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User Topic: Help! Need quick advice!
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Exclaimation  Posted: 8:00 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

D-day was 10 days ago. Asked WW to leave and she did. We have not seen each other since. We have communicated, but not seen each other. We own a business together. Regardless of how this ends, good or bad, I KNOW I don't want to run a business with her.

I made an appointment to see our accountant, who also does business valuation tomorrow at 1pm to discuss. WW insists she needs to be ther because it is about business. OK. Makes sense.

I have not seen her since. This will be the first time. How do i handle this? Any tips? Cold and professional is my plan, but I am afraid of the emotions it might cause. Please suggest some practical tips to cope. I wish I didn't have to see her.


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
LonelyHusband
Member
Member # 34145
Default  Posted: 8:28 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Cold. Unemotional. Detached.

Count to ten before each time you open your mouth. What will want to come out of your mouth will be emotion and pain. Stop. count to ten. Now answer slowly and calmly.

Avoid eye contact. If you have to show any emotion, make it disdain.

you need to show strength and respect for yourself before you have a hope of her showing any. however, the more I read about your WW the less I like her. This sounds like the only things she is interested are those things that threaten her position. That's pretty shallow.

[This message edited by LonelyHusband at 8:29 AM, June 3rd (Monday)]


BS ( me) 41
fWS (OktoberMest) 35
D day #1 29/10/2011, D day #2 15/112011, D day #3 15/03/2012
Reconciling.
“It’s better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all”, is inadequate consolation when you vacuum up a child's hamster'

Posts: 1290 | Registered: Dec 2011 | From: UK
sailorgirl
Member
Member # 38162
Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I don't see why WW needs to be there. She can meet with the accountant separately. You're not making any decisions--you're getting advice for you. I think your meeting needs to be private.

Have you told the accountant that WW is having an affair? I think the accountant needs to know the situation in order to advise you. I would stress that you'd like to go through each option and it's ramifications for you. The ramifications for WW are not your concern.

[This message edited by sailorgirl at 8:41 AM, June 3rd (Monday)]


Married 14 years, three amazing kids
H had 17 month EA/PA
D-day 1/5/13
Reconcilling

Posts: 787 | Registered: Jan 2013
Bigger
Member
Member # 8354
Default  Posted: 8:51 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

If she insists on coming then simply keep it business like.
Remember that NOTHING will be decided at this meeting and that there is no need to go into details.
However… Despite this being about business and this being a joint venture you can and should request she does not attend. Tell her the accountant can report to her what goes on and/or she can have a meeting with him but right now it’s a preliminary meeting for your benefit.
Remind her that the accountant is the company accountant. Not YOUR accountant nor HER accountant. Therefore both of you can and should trust the accountant to give an unbiased report.


"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

Posts: 5503 | Registered: Sep 2005
simplydevastated
Member
Member # 25001
Default  Posted: 9:04 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Have you told the accountant that WW is having an affair? I think the accountant needs to know the situation in order to advise you.

My personal opinion about ^^this is that the accountant doesn't need to know personal details like this. But that's just me.

I agree with the others, keep it detached and business like. Treat it as any other meeting with clients. Don't talk about anything personal before or after the meeting with your wife. I also like the 10 second rule before speaking. It helps.

Good luck.


Me - BS, 39 (I'm not old...I'm vintage)
Two Wonderful children - DS10, DD7
Married, for now... (4+ D-Day - listed in profile.)

Posts: 5854 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: In the darkest depths of hell!
sunshine226
Member
Member # 38851
Default  Posted: 9:10 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

If she is there too, how much of what your accountant tells you will you actually hear???

You will be so focused on trying to keep yourself from looking at her, thinking about it, talking to her, that whatever your accountant tells you about your options will not even sink in and you wont hear a thing

Try to do this on your own, it is for your own good to find out where you stand with this business, she can meet with him after if she wants to, no decisions are going to be made at this meeting, just advice so she really doesn't have to be there, does she????


Me-BS (44)
Him-WS (47)
DDay 1/1/2012, common law for 22 1/2 years when he began A in September 2011
Status: moving on without him

Posts: 234 | Registered: Mar 2013
Josephine01
Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 9:21 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I'm sorry Shockedman for everythig. I think everyone has given you good advice. I also think that your head won't be in the game if she is there. Is there anyway that you can postpone the meeting untill you've had a chance to talk with your WW? You should tell her that your not willing to be in the same room with her yet and figure out a way for both of you to be involved w/o being together?

If not just be cold and business like, it'll be hard, I know.

