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Reconciliation
User Topic: update on anger from last night
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 8:43 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

I went to h last night after my anger outburst and said that I wanted to calmly tell him how I was feeling. He gave me a look, kind of fuck you and said nothing.

I walked away, said nothing. He chose to sleep on the couch.

This morning I tried to explain how his saying no to me made me feel.

It turned to how selfish I am, how I don't appreciate what he is doing, how by saying that I need more from him is being too demanding.

How it is not all about me and my pain.

He also says that he doesn't ever think I will get over this. that maybe we should end it now, give up.

I apologized before this conversation for allowing my anger to take over and not expressing it in a constructive way and that I would try in the future to talk about it before it overwhelms me. I tried to tell him how hard it is for me to have this anger, never had it before and I am not good at dealing with it, that I have to learn how. How hard it is for me to ask for anything, how vulnerable it makes me feel. How much it hurts when he refused my request.

He seems to put up this wall of indifference.

I told him that I believe that I have made my needs clear, asked if he understood and said that it is up to him to choose if he wants to do this.

His response was that what if he is unable or does not want to.

I told him that is his choice.

MC tomorrow morning. I think it is going to be a tough one.

I am so very tired. As my mother used to say "shit or get off the pot". crude but so very true.

I know what I want in my life and I will accept nothing less.


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
gerrygirl
Member
Member # 26294
Default  Posted: 9:39 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

((cantaccept))


What I see is that you are the one putting all of the effort into your M and R. Your WH is deflecting his lack of effort by making you into the bad guy in this situation. If he can make you accept the responsibility then he doesn't have to do anything.

I think he is right when he said he is unable or does not want to. From reading your profile, this is what he has been saying to you for a long time. If I were you, and I know that this is HARD, I would do a hard 180. As others have said, start preparing for D. Protect yourself. You can not R alone and right now you are.


Me(BS)-45; Him (FWH)-43 (baxtersbff)
M - 20 years
DD - 16; DS -12
D-day #1: 8/12/07; D-day #2: 11/18/07; D-day #3 5/26/2010
Real R Begins - 5/27/2010

Posts: 962 | Registered: Nov 2009
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 10:15 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

gerrygirl,

you are right. I take the blame too easily, way too hard on me. My mc says that I need to be sure for me that I have done everything i can before I can make the decision to d.

It is so very hard. I am recognizing life long patterns in myself, struggling to have boundaries, it is so easy to fall back into "comfortable patterns"

How do you "180" when you are living together?

It feels so crazy, I feel so wrong when I protect myself, feel like I am being false.

I have always been so open with my love, so giving that when I choose to not show it, it feels wrong.

I have to remember, only give love when it is deserved.

Don't give it away so cheaply, I am worth so much more than that.

Thank you for your words.

Thank you to everyone that has responded to my crazy posts, I feel so selfish.

I don't know how I would survive this without all of you.

(((all of my si supporters)))

from the bottom of my heart


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 10:44 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

He keeps telling me that I need to recognize his effort. Recognize all the hours he spends talking to me.

He says that nothing reaches me. That I never express appreciation for what he does.

I don't agree.

Every time he does something that reaches me, gives me some relief, I tell him. I go to him, put my hands on his cheeks, look him in the eye and say what I feel. Thank you for pushing through that with me, it helps, I love you.

I think that he is not always reaching me is because he listens but doesn't offer words of comfort. Never brings up the pain that he caused.

Then I start to feel guilty, thinking I am expecting too much, being selfish. Then i go back to after what he did he should be giving whatever I ask for and then trying to do more.

ugh


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
Knowing
Member
Member # 37044
Default  Posted: 10:47 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

The 180 is outlined here: http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/faq_bs.asp#FAQ11

I can understand your frustration with an unremorseful spouse this far out from DDay. The 180 will serve you well with all the issues you mention your WS, problems with your own boundaries, feeling bad about taking care of yourself...


Me: BW, Him: fWH
Together 12 years
My EA (?) 2005-2011
His STA/PA: D-day: 19/09/12
TT: 08/12/12

We are in R.


Posts: 697 | Registered: Oct 2012
Althea
Member
Member # 37765
Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

He is saying this

He keeps telling me that I need to recognize his effort. Recognize all the hours he spends talking to me.
He says that nothing reaches me. That I never express appreciation for what he does.

To keep you from daring to ask for anything else. The red flag for this is that he bring it up in response for stating a need that is not being met.

My WH struggles with getting defensive and hearing that he is not good enough every time I tell him I need more. I think this may be true for a lot of waywards particularly in the beginning. This doesn't mean you shouldn't state your needs anyway.

