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Reconciliation
User Topic: Techniques/Perpective for Mind Movies during Intimacy
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 8:15 AM, October 6th (Sunday)

Ugh.
Wondering how folks deal with mind movies during sex. In the past I have sort of been able to squelch these away. . . kind of try to "take back" whatever it is that we are doing. But the past couple of days, it has been a problem, leaving me upset and H feeling helpless.

So, I guess I'd love to hear any techniques ya'll have for dealing with this. My overwhelming feeling when he is doing X is "he did this to her, and took pleasure from it." I guess my major hangup seems to be him giving her pleasure. It kills me.

So, I have both stopped and not stopped having sex when this happens. (I am able to "carry on" sometimes and it goes away.) This morning we stopped and he just held me and I felt angry and betrayed. This is normal, right?

What I want from him at this time (besides making it un-happen, which he can't) is to somehow diminish it. He can in some regards, because he knows now that it was empty and meaningless and selfish, but I am looking for something more. It is like I want to hear something negative about the actual act. The problem is, I don't think he can come up with that except that it was wrong of him to do it, and then he tells me how he feels about it now.

It also certainly doesn't help that at the time, he thought he was expressing "love."

Sigh. This sucks. If someone can tell me they got through this stage, I'd appreciate it.

Edited for clarity

[This message edited by bionicgal at 7:24 PM, October 7th (Monday)]


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2079 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
ShatteredLove00
New Member
Member # 40830
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

Great question. We are only a month out, and while definitely not having actual sex, we have had intimate moments. Luckily I have never thought of it DURING, but I almost ALWAYS think of it directly afterwards. And I feel disgusting and angry. I hope someone with more experience and perspective has some advice for all of us with this problem.


Me: BS (29) Him: SAWH (30)
HS Sweethearts, WAS each other's 1st/onlys. 1 child & 8 months pregnant when he hired prostitute/confessed.
D-Day: September 1, 2013
Shocked, disgusted, and struggling.

Posts: 34 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: United States
jo2love
Moderator
Member # 31528
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

(((bionicgal)))

I used to picture us making love in a room with a mirror (like in an interrogation room where the police can see through it). OW was on the other side watching us, unable to stop us, and seeing how little she meant to him. I could see her, but he couldn't. At first I thought it was a little out there, but I realized that it helped me take back sex since I felt like I had some control in all of this.


Posts: 36039 | Registered: Mar 2011
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

jo-
I like it. That may work! It is weird because we've been intimate a lot since DDay, and it has been bad just the past 2 days. Hoping this is just some phase. . . it certainly is a mood killer. Luckily, H is actually very sensitive to it -- tries really hard to let me know he sees +me,+ that he loves me, that she doesn't cross his mind unless I bring her up, and that he finds me very attractive.

Hopefully, "this too shall pass... ?"

[This message edited by bionicgal at 1:08 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2079 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
jo2love
Moderator
Member # 31528
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

I hope it works for you.
After a while, I could just picture the mirror and all A related thoughts would stop. It does get better.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 1:10 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]


Posts: 36039 | Registered: Mar 2011
FeelingSoMuch
Member
Member # 38814
Default  Posted: 1:12 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

I'm not recommending this, but it worked for me.

I showed a Facebook photo of OM to a few women I know. I didn't give them any background. They all said he looks like a dirty rat or some variation of that. One friend, who actually knows what happened, apologized for laughing. She said that when she heard my wife had cheated, she expected the guy to be really good-looking. She was shocked to see his photo.

Knowing he's an ugly dude has helped me when it comes to sex. It helps to know I'm more attractive and actually care for my WF.

Related, my WF hates that I did what I described above. I understand why, but it made having sex with her a better experience for me.

The mind movies that kill me are of them sharing non-sexual, intimate moments.


Me: BH
Her: WW
Together since 2001, married since 2007.
D-day: Feb. 20, 2013.
Broke NC: 2 phone calls since
Today: In MC and IC, attempting R.
It got easier: They no longer work together.

Posts: 509 | Registered: Mar 2013 | From: Canada
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 1:29 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

In my case OW was a friend.

Not anyone that would ever turn a head, that is for sure. Cute at best, on a very good day. No vixen.