I wish there were a better answers for you.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 9:47 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

She said that she can't see me yet either. Holy shit! right? She has an affair and it has taken her over 2 weeks and she still can't even apologized for the affair or made any effort to win me back. Thats low shit. To be clear, she has already apologized, but only for hurting people and putting us in that position. Never for the affair. Also sent a bunch of self-defacing BS, full of I and me statements, like "i don't know how I can ever live with myself". Not too much about me and my needs. I rescheduled it for June 11. I meet with my attorney on June 10, so at least I can go in there with some knowledge. I also thought it prudent to bring a voice recorder with me to record the whole conversation so if I am distracted, I can go back over it.

LonelyHusband: I hear you. As each day passes, I am liking her less and less too. The women I thought she was has become someone else. It's as if she has already made up her mind and trying to make it easier for me to make my decision. It is. I never would have guessed in a million years she would have an affair. I was wrong. Then I would have never guessed that when she was caught, that she wouldn't fight to win me back. I was wrong again. At this point the only thing I am right about is that she is damn good actress!

[This message edited by Shockedman at 9:49 AM, June 3rd (Monday)]


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
Itsgoingtobeok
Member
Member # 37664
Default  Posted: 10:18 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I'm in the same boat as you . Me and my WW own a business together . Imho is this . By seeing your accountant so soon tells me you are allowing you emotions to control your decision . You need to formulate a plan that will allow you to leave the business or operate the business without your WW. This will mean eating some crow and acting like your WW has the upper hand but it will buy you time to see a lawyer and to start your plan to minimise your losses .


BS-(52)
WS-49
married 28 yrs
Kid's -2
A- several
DD- 12-10-12
Starting recovery

"I don't understand the world today I don't understand what she needs I gave her everything she threw it all away" tom petty


Posts: 215 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Los Angeles
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 10:27 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I don't think it is an emotional response. I mean of course it is partly, but I do think part of the problem in our marriage/life was running this business together. I brought up many times over the past year. But she never wanted to address it. At this point, I am highly skilled and could find another job pretty easily. I am willing to even dissolve the business completely to get out and not have to work with her. In some ways I think I am actually helping the situation. If we want to have and chance of R, I think taking the business out of the picture will make it easier as we have one less thing to deal with. BUT she has held resentment about the business since we started it always saying that I treat her as if she is not as important as me. I absolutely did not treat her this way. In fact, I did the opposite. She knows as a fact that I am more important, but I never ever made her feel this way. It was her own feelings of inadequacy as she knows that I can run the business without her and she can't run it without me. I was doing this long before we started the business together. Been in my field for 14 years and it is a highly skilled area. Our business is only 3 years old.

Also, I am seeing my lawyer the day before the accountant and all I am looking to do is to get some info and then sit with it. I don't paln to do anything with it just yet.

The shitty thing, is my WW has been making plans with this guy she has been cheating with for 7 months. Normal bullshit. Love at first sight, soul mate, deep emotional and sexual affair. Planning our future together. That trumps our 17 year relationship and 10 years of marriage. Then she is indignant with me because I am making a plan for my future. Whatever my future holds, with or without her, running a business together is out of the question. She said to me the other day that she thought I was bigger than that and exes can run business succesfully.... I laughed and said "maybe exes that split amicably and were still friends, but thats not us."

Does that give any insight into where she is at? I think her mind is already made up and she checked out long ago. This is now the formalities stage....

[This message edited by Shockedman at 10:39 AM, June 3rd (Monday)]


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
savvy
Member
Member # 39102
Default  Posted: 10:30 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I too own a business with Wh. Thankfully he also has another business with his dad so most of the time he's not there. It's still so new to you don't make any rash decisions just get some information for yourself. Wishing you well.


me-BS (49)
him-WH (49)
2 children 21 and 19
Together 30 years
Ow-(30)and she knew me knew he is married.
D-day 1 4/24/2013
D-day 2. 7/9/2013. Day after anniversary
D-day 3. 8/12/13.
Filing for divorce

Posts: 135 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: connecticut
1Faith
Member
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Have something scripted before hand so when the emotions hit (and they most likely will) you can fall back on what you have prepared.

Perhaps something along the lines of "we are here to discuss the business. We need to focus on this for now. It would be best to wait on discussing our m at another time."

I know its easier said than done but you have been very strong. I believe you can do it.

Deep breaths and good luck.

(((hugs)))


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1105 | Registered: Apr 2013
1Faith
Member
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

oops - double post...sorry

[This message edited by 1Faith at 10:42 AM, June 3rd (Monday)]


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1105 | Registered: Apr 2013
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 10:44 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Holy shit guys. more drama. Backstory is that I asked her to move out on d-day. She did. Now you wants time at home. I agreed. Then shes wants to stay here. I disagreed. I told her that she came come from 5pm-11pm both Tues and Wed nights and I will leave. She is throwing a hissy.

