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Just Found Out
User Topic: Cheated on me Again
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 6:46 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

1st time I was devastated. 2nd and third I was hurt, 4 or 5th not really feeling anything. I think I'm numb. I'm in a gay relationship but all the emotions are the same. Read somewhere that cheating isn't as bad as an affair because they just sexually objectify the other person, there's no real emotion there.We'll either way it cuts deep. Been together for a couple decades. I'm sure now this has probably been going on since the beginning. HA! He wants to make it about "how dare you not trust me and go thru my phone". Oh well. I guess I can choose to continue this even though it is taking its toll on me or I can leave. We have small kids together, last time I left for 9 months. Thought he understood how much it hurt me. This time he didn't bother to use a condom. I tracked the person down and they had no knowledge of me. I wasn't even mad at them. I just wanted one person to be honest. He was honest and actually very sympathetic. So now I have to wonder about my health as well as deal with these emotions. Who knows how many times I didn't figure it out.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
iwillNOT
Member
Member # 40605
Default  Posted: 7:07 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

I'm so sorry you are in this position. No one deserves to be betrayed like that. When you say cheating isn't as bad as an affair - I assume you mean one night stands. I just want to say that lying and deception are devastating no matter what. That he would repeatedly cheat, lie, betray, put your mental and emotional health at risk, AND risk your health and life with unprotected sex - these things are devastating and terrible for you, whether they were "just" one night stands or a longer affair. And he did it over and over.

You don't trust him and you went through his phone because HE IS NOT trustworthy. Do not allow him to try to shift blame onto you.

I am only 2 months into this process myself, but I want to say, please focus on you and your kids right now. Take care of the basics, eat and drink and try to sleep. Breathe. Read here and post here - it has been a lifesaver for me.

There are lots of great articles in the healing library. Check it out if you can. Give yourself permission to process and gather information before you make any big decisions.


(((AlexFL)))


Me: BS, 43
Him: WH, 44
Together 21 years
Married 14 years
Kiddos 2,6,8,10
Dday#1 2004, 3 years after EA/PA co-worker MOW
Dday#2 8-6-13, 13 months EA/9months PA with co-worker MOW - caught not confessed
Rugsweep now, pay later. Ask me how I know.

Posts: 490 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Midwest
Skan
Member
Member # 35812
Default  Posted: 7:58 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

Ah hun, (((hugs))). You''re with a serial cheater who evidently has no intention of changing his ways. He''s exposed you to STDs/HIV and evidently, not for the first time. I''m so sorry.

If you haven''t already, look up in the left hand corner and in the yellow box, click on The Healing Library. Start reading. Read any post on this forum that has a bulls-eye next to it. And I might suggest checking out the "I Can Relate" forum and reading on the SA (sexual addict) thread. Because that''s what your WBF sounds like to me.

And do take care of yourself and your children. Eat what you can. Stay hydrated. Sleep when you can. If you don''t take care of yourself, you can''t take care of your beautiful children. Come Monday, I would see a lawyer to find out what legal options you have. Knowledge is power, so please go get yourself educated on the legalitys if you decided, rightfully so, that you cannot be put through this gut-wrenching wringer again.

Come back often for support. It''s slow here on the weekends, but we are all here to support you.


Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012



Posts: 4713 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 8:06 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

I blame myself cause we were together so young. (Teenagers) we grew up together and did everything together. Sometimes not so traditional.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
emotionalgirl
Member
Member # 40184
Default  Posted: 8:29 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

Alex...it is NEVER the BS fault and it does not matter how long you have been together! No matter what as BS we may be 50% at fault for the issues in our relationship but the WS IS ALWAYS 100% responsible for the A! I am so sorry you are hurting so much (((hugs)))


1st D day: Saturday July 20,2013
2nd D day....when the s**t really hit the fan and the truth came out.Saturday August 3,2013
3rd D day: Friday August 16, 2013...NC sent Friday Aug 30 4th D day NOV 11
Me: BS
Him: WH
Married 25 years....finally in R

Posts: 370 | Registered: Aug 2013
strongerdaybyday
Member
Member # 40264
Default  Posted: 8:55 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

(((hugs))) I can't offer any better advice but I understand the pain of being cheated on and it sucks.