But, it is the fact that he was giving her pleasure that is killing me right now. Can I pretend she faked it? I don't know. Can anyone relate? How do I think my way out of that?

[This message edited by bionicgal at 1:39 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2079 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
jo2love
Moderator
Member # 31528
Default  Posted: 2:58 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

Can I pretend she faked it?

Yes. She was probably an ego boost for him. The A doesn't mean she was better at doing physical or emotional things. It doesn't mean she was prettier, either. She was pure ego kibbles.

I know this isn't easy. There are better days ahead. Keep leaning on us. We're here for you.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:00 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]


Posts: 36039 | Registered: Mar 2011
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 3:48 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

I am just so sad today. It is one of those days where it feels like it won't ever feel better.

I don't always feel like this. . .but it is a rough one. I am alone with too much to do as well, so I am stressed and lonely.

Thanks for the support, guys.


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2079 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
SSmile
Member
Member # 37696
Default  Posted: 4:07 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

It will be a year soon. We havent even kissed, yes not even once in all this time. Yeah, I am angry beyond words and its painful. I miss my husband. He is trying and has been since day 1 but it's me..What is wrong with me? maybe its because I found out on dday he had multiple women since our 1st yr of marriage and lied until a year ago. besides that..he was a wonderful husband really. I felt lucky. now I feel stupid.


Anyone can give up, it's the easiest thing in the world to do. But to hold it together when everyone else
would understand if you fell apart, that's true strength.
-unknown

Posts: 84 | Registered: Dec 2012
OldCow18
Member
Member # 39670
Default  Posted: 7:44 PM, October 6th (Sunday)

We've not had tons of sex since d-day, but some. One time when the movies were awful I imagined WH was someone else. Probably not a healthy thing to do, but I wanted to enjoy it. It helped that night. I felt like I was getting back at him in some small way...picturing him as someone else was the only way I could get her ugly face out of my head. Like I said, probabl not healthy, but it worked.


Me, BW forty something, DD & DS,
Married to WH (49) 11 years, together 16
D-Day 6.8.13

Posts: 620 | Registered: Jun 2013
gettingthere2013
Member
Member # 38232
Default  Posted: 1:31 PM, October 7th (Monday)

As a couple that had a banging sex life pre A and during A,there was NO way I was going to give that up...OW took enough from me. That said,my mind movies were horrid. In the beginning I could barely touch,accept touch,kiss or be kissed by my H. Everything he did triggered me. My solution? I had H tell me everything they did...details I never really wanted to know Thankfully,they all rang true,and I could believe he was telling me the truth. Sooooo,in the early days,we only did things they did not-with the exception of kissing,they did kiss,but I toughed that one out,because again...screw you,OW,I like kissing MY husband,so sad that you don't like kissing yours Doing things they did not meant I could enjoy being intimate with H without picturing her. I'm convinced that being able to maintain that intimate connection has been integral to our R.


Me:BW(42)
Him:WH(40)
Kids: Seven...yes,you read that right,and yes-we do know what causes them :)
Dday#1 1/29/2013(ONS with coworker)
Dday#2 4/8/2013(6 month LD PA with coworker,over for six months at time of discovery)
Reconciling...in all our

Posts: 73 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: South
SorrowBhindSmile
Member
Member # 38139
Default  Posted: 3:57 PM, October 7th (Monday)

((((bionicgal)))

you have NOOOO idea how much i feel your pain. UGH. it totally just sucks, doesn't it?!?!?

I have been working very hard these past couple months with my MC/IC to try and regain back the joy and pleasure i once found in sex. I mean, i enjoy it, but not like i used to, due to the A and the mind movies.

maybe TMI...sorry...

Once technique we came up with was to replace the mind movies. My IC says to think about my fantasies...really spend time thinking about them. Think about what i enjoy, what i like, what turns me on, etc. Then, create my own mind movies using those fantasies, and superimpose them over the yucko mind movies.