Her response after I refused this 5 times:

After some very careful thought, prayer, and consideration it seems that for you, it comes down to what I did. Period. It comes down to what you need financially to move forward. Period. I was staying in the original plan of individual counseling, MC counseling, running the business and household as we move through this first step. My thoughts have been with 17 years and 10 years of marriage. With 11 years of building our home. I felt as though if we tried to work through some of the emotional end of all of this we would find out if there was something worth saving. But now you have moved so hastily I can't even give time to think about the things above. Now I've moved into your time line...your idea of how this should work. You say I've lost my rights to come home, sleep there and to be in the home when I need to. The home I built too. This is not for you to decide. No matter what I did, that right still remains. I'm coming home to sleep on Tuesday and Wednesday night. I will work outside of the house. Make other sleeping arrangements.

Mine:
I find it hard to believe that you can't see why I would start making plans for my life and future. For the past 7 months, you have been making plans for your future and NONE of them included me. I am in the info gathering stages now. Meeting wioth our accountant was to gather info about our options so when we are ready to make a choice, we know where we stand. It has nothing to do with what I need financially. In fact the opposite. Do you think I want to give up a business I worked so hard for? If we want to have and chance of reconciling, I think taking the business out of the picture will make it easier as we have one less thing to deal with and can focus on our marriage. At this point you are keeping you options open and can't even commit to trying to work on our relationship. If you were commited to trying, you commit to really trying. Meaning No Contact and transparency.

I will not leave Tues and Wed, so if you want to sleep here it will have to be with me in the house.


Now its a power struggle...what should I do?


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
mainlyinpain
Member
Member # 39134
Default  Posted: 10:48 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

I would say meet with the accountant yourself, let him tell you if you need to have a meeting with her present subsequently or if he can just update her. Is he also your personal accountant? Most likely he is, and you should inform him of the situation, of a probable divorce so he can get his ducks in a row about the situation. They hear it all the time. Is it you or her that usually deals with the accountant? He can actually be a valuable source of information to benefit either you or her in the divorce proceedings. Ask your lawyer if he would benefit from your meeting with the accountant first. (((Hugs))) to you.


DD 1 - 7/7/2004
DD 2 - 10/31/2011
DD 3 - 4/30/2013(or continuation?)(Yes)
DD 4 - 9/25/2013
DD 5 - 2/15/2014 (found phone from 2009)

Posts: 485 | Registered: Apr 2013
Twitchy
Member
Member # 25393
Default  Posted: 10:52 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

As for her staying overnight, make up a bed for her wherever you want her to sleep. She's right that you can't force her to move out, but how you arrange things in the home is up to both of you.

Lay out a blanket of the basement floor. If she conplains, throw her a pillow.


BH(me)-49, FWW-43,
D-Day #1 - Oct 2007 - On-Line EA leading to a failed rendez-vous
D-Day #2 - Nov 2008 - In person EA caught early.

Away you will go, sailing in a race among the ruins.
If you plan to face tomorrow, do it soon. Gordon Lightfoot


Posts: 617 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Ontario - Canada
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 10:52 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Now this:

And because you have moved it so fast in this direction all I can think is that you want a divorce. This is the kind of action someone takes when they don't want to be married anymore.

And my response:

Unlike having an affair where you plan your future with another person?

Making plans to safeguard my life is logical. I am meeting with lawyers and accounts to know my rights. My actions have nothing to do with our marriage, rather they have to do with the logistics and assest of our life. The less we have to deal with, the more we could focus on our problems. You are simply seeing however you want to see it. I gave you the plan of action and now I am following through. You are welcome to see it however you wish. I know I am just preparing myself for whatever direction our relationship goes.


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
brokenblackbird
Member
Member # 29541
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Now its a power struggle...what should I do?

It has been a power struggle for her the whole time. She wants to remain in control. I said it in my last post to you. Your wife doesn't like feeling like she isn't in control of the situation. If you look back on your marriage, you'll probably find this has been true for a long time.

You make YOUR decisions based on what YOU want. Don't let her make decisions for you. She doesn't get to decide what is best for you. If she shows up at the house, then she does. Legally it is her house too and you can't keep her out. Have her sleep in the guest bedroom. Stand your ground and draw your boundaries.

Make a list of what you need from your marriage. The first step is NC. Why would she be unwilling to take that stand if she is all in for the marriage? Next step is transparency. Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Then the work of IC/MC.