[This message edited by strongerdaybyday at 8:57 PM, October 12th (Saturday)]


Me-BW Him - WH
Married 6 years, together 13+ years
D-Day Summer 2013
children-3
If it is what it is then what is it?

**If I edit I'm correcting a typo!**


Posts: 380 | Registered: Aug 2013
LifeIsBroken
Member
Member # 27071
Default  Posted: 10:56 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

So you've been together a long time. You have a family. And your partner cheats on you, risking everything for a cheap thrill. PLEASE read in The Healing Library. Protect yourself with information. Everyone on this site has been affected by infidelity. We've all been there. Read, especially the 180, then follow through. Don't be nice to your partner, just be tolerant of him. And don't put up with this one more time. He has shown you a huge amount of disrespect and thinks so little of you AND himself that he engages in unprotected sex with, essentially, strangers. This is not honorable in any way. You have some serious thinking to do. Because, unless your partner is willing to turn himself around - which will require a great deal of work on his part - you will live with this kind of thing the rest of your life. YOU have done nothing wrong. Do not blame yourself because you aren't to blame. All this mess is squarely on his shoulders, not yours. Stand up for yourself AND your children. Sending hugs to you....


BW: 59
XH: 60
Married 34 yrs, LIBerated: 2/17/11
MOW: 50 (she said she wanted a sugar daddy; xh said, "I'M HIM!")
Actions ALWAYS have consequences. Too bad cheaters don't consider the consequences BEFORE they create so much damage.

Posts: 453 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Missouri & Massachusetts
Josephine01
Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 11:01 PM, October 12th (Saturday)

Hugs to you, I am so sorry you have to be here. Keep posting and STOP blaming yourself.

Be good to yourself.
Jose


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
Crushed1
Member
Member # 6449
Default  Posted: 12:14 AM, October 13th (Sunday)

Hi AlexFL, I'm sorry for your pain. Lots of good advice above. Keep reading and posting for support and help.


~~"You can't run away from yourself"!!! Me to my H when he descended into adultery insanity.
~~Prov.15:13 "By sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken"
~~"The day breaks-your mind aches"
~STRENGTH~PEACE~HOPE~FAITH

Posts: 9693 | Registered: Feb 2005 | From: Texas
5454real
Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 12:33 AM, October 13th (Sunday)

Sorry you've had cause to join our community. We're glad you made it/

I blame myself cause we were together so young.

I understand the sentiment, but absolutely in no way do you bear ANY responsibility for his choice to have an affair. That's on him and him alone.

Please take some time to read in the healing library. The knowledge to be gained there is astounding.

Strength


BH 51, WW 42
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 20(Hers),DS 9 Ours, DGS 3, DGD 1 mo
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2704 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
waiting2see
Member
Member # 13767
Default  Posted: 8:09 AM, October 13th (Sunday)

Life is too short to live this way.

I know how frightening change can be for you and your children but how scary is the prospect of living like this for the rest of your life?

Teach your kids how a person should be treated in a commited relationship. You owe it to them and to yourself.

Hugs


me: BS
him: XWS

Much of your pain is self-chosen. ~Kahlil Gibran, The Prophet, 1923

"It's not livin' that you're doin' if it feels like dyin." Ray Lamontagne


Posts: 1931 | Registered: Feb 2007
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 9:27 AM, October 13th (Sunday)