The other thing i have had to do that has helped was to deconstruct the A. I had this idea in my mind of what i thought it was. I had this epic, awesome grandiose love affair all played out in my head. Once I started asking questions, getting details about specific encounters, and their meet ups in general, I was able to wrap my head around what it really was...i am beginning to accept that it was nothing like what my WH and i had/have. So, sometimes, when i am struggling with mind movies, I try and go to the place that knows that OW never ever shared with my WH what i did. What they had wasnt an epic, awesome grandiose love affair...it was 2 broken selfish people sharing nothing more than sex that "wasnt better just different." She didnt get the best of him.

I'm not all the way there yet, and sometimes i still struggle. Its hard, but we are working on it together. Day by day, building new memories, a new marriage.

hugs to you.


Me: BW
Him: WH
OW: My former "dear friend"/neighbor
Married 20+
Kids: 3
D-Day 12/2012
Committed to R 7/8/2013
"Believe in yourself and all that you are. Know that there is something inside you that is greater than any obstacle"

Posts: 357 | Registered: Jan 2013
UKlady
Member
Member # 39058
Exclaimation  Posted: 5:30 PM, October 7th (Monday)

I''m not sure about the etiquette of posting links to past posts here or if they even work? Well back on 13th September I did start a thread in this forum called - Mind Movies? This may help! with details of how my IC had helped me.

If it''s allowed, and works, the link is here: https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/text.forums.asp?tid507737


Me: BW 45
Him: WH 48
Married: 6 years, together 9 years
D-day: 3 January 2013 - he confessed.
A: June-Dec 2012
No children.

Posts: 153 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: UK
UKlady
Member
Member # 39058
Default  Posted: 5:13 AM, October 8th (Tuesday)

Actually - I don''t think I''m being very helpful by not repeating what I put in that post. So, hopefully this may help, this is what I started that post with:

WH and I are 8 months from DDay now and, on the whole, are doing well. He is doing everything he should to help us heal. However, still, still, I find myself obsessing over the physical stuff. I''ve always struggled with this even knowing the reasons behind the A (WH FOO issues and poor/non-existent coping strategies) and knowing that the sex was bland, unfulfilling, even knowing that he was manipulated by a very mentally unstable OW. Still I struggle with mind movies especially during sex with WH.
But I have hope! My IC suggested picturing the mind movie that I have playing in black and white and poor quality - she said to project it onto a blank wall, large size. Then she asked if I could picture a good movie of me and WH - which I can (''twas quite explicit! ) and for this to play bottom left of the big movie in small size but colour and in HD. Next I had to stretch that small, glorious movie right over the top of the poor quality black and white one and focus on that!

Since then I''ve read more about this and a NLP technique called ''Swish'' which really is just a posh way of saying what the above is.

When I tried it out I was concerned that it would take too long to ''set up both screens'' etc as you are told to imagine !! But what I discovered is that before long simply the word ''swish'' was working for me. In fact, I subconsciously changed the word from ''swish'' to ''switch'' as I found that when I said it to myself I immediately switched to another thought - any old thought not even necessarily A related.

I''m not saying that it will work forever, but even if it is just for a slight reprieve it may help. It is horrible to be in this position but we all need the help and support we can get.


Me: BW 45
Him: WH 48
Married: 6 years, together 9 years
D-day: 3 January 2013 - he confessed.
A: June-Dec 2012
No children.

Posts: 153 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: UK
Laura28
Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 5:41 AM, October 8th (Tuesday)

Hi honey

These things helped me dodge the mind movies:

1. Imagine her cringing in the corner of the room crying watching you.

2. Imagine her alone and lonely in her cold bed.

3. Magnify her physical deficiencies. If she has big boobs imagine them flopping to her waist, if she has bad skin imagine it as much worse, if she has bad hair imagine it as lanky, greasy and smelly etc. Whatever applies in your sich, if she is overweight imagine her as monstrous.

4. Imagine their manoeuvres in bed as clumsy and awkward.

5. In your mind watch him getting out of bed and leaving her to go home. Watch her get back into bed alone and sad.

6. When he made a "new" request I flatly refused to participate. Tough luck for him. (I will never forget one night he did something quite new - my response "No f...ing way". We both knew he had done it with one of them even though we didn't discuss it. He never tried again.)

These worked for me in the early days and may help you.

Do what you feel comfortable with. You owe him nothing. It is his job to make you feel safe with him sexually.