What do you want from your marriage?


Posts: 752 | Registered: Sep 2010
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 11:07 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

What do you want from your marriage?

I have been spending a lot of time thinking about this lately. What I want is already gone, so I am not sure. I wanted a loving, commited partner to share my life and passion with,but that is gone. I also think I want children and she does not. That is likely the deal breaker for R. I told her in the past I was willing to give up having kids to be with her because our 17 relationship was more valuable. Not any more.


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
brokenblackbird
Member
Member # 29541
Default  Posted: 11:14 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Then you need to see an attorney and file paperwork. It sounds like you know this isn't going to work for you.

This may have been an exit affair for her. She is quickly moving the context of her communication with you towards divorce - even though she says its you who wants it (this is typical of the WS, not at all unusual to see it coming).


Posts: 752 | Registered: Sep 2010
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 11:38 AM, June 3rd (Monday)

Heating up!

WW:
I have said that I will go to therapy and MC. That is effort toward some sort of end. That is a process to see if we both have it in us to move forward in our marriage, to see if we should still be married, to see if you can forgive. No, I am not being a coward. I was going through the first step to see if our therapists even think, like you said, whether we should even go to MC. You have not made your decision. You cited things like whether we reconcile or don't it's going to be very difficult to move forward. You cited in conversations that you don't even know if you can do the work to reconcile or even want to. Your signs to me have all been related to a separation plan. That is now the space you have put us in. I was still in the first phase. I thought we would move in a direction when we had the answer. When when our emotional status is in a better place to make decisions then we would then take the proper steps to move in whatever that direction would be.
We don't even know what direction we are moving in. You cited that you too, have been unhappy for quite some time. I didn't even know this. You didn't communicate that with me at all. I thought you were alienating me due to my family problems. I thought that was the problem or else I would have asked otherwise. So I still have yet to hear what that even means.

And you going to an attorney, real estate agent, valuation appointment has ALOT to do with our marriage. It is what we have built in our marriage. And you are trying to figure out what your rights are, what money there is for you to move forward WITHOUT ME. That has everything to do with our marriage.

You said: I know I am just preparing myself for whatever direction our relationship goes.---- You don't know what your direction is either. How are we supposed to know this when I have gone to 1 therapy session and when you have gone to 2 since the affair has come out.

It is not how I see it. It is what it is. You are moving forward with a separation plan. What you have said to me in texts shows me that I don't stand a chance in redeeming myself.


ME:
I have said that I will go to therapy and MC. That is effort toward some sort of end.
You have said you will go to therapy and MC, but you did not say you wanted to. As you said, you “agreed” to it. I made that decision. You can’t commit to No Contact, so you are really not committed to trying to work it out. I would be looking at this different if you had. This may be an exit affair for you. You are quickly moving the context of your communication with me towards divorce - even though you say it’s me who wants it.

You cited things like whether we reconcile or don't it's going to be very difficult to move forward. You cited in conversations that you don't even know if you can do the work to reconcile or even want to.
I am being real and honest. You damn well know it will be hard for me to forgive you. I never said it was impossible. That is being real.

That is now the space you have put us in.
This is the space YOU have put us in. Making a plan for my future is not wrong and I will not apologize for it. I am in the info gathering stages. I did not file for divorce. You are just seeing how you want to see it and can’t relinquish control. I am not doing things the way you want, but rather the way I want and that is OK.

And you going to an attorney, real estate agent, valuation appointment has ALOT to do with our marriage. It is what we have built in our marriage. And you are trying to figure out what your rights are, what money there is for you to move forward WITHOUT ME. That has everything to do with our marriage.

It does not. Our marriage is about you and me and our relationship with one another. It is not at ALL about the money. Material possessions are not important. Again, making a plan. Never said I was putting the house on the market tomorrow, but IF and WHEN that time comes of does not come, I want to be prepared to move forward and not have to start the whole process then.

It is not how I see it. It is what it is. You are moving forward with a separation plan. What you have said to me in texts shows me that I don't stand a chance in redeeming myself.
You have not showed me yet that you even want to redeem yourself. You won’t commit to trying, you are just weighing your options. If you were seriously trying to redeem yourself, then you would drop the attitude and control and commit to NO contact. Instead you act indignant and say things like “I have a right to privacy”. That is not an option if you want this work.


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
1Faith
Member
Member # 38975
Default  Posted: 12:14 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

My suggestion is to stop with the text. I know right now it is easier said than done but you can't discuss a relationship or their issues via text. Plus they can be altered and potential used against you.