You can't keep doing this alone. To 180 while living together you just start concentrating on you. Go to IC, prepare for divorce, make a contingency plan, get strong for you. You don't have to be cruel to your WH, but just don't try to engage him any more. Expect that he can't/won't meet your needs and take care of yourself accordingly. Seeking out an attorney and finding out your rights is a good first step.


Taking it one day at a time.

Posts: 437 | Registered: Dec 2012
HardenMyHeart
Member
Member # 15902
Default  Posted: 11:20 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

Anger is poison to R. It is understandable given the circumstances, but it is almost always destructive to the relationship. It doesn't matter who is right or wrong.

Many times a BS will try to control the navigation through R hoping for some predetermined outcome. They regard their point of view as the only "right" way to R. When the WS does not R the way the BS expects, anger is often the result.

R takes a lot of patience. If you truly want to R, then don't rush to fix things. Allow the relationship room to evolve into ways you may have not considered. Holding in anger is destructive. It is very important to find constructive ways to express yourself. If you find yourself getting angry, this is an indicator that emotional intimacy (i.e. being connected) is lacking in the relationship. Find ways to improve this. Many couples use a MC to improve this, but there are also many good books available on improving a marriage.

I know what I want in my life and I will accept nothing less.

And this is why you suffer. This is a very selfish position and would be difficult for a spouse to deal with.

I now strive to have a calm and peaceful mind. That's it. I try not to regret the past or worry about the future. Things like greed, vanity, anger, hate, stubbornness, inability to accept change, will all lead to suffering.

I know that happiness comes from within. I learned to turn my anger towards my FWW into compassion. I took the time to understand her point of view and what drove her to betray me. I also realized that true love stems from acts of kindness. When I felt myself getting angry, I turned it around by doing something kind for my wife. In my mind I would acknowledge the anger, but I would quickly understand the cause and move on. We can't control our thoughts, but we can control how we react to them.

Some of this may sound backwards. Some may call it rewarding the WS for having an affair. To me what is important is that I am now content with our marriage. It is stronger than before the A and we are closer than ever. My wife and I both learned to build on each others strengths, rather than trying to tear down the weaknesses. Every minute you are angry is another minute you are missing the beauty and joy that exists around you at the present moment.

[This message edited by HardenMyHeart at 11:21 AM, July 28th (Sunday)]


Me: BH, Her: FWW - Long Term EA/PA
d-day: June 25, 2007
Married 29 years, Happily Reconciled

Posts: 5622 | Registered: Aug 2007
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 11:39 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

Thank you all, so very much. I think I am just way too needy right now. I have moments of clarity but it seems to be fleeting, hard to hold on to.

I am dealing with so much pain right now. It seems his a and his abandoning me have brought all of my issues from my childhood and realizing the impact of how they shaped me and what I thought of me. It is so much to process along with the pain of his actions today. It all seems to get so jumbled, hard to focus on anything, like a rotten stew.

yes i don't dare to ask for more. How could I possibly risk it? If he can't give the little I ask for how can I risk myself by asking for more? I guess I am testing, testing to see if it is safe to risk my heart, ( as if I am not already)


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 11:48 AM, July 28th (Sunday)

Hardenmyheart,

What I meant by accepting nothing less did sound rather selfish, so I must clarify.

I am looking for basics.

being able to openly express my feelings without being ridiculed. No walking on eggshells, years of verbal and emotional abuse, that I allowed, but no more. Respect. Sharing of thoughts and emotions, no assuming, I need to know how he thinks and feels. Is this selfish?

As to my anger. I know it was inappropriate. I apologized to him this morning. I have never allowed myself to have anger, boundaries (regarding accepting abuse), this is all so new to me. Not an excuse, I need more experience and must be prepared for this emotion and be ready to handle it as I guess it is inevitable that I will have feelings of anger.

I do try to talk to h about my anger, using I statements, focusing on how I feel, he runs, will not listen.

I really am trying not to do any further damage.

Sometimes it feels as if it is at my expense.


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
HardenMyHeart
Member
Member # 15902
Default  Posted: 12:09 PM, July 28th (Sunday)

I am looking for basics.

You may want to consider looking for a different set of basics. Try to get to a point where you can be happy, calm, and content, independent of what your spouse does or says. Do not blame "your" suffering on your H or your circumstances. This takes away your power to control your feelings and gives the power over to your WH. He can than manipulate you by attacking your weaknesses (for example, ridicule). In other words, if someone is able to push your buttons, then get rid of the buttons. Hopefully this makes sense.

being able to openly express my feelings without being ridiculed. No walking on eggshells, years of verbal and emotional abuse, that I allowed, but no more. Respect. Sharing of thoughts and emotions, no assuming, I need to know how he thinks and feels. Is this selfish?

