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User Topic: Sex attitude survey
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 6:42 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

I'm wondering if my attitude around sex is overly puritan. So, a little survey.

1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex?

2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date?

[This message edited by OnceInALifetime at 7:03 AM, July 7th (Sunday)]


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
cayc
Member
Member # 21964
Default  Posted: 7:10 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

Since I'm up early so I can work out before watching the men's Wimbledom tennis final (do I live an exciting life or what???), I'll bite.

1) What must be in place for you to have sex? Feelings of love? An optimistic feeling that you might one day love this person? Simple lust and attraction?

Lust and attraction plus the optimistic feeling.

2) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex? (Be honest)
Based upon my current beau, the second day of our first 3 day date lol.

3) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

Pleasure and excitement and admiration. By admiration I mean the same thing when I said above that optimistic feeling. I have to really think I like them as a person and will continue to do so.

4) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?

No casual sex in the sense that I won't sleep with anyone just to have sex. I have to like the guy and be thinking in terms of the guy staying around for awhile. So while physical aspects matter in the sense of attraction, if I'm not into his mind who cares what he looks like b/c I'll have zero sexual interest. I have to be into him to want to touch him.

5) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?
I've done both, it just depends on the moment.

6) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?

Both.

7) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?

No. Again, the mind thing. I'm connected mentally to my dates before the actual "date" happens. If I find myself on one of those dates - I don't like him, don't want to be there, don't know him well enough to know if I like him - then sex will never happen.

ETA: this is why with OLD I do A LOT of emailing, texting, calling before meeting. IF you make it through the 2-4 week gauntlet of that to actually meet me in person, then I'm mentally in. (Unless who you are verbally is much different than you you are in person like that guy who I had long involved discussions with then I turn up at his house, he can't look me in the eye, say a word, argues with me over a work test I just failed implying it was my fault that I didn't know a crucial piece of information, and then says let's get dinner which means let's go to the grocery store, I'll buy food and you cook it lol).

8) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date?

No. Sometimes before, sometimes during.

There's a theme in my answers. I have to be mentally into the guy. When that's there, I'm much more open sexually.

[This message edited by cayc at 7:14 AM, July 7th (Sunday)]


"The difference between involvement and commitment is like ham and eggs. The chicken is involved, the pig is committed." -Martina Navratilova
"The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me." -Ayn Rand

Posts: 3003 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: Mexico
Amazonia
Member
Member # 32810
Default  Posted: 7:12 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

1) I like them, I want to have sex, and I know they''re clean.
2) depends
3) it''s just sex. I guess it would depend on the individual, but...it''s just sex.
4) I have two general experiences - within committed relationships, or ONS. The motivations are completely different.
5) yep.
6) I generally know whether or not I''m going to have sex with a person beforehand, but I don''t discuss it with him
7) nope
8) within a relationship, yes ONS, no


"You yourself deserve your love and affection as much as anybody in the universe." -Buddha
"Let's face it, life is a crap shoot." -Sad in AZ

Posts: 13565 | Registered: Jul 2011
SBB
Member
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 7:31 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

1) I go with the flow, if it feels right it happens.
2) Simple pleasure and excitement.
3) Yes and No. I've had casual sex with lots of cute and dumb no futures. I don't 'wait' X dates for someone I really like - I wait until the right moment per answer 1) above.
4) Yes. As a woman its kind of like shooting fish in a barrel. I'm not really into innuendos.
5) I would be mues creeped out if it was pre-planned. See answer 1) above.
6) Yes - I generally don't go on a date expecting to get laid. I have found a direct correlation between nanna undies and getting laid. I hardly ever get laid when I'm wearing my nice undies.
7) See answer 5 above.

To me its just sex. Bumping uglies. The horizontal tango. IMO it is a form of self expression, like dancing. It is supposed to be fun - analysing it makes it about as sexy as a visit to the dentist.

Perhaps I'd feel differently if I saw sex as a sacred union between two people. I see intimacy as that sacred union, not sex. Two very different things. I've had great sex where there has been no intimacy. I've had great intimacy where there has been no sex.

When you have both - its not about waiting X dates for sex, its about building on that intimacy and not rushing it thereby creating a synthetic version of that intimacy via sex. Sex does not equal intimacy. IMO lots of people get this part wrong.

What are you afraid of OIAL? Rejection? Performance? Intimacy? Or are you wound up like a spring? You don't have to answer here but I would encourage you explore this a little. I may be way off base I but I honestly get a sense of fear when it comes to your encounters with the fairer sex.

I hope you've pursued the dancing - getting comfortable in your own skin will help quell the uneasiness all of this stuff brings out in you.

[This message edited by StrongButBroken at 7:47 AM, July 7th (Sunday)]


Buzz- The word you are searching for is 'Space-Ranger.'
Woody- The word I'm searching for, I can't say, because there are Pre-school toys here.

Posts: 5440 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 8:00 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

SBB, I'm wound up like a spring. Also, I'm not a nervous date initially, but I have trouble imagining a woman wanting me *that* way, so if I feel desire, I freeze around that and it doesn't get expressed.

It is rather like dancing. There's something fluid and improvisatory that I lack. As well as the leading role that men are expected to take. Whether learning to dance would somehow translate to feeling more at ease with expressing desire, who can say?

I'm a case of arrested development. By my age, men who've led normal lives have had more than one partner. The women I date aren't wanting to be with a wet behind the ears boy. Sort of a catch 22 for me.