HUGS

Laura


Married 32yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 60yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA 16+ years).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2754 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
ILINIA
Member
Member # 39836
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, October 8th (Tuesday)

I feel like this is going to be tmi, but here goes!

I realized if I am leading/initiating my mind doesn't wander. If he initiates, there is more chance for mind movies. Therefore, here are some things that have helped me:

- During the day I think about what I want to do with him at night. This can be simple or really planned like what I want to say, do, positions, wear, etc. It gets me in the excited for the evening. Sometimes I will email him with teasers.

- I initiate and tell him what I want

- I keep talking

- I tell him to talk and compliment me

- I don't try to please him, he is in charge of pleasing me

- If any thoughts sneak in I think of a stop sign and say "stop" in my head and then refocus on telling him what I want


I did ask him early on that he had to "throw me a bone" because I am 16 years older and the OW couldn't have been perfect, he told me the following:

- She asked him "What do you think of my 23 year old breasts?" (her words per wh) and he just mumbled because he knew mine were better. I don't mean to brag, but mine are darn awesome even after 2 kids :-)

- He said when he touched her, he felt her fat roll and felt disappointed. He thought she would have been in better shape.

- She shaved down there and was all stubbly. He felt she was trying to play up how young she was by shaving it all off and he didn't like it and he didn't like the stubble. (obviously, it wasn't a show stopper)

- Afterwards, he realized "She wasn't all that." but she flattered him and he needed the ego stroking. He struggled with ED for awhile and just started taking Viagra, so he said he felt young and virile, because she didn't know about his performance issues.

As much as I don't want to put other people down, it really helped me to hear those things. Therefore, I can make my own mind movies knowing there are things that he preferred with me.

[This message edited by ILINIA at 5:35 PM, October 8th (Tuesday)]


Entering R slowly and cautiously...

Posts: 501 | Registered: Jul 2013
LA44
Member
Member # 38384
Default  Posted: 7:59 PM, October 8th (Tuesday)

((bionicgirl)), I remember my IC telling me to grab an image from a movie or a book and use that image for as long as I needed too. She said, "the dirtier the better." At some point, if you are doing the work and he is owning it by showing remorse you won't need that anymore. Easier said than done!

I do like the suggestions from everyone - I do picture the AP alone or watching us walk away together and it helps immensely.

UK Lady - good one! I remember that.


Me: 44
He: 47 WH
Married: 15 years
D Day: December 2012
Affair: Fall 2009 - Dec. 2011
R is not linear

Posts: 2482 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: Canada, eh
tryin2havefaith
Member
Member # 37165
Default  Posted: 9:58 PM, October 8th (Tuesday)

I too struggled for a long time with mind movies. It took a long time till I got the whole timeline from FWH. Putting all the pieces together helped a bit. My mind made the unknown much worse. But thinking of OW watching and crying in corner just did not work for me. I did not want her in my bedroom even in thoughts.

My FWH and I had chance to house sit for a friend. They have a pool and a fire pit, and a secluded backyard. We had a very romantic evening making love in the pool and then being in each others arms in front of a fire, all while under the stars. We just felt so very close. So now when mind movies (or guilt/shame for him) hit, we both use this memory to rebound and refocus us. Putting our sights and thoughts back on US and not OW.


ME- BS
HIM- WS
DDay 1/2011
4 - 6 months of TT'ing
Fully R'd
"Just as ripples spread out when a single pebble is dropped into water, the actions of individuals can have far-reaching effects. " -Dalai Lama

Posts: 265 | Registered: Oct 2012
hearthurts23
New Member
Member # 40448
Default  Posted: 9:05 PM, October 28th (Monday)

I was struggling with mind movies and still do from time to time but it has gotten much better since I started focusing on the negatives he told me about the encounter instead of all of the "what if's" that my mind makes up.
I don't know if it's like this for others, but for me my mind movies of them play it out like a steamy porno which he has repeatedly told me it definitely was not.
He said that she started screaming obnoxiously as soon as she got on him, so much so that he cringed. He called her noises "mooing".
He also told me that when he realized he wanted to stop, he shoved her off of him and she damn near hit the floor. This made me laugh so hard I cried.
When I feel my worst, I try to imagine what she must have felt like when he was not interested in finishing and literally shoved her off of him. That's usually enough to make me feel better. It may be petty, but it sure as hell works for me.