She is bantering with you to get a reaction. She does not appear remorseful in the least more scared of losing all she has.

That is a consequence of her poor choices.

You can't negotiate with a terrorist and you can make sense of nonsense.

Keep it simple and limit communication at this point.

Good luck. Stay strong.


"I can be changed by what happens to me. But I refuse to be reduced by it." - Maya Angelou

Posts: 1105 | Registered: Apr 2013
wonderingbull
Member
Member # 14833
Default  Posted: 12:29 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Did you notice that she's changed the conversation for the "me, I,you" to "us,we"?

What she's doing is a classic cheater switcharoo.... Instead of taking the blame, doing NC and being part of the solution she's trying to get you onboard with her "magical" thinking... She's trying to buy time to continue cake eating to keep you as her backup plan...

In her mind, she's lost control and the only way she thinks she can regain it is to keep you towing the "us, we" plan as she needs to reclaim the "you" backup plan...

I'd bet dollars to donuts that when she was in the middle of her A and planning her new world of rainbows and unicorns with the OM she was sure she'd keep you under her thumb...

Her thought process most likely went something like this...

"If" I get caught with the OM, BS won't divorce me! He can't because we've got so many ties together like the business and the house... I've got him over a barrel so fuck him.... I've got that backup plan by the short hairs...

Ok, now that she sees you actually moving forward her backup plan isn't cooperating one damn bit... She really thought you'd be there and so she's bringing up the "us,we" crap...

Keep doing what you're doing... Protecting yourself from her destructive actions and thoughts...

You can't trust her...

I know this... If a person I do business with will cheat on his/her spouse they'll cheat me in a heartbeat...

WB


The secret of life is enjoying the passage of time...

James Taylor


Posts: 5969 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: A better place
Lyonesse
Member
Member # 32943
Default  Posted: 12:40 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I'm seconding 1Faith's comments. I know the overwhelming need to point out to the WS just where their illogical fallacies lie. She is not in a place to hear it, though, she is just trying to ensure that her plans are not derailed by your confident progress.

I think it will be better for you, and more effective, now that you've laid it out, to tell her there is no need for more discussion until she ends the affair. Really no point in "exploring" the potential for the M while she is in another relationship. Then communicate only about business and financial necessities until she indicates she is willing to do so. If she cannot do that, file.

I know this is really tough, but the NC with AP is just non-negotiable. Without that, nothing else can happen.


Me: BS, 40's.

Posts: 1794 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: West Coast
hathnofury
Member
Member # 32550
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Totally agree with above responses from others.

No more long messages. Only short specific ones about finances/business/property that are absolutely necessary.

I wouldn't discuss the lawyer or accountant any more with her. You have tipped your hand, it would have been to your advantage to pursue that without her knowing. That way, you are exploring your options for YOU and not being questioned what your motives are. She may now try to sabotage your efforts (meet with as many lawyers as she can to prevent them from representing you, file first, take all the money and run, etc). Don't include her in any other plans. She doesn't need to know. She only needs to know if you move money, file, etc and that is after you have the legal blessing of your L and after the fact. If she was truly considering R, she would still try no matter what you did, and she's not.

[This message edited by hathnofury at 12:43 PM, June 3rd (Monday)]


BS 43, SAWH 38. M 15years, together 17. Body count in the triple digits. Both in recovery, trying to R.
Three kids under age 11.

Posts: 1464 | Registered: Jun 2011
Bigger
Member
Member # 8354
Default  Posted: 12:45 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Snap out of the drama.
Simplify your interactions. Stop these long texts. You won‘t negotiate or bargain your way out of infidelity. And you DEFINITELY won’t “cure” her.

Stick to facts and reality.
Fact is that since it’s a marital home you can’t refuse her access or residence. OK – it IS possible that IF you file you could seek residence while the divorce goes through but since you don’t have kids and there is no physical threat to either of you I doubt it will be granted.

You have also stated that you don’t want the house. That IF this ends in D you are offering her option of buying the house. So why hang onto it? Why not simply allow her to move in and you move out? The collateral in the house might enable you to buy her out of the business IF this ends in D.

I would seriously consider giving your wife (well, at least offering it…) what she is asking for.

Look at what she has been telling you over the years:
You are not meeting her expectations. She isn’t happy with you. She has refused you sex. She has refused to be part of a marriage. She has shown she seeks fulfillment elsewhere.

Look at what she’s telling you now:
If she’s allowed to deal with her infidelity on HER terms she’s willing to get professional help to see if MAYBE she could accept you despite the earlier comments.