I asked these questions because I need to convince myself that women are sexual beings. That they like sex, have fun with sex. That it's not taboo. That I can *go* there, that I'm even welcome to go there.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
I.will.survive
Member
Member # 34677
Default  Posted: 8:37 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

OIAL, your last reply hits home for me. My SO got married at 22 and his wife was his first.

They were married 16 years and she developed a sexual problem involving pain so for 3 straight years there was no sex.

Fast forward to his divorce and he felt like you did. But he thinks like a girl and needs the mental connection and intimacy. He did have sex with 2 other women in the last year, but for as many dates as he went on...he could have had plenty more experiences. He just needed to know he wasn't "broken" know what I mean?

So for you, maybe it's a combo of arrested development and need for mental connection.

For me, I am not a serial dater. I choose one and focus entirely on him. That's my comfort zone. I married the last guy I did that with. Had sex on the 3rd date.

The man I love now (although I just broke it off with him because I'm not sure about marrying him) I told him I wanted to wait. Yeah...that lasted 3 dates as well. So for me, it's a feeling of intimacy that we've already created before sex. Sex isn't just an act to me. It is sacred and I don't share my body easily. I have to have the feeling we are going to be in a relationship where I feel secure.


Posts: 530 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: east coast
SBB
Member
Member # 35229
Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

You're not wet behind the ears. I wouldn't want to be a 20 somethings' "2nd" anything. Its very different with someone who has spent a quarter lifetime in the same relationship.

Being on the dating scene after a 10 year hiatus I've noticed quite a big difference in how people in my pond have sex. Most have had long term relationships so the sex is different, charming, quite lovely actually.

Have you never been the aggressor in a new relationship? Maybe that's what is freaking

Yes, women like sex. There is nothing sexier than confidence - not sexual confidence but self-confidence. Someone that likes themselves is as important as them liking me.

I've had lots of partners but I'm still a novice when it comes to any new partner IYKWIM? I don't have a cache of 'moves' on my go-to list (not for them, anyway ) but I'm just more comfortable with exploring this new terrain.

ETA

I have trouble imagining a woman wanting me *that* way

Do YOU want you *that* way? Sounds like a weird question but it is really important that you dig you too, y'know.

[This message edited by StrongButBroken at 8:44 AM, July 7th (Sunday)]


Buzz- The word you are searching for is 'Space-Ranger.'
Woody- The word I'm searching for, I can't say, because there are Pre-school toys here.

Posts: 5440 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Australia
gahurts
Member
Member # 33699
Default  Posted: 8:44 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

OIAL,

I seems to me like you are pushing yourself. Both with the dating and now worrying about when, if or how to have sex. WHY???? Why rush it? What is it that you are actually looking for?

For me, sex is the next step along the intimacy continuum. Certainly not the first, prefereably towards the end. There has to be love in it for me or it is just empty.

For me, there has to be friendship, then intimate discussions and getting to know you on a very deep level. Learning her mind. Letting chemistry develop. Then the idea of sex can come in.

It is OK to not move forward on a sexual plane. I know I am quite old fashion but there is nothing wrong with letting a relationship grow at a pace that is comfortable for both of you. Let it happen. Don't try to force it.

I love reading your posts and I've noticed a pattern develop that I think others have mentioned. You seem set on the end goal. I know what that is like. I want the same thing. But I know that in order to get there, I need to take a step back and let things happen at the right pace.

I M'ed xWW within a year after we started dating. I was focused on getting that family unit back together after my 1st D and just drove ahead. BAD CHOICE!!! I let so many red flags go by that should have been deal breakers.

Try to relax on the dating front. Give the women a chance to show you what they think of you, rather than you deciding that for them. If it is meant to be IT WILL HAPPEN!! And in the end, no woman who cares about you will think twice if they are your 1st, or 2nd or other.


"Strength does not come from physical capacity. It comes from an indominable will" - Mahatma Gandi

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - Aubrie


Posts: 3333 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Georgia
inconnu
Member
Member # 24518
Default  Posted: 9:08 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

I ended up in a relationship with the first man I dated after (cough*during*cough ) my divorce so my answers may not be applicable.

I don't do casual sex. There has to be some sort of connection. It might not necessarily have to be long-term, though. I went into the first weekend with now-SO hoping for more, but okay with the thought that I might just have that one weekend with him.

4. I don't know if I would initiate or not (not much dating experience to go on) but with SO I made it clear I was interested in sex. We were both coming off of a long, dry spell on the bus. I don't know that subtle would be accurate.

5. it's an LDR. we planned our first weekend.

6. not applicable in my situation

7. I can't say always, but I did with SO. We had a lot of rather frank discussions as friends, before we decided to take the leap into more than friends.

oial, as far as your attitude towards sex goes, you are who you are. The number of partners a person has does not necessarily correlate to someone being a good lover. I think the more woman a guy hooks up with, the more chance it is that he's not a fabulous lover (there's an "all about me" message in that, imo). Otoh, someone who has only been with one other person can be a sex god, because he's really into the woman he's with, and really into sex.

Attitude has a lot to do with it. Being comfortable with yourself as a sexual being is important. If you're thinking you're overly puritan, then it sounds like you're not that comfortable about sex. To be blunt, unless you want to go without sex for the rest of your life, you need to figure out a way to deal with this. And the sooner the better. Because you're not going to attract the right woman if you come across as neurotic about sex.