I guess because we weren't always "traditional" and that as a couple we made decisions together to par-take in some non traditional scenes- I feel partly to blame... But on the other side these past things were discussed and decided together- I still can't help feel totally betrayed. I guess some people have open relationships- I do not want an open relationship also because if the shoe was on the other foot- he would not be as rational. He said that since I knew of his cheating and waited to confront him , that I'm fake and pretending, and I just don't know how a person can come home after sneaking around and act as if nothing happened... I would be guilt ridden. I wouldn't be able to look at my self. I am so glad I Checked his phone that night. I don't care that he said it was a betrayal of his trust. I told him that I don't check on him often but unfortunately everytime I have, I have found something. All other aspects of our life seemed to be going very well. We had separated for 9 months a little over a year ago. I thought things were really going well... Did I get what I deserve since we experimented as a couple in the past. Should I just forgive again. If I don't I really have no idea what to do. He finally admitted to it. Still didn't apologize. He said these no point. He says he did use protection but why was I told otherwise by the person he met up with? I am a really good person. I may even be slightly a push over, I forgive way too easily. I have kept note of all the past things as a reminder because by nature I wait her push things out or sweep them under the rug till I don't remember what I'm angry about. In my heart I know I shouldn't tolerate this. I don't have low self esteem, I'm not afraid of being alone. I've loved this person since I was a kid. We've been together forever. All the men in my life have hurt me. He was not suppose to. He always always made me feel so special now I just wonder if I've turned a blind eye for so many years. Sorry this is so long but it feels better to write it out. I don't feel mad. I feel frustrated that AGAIN I'm in the exact situation with him. I am disappointed that this is who he is and I'm upset with myself to feel pity for HIM. Last time I freaked and got angry and he was angry and it was hell. This time like I said before part of me wants to say who cares. There is nothing I can do. We are so entwined in every aspect of our lives. I'm upset and feel like I could scream and then part of me still is deeply in love because other aspects of our life work well. There's no escape for me. I wish I could freeze time so I could think, evaluate and process- instead I find myself with this energy that I need to clean, and throw out old crap, and keep myself busy. An apology would be nice, a sincere apology would be nice. But like I said earlier, maybe I am getting what I deserve.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
Josephine01
Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 12:01 AM, October 14th (Monday)

Alex, this is what the 180 is for. Unfortunately, it won't freeze time, but it will help you to grow stronger and feel more capable of making a well thought out decision.

It would also show your partner how much he really hurt you and you will not put up with it, not for even one minute.

Please take care.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
Knowing
Member
Member # 37044
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, October 14th (Monday)

Alex, in the past you may have experimented sexually but it was something you decided on together, right? Your WS going out on his own to seek new sexual partners was not something you agreed to! There is something really broken, immature, selfish and self-centered about someone who will go out and seek new partners while still in a relationship.

On top of that what you describe is a lack of remorse and willingness on his part. Changing cheating behaviour takes a lot of work! Is he really willing to do whatever it takes?!? All the energy that is going into this drama with his serial cheating could be better put towards yours and the children''s care...

Only you know when you''re done, are you in counselling?


Me: BW, Him: fWH
Together 12 years
My EA (?) 2005-2011
His STA/PA: D-day: 19/09/12
TT: 08/12/12

We are in R.


Posts: 697 | Registered: Oct 2012
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 11:44 AM, October 14th (Monday)

Ugh. This is terrible. I am really not feeling anything, I don't feel anger, I just am not feeling anything. Part of me just feels like I'm an idiot. I should have screamed and yelled but instead I am trying to remain calm. I'm wondering if there is anything left to feel. Have I become so complacent, have I become so numb that there is no reaction left in me. I have to say I don't hate him. He was always so good in so many ways - part of me is just going about things as if nothing happened but not exactly. I know it's affecting me- it's just there's nothing. It didn't work to scream and yell, it didn't work to cry and be sad, so now I just have nothing. Does that seem normal?

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
Josephine01
Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 12:18 PM, October 14th (Monday)

It sounds very normal. There are many cycles that we go though in times like this. You are likely in one of them.

It could be though that you have come to accept that he is who he is and you need to move on while you two can remain friends.

I know all this is hard. Please stay strong.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
Truly
Member
Member # 40715
Default  Posted: 12:44 PM, October 14th (Monday)


oh boy is that normal!

I think the more you find out or suspect you were cheated on the number you become.

Trust and respect is essential and at the moment you have neither. You don't have to decide today.
Do the 180, find YOU and your life today. Love and protect your children and look after your health (full STI/STD checks).
No one asks for this hell, keep checking phone and email etc there's prob more to come...
((((AlexFL))))
PS. Just want to reiterate that none of the cheating is your fault AT ALL!


There are dark shadows on the earth, but its lights are stronger in the contrast.
Charles Dickens


Posts: 257 | Registered: Sep 2013
silentheart
Member
Member # 40903
Default  Posted: 1:04 PM, October 14th (Monday)

First, I'm so sorry you are going through this. And this is NOT your fault and you do NOT deserve it. The different feelings you are experiencing day to day are completely normal. I just found this site a week ago and my DD was 14 months ago. I wish I would have found this site then. Keep reading and posting and do the 180!!! You deserve a true apology and since remorse from him. Do not just settle and put your needs last. You have to be honest with him about what this is doing to you. And if he really gets it and wants a future with you he will be willing to do whatever it takes to have you in his life.