Me - BS 23
Him - WS 24
His drunk ONS - 8/5/13 (sex was not completed)
DDay - 8/18/13
Junior High Sweethearts: Eachother's first & only before this.
Together 8 years, married 3 years.
No kids for awhile if at all, both in college.

Posts: 15 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: Texas
whattheh
Member
Member # 40032
Default  Posted: 11:17 PM, October 28th (Monday)

I got many details so I knew what when on and how he felt. It was bland and unexciting. I also shared any trauma I felt even if it ruined the moment or told WH after and discussed.

Now if she comes into my mind I visualize her body flopping in the air as if shes been shot but not a violent scene...her body just flaps as if paper in the wind. She is nothing and deserves no place in our life is my mantra. It took me about 8months to get here.


BW- mid 50's (me)
fWH-late 50's
M 33 T 35
DD-Early 2013 PA 2010
In R but I have PTSD...

Posts: 575 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
plainpain
Member
Member # 40139
Default  Posted: 2:23 PM, October 29th (Tuesday)

I have laid claim to my H, and we have had sex pretty much every day since we started our HB. It's been about 7 months since I found out about the A. Mind movies are always there, but I just remind myself that he is with ME, while she is sleeping somewhere else rejected, alone and pregnant. I imagine her there, in her house, wondering what he's doing with me. My H is not sharing a bed with her, and neither am I - she is not welcome in my head while I'm having sex with my H.

The movies are in my head, not his. I, too, imagined their sex like some hot porno movie, but he said it definitely wasn't that. He has assured me that I'm 'better' than she was, which probably shouldn't even matter to me but it does. He said she would have had sex every day, so the fact that it was only 5-7 times over two months was indication that it wasn't really about the sex for him. He gave her sex to keep her coming back, because what he wanted was the validation. Understanding that seems to help in the bedroom, although not so much when we're holding hands or on a date. I'll get there, too, I'm sure.

It wasn't romantic, either. He said he didn't use any creativity and she was a lot more into it than he was, which leads me to suspect she was putting a lot of effort into appearing to be having a great time. He said that, honestly, he didn't care if she was satisfied or not - that was what he liked about it. Just for ego, he wanted to believe he was a super fantastic lover able to attract and satisfy a 21 year old, but he didn't actually CARE about pleasing HER. He didn't have to care about her feelings, if he hurt her, if she felt disrespected, whatever. She meant nothing to him, and so he could be completely selfish sexually. If she actually got off on being treated like that, then she has some issues to work out. Whatever he did with her was the equivalent of a pick-up line in a bar. He probably just did what worked on me, and marveled at how she seemed to enjoy his same-old same-old so much more than I did. That sexual energy wasn't for HER, it was for HIMSELF and how it made him feel to be so selfish and powerful enough to have a woman let him treat her like that. So, that's on him. He has to live with himself on that, and he really does feel tremendous guilt and shame for being so reckless with someone else's heart - even though I have my own separate feelings about that.

I just keep telling myself that this was about him, not her - she could have been anybody, with any body type. All she was was different. He is with me now because of who I am to him. She no doubt looks better naked than I do, so I just accept that she's got a better body and I have my husband. I can live with that.

One practical thing we have done is to just go out and have crazy sex other places than our bedroom. I acted like I was the one having the A with him, and I let go a lot of my inhibitions. What is there left to lose, really? Going out with no underwear, getting tipsy and having sex on a picnic table in the rain at midnight... whatever. Now if I have mind movies, it's a LOT easier to replace those with real memories of our own escapades.

The biggest thing that has helped is actually that I also completely stopped worrying about pleasing him. I decided that if I was going to be having sex with him, it was going to be because I wanted to, and I was for sure going to get more out of it than I was putting into it. TMI?


Me: Believer; 40s
Him: Liar; 40s
Married 19 years
1 year EA/2 month PA/incidental infidelities I can't begin to process
OC born 2014
OW:21
In successful R, but still in just plain pain.

Posts: 808 | Registered: Jul 2013
Topic Posts: 22