Say what you wanna say and let the words fall out...honestly
I wanna see you be brave

Pretty pretty please, don't you ever ever feel
Like you're less than, less than perfect


Posts: 12124 | Registered: Jun 2009 | From: TX
cmego
Member
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 9:27 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex?

I don't count the dates. It is more...when it is right. For me, it needs to be understood the relationship is monogamous.

2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

First? It is more like...let's get this one over with, so pleasure and excitement. I think the first one is a little nerve wracking, then you just kinda give in to the pleasure.

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?

I don't have casual sex. I did that in college a few times and it just doesn't work for me. I need to feel an emotional connection to someone to have sex with them. I would...again...wait until we agree that we are monogamous..t.hen game on.

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?

Hmmm. Well, the last guy I dated with any seriousness I suggested the first kiss. But, I don't suggest sex until I'm further into a relationship.

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?

Both.

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?

Nope.

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date?

Yes. I have told guys that sex = monogamy to me. Wether I'm having sex with them or not, I think guys need to know this about me fairly early on. If they are looking to bump uglies with no strings...I'm not your girl.


Bottom line, everyone has different attitudes around sex. I very much enjoy sex, but for me, I need an emotional connection and a commitment to a guy...I've always been that way. I am open to talking about it with a guy I'm dating, even fairly early on. I'm not a prude at all, but sex means something to me, but I have girlfriends who are perfectly good with one night stands. To each his own. I protect my beliefs, and if the guys doesn't match them...well...he isn't my guy.

When I'm in a relationship, my attitude totally changes about sex. I can have it constantly, I"m open to trying new things, I initiate, I play and have fun with sex. It is strengthening my bond to the guy, so I want to make him happy...and it feels great.

But, you don't get ^^^^^ until I'm...secure.


me...BS, 43 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced

"For whatever we lose, like a you or a me, it's always ourselves we find in the sea" ee cummings


Posts: 4033 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Virginia
missherlots
Member
Member # 30591
Default  Posted: 10:22 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

I think you must stop comparing yourself with anyone else to see if you are right or wrong.

You should look inside and decide what is your moral value and act on it.

Every time you mention about hot or it is not dating potential (or anything among does lines),it really makes me angry because it looks like you are in a meat market.

In my eyes, you have not learn anything about compassion and love for others beyond the conditioning of your self. look beyond you Ego and make an opinion of a person with no presets or expectation. We all are mess up in someway, but find the beautiful on it and take a decision with time not by looks or criticism.

I am sure you have great qualities and defects, and so everyone else.

You need to give yourself time to know the person. You can not judge by one date. People get nervous or worry about the settings, but you immediately disqualify anyone because she is not hot or whatever.

You really need time alone and, I mean alone? stop thinking about dating. You are not ready.

Let your heart and being flow naturally and it will happened for you when you are ready. If you keep forcing it, you will continue being disappointed.
You are asking who does what and when. that make me think that you are not sure what you want.

Sex is like anything else, normal and satisfactory but also means something profound and intimate. it is a connection with the person in the most profound way of intimacy and giving. Can you relate to it?
or can be fun and very human (satisfactory).

I, in my case, can have both with no conflict. I can have a relationship with someone and not been with anyone else because I am a one woman man, but if I am single with no relationship and in adult agreement with someone else, I can do it with love and respect but not intimate connection.
the Question is : do you like to have sex or you want to make LOVE to someone?

it is up to you if you open your mind and look inside.

my two cents


Pain and suffering is part of life, but I choose to feel love and compassion for all people excluding no one.

Posts: 95 | Registered: Jan 2011
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 10:38 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

Have you never been the aggressor in a new relationship?

My XW courted me aggressively. The closest I've come was with a date I got pretty hot and heavy with since the D. She made it clear she was interested, which made it terrifically easy to go for that first kiss, and the second, and the third (excuse me while I stroll down memory lane...)

It never led to sex, but that's a different story. But to answer your question, no, almost no experience being the aggressor.

Do YOU want you *that* way?

My sense of body image is not terribly consistent. In a very broad sense, I think I look pretty good for my age. But my self-evaluation varies, depending on how attracted I am to my date. When it's just me and the mirror? I'm generally OK with myself.

ETA: maybe this was meant more broadly than body image. It is a weird question for me to answer. But no, I don't see myself as particularly sexy.

gahurts, I hear what you're saying. Patience ain't easy after such a long dry spell. But I also think I've attached some sort of mystique to sex, and that's warped my dating life because expressing desire is hard for me.

misherlots, I'm glad you are an enlightened sexual being. Of course looks matter to me. Are you saying they don't matter to you? Other things matter as well. I'm not so shallow as you accuse me of being, and don't appreciate the judgment.

[This message edited by OnceInALifetime at 10:58 AM, July 7th (Sunday)]


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
gma56
Member
Member # 19595
Default  Posted: 11:33 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

The way I was after my first divorce in my early 20s is completely different than as a single 57 yr old. I'm answering as I am now.

1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex? It may be a long time before sex.
There won't be sex unless there is love involved. No casual sex. My past experience with casual sex was satisfying but only for a short time so I will wait.

2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

Statement of love but the pleasure and excitement will definitely be a part of the love making.

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?

No casual, it does nothing for me. I will wait until I am feeling what I need to feel for the man involved.