Me: BW, 37
Him: SO, 37
No children
Committed relationship 13 years
Dday: July, 2012

Posts: 51 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: Texas
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, October 14th (Monday)

Just took an HIV test. Came out negative. So I am somewhat relieved but I know I need to take another one in a couple months. At least I can breathe for a minute.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
tushnurse
Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 1:19 PM, October 14th (Monday)

Alex, welcome to the club no one ever plans to join.

Please stop blaming yourself. So earlier in your relationship you mutually agreed upon some nontraditional activities, big deal. THEY WERE MUTUALLY AGREED UPON. That's not what causes him to now lie to you, and have sex with random people. What causes that is something very broken within him. You need to stop trying to own his actions. The only person you have control over is you. The sooner you accept that the sooner you can start to heal yourself. Figuring out what you want, and how to go about getting it.

Do NOT allow him to blameshift this, snooping in his phone, he's your partner, correct? Then there should be nothing to hide. NOTHING, and the fact that there is, tells me that you probably have just touched upon the surface of what he has done.

Now the most important thing is to take care of you, and your kids, just like on a flight, you have to put your oxygen mask on first, before you can help your kids, you have to put your mental well being first and foremost, if you don't you won't have anything left to give your kids.

Get into counseling for yourself. Read up on 180, it's for you, so you can get strong again.

You don't have to make any decisions today, tomorrow, next week, or next month, but you do need to start thinking on what it would take from him, for you to continue to stay in this relationship, and ask for it. If he is worth sticking around for he will hop at the chance to make things right, if he doesn't then you have an idea how much he is willing to try to help and save the relationship.

((((and strength))))


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 8145 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 2:22 PM, October 14th (Monday)

Where do I find 180 ??

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 2:29 PM, October 14th (Monday)

I'm a very loyal person and I almost feel responsible to make sure everyone else is happy. I don't even want to see him sad. I know I sound terribly wishy washy but this is all I've known since I've been a teenager. I'm a little worried because last time this happened and I did react- it was not a good situation at all. I know I can't fix anyone but if this is the end, I am worried about his reaction. Right now he is sad and keeping his distance. But I'm a little fearful of what comes after sadness.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
Josephine01
Member
Member # 38511
Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Alex,

I see your frustration, but you can't go on living like this. You need to take some time to reflect your feelings. If you think he might do something to physically hurt himself try to get him into therpy, but if you think he will be sad and depressed. This may be what he needs to stop treating you like this or his next partner like this.

The 180 can be found BSQ&A: Here is the link:

What is 180 and how does it work? Submitted by Making It
It's in the Healing library to the left.

Good Luck, my friend.


Me, 42 BS
H, 61 WH
2 boys 19 and 15 years old
Married 24 years

Posts: 314 | Registered: Feb 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 11:40 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

We work together and today he is lashing out and told me he is canceling an event we were suppose to attend, and canceling a trip with kids cause he doesn't want to go with me or without me. A customer came in today and he started saying - oh there's your friend, now u can be friends, I know you talk to him. Then he said he is leaving and not able to work. He also said in not leaving early because I'll go to the gym and he isn't staying at work so I can go to gym. I take care of the kids from 330- bedtime. I just feel like he is trying to manipulate me. He said I've made him always feel irrelevant and that it's not his excuse but that's how he has felt. I still don't have any feelings. I feel like he is going to wear me down. I try to explain that we've been through this before and it's not fair to me. I feel like I'm suppose to stand by him although I don't think things will change. Our lives are SO entwined I don't see how this will ever end well.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 2:30 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Tried speaking at work which was a bad idea. He became very upset, crying, slightly mad- said he thought we were going to finally make it official by getting married now that it's legal- and he messed up, he said now we'll be lucky to even speak. Made me feel very bad. I am hurting but I hate that he is hurting. It still hasn't sank in. I feel like I don't even care and that I should just forgive and forget to make all this drama go away. But that isn't fair to me. He has cried and felt sad but with if he would have given me a disease or something. He didn't think if the consequences. Why do I feel bad. I should just have left and said screw u. Why am I so stupid. It's always drama anymore. I don't know how to escape it.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
lieshurt
Member
Member # 14003
Default  Posted: 2:38 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

AlexFL, he is manipulating you with his immature tantrums. Don't let him do that.