Look – nearly EVERY WS here on SI has tried to get to end the affair on “their” terms. It’s like an alcoholic that tries to stop drinking without outside help; it WONT WORK.

You have to remove each and every excuse she has for compromising on how she works on the marriage and leave her naked except for the ONLY excuse there should be: She wants to work on the marriage because she WANTS to.
Get that? Not because divorce would affect the job. Not because you have a neat house as a couple. Not because she can tolerate having sex with you every third month. Not because you to would have to make financial compromises… You have to take each and every one of her excuses and refuse it:
“Yes honey. If we divorce we won’t be friends. It’s not that I don’t want to or that I will be your enemy. It’s just that this is what happens when people divorce. I plan on moving on and creating a new life. Look around; how many people do we know that are good friends with their ex?”
“Yes honey. I don’t think we will be working together. There is too much attachment between us and it’s better for both of us to put distance between us”.
“Yes honey. We will have less spending money when we have to pay for separate houses, groceries and so on, but that’s just what happens.”

I’m going to copy/paste from my first post on your thread:
You care too much for her to constrain her. If she is so uncontent with you then you won’t stand in the way of her leaving. You aren’t happy with it but it beats feeling like you are her warden and DEFINITELY beats sharing her.
That you can accept that there might be things you do that could contribute to her discontent. BUT those things will NEVER justify her decision to have an affair. The affair is totally 100% her bad.
If she wants to work on the marriage then she has to tell you so in a clear and concise way. You won’t force her. She doesn’t have any excuse or reason to remain, nor excuse or reason to prevent her leaving. It’s totally her call.
Remove each and every excuse. Leave her standing there with no other reason for being in the marriage other than she WANTS TO.


"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

Posts: 5503 | Registered: Sep 2005
LonelyHusband
Member
Member # 34145
Default  Posted: 1:22 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

180 and File for divorce. She needs a wake up call. If you do acually want her back, then you need to try and shock her out of this nonsense. It might work, it might not, but until you assert control of your own life again you and just going to stay on this little melodrama merry-go-round. Either way is a win win for you. However, the longer you stay in this drama the more you will come off worse.

nothing will change until you change it. Take your life back.

[This message edited by LonelyHusband at 1:29 PM, June 3rd (Monday)]


BS ( me) 41
fWS (OktoberMest) 35
D day #1 29/10/2011, D day #2 15/112011, D day #3 15/03/2012
Reconciling.
“It’s better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all”, is inadequate consolation when you vacuum up a child's hamster'

Posts: 1290 | Registered: Dec 2011 | From: UK
Shockedman
Member
Member # 39376
Default  Posted: 1:32 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I am sick. It hasn't been texts, but rather email. No matter, it is out of control now. I have to agree with you all. Here is the latest:

"Don't tell me who I'm taking action for. MC isn't taking action for us????????? I've already answered your question in re: to no contact. Drop the no contact agreement. I'm not signing anything unless you hand me a divorce paper."

I guess I will give her what she is asking for. My heart is broken.

I responded:

So you are saying you will sign it if I serve it? Why do I need to drop the no contact? If you weren't having contact it not be an issue? Right? I thought after 17 years together and 10 years of marriage, the LEAST you could do was to commit to stop talking to your lover while we try to settle our marriage. I see you are unwilling to do that now, so what are we even trying for?


Posts: 102 | Registered: May 2013
simplydevastated
Member
Member # 25001
Default  Posted: 1:39 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Wow! This has all gotten to be rather ugly and fast. I'm sorry this is happening.

I've already answered your question in re: to no contact. Drop the no contact agreement. I'm not signing anything unless you hand me a divorce paper."

^^This sounds like she's just told you what she wants without coming straight out and saying it. She doesn't want to go NC with her AP. I guess the big question is why. Is it because she's still talking to him? Don't be surprised if she comes out and says, something to the effect of "This divorce is what you wanted." or "I've tried to (fill in anything here) and you couldn't see my efforts." Those see to be classic WS lines.

It may be in your best interest to go NC with her. Maybe tell her that you'll only discuss the business and that's all...

Good Luck.


Me - BS, 39 (I'm not old...I'm vintage)
Two Wonderful children - DS10, DD7
Married, for now... (4+ D-Day - listed in profile.)

Posts: 5854 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: In the darkest depths of hell!
rivenheart
Member
Member # 13838
Default  Posted: 1:55 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I have to agree: stop the drama. You've made your requests clear to her. She's made her refusal clear to you. Continue with your information gathering. Implement the 180 and go NC with her outside of essential communications regarding the business. If she wants to come home, she almost certainly does have that right. Equally, you have the right to leave, which I would suggest you take.