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?
Hell yes to both questions. When I'm comfortable and love someone, I'm definitely not so subtle.

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?
I've had both planned and not planned but again it wasn't casual.

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?
Not since my D.

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date? Yes. The meaning/act of sex is very special to me so I do tell in advance that I don't do casual.

I won't compromise my beliefs for a short time of pleasure because it hurts my self respect more than how good it feels for a few hours. JMO.

OIAL- There are many women that love casual sex, ons, and fwb so you can always have it anytime. if they aren't into it then they will say no. The question is, can you handle casual sex ? No strings ? You are a very passionate man, can you have casual and not feel anything ? Can you not fall in love if it's fwb on going affair ?
Only you know the answers but I know me and it would screw with my head and emotions too much to settle for anything less than I want and expect. I want the whole package and if I'm blessed to have a special man in my life again, then it will be worth the wait.
Hugs and it is hard to grow up when we are suppose to be the adults.


BW-Divorced
It's my life now, my choices, my mistakes to make and my victories to celebrate. His choices made me free of liars and betrayers in my life. I lost my family but gained a second chance to be happy.

Posts: 20323 | Registered: May 2008 | From: Half way to where I want to be.
cmego
Member
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 11:45 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

Overall, I think men are more focused on looks than women are. My ex was certainly not the best looking guy I ever dated, and I totally overlooked what I didn't find physically appealing because I did like his personality. On the other hand, if I had found nothing physically appealing about him, I wouldn't have given him a chance either. We all have our likes/dislikes about the opposite sex.

In my experience, and talking with men on OLD, men can be very blinded by how a woman looks, and not see beyond the "pretty exterior" until later in the relationship.

I say men are distracted by a paint job and forgot to check under the hood until the car suddenly isn't running any longer.

I think OIAL is exploring his own view on sexuality, and questioning them. Introspection is always good. It is always better to question yourself than to question others...so I think you are on the right path of figuring yourself out. Your beliefs. I think what missherlots is trying to say is that when you become comfortable with your beliefs, you will feel more in charge of your dating life. And, now, you are taking the time to explore your beliefs and ask questions. I think that is great.

If you aren't attracted to someone...if there is NO spark when you meet...then it may never develop. I've done a lot of "first dates only", mostly because something turned me off...not necessarily because I wasn't turned ON. Rude to waitress, for example. That guy didn't have a shot in hell with me the second he was rude to the waitress. Or the one guy who drank like 6 beers. Total turnoff for me. I'm not going to give him a second chance, I don't care how nervous he was...it is a deal breaker for ME. I don't think men think this way. I've only had one guy who didn't ask for a second date, and I'm assuming it is because he didn't find something physically appealing about me. OK. Next.

Did I tell those guys why I didn't want a second date? Nope. I just said I wasn't feeling a match and wished them well.

SI is a good place to come to ask questions of the opposite sex. Great cross-section of people/races/ages.


me...BS, 43 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced

"For whatever we lose, like a you or a me, it's always ourselves we find in the sea" ee cummings


Posts: 4033 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Virginia
InnerLight
Member
Member # 19946
Default  Posted: 11:53 AM, July 7th (Sunday)

I am different now than when I was young and promiscuous. Back then sex was simply a way to connect, and even men who were hard to connect with could be reached through sex. Back then I was the aggressor 50/50. I thought I was ok with casual sex then, and while it was special I didn't give a lot of meaning to it, at least consciously.

Now that I am older I feel differently. I have only had one sex partner since the D so I can't claim a regular pattern about sex with different men. I can only talk about my SO and me. For once I wanted the experience of a slow dance romance and that meant waiting what for me was a super long time before having sex. 7 dates! We had a serious exclusivity talk beforehand and talked about what we meant to each other and what sex meant. It was more than just attraction and excitement, tho I'm not sure I would say love because even after 7 dates we were almost strangers still. But there was a lot of feeling of respect and honoring for each of us because we both waited longer than either of us had waited before. This sense of mutual respect has been clearly felt throughout our 3 years together.

I will never initiate sex with a new person again...or if I did it would mean that I was depressed or anxious and had no confidence in the man to like me enough to make an advance. (That comes from just knowing myself-not a judgement on other women who initiate sex). For me to feel good with a man I have to see how he does make a move towards sex and if I enjoy his advances. I have no problem giving a guy signals that I am receptive so he isn't lost wondering if he has a chance. It also feels good to give a man space and time to express his feelings for me. I've also learned that this makes for way hotter sex for me.

This has helped me as our relationship continues. Recently I felt a lack of romance. I shared what I felt. Initially he kind of froze when he realized I was unhappy with him. I didnt go on about it but left him space to Get us back on track. Within the week he surprised me w a dozen red roses, an appreciation card, and a special dinner date at a fancy place I've been wanting to try for a year. He really got us back on track feeling romantic and close again.

I think how you treat eachother in early dating repeats itself over and over in a relationship and sex is often one of the first really big negotiations.

When I was young I thought that sex wouldn't be that sexy when you were middle aged but I was wrong. At age 52 It is the most mind-blowing ever!

[This message edited by InnerLight at 12:07 PM, July 7th (Sunday)]


BS, age 53, d-day 6-2-08, divorced after 17 years and 20 together. dating again, living in the sticks with a cat. It's taking a long time to create new dreams and a new life but it is slowly coming together.