I should just have left and said screw u.

From what you describe, yes you should have. Why haven't you? Why haven't you taken care of yourself instead of focusing on him? He doesn't deserve your empathy, so stop worrying about his feelings and focus on taking care of you.


I'm sorry if you don't like my Honesty, but to be fair I don't like your lies.

Sometimes it's better to push someone away...not because you stopped loving them but because you can't take the pain anymore.


Posts: 13719 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: Houston
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 3:49 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

I have no family here, financially I can't and that I always try to see the good in someone. I know it's terribly stupid and immature but I hate this and it scares me. I don't think its rational for me to think I could walk away and that world war 3 won't break out. I still care deeply and love him but enough is enough. Right ? You're absolutely right. Why am I worried about him. He wasn't worried about me. And I can already hear his insecurities coming out almost accusingly as if I'm the one that cheated. It messes with my mind. He said stop being a victim. I said I am a victim. I'm entitled to my feelings. I think I should not have to worry about where he goes when he leaves the house. I've never been in another relationship to compare. How do I know. Maybe I'm suppose to say " he's good in all other aspects but this infidelity thing" Should I accept that in my life. I don't make decisions alone. I've always had him to bounce off of. Now I'm being filled with guilt like its my fault for not keeping it together, or giving up on him.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 10:13 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Still feeling lost, not really sure what to do. I feel guilty although I didn't do anything wrong. I feel like I'm giving up. I don't want to live wondering everytime he leaves the house if he is being faithful. Everytime I checked, I found something. Makes me believe that there were many times I just didn't find out. Kinda feel in limbo.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 7:08 PM, October 16th (Wednesday)

I am feeling really down and worthless tonight. I'm starting to question my purpose. Been speaking to him and he has apologized but I just feel so down. I realize I am alone In this and I should stop feeling sorry for myself but it has affected me deeply. Still not allowing myself to really believe it.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
Broken1Again
Member
Member # 32211
Default  Posted: 10:51 PM, October 16th (Wednesday)

My WS is a Serial cheater too and it's very hard to know what the right decision is. I can relate to what you are saying. You almost become numb to it. I sometimes feel like "everyone cheats, so I might as well stay with what I know". Isn't that a terrible way to feel? I'm not sure what to tell you because I'm going down a bad spiral myself and not sure what to think/feel anymore. I just wanted you to know that you are not alone. Definitely not alone. ((((Hugs))))


BS: 40
WS: 42
Two boys 13/11
Married 15 years
Dday: too Many to remember. 3 significant OW and many "less"'significant OW. Believe WS has bad boundaries and craves the attention.
In R.

Posts: 859 | Registered: May 2011
OnAnIsland
Member
Member # 34319
Default  Posted: 12:47 AM, October 17th (Thursday)

So sorrythatyouhave to be here. You are not alone. You are still n shock probably. Take care of your self and your kids. You will know when it is enough, and when you are ready to go.

Are you in counseling? I think it could really help you heal and sort things out.

You are not alone. You don't need to make him happy. You are also not responsible for his past choices. You are responsible for your own happiness, and for the health and safety of your kids.

Keep reading and posting.


D-day: Christmas 2011
D-day 2: 3/28/2013

Married for over 15 years
2 beautiful boys in elementary school

You may not control all the events that happen to you, but you can decide not to be reduced by them. Maya Angelou


Posts: 1478 | Registered: Dec 2011
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 5:35 PM, October 17th (Thursday)

I am definitely in shock - after last time and all the emotion and anger and sadness for him to do it again. I just want to say FORGET IT. There's nothing that I can do to change your behavior. Not consequence makes you think before u act. If he was a report card he'd be all A's and a big fat F. And that's why I still feel like I'm holding on. I honestly don't think he is a bad person and I do think that everyone probably cheats so why bother moving on. I'm not afraid to be alone. It's not fair. After last time it was so hard for me to forgive but I did. I dove back in, I let my walls down and BOOM this happens. Why do I feel bad for him. Does he have that much control over me

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 7:18 PM, October 17th (Thursday)

I realized tonight that I felt guilty to go to the gym... He was at the house with kids and I felt guilty leaving. Why do I feel guilty to go to the gym for an hour and he didn't feel guilty to have unprotected sex with someone for an hour. I'm stupid

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
idealist
Member
Member # 9462
Default  Posted: 11:21 PM, October 17th (Thursday)

Hi Alex,
I am terribly sorry for what you are going through and I went through something similar in a straight relationship. What I am going to suggest is only food for thought. It is not meant to replace the process of resolving your feelings but rather to perhaps draw out a structural map that might make sense.