Right now she's either delusional, or she's playing you for more time while she finalizes her exit strategy. Either way, it's not in your interest to engage with her.

I would suggest you continue IC. When the date for that MC session comes around, attend it. If she shows, fine. If not, fine. Just don't let the MC'er or your WW rugsweep or blame-shift or pull any other bullshit about the A. Know your bottom lines and stick to your minimal requirements for R. Lay them on the table early and don't waver from them. You can't control her, but she can't control you either if you don't let her. Specifically, she can't dictate under what conditions the M continues. Either one of you are legally empowered to pull that plug at any time. Marriages only continue to exist by mutual consent. A NC letter is very, very far from being a ridiculous or unreasonable requirement - and even if it were so, you'd still retain the legal right to end the M. Showing up to MC with good information on how assets would likely be divided in case of D will be beneficial for you. It will show you mean business and can provide factual material to discuss productively if R is not in the cards.

You're doing very well so far. Just try to de-escalate the drama, follow the 180, and keep posting/reading here.


rivenheart ~ heartriven
Me: BW, 36 at d-day; WH, 40

Posts: 1037 | Registered: Mar 2007
whatlysbeneath
Member
Member # 32665
Default  Posted: 1:57 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Shockedman,

Your actions have clearly revealed her intent.

Continue to gather knowledge and treat her like the untrustworthy stranger that she is.

Logically you must realize you are on the D path. When you have all the knowledge you need on your rights and options, file for D.

You can still call the D off if she chooses to change and become remorseful.


Me: BH
Her: WW
Together 18 years
M 17
D day 2010
4 young children
Every secret in a marriage is a lie...I'm tired of being lied too.

Posts: 129 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Mayberry to Hell to Limboville
whatlysbeneath
Member
Member # 32665
Default  Posted: 1:57 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Shockedman,

Your actions have clearly revealed her intent.

Continue to gather knowledge and treat her like the untrustworthy stranger that she is.

Logically you must realize you are on the D path. When you have all the knowledge you need on your rights and options, file for D.

You can still call the D off if she chooses to change and become remorseful.


Me: BH
Her: WW
Together 18 years
M 17
D day 2010
4 young children
Every secret in a marriage is a lie...I'm tired of being lied too.

Posts: 129 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: Mayberry to Hell to Limboville
toomanyregrets
Member
Member # 37740
Default  Posted: 3:07 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Seeing your lawyer is a good idea from what you've written.
And from what your WW said you might as well file.
She'll only sign a NC letter if you file for D. Might as well, she's already left your marriage.

One question, what about the OM's and his BW? Did they R or seperate?


BH - 64
fWW - 59

"Affairs are not mistakes, they are a series of deliberate choices." - CrappyLife


Posts: 452 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Upstate NY
TOMTEFAR
Member
Member # 39257
Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Dude!

Read the book "No more Mr Nice Guy"

You really need to. In all Communications with your WW you keep going on the defensive, explaining yourself falling for her manipulation and controling.

You need to snap out of it.

Stop explaining your actions. If anything just state your actions, don't explain them, don't argue them with her. Don't fall into her manipulations and controling.

Her refusing to write a NC letter that "YOU" should mail shows Everything. She either has no plan at all to get back to you or beleive you are week and will allow her back regardless of what she does.

There is a common saying in these circomstances. It goes like this: "If you want to have a chance of getting your WS back you need to be prepared to loose Him/Her"

She is still running the show and in the fog. You need to run the show and you need to snap her out of the fog.

The normal actionplan for this is to actually file for D. If she snaps out you can Always stop the D. Filing will give you the answere you want. Either she snaps out and comes begging back to you or she shows her colors. Either way you will be allowed to move on woth your Life.


Posts: 105 | Registered: May 2013
tushnurse
Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 5:23 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

This is so emotionally draining and you are doing better than a lot of us did in those early days. She is still in blame mode. That tells me she is still in the A. Any further thought to talking to the other BS? You two can work to help each other.

Another thought I had is she has been talking with someone who has btdt or an attorney. That's why she's pushing to get back in the house because she foun out she can, probably telling her parents that you are working it out.

Have you tracked her? Her denial for NC is bs. Try to keep communication to a minimum and when she asks why you are doing this simply state that she has done nothing to help you even begin to think R is something you can try, NC AND passwords/access to all phone email is a must. She will most likely go apeshit. Just walk away.