Posts: 5735 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Rural California
missherlots
Member
Member # 30591
Default  Posted: 12:15 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

dear OnceInALifetime,
Please accept my most sincere apologies. I did not mean to get across in the wrong way.
In the contrary of you being shallow, I think you are over concern of not hurting anyone's feeling; but, you are forgetting about yourself.
Just be in the moment and let go the controls. enjoy life as it present itself. Be you and recognize every feeling and thought. it will give you an inside of what you need. Do not judge your thinking.

let your being and moral believes guide you. I am doing the same myself and it works.

I lost a very important person in my life (so) again, and I am healing but not rushing. It will come again by itself when I am ready.

I walk the walk! Just be patient and life will give you everything you need.

again, you are loved here my lots of people including myself so, don't think you have not love. you just don't have a partner.

my two cents.

Just for the record: Im not gay!!



Pain and suffering is part of life, but I choose to feel love and compassion for all people excluding no one.

Posts: 95 | Registered: Jan 2011
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 12:24 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

Just got back from a long run, so feel a little more clear-headed.

I've been sexually frustrated, and that's exacerbating the problems that arise from my rather fuzzy view on sex. cmego is right. I'm reevaluating what sex means to me. Part of me just wants sex. Lust is a natural drive, and now, in the warm weather, I'm especially feeling that drive.

I feel somehow immoral about treating sex casually, though I can't claim to have any coherent arguments for why casual sex would be immoral. In fact I'm somewhat jealous of those who can do that. Maybe it's the feeling of using someone, and being used, that feels empty and therefore wrong? But if there are no expectations other than lustful fun, what's so bad about that?

I question whether I'm capable of casual sex from an emotional standpoint. Might be in part related to the morality issue.

missherlots, your last line cracked me up. I reveal too much of myself here, so I can get prickly if my underbelly feels in danger of getting stepped on. You make good points; I agree I cannot be so goal driven. I've become impatient.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
better4me
Member
Member # 30341
Default  Posted: 3:38 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

My answers parallel cmegos. And I think she says it better than I could!

My first husband was my first sexual partner. My second husband was my third. Since my divorce 2 years ago, I've had 2 sexual partners (got close with a couple of others, but no cigar ) I have a tendency to bond really strongly with my sexual partner and that isn't a safe thing for me to do emotionally unless I know it is a safe thing to do. I don't know exactly what makes me feel safe, but it is a period of several dates, feeling a connection mentally as well as physically, and being able to envision a relationship that may last with the person. I've tried it the other way, tried to view it as a casual encounter and I just can't...it was fun, it felt good but it messed with my head too much...In a relationship I've had sex that wasn't "making love", and sex that was...and both are great!

So I now know this about me: I love sex. I love it best in a committed relationship. I'd like to be with a man who likes sex better in a committed relationship too...

I think your attitude about sex is really just fine OIAL...in fact, I think your attitude about sex is kinda sexy


DDay 11/17/2010 BW:52
Divorced

Posts: 3011 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Iowa
million pieces
Member
Member # 27539
Default  Posted: 4:02 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

OIAL,

I think we may have similar views on sex. While I wasn't a virgin going into marriage at 27, I had only 3 other partners, all in long term committed relationships. Most of my friends were the same way or less experienced.

I tried casual sex w 2 guys after I was separated for months. Honestly, they weren't people who I would have wanted to be in a relationship, so I felt a bit icky afterwards. Not horribly icky, but enough to know it wasn't for me.

When I met my current SO, I knew he was a guy that I would want to date. We had spoke several times on the phone, and as we were set up by a mutual friend, I knew about his background. When I met him for the first time (I had no pics of him), I remember just loving his smile. He was not hot in any true way, but his smile just had me. And then we had sex the first night I thought for sure I screwed something up, he thought I was a whore, etc. I never expected him to call me again. Well, he did and it has been over 2 yrs later and we are still going strong. We joke about my loose morals on the first date, I tell him I was just testing his morals and he failed

I don't know what I'm trying to say here (as usual) but I did/do think that I should wait for a connection. In the past, when I have not, I didn't feel good afterwards. If I ever go back to dating, I will wait until I know the guy and feel a connection.

And like others have said, I do envy others' view about casual sex. It seems so less complicated. My SO sure has that view, thank goodness.


Me - 42
2 kids, 9 and 11
D-Day 2/5/10, separated 3 wks later
Divorced 11/15/11!!!!

Posts: 1231 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: MD
hit-by-a-train
Member
Member # 8923
Default  Posted: 4:26 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

I'm really glad you asked these questions, OIAL.

1. No set number - I'm much more of a "follow my gut" than a planner type person.

2. Always pleasure and excitement and with my now SO, it was an expression of just budding love.

3. I have no idea what the future holds, but no casual sex in this brave new world of stds....

4. Yes and yes to initiating and non subtle innuendos. At my age (64), times a wastin'.

5. With my now SO, he got a hotel room for us to use after an out of town event, but he made sure I understood that the sex part of the night was not mandatory on my part. But yeah.....I was looking forward to getting off the darn bus after almost 7 years!!

6. No.

7. Not in my distant past, but my current SO brought it up before we did the deed, because he wanted to make sure I knew that he was NOT into casual sex and that he needed to feel some love before he was willing to get nekkid with anyone.