I begin with a story about a visit to a friends home. They have a 6 year old and a 4 year old. I asked the 6 year old, "do you have a brother?" "Yes," he answered nodding towards his little brother. I asked, "does he have a brother?" He paused and answered, "no." And that makes perfect sense given the way that this little guy makes meaning in his world. He can't yet put himself in his brothers position to reflect that he is his brother's brother. Perfectly normal - developmentaly speaking.

Alex, I was like you in that I was developemntaly at that point (Robert Kegan calls) called interpersonalism. We make meaning in our world in the space between ourselves and the other - the relationship is more important than our sense of self (and boundaries).

You partner seems caught in the "imperial balance." The selfish adolescent who has difficulty with empathy and makes meaning based his "needs" being satisfied.

This is oversimplified for the purpose of an interenet message board of course. I would also urge that you read a bit on attachment theory.

In any case, it is time - even if it feels unnatural - to find you anger and let him worry about the relationship he has trashed - to take care of Alex. Damn serious, Sir. He is not taking care of you so you need to. Be gentle with oyurself, but be firm with your need to be healthy.


Everything can be taken from a man or a woman but one thing: the last of human freedoms to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way.

Posts: 1732 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Southern California
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 6:06 AM, October 18th (Friday)

That sounds like something I need to read up on. This site is very helpful. Your post makes sense. I think reading up on attachment is what I need. We've been together so long. Do you have any suggestions on what to read so that I can separate his emotional needs and work on my own. (Detachment ?? )

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
hardtimesinlife
Member
Member # 10468
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, October 18th (Friday)

Alex, what you are feeling is very normal. It is a roller coaster. Your feelings will go up and down at any given moment.

Detaching will help you take care of yourself and your children. You will be able to get stronger and stand up for your rights. Sometimes we get so bogged down taking care of others we forget our own needs.

Your ws is acting like he has the right to do this. He needs to wake up and make some changes. Please don't have unprotected sex until you are both clean. Drink water, eat healthy foods and by all means make time for the gym. It is easy to think that if we take care of ourselves our ws will turn even further away from us. Usually not true. We need to take care of ourselves even more when the shit is hitting the fan.
Hang in there. Hugs


Ddays 2004 & 2007
I cut my losses mid 2013
Feeling happier every day :)

Posts: 6088 | Registered: Apr 2006 | From: Florida
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 4:32 PM, October 18th (Friday)

Not only are the emotions a roller coaster but I'm having flash backs of other times I thought or suspected but now without a doubt I know. It makes me feel so dumb. Like when we left vacation and he stayed behind for 3 hours to have a few "quiet moments" on the beach. Or when he was gone 5 hours and said he got stuck in the sand and had to wait for a tow. Even if they seemed remotely believable I would not trust it was true. I know I turned a blind eye bc I convinced myself I didn't need to be a detective. I don't want to spend time or energy "figuring it out". We fought for it last time. We both cried and sober months working on it. And when I thought I finally could put my guard down I immediately find out I'm a fool. I have to go to a work event with him tonight. I am trying to not be angry but I want to scream.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
idealist
Member
Member # 9462
Default  Posted: 5:45 PM, October 18th (Friday)

Hi again Alex
I hope you are doing well as I type this and that you are finding some measure of peace amidst the chaos and pain.

When I wrote about attachment I was refering to attachment style as opposed to whether or not to remain attached. Nonetheless it is probably a good idea for you to stop viewing yourself in the context of the relationship for now and instead view Alex in the context of a supportive and basically good commuity of friends. e.g. detach. Here is an overview of the concept:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attachment_in_adults

One of the most common reports of people who are involved with a partner embedded in the imperial balance (an adolescent "selfishness") is to feel manipulated. The way this person makes meaning of the events and relationships in their life is something like; "This feels good and my needs are being met - he/she/it is good. That feels bad and my needs (as I perceive them) are not being met - he/she/it is bad." When Alex is angry, then I feel diminished and/or guilty, that means Alex is bad. While that stranger meets my need to feel attractive and powerful, so he is good. Just as the 6 year old I described could not see that he is his brothers brother, the partner in the imperial balance does not see the other person's "human-ness" and has rtouble with empathy. He IS his needs instead of HAVING needs - it is a subject - object difference.