Of course this is selfish, but it is also a basic emotional need and one of the primary reasons why we enter into a relationship. So why do you think your H ridicules and abuses you? Is he lashing out due to his own suffering, has this become his way of manipulating the marriage, or some other reason(s)? It's important to understand where he is coming from because this will help you better understand what you can actually do to improve R.


Me: BH, Her: FWW - Long Term EA/PA
d-day: June 25, 2007
Married 29 years, Happily Reconciled

Posts: 5622 | Registered: Aug 2007
cantaccept
Member
Member # 37451
Default  Posted: 12:18 PM, July 28th (Sunday)

I do want to understand why he treats others,me especially with ridicule, abusively.

We have talked, so far he says, that is what I have always done. I have always treated everyone badly until they left me, until he met me no relationship lasted more than 2 years. I have too high a tolerance for abuse.

I ask, do you think this hurts you? Are you afraid of me leaving you?

He does not want to delve into this. I feel we must if we are to ever connect in a real intimate way.

How do you show love for someone while simultaneously distancing yourself?

this confuses me.


Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.

I would now like to be known as Can!

dday October 21,2012
dday December 20, 2013
wh boots5050
attempted R, it was all a lie

divorcing


Posts: 1232 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Connecticut
authenticnow
Moderator
Member # 16024
Default  Posted: 12:55 PM, July 28th (Sunday)

How do you show love for someone while simultaneously distancing yourself?
Don't. Because you have to start putting yourself first and until he is ready and willing to delve into that stuff (like maybe when he realizes he really might lose you), nothing will change.

You cannot reconcile alone and by the way he's acting, it doesn't seem like he has it in him right now.

Work on you and stop trying to figure him out. That's on him.


Take up your space (and do it well).

"That's the thing about pain, it demands to be felt."


Posts: 36495 | Registered: Sep 2007
LA44
Member
Member # 38384
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, July 28th (Sunday)

((Cantaccept)) you have been given some excellent advice. I am only 8m in so anger comes/goes but I do not like myself when in it and need to work on this in IC.

Hardenmyheart: can you please note 1-2 marital books you recommend. I have read so many Infidelity books...I would like to move forward...


Me: 44
He: 47 WH
Married: 15 years
D Day: December 2012
Affair: Fall 2009 - Dec. 2011
R is not linear

Posts: 2102 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: Canada, eh
Getting to Happy
Member
Member # 35200
Default  Posted: 4:59 PM, July 28th (Sunday)

Years of verbal abuse, drinking, being fired from 2 jobs in 7 years because of his temper.

I forgave and forgave, my brokenness. Lack of self worth, boundaries.

2 attempts at MC. Last therapist refused to see him anymore and told me to divorce.

I withdrew during the last 2 years. Self protection, walking on eggshells.

My dear Cantaccept~

I am not sure how much more compassion you could show to a bully with anger issues, one that shows and has shown you so much disrespect.

I went to h last night after my anger outburst and said that I wanted to calmly tell him how I was feeling. He gave me a look, kind of fuck you and said nothing.

The NERVE...!

It turned to how selfish I am, how I don't appreciate what he is doing, how by saying that I need more from him is being too demanding.

You are not selfish. NO Way! He is using something called 'projection'.

It turned to how selfish I am, how I don't appreciate what he is doing, how by saying that I need more from him is being too demanding.

Really, but he is demanding that you choke down those emotional crumbs he is giving you and like it or shut up...GAH!

...a defense mechanism in which a person unconsciously rejects his or her own unacceptable attributes by ascribing them to ... persons in the outside world.

... an immature defense, the projection of one's negative qualities onto others...

...another form of defense, one which may be linked to the making of false accusations...a bully may project his/her own feelings of vulnerability onto their victim... (from Wikipedia)

Some of the advice you have gotten on this thread may not be in your best interests.

You have prostrated yourself to your WH for years! He tried and tried to beat you down verbally, emotionally. Then he adds the ultimate insult: taking a lover while being married to you. And tries to keep his and her secrets from you. Thanks Pal.

You have every right to be angry. HE is the cause and source of this anger. If you are not allowed to express your displeasure in his A, you will surely bust!

He is not getting the correct social cue of anger and hurt from his betrayal. Which most healthy people do when they are verbally and emotionally abused.

Having compassion for your destroyer is what started the dysfunction in the first place.

He is not accepting you fighting for your rights as a human being, living with him as loving spouse. He is actually showing you what he thinks of you. Chattel.