He has a very refreshing view about hot or not also.....across several conversations and situations he steadily holds to the "how you look is only the wrapping paper on the real valuable present inside" viewpoint. That's very good for me, since I would not be considered "hot" by too many males, I don't think.

t/j to Inner Light: at 64 and 61, my SO and I agree that neither one of us has EVER had this much fun in bed! It's kind of like a second teenagerhood for us - so just know that sometimes God saves the best for last.

[This message edited by hit-by-a-train at 4:40 PM, July 7th (Sunday)]


In the depths of winter I finally learned there was in me an invincible summer..Albert Camus
**Beloved hubby died at home 1/28/2013, age 61..** God sent me two good men in a row......and saved the best for last. Grief & joy coexist.

Posts: 2279 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: USA
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 6:28 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

Thanks. There's one thing that I'm trying to understand. Most of you want to feel a connection before having sex. But also, reading about how sex has happened quite quickly for some of you, means that connection developed real fast.

How deep was the connection when you first had sex? How well did you know your partner?

The first date is, for me, just a meeting. I'm not going to start getting romantic. Feels way too forward. We don't know each other at all.

The second date is where I hope we will get a slightly deeper sense of each other's personality. This is the first real date where there might be some romantic undertones. But it sounds like by the end of a second date, some of you have felt connected enough to go into that third date (really a second date, IMHO) thinking that sex was a distinct possibility?

This is where I wonder if my puritan nature starts coming in. I can't imagine things progressing that quickly, even when attraction is high. I don't even understand the logistics of getting from date 2 to being in bed together by the end of date 3. That would imply date three was at one of your homes, which even I know is highly suggestive.

I don't mean to sound prudish. But I wonder if I *am* prudish. These are things I'm trying to digest and examine for myself, because being a frustrated prude ain't fun.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
kernel
Member
Member # 27035
Default  Posted: 6:44 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

t/j to Inner Light: at 64 and 61, my SO and I agree that neither one of us has EVER had this much fun in bed! It's kind of like a second teenagerhood for us - so just know that sometimes God saves the best for last.

Thanks for this!!!


"On particularly rough days when I'm sure I can't possibly endure, I like to remind myself that my track record for getting through bad days so far is 100% - and that's pretty good."

Posts: 4924 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Midwest
cmego
Member
Member # 30346
Default  Posted: 7:16 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

With fSO...first "date" was at my house. We had been emailing for 3 or 4 weeks and had met for coffee. I trusted him. With that said, nothing happened physically between us for 2 months, then when it did...everything was discussed before time. Including kissing.

One guy that made it to the 3rd date that I liked (and lots of phone calls in-between) was physical (not sex...but...), and yes, it was in my home, I offered to cook him dinner. We ended shortly thereafter.

I had another guy that made it to the third date that I only hugged, he kissed my cheek...but he was a fWS and I found I just couldn't go there. I put up a major physical boundary with him and I knew I just needed to end it.

So, yeah, by the third date, I'm expecting at least a kiss.

But, my IC and I discussed this one day, and she said her H didn't kiss her until date 10. She thought the entire time he wasn't interested and couldn't figure out why he wasn't "interested in her". He said later it was because he knew he liked her and didn't want to screw it up. He got lucky that she continued to accept the dates, because she was really confused.

I really think it boils down to being open to talking about it with your date. By the third, if they have been good dates...you should be able to say, "I would really like to give you a kiss...." and there is nothing wrong with saying..." I really like you and want to take it slow..." while you figure the rest out.

On the other hand, OIAL, there is no "formula". I think by third date, probably a kiss...then the rest is unknown. It depends on if multidating is going on, if there is real interest, etc. Some relationship progress quickly, some don't. There are too many factors. If the guy is multidating, I'm not going past a kiss until it is monogamous. But...that is simply...me. My boundaries.

If I've had several really great dates, long phone calls in between...yeah...there might be sex by 4th date. The sex is the step (for me) that brings us closer together. I really like the guy, no red flags, we discussed sex, its monogamous and we are on the same page=sex.


me...BS, 43 years old, 2 small kids
WS, 41, multiple gay affairs
M 15 years, together 17
Divorced

"For whatever we lose, like a you or a me, it's always ourselves we find in the sea" ee cummings


Posts: 4033 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Virginia
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, July 7th (Sunday)

I guess sex after just a few dates was hard for me to imagine because I'm not very at ease when I feel attracted to someone (unless her attraction to me is blatantly obvious).

I've had obvious mutual chemistry with one date. So it's not entirely foreign to me. But what sent me to the dumps was that it wasn't right with her, anyway. We had nine dates overall. I would have been ready for sex by the 5th date. I was riding a high. But it turns out we didn't know each other well at all, even after 9 dates, and we weren't right for each other. Whatever "connection" was there was a farce.

If we did have sex, that would have probably gotten me more emotionally involved because of all the significance I tend to burden sex with, and who knows, I might be well into another poisonous relationship.

Unless I'm able to strip sex of the weight I add to it, I have to be *very* careful about chemistry. Flashy chemistry wouldn't be enough. I'd need to feel like her good friend as well, which takes some time to develop.

If I could strip some of the weight off, then sex with someone I like but haven't yet developed a deep friendship with (but with optimism for that), would be workable. I think this is where I want to be, actually.

This has been a good thread for me. Thanks for all your honest input.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
willowiris
Member
Member # 5372
Default  Posted: 9:36 PM, July 7th (Sunday)


1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex?