Adults transition into an ability to feel empathy and hold both the good and the bad of someone in mind at the same time.

Can you two find a counseler or therapist to talk to? If so, I recomend it. If not, then protect Alex for now.


Everything can be taken from a man or a woman but one thing: the last of human freedoms to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way.

Posts: 1732 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Southern California
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 10:03 PM, October 18th (Friday)

You totally make sense and I am so happy to see your response. It makes sense. I know there's something more to this and that it all isn't blk and white. I just don't want to be any ones counselor. He said to me tonight that he wishes he could make it right as he was holding back tears but we've been down this road. Last time it was 9 months of separation. I don't want to go thru this to end in the same place a year from now. I don't think I will ever want sex again and if I do I will never trust another person without a condom. I feel I've become hardened and without emotion. I obviously can not satisfy what he needs and at this point I don't even care to try. I love him dearly but I feel I've had enough. I'm not looking to be on a road to recovery. Been there done that didn't work. I know he isn't bad but I just don't think we are good I guess. I tried last time. I really gave it my all. He says I don't see him. I dont give him the attention he needs. So I say go find someone that will. I don't want to bend over backward anymore. I am a good catch. A very good catch- he was the love of my life since teen years. Now I am angry, sad and numb. He could have been honest. I know in dealing with someone who truly feels bad for their actions but he did before as well and it didn't stop him. I'm lost cause our lives are SO entwined. I actually like being with him but I can't try to convince him of that anymore. I'm not afraid to be in my own. I don't have the financials to support myself and the kids but I can. I'm a hard worker. I just feel so bad for him. I don't want to but I do.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
idealist
Member
Member # 9462
Default  Posted: 10:37 PM, October 18th (Friday)

I'm headed for a few glasses of wine with friends but I am glad I saw this. First, Alex, I am not trying to convince you of any course of action. What I offer are a few simple insights - and insights alone are fine but not "enough." No smoker lacks the "insight" that it is not healthy, right? But they are going to continue to smoke.

He says I don't see him

Utter bullshit. You have lived for him (based upon your posts) People like us feel "your pleasure is my pleasure. You have beeen manipulated in the past but establishing new boundaries.

I dont give him the attention he needs

People trapped i the imperial balance have a void in their center. Because they canot validate themselves they seek external validation. But there will never be enough. His work is to re-connect with the wounds that created that void. You cannot do that for him.

He said to me tonight that he wishes he could make it right as he was holding back tears

When they say, "What he doesn't know won't hurt him," they most often mean, "what he doesn't know won't hurt me." Right now you are separating, and I respect your decision. You may change your mind. My advice is that the decision to try again should be predicated upon his desire to grow up and accept your needs as equal to his own. His tears are likely (at this point) owing to the idea of losing his biggest supporter (and source of validation) rather than your hurt and pain.

Good luck Alex


Everything can be taken from a man or a woman but one thing: the last of human freedoms to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way.

Posts: 1732 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Southern California
watwasIthinking
New Member
Member # 41002
Default  Posted: 10:45 AM, October 19th (Saturday)

Alex
Stay strong. I can relate to what you are going through. I found out my husband was cheating...again.
This was after I separated myself from him by working in another state for over a year. Every couple of months I would come home and visit. For me, the time away was a self reflect. A time to clear my head, sort out my feelings. I still wanted the family unit. I still wanted him to be my husband. I wanted to hold on. I thought I would grow old with this man. I have been with him for half my life!
I decided to move back home thinking all was well and he had finally got it out of his system. Only disappointment. Needless to say, I've been back a good 2 months now and I just filed for divorce.


Me 41
Jack*ss H 43
2 kiddos 19 & 3
Been together 21 yrs.
Married for 13 yrs.