What, his feelings are hurt because now you won't accept the crumbs of him 'trying' to be nice?!? He is uncomfortable with your being devastated by his terrible actions?!? It's on you to understand his psyche to keep peace in the house?!? Really?!?

This is called rugsweeping.

How about him understanding the searing pain that he has caused by his A?

How about when you trigger, for him to hold you and tell you how very sorry he is that his actions have caused you both such sorrow? HOW ABOUT THAT...?

You have every right to your anger.

If he was big and bad enough to take a lover right under your nose, he should Man UP and face the consequences for his actions. IMHO.

His passive aggressive 'indifference' attitude is what you may want to cultivate in order to achieve the 180.

Because remember the opposite of love is not hate, it is indifference. Turnabout is fair play.

I am so very tired. As my mother used to say "shit or get off the pot". crude but so very true.

INDEED! Be nice or be gone.


WS him
BS me DD's 26, 25' DS 23
dd1 1-1-10, dd2 Mothers Day 2011, dd3 3-12-12 Hawaii trip with ho-worker...

Never forget what is worth remembering or remember what is best forgotten.
Unknown


Posts: 1138 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: La La Land
HardenMyHeart
Member
Member # 15902
Default  Posted: 11:44 PM, July 28th (Sunday)


Begin t/j
LA44, I made several book recommendations on the following thread:
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=501871&HL=15902
End t/j


Me: BH, Her: FWW - Long Term EA/PA
d-day: June 25, 2007
Married 29 years, Happily Reconciled

Posts: 5622 | Registered: Aug 2007
Missymomma
Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 12:22 AM, July 29th (Monday)

On your profile you put that your WH has severe anger issues and lost 2 jobs in 7 years. You also mention him having a drinking problem. He has some serious issues that have nothing to do with you. You cannot nice him into being a good, loving, kind husband.

Please stop trying to twist yourself into a pretzel for this man! You have a right to your feelings. You have a right to your anger. If anything, you have probably suppressed your anger for far too many years. Do you have your own IC? Not just the MC but a therapist that is there for you.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
sri624
Member
Member # 33956
Default  Posted: 12:31 AM, July 29th (Monday)

i am so sorry you are dealing with this pain.

the only thing i wanted to add was this....please listen to every word that Getting to Happy wrote to you tonight.
that post to you is right on point. i would have said the exact same thing to you.

stay strong....and know your worth.


BS (41):(Former Doormat)
WS (39):(Busted Cheater)
Married: 10 years, 3 kids under 5
DD1: 10/11 PA/EA with pilates instructor/former stripper.
DD2: 10/12 False r, cheating with other women, online dating,Substance abuse issues.
Attempting R in bi

Posts: 916 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: Alabama
Wonderingwhy11
Member
Member # 34782
Default  Posted: 1:34 AM, July 29th (Monday)

cantaccept - I am sorry for your pain. My advice is to work on yourself. IMHO your anger is either he is not doing what you want/giving you what you need or anger at yourself for putting up with his behavior. You need to figure out how to let go of the anger. You need to be happy - either with him or without him.

If he is telling you he is unable to meet your needs or doesn't want to, then you need to stop being angry at him for what he isn't willing to do. You need to do soul searching and figure out what makes you happy and not rely upon him or someone else for that happiness. These is hard - especially if your childhood did not allow you to feel safe and secure with yourself.

You can't change the past. You can change your future. It is easy to fall back on familiar behaviors that are not healthy for you. It is hard work to change. My suggestion is go to IC and work on you.

Since DDay I have been extremely angry at WH and myself. Angry that I tried to keep peace and made decisions for the sake of our marriage and not for my wellbeing. Angry he chose to cheat instead of honestly talking to me. Angry because he didn't see what I did for our marriage. Angry that he was so selfish and did not care about hurting me. I have realized I can't continue to be angry. The anger hurts me. The anger will hurt you more than it hurts WS.

I am still working on the anger and letting go. It is a work in progress.


Me BW - 46
Him WH - 53
Together 23 yrs, Married 18
DDay August 2011
2 kids - 13 and 15

Gotta love the life that we livin'


Posts: 376 | Registered: Feb 2012
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 6:52 AM, July 29th (Monday)

Hardenmyheart,
I so appreciate your approach to this. I struggle with not having a map that feels authentic to dealing with the affair.I resonante a lot with Buddhism, and have found that being compassionate to my husband, as hurt and angry as I am, has helped a lot in these short 6 weeks. That doesn't mean I have forgiven him in any real sense. . . That must be earned. But, I feel like only love and a lot of hard work is going to get us through this.
Peace be with us.

[This message edited by bionicgal at 6:52 AM, July 29th (Monday)]


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is more like a mental break than a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 1738 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
Topic Posts: 19