No set number of dates, but I think with my last boyfriend, we had discussed dating exclusively, and it might have been around 6 to 9 dates.


2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

I would not go as far as to use the word love, but it is the start of a commitment/exclusive relationship.

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?


I used to, and i am not judging anyone who has, but I generally don't have sex outside of committed relationships, and if I do, it is usually with someone I trust and because I don't feel like dating, though it seldom happens anymore. I am more apt to just wait.

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?

In a committed relationship? Sure. Why not initiate it? If you want it, go get it.

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?

I know it kind of kills the spontaneity, and I would not say 'planned' per se, but I would say at least discussed. Things like exclusivity, birth control, behaving responsibly. yeah. Discussed, and then it happens after that.

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?

Not since I was much much younger. It's just not my thing anymore. I prefer to get to know someone.

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date?

Yes.


D-day 09/2004
Filed for divorce 9/2006

We accept the love we think we deserve. "The Perks of Being a Wallflower."


Posts: 12326 | Registered: Sep 2004 | From: Margaritaville
Catwoman
Member
Member # 1330
Default  Posted: 4:06 AM, July 8th (Monday)

1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex?

For me, it is not the number of dates, but the level of comfort, a sense of having some sort of commitment to exclusivity and having an opportunity to have desire and attraction build. With GDM, it was about 6 weeks of daily contact and 2-3 dates/week. I would not set any hard and fast rules about number of dates/number of weeks, but get in touch with what is right and comfortable for Once.


2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement?

Like many women, I associate sex with bonding and commitment. I don't choose to pursue a physical relationship with someone unless I feel we are on the road to that sort of relationship. Love may be premature, but definitely I am looking at sex as a way to strengthen the bond and commitment between us.

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential?

I need to be emotionally into the fellow. GDM seduced me with his marvelous mind. Physically, he is pretty average. Certainly wouldn't be considered "hot" by most standards. But he is smokin' to me because of that marvelous mind of his.

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos?

If I am into someone, I make sure he knows it. I may not initiate a first encounter, but I will flirt and otherwise make it clear that him making a move would not be a disappointment to me in the least.

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place?

Because up until the last couple of years I have had kids at home, a modicum of planning has been necessary. But no, I've not laid it out as such--it has been more of a "well, it's not going to be tonight, because I have kids at home/have to be home at a reasonable hour, etc."

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines?

No.

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date?

Yes. To pursue a physical relationship, I want exclusivity/commitment. Not commitment in terms of marriage or anything like that, but commitment in terms of we're going to be a couple until one or both of us decides that we aren't.

Once, I suggest you let things develop naturally and not worry about the number of dates, etc. If you're attracted to a woman, let her know. But to think that there is some magic formula out there puts artificial pressure on you--let things unfold at a pace that works for both of you.

Cat


FBS: Married 20 years, 2 daughters 25 and 22. Divorced by the grace of GOD.
D-Days: 2/23/93; 10/11/97; 3/5/03
Ex & OW Broke up 12-10
"An erection does not count as personal growth."

Posts: 29541 | Registered: Apr 2003 | From: Massachusetts
gahurts
Member
Member # 33699
Default  Posted: 7:37 AM, July 8th (Monday)

OIAL,

Unless I'm able to strip sex of the weight I add to it, I have to be *very* careful about chemistry. Flashy chemistry wouldn't be enough. I'd need to feel like her good friend as well, which takes some time to develop.

If I could strip some of the weight off, then sex with someone I like but haven't yet developed a deep friendship with (but with optimism for that), would be workable. I think this is where I want to be, actually.

Why??

You place a great deal of significance on sex. GREAT! Those are your values. Don't change your values to meet some societal pressure or viewpoint that isn't you. Liek I said before, focus on getting to know the other person and let things develop. Maybe other people here will laugh at me for saying this but you know - it is OK to wait to have sex. Some people even wait until they are married or at least in a mostly permanent relationship before taking that final plunge. It is OK.

Just for some levity - if the pressure is too high, there is always battery operated Barbara (BOB).

[This message edited by gahurts at 7:38 AM, July 8th (Monday)]


"Strength does not come from physical capacity. It comes from an indominable will" - Mahatma Gandi

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - Aubrie


Posts: 3333 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Georgia
NaiveAgain
Member
Member # 20849
Default  Posted: 7:48 AM, July 8th (Monday)

1) How many dates must you go on before you might have sex? Same as Catwoman...no specific number. I have sex when it feels right to me. I have to be comfortable with the guy and know him a bit and feel there is a chance for a long-term relationship because I don't do casual sex. Casual sex does would make me feel a bit used although realistically if I want it as bad as he does, then it isn't using, it is two people getting their needs met. I guess I am trying to say I have to have the emotional bond for it to work for me, but I have gone a year or two w/o sex and because I DO like sex and need it in my life, once I do find someone that I click with, if I have known them for a while as a friend, the sex may happen pretty quickly once we start dating.

2) What meaning do you give your first sexual encounter with someone? Is it a statement of love? Or simple pleasure and excitement? Both. It is definitely a primal "wanting" experience, but I also tend to really, really like the person, a lot, and feel I know them somewhat. I rarely am ever in "Love" with someone when I first start having sex with them though. That generally happens a bit later. The exception was my XSO. I was in love with him before our first date.