Posts: 5 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: tx
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 11:16 AM, October 19th (Saturday)

I think you hit the nail on the head. I have always been a huge supporter (as he was for me as well). And I think we are both fearful of losing that. I am so grateful for the posts of other people- it's helping me to see that there are other people in similar situations and that it's normal to be pissed off and still in love. If this was the first and only time it may be different but I need to recognize that his past dictates the future. Now if I could convince my heart of that

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 5:18 PM, October 19th (Saturday)

I bought a book on detachment. So far I don't recognize too much of my behaviors in the stories but I'll keep reading. I did like a line from the book that reads....
We are harming him every time we step in and bring order to the chaos he created

I understand that bc in a way if I just said I forgive- everyone's day can go almost back to normal (but it doesn't last)


Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
painfulpast
Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 5:48 PM, October 19th (Saturday)

Hi Alex, this sounds like a very co-dependent relationship. You feel the need to save him - to make everything right. That isn't your job.

The fact is he is treating you horribly. Each time he does this, you feel less and less. Well, that's probably because each time he does this you feel like you deserve less and less. After all, if you deserved a partner that loved and respected you, he would have stopped, but he hasn't. So, maybe this is just your cross to bear.

Alex, if you can be respectful and loving, then you deserve someone that treats you in the same manner. Right now you are with a very selfish master manipulator. He is only interested in himself and his feelings. The way he is pouting because you're upset proves that. He's saying that you have no right to feel the way you do, and that he is going to treat you poorly until you get over his infidelity. That is horrible Alex, and it's emotionally abusive.

He has cheated 6 times. How many times does he get to cheat before Alex leaves for good? What is the number? It isn't 6, so is it 8? 12? Will Alex never leave? Because if you aren't going to leave, you might as well stop getting upset and bringing it up. He's showing you he won't stop, and you're showing him that's ok.

I'm sorry - I'm sure these comments are not what you're looking for. Unfortunately, saying that he's mean and that 'we're here for you' isn't going to help you. Getting you to realize that this is not normal and that you do not have to accept it is supporting you. Anything else is really helping you stay in an abusive relationship.

Be strong Alex - realize you deserve a better partner. Leave this cheating manipulator and build a real life for yourself.

And what is this man teaching your children? What kind of example is he?


It's so easy to believe someone when they're telling you exactly what you want to hear.....

Posts: 1878 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 9:28 PM, October 19th (Saturday)

I needed to hear that. I appreciate u laying it on the line. I am a great person. I'm a great catch. We had a beautiful relationship but these last few years have broken me down. The hard part is.... If he was a report card he would be all A+ and 1 F. That's the hard part. Thinking of the laughs, the fun, the memories. Wish he could fix what's broken in him but I'm not bending or changing anymore. It doesn't work. U could jump thru flaming hoops and it's still not going to make them faithful. Sad but true.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 4:49 PM, October 20th (Sunday)

So today I was presented with "what do we do now". I decided I'm not ready to make any decisions- he is not staying at the house- I feel like my anger is coming now. I'm so mad that I put my faith in him. I won't do it again.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
nestlee
Member
Member # 39871
Default  Posted: 10:21 AM, October 21st (Monday)

I'm sorry but if your spouse cheated on you a 4 times then there will be a 5th time. I wouldn't bother trying to have a relationship with a serial cheater. Time to kick his ass out . U deserve much better.. Good luck..


A woman needs a man..Like a fish needs a Bycicle.

Posts: 71 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: Canada
AlexFL
Member
Member # 40966
Default  Posted: 6:53 AM, October 22nd (Tuesday)

I understand that abuse comes in many forms. I have been around emotional blackmailers before. Everything I'm going thru with H is identical to last time. I want to believe so badly that this just isn't an impulse and that he can be "fixed" but I see the same conversations happening, the same tears, the same "I can't go to work cause I'm too tired and sad" (our business depends on him being there, last time in his abcence I had to go in and now I'm thinking that I won't go this time. Something has to change. I can't worry about it or I'll crawl right back and try to forgive and forget. Financial ruin is a big one the guilty party can hang over your head. He is doing it in a way that makes him look like the victim but really I think its a controlling action. He is truly devastated. This is all very very hard. I feel like it's not so black and white but the writing is on the wall. I need someone to hear me cause I'm going a little crazy and stressed.

Posts: 146 | Registered: Oct 2013
Topic Posts: 48