walked all over and taken advantage age of. It's not surprising then that I also became the BS. Do you want this legacy for your daughter? That's it's okay to be treated like shit or worse thats it's okay to be a spiteful cheating bitch?!?

I don't think so.

Me: BS 45
Her: fWS 48 (same sex partner)
Together: 18 years now (both MDs)
OW: meh so what 40s PhD
DD1: 10/30/11EA; DD2: 11/10/11 Had ONS; TT until 12/26/11; broke NC 6/12; NC again 7/12; R-ish

Posts: 2242 | Registered: Dec 2011 | From: Great Southwest
New Member
Member # 38233
Default  Posted: 9:12 AM, March 27th (Wednesday)

Let me first say thank you, as always. Sounding like a broken record seems to be a part of this situation and I appreciate the patience you all show. Second, everything you say makes perfect sense and is exactly what goes through my mind some days. I feel like I'm in my own fog half the time. As soon as I wake up and see what a fucking idiot I'm being, I snap right back into it. I've been trying to figure out why and the best I can come up with is that I have to let go of those "rules" that I adhered to in the marriage.

The rules that you have to see your spouse and marriage as unique and something that no one else can understand, and the rule that you have to believe that you can just talk your way through everything and trust your spouse is there for you...well, they don't apply anymore. But on those days when WW is lying to me (and, in all fairness, herself) about what she wants, it becomes way too easy to get sucked back into the rules. I have to make a conscious decision to stop.

I think I've had a hard time accepting what I need to do, because I truly believe that my wife is confused. I'm not excusing anything she's doing, but I imagine it is so much easier to walk away from someone who is intentionally manipulative and deceitful than to walk away from someone with her history of abuse and problems who is seriously lying to herself probably more than she's lying to me.

I've done a lot of (productive) thinking lately and I realize that I'm focusing my energy in the wrong place and don't even see it. We had a 'heart to heart' this weekend where I gave her even more power over me, but during the course of the conversation a light went off. I realized that I wasn't trying to convince her to come back or to leave the other guys alone. I was trying to convince her that she could trust me and that I really loved her. As I was talking I started to think, "Why the fuck would she be questioning my love and fidelity? Shouldn't it be the other way around?"

I was actually sitting there telling her about the women who've asked me out lately and trying to prove to her I care about her because I turned them down. I realized that this is all wrong. I can't do this anymore. I went through her phone (without her permission) and saw the craziest thing. She has a friend who has been cheated on and that friend essentially has her 180'ing me. She's convinced my wife that the cheating was my fault and without calling it the 180, that's what she's encouraging her to do because it worked with her wayward husband...but I'm not the wayward one. Every time I cry or bargain or apologize for something that is not my fault, it becomes confirmation to her that the strategy is working. Wow. That was an eye opener. Since then, I'm all on board for the 180 and it may be a short lived feeling, but I don't actually give a damn what her reaction to it is, so long as I feel better.

D-Day: January 2013
Me, BH: 31
Her, WW: 31
Married 10 years
Kids: Daughter, 3
Divorced: Sep 2013

Posts: 46 | Registered: Jan 2013
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 9:24 AM, March 27th (Wednesday)

Glad you are doing okay NG. Detaching will help greatly. Don't try to justify anything with her. You can't nice or reason her back. Focusing on you and your children is a good thing. Remember the 180 is for you to get to a good headspace. Don't engage in anymore long drawn out conversations. They tend to go just like the one you experienced with unremoresful WS's. Everyone messes up the 180 in the beginning. If you mess up just start it up again. Once you detach you will get some clarity.

Will it be awkward with both of you walking around the house not talking to each other sure but the point isn't you NOT talking to her, the point is you FOCUSING on yourself.

The difference is her "180" is being done to MANIPULATE you where yours is being done for you to detach and focus on you. I wish you the best and if you fall off the 180 get right back on it. Keep posting it does help.

[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 9:25 AM, March 27th (Wednesday)]

D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Divorced 9/2/14 and loving life!

Posts: 1912 | Registered: May 2011 | From: VA
Member # 36134
Default  Posted: 4:36 PM, March 27th (Wednesday)


The 180 is for you, not her. It's for you to begin your detaching from her so you can begin to heal.

Healing with someone essentially putting you down for every other thing that does not work out in their life... well it can't be done.

You need to be there for your DD. Her mama is NOT a healthy and stable person right now... you are.


I trust you is a better compliment than I love you, because you may not trust the person you love, but you can always love the person you trust. - Unknown
Relationships are like sharing a book, it doesn't work if you're not on the same page.

Posts: 5270 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Florida
Topic Posts: 24