3) Do you have different attitudes towards sex depending upon the long term potential of your date? In other words, if your date is hot but you're otherwise not really interested, will you have casual sex? Do you wait longer to have sex if you see long term potential? I won't have sex with a hot guy unless I know he is into me completely and there is the chance of long-term.

4) Do you ever initiate when it comes to suggesting sex? Or make not so subtle innuendos? After I am in a relationship, but not the first few times. But I will respond positively if he makes a move and I am interested.

5) Is first sex with a new partner planned mutually in advance, or does it just somehow happen due to the right mood being in place? Not usually planned. Sometimes expected, and sometimes catches me by surprise (like with my new guy).

6) Have you ever had sex at the end of a date, when going in you really weren't thinking along those lines? Yup.

7) Do you always discuss what sex means to you before having sex with a date? Yup. In every circumstance of me having sex, the guy knew what he was getting into and what to expect ("I need to be in a committed and exclusive relationship." "I have no diseases, do you?" "I don't mess around casually.....," etc....)

[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 7:50 AM, July 8th (Monday)]


Original WS D-Day July 10, 2008. Kept lying, he is gone.
New WS (2 EA's, no PA) 12-3-13
If you don't like where you are, then change it. You are not a tree.

Posts: 15108 | Registered: Aug 2008 | From: Ohio
OnceInALifetime
Member
Member # 26023
Default  Posted: 9:03 AM, July 8th (Monday)

gahurts, I understand. Thing is, I've been pretty stodgy, sexually speaking. I've had a good number of women tell me, after 3 to 5 dates, that they see me as a friend, they like me, etc., but that there's no chemistry.

What I take away from this is that I'm lacking in sexuality. Sexuality isn't the same as sex, but sex is the driving force behind sexuality.

I need to get this chastity belt off of me. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to start pushing for early sex. But I do need to find my sexuality, and convey that I'm looking for more than just friendship.

I've always been really conservative, socially (not politically). It's my puritan upbringing. My XW's crazy cheating around with strangers from the internet only underlined my sense that sex for only fun is somehow immoral. Something about the act feels unclean to me, unless it has almost spiritual undertones.

This is why hearing people discuss their own attitudes around sex is very refreshing to me. I feel like I've put myself in a box around the issue and thrown away the key.

I know I can't change my personality. I like who I am, more or less, and am not going to wear a mask. But I think I can loosen some of that rigidity around sexuality. It's hard to feel sexual when sex is a forbidden fruit.


BH, now divorced

Posts: 3012 | Registered: Oct 2009
Crescita
Member
Member # 32616
Default  Posted: 11:52 AM, July 8th (Monday)

I think it might help if you start thinking in terms of planning opportunities rather than planning the act itself. You have to get comfortable with the idea of it being possible before you go right to it.

Chemistry is going to be hard fought if you are just having lunch, dinner out, playing mini golf or going to a baseball game. You need a bit of suggestiveness and some privacy to let things unfold in a way that will feel organic. Itís hard for a kiss at the end of the night to lead anywhere if you have only started to think in those terms at the end of the night.

Inviting someone over for dinner is a bit suggestive, but it doesnít have to lead anywhere so it can also take away a lot of the pressure. It certainly beats someone having to be so bold as to suggest a hotel or asking to come in at 11pm when your date to that point has been largely platonic.

Even if you decide to grab dinner out instead, the mere suggestion of dinner in will get wheels turning in a more intimate nature (Was he implying something? Could I? Would I?)

Your idea to start dancing would also be great to get more comfortable with physical contact that doesnít have to lead anywhere.

Thatís the key; it doesnít have to lead anywhere. The idea that it could is a necessary step in being comfortable with intimacy though, at least for me.


Posts: 3263 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: The Valley of the Sun
ladies_first
Member
Member # 24643
Default  Posted: 4:23 PM, July 10th (Wednesday)

OK, I'm late to the party. Stealing from another recent thread:
I know there's a common feeling out there that the man should do the pursuing, because guys need to feel that they conquer their woman, like she's a prize that they win.

Good sex is about give and take. Stop with the conquering bullshit, already. I'm special, but I'm not a prize to be won. If you insist on generalizations, how about this one: Both men and women want to be respected and appreciated sexually.

Granted, chemistry is a Bitch!

OAIL, loosen up. I don't think you're that kind of guy, but I'll say it: Don't be the asshole who "uses" women just for sex.

For your next reading assignment: Naomi Wolf's book titled "Vagina: A New Biography."

Finally, I think you'll put too much pressure on yourself with dancing lessons at this juncture in your sexually frustrated life. I still say have some fun! Go find that perfect taco or best scoop of ice cream your town has to offer. Summer's half over, OAIL, are you having fun?


"We must be willing to let go of the life we planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us." ~J. Campbell
"In the final analysis, it is your own attitude that will make or break you, not what has happened to you." ~D. Galloway

Posts: 2143 | Registered: Jun 2009
InnerLight
Member
Member # 19946
Default  Posted: 4:36 PM, July 10th (Wednesday)

Don't be the asshole who "uses" women just for sex.

This so DOESN'T sound like OIAL that it almost made me laugh.


BS, age 53, d-day 6-2-08, divorced after 17 years and 20 together. dating again, living in the sticks with a cat. It's taking a long time to create new dreams and a new life but it is slowly coming together.

Posts: 5735 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Rural California
Topic Posts: 32