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8089 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
Athena1979
Member
Member # 39393
Default  Posted: 5:32 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I'm sorry...she is requesting to sleep in your house? I'm still stuck on that. Why doesn't go sleep at the OM house?
And agreed...keep it short and sweet with the conversation. Answer every communication with her as "no, dear. I will consult with my attorney first." "I'm sorry, dear. But I will need to consult with my attorney before replying."
That's would be super annoying. The best way to get back at someone who does this is to be super sweet to the other person.
And btw, what I learned from this website and from small things my darling, prostitute buying husband was saying, is that people cheat because they are depressed. They do it because they need attention and they need from anyone and everyone who will provide it. It has nothing to do with you. She has mental issues with her own self esteem. You can't fix that, only she can. Trust me. It's all about her self confidence. That's why she did it. Good luck!


Married 11/11/11
Together since 3/2005
2 kids
D-day 12/27/12
D-day 4/12/13
D-day 6/26/13
God keeps the devil on a short leash. God will never give you more than you can handle.

Posts: 111 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Athena1979
I think I can
Member
Member # 17756
Default  Posted: 5:36 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I'm so sorry, shockedman. You really are doing incredibly well for so early on, despite the terrible pain you are in.

Deep breaths. You can do this. You will get through this.


I'm not the winner, I'm the prize.

Posts: 8805 | Registered: Jan 2008
WildRose
New Member
Member # 39424
Default  Posted: 5:45 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

I think you should change your locks on your house, TODAY. She has no right to force her presence on you when she is the offending party!

I learned a breathing technique once to help cope with stress, I want to share it because it may help during your accountant meeting - it has helped me keep my cool under pressure before.

It's very simple. You take one slow, deep breath, and imagine that you are breathing in goodness, peace, self control, composure, health, happiness, whatever you need to breathe in at the moment. When you release your breath, slowly, you imagine that you are breathing out all the tension, anger, stress, hurt, disease, anything that feels out of control, anything you need to breathe out at the moment.

So the basic concept is: Breathe in good, breathe out bad. It can help lower stress (and even blood pressure) if done alone for about 20 mins during quiet times, but in the context of a pressure cooker situation, when anything triggers you to be upset in ANY way, allow yourself the space to breathe in and out, that one deep breath before responding. It takes seconds, but can be a self-control life saver.

I hope it helps you. I'm so sorry for what you're going through. I know the first days after discovery are such a whirlwind. Stand up for yourself!! I hope things get better for you.


Posts: 9 | Registered: Jun 2013
MediumRare
Member
Member # 35128
Default  Posted: 7:25 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

So sorry you are here Shockedman.

As others have said, you need to 180 hard and stop these long replies to her utter, cake-eating, gaslighting nonsense. So she is willing to go to MC (probably on your dime) while fucking some other man's dick? This is her "working on us" LOL.

Start looking at things realistically and don't get suckered into this drama and bullshit she's looping you into.

When she checked out of the marriage, she checked out of the marital home AND checked out of you giving a shit. PERIOD. If you feel the need to answer her in anyway, keep it to short but sweet messages such as that: "When YOU decided to check out of the marriage, YOU also decided to check out of the marital home AND from any of my attention."

When she is willing to beg for forgiveness, go NC with confirmed NC letter, go for full transparency (all passwords, emails, accounts, GPS, VAR, etc. etc.), as well as IC/MC, only THEN can R even be SLIGHTLY considered.

Do the 180 friend and protect yourself and start taking care of ONLY yourself. There is no way she is going to come out of her fantasy fog bubble if you play into her dramatics of ludicrous non-NC offerings and her obvious misunderstanding that she jumped on another man's dick so SHE has NO say in any bargaining. SHE is the one that fucked up, so SHE is not in the drivers seat here any more and should be served divorce papers immediately (even if you don't divorce) to make it clear where this is headed if things don't change DRAMATICALLY and IMMEDIATELY.

Good luck friend!


BS (ME): 44
WS(HER): 42
9 years
OM#1- 20-something loser, stole bunch of my things after she had sex with him in our bed (no condoms, STDs)
OM#2- 24 year old, unemployed loser, lives with mom & dad
DDay 1/2012
NC 3/20/2012
SGASDay 4/1/2012

Posts: 712 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: California
Lyonesse
Member
Member # 32943
Default  Posted: 8:47 PM, June 3rd (Monday)

Can you move up your consultation with the lawyer? I don't mean to add to your worries, but there have been instances where a spouse who has checked out removes money from the joint account, or runs up credit card debt. I think you should make sure ASAP you understand all the ways you may need to protect yourself. Better safe than sorry.


Me: BS, 40's.

Posts: 1794 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: West Coast
Topic Posts: 40