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User Topic: 180 vs NC-except-work
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 9:48 PM, March 1st (Saturday)

I was wondering how long before NC breaks the addiction, or at least reduces the desire for contact, with the caveat that I'm still working with/for MM in a small informal office. Then I started wondering what is different between NC-except-work and the 180 that is prescribed for a BS? Because the 180 is alleged to have the side-effect of pulling WS attention back to the BS... not killing the desire for contact.

I guess one difference is that I'm still free to date others? Though I'm not sure this will kill the attraction, seeing as we had reduced contact once before, until my (also single!) coworker-friend started flirting and we went out on some quasi-dates and MM came swooping back in for more attention. This past week my friend was again hovering around my desk and we went out for coffees, a lunch, and a movie on Friday night. He's actually a great friend, has been so sweet and supportive, the one person to tell me "for what it's worth I think you did the right thing," and I figure it is good to keep busy rather than sit at home and miss MM, so it's not like I should avoid him right?


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
Brandon808
Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 11:30 PM, March 1st (Saturday)

Because the 180 is alleged to have the side-effect of pulling WS attention back to the BS... not killing the desire for contact.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. It doesn''t pull the WS back to the BS as much as make the WS acutely aware they no longer have the attention from the BS they have grown accustomed to. This can serve as a wake-up call for WS.

I think in your case detachment is the ultimate goal. The 180 is about focusing on yourself. In a sense that''s what you need. However, the difference is that the goal is for permanent NC.

I think spending time with that friend is a good idea. He is aware of the situation with MM so he knows what the score is, right?


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3882 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
Skan
Member
Member # 35812
Default  Posted: 11:09 AM, March 2nd (Sunday)

The purpose of the 180 is for the person performing it to detach from another person. It is not to bring that person back, it is not to punish the other person. It is to allow enough detachment to be able to discern what you need, what is healthy for you, and to "step away" from the person that you''re attached to. The focus is solely on your needs.

NC is to break the other person''s attachment to you and to keep you from engaging with an unhealthy person in an unhealthy way. It''s to set up barricades between you and the other person so that you are not harmed again, sucked back into their sphere of influence/drama, and to keep in place healthy barriers.

Yes, they have some cross-over, however it''s the focus that is the difference, if you will. IMO, of course.


Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012



Posts: 4857 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 11:13 AM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Yep, my friend has known what's gone on all along, ever since I gave him a ride to a group dinner and he pointed out "it is obvious" and I was happy to tell him the truth. We only hired him one year ago, so after the affair had started, so that's been the context all along.

Of course he's a little imp, last week specifically left a chair open next to me for MM to sit between us, the better to amuse himself with the drama. And in retrospect it may also have been his influence that resulted in me leading yoga practice for him and some other guys directly outside MM's office, and of course MM decided to stay late to watch... but hey, he's 22, can't expect too much maturity right?


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
Kelany
Member
Member # 34755
Default  Posted: 12:05 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

1. You could have switched chairs.

2. You did not have to lead yoga in front of the mm.

You too are still playing games. You CAN shut it down. You don't have to be the office joke. You CAN be the mature one. Take personal responsibility.

I would find another job. It's too tempting.


BS - Me
SA/FWH Him
DDay 1 - Jul 11
DDay 2 - Jul 12
R Dec 12

Former 80s Icon wishful thinking


Posts: 2031 | Registered: Feb 2012
Kelany
Member
Member # 34755
Default  Posted: 12:16 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

I just read your latest thread in WS.

You can not be friends with this MM. It's not possible. You already said you tried ending it before but went back to him.

You can't have an affectionate friendship. You need to have boundaries. You helped destroy his marriage. He used you for a side piece. He's not friend, he's not an upstanding, trustworthy person. Why would you want a friend like this?

And the 22 year old, just using you for fun drama? Again, why do you need a friend like that?

Boundaries, work on you, so you can respect and love yourself.


BS - Me
SA/FWH Him
DDay 1 - Jul 11
DDay 2 - Jul 12
R Dec 12

Former 80s Icon wishful thinking


Posts: 2031 | Registered: Feb 2012
Brandon808
Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 12:21 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Then I have to retract what I said. This takes too much amusement in stirring up trouble simply for its own sake. If he sat between you and MM then I would feel differently. I don''t think maturity alone covers it. I certainly knew plenty of people in their twenties who would have encouraged NC and ending the A


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3882 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
painfulpast
Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 1:38 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Well, forgive me, but you did say you told his wife, so my guess is he may need to find another job. This might solve these issues all together.

I assume he's an engineer like yourself (from another thread - again, sorry). If so, he should be able to find work soon enough. How long has he been with the firm you're with? I'm sure they'll give him a good reference.

Meanwhile, I would actually suggest full NC. You've mentioned that basically everyone at your office knows, so just tell your boss (the owner, not MM) that you would rather not be on projects he's working on. Don't sit near him. No more anything outside his window.

It's not a difficult as it seems. If you've told his wife, then just imagine the hell that is happening in her head, and her life. You felt badly for her, so just think of her.

Sorry you're fighting this. Hopefully, he'll be gone soon.


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1893 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
Mrs Panda
Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 2:17 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

In an office full of men...you have already had sex with one of them...

You are having impromptu Yoga class in front of MM office?

How do you expect to be respected as an intelligent female when the men are probably taking bets on who can bed you next?

You continue to disrespect his wife by having any contact with this man.

You comment on your friend's maturity. Look in the mirror.


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1986 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
Deeply Scared
Administrator
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 7:08 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Moving to the WS forum


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 197957 | Registered: May 2002
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 9:02 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Well the yoga was planned, I'd been pushing my other friend to give it a try - as in, go to a class by himself - because he has a lot of aches and pains and inflexibility. He eventually approached me and asked me to teach him instead, because a class would be too intimidating... and the only place we could agree to practice was at work afterhours. Then the only space large enough, one 22yr old friend invited himself and another of his friends to join, was directly outside MM's office. It kind of spiraled out of control, I'd thought we could use a workroom, but with 4 people there wasn't enough open floor space. Anyway this was a month or so ago, while the affair was still ongoing.

Also I am fine with a reputation as a slut. I like sex, don't believe in any religion, and I'm single- not cheating on someone I love. If people want to judge based on their own moral values, that's fine, but they aren't my values so I don't care and it's not an effective way to pressure me to change.


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
sunnyrain
Member
Member # 30164
Default  Posted: 9:32 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Okay, so you are good being the office slut. Got it.

What is your goal in regards to AP?


"I'm not much into health food, I am into champagne."

Posts: 389 | Registered: Nov 2010
authenticnow
Moderator
Member # 16024
Default  Posted: 9:35 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Posting as a member-

Also I am fine with a reputation as a slut. I like sex, don't believe in any religion, and I'm single- not cheating on someone I love. If people want to judge based on their own moral values, that's fine, but they aren't my values so I don't care and it's not an effective way to pressure me to change
What are you looking for here, then? People usually come on here trying to make positive changes in their life.

You seem fine with what's going on and comfortable with your moral code. Why join an infidelity site? What type of support are you looking for?


Take up your space (and do it well).

"That's the thing about pain, it demands to be felt."


Posts: 37755 | Registered: Sep 2007
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 9:46 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

What are you looking for here, then? People usually come on here trying to make positive changes in their life.You seem fine with what's going on and comfortable with your moral code. Why join an infidelity site? What type of support are you looking for?

I joined the site when considering how to end the affair and whether to disclose to his BS. This is the first time I've been involved with a married man, and I don't want to get involved with another one!! Also I was hoping for advice on how to work side-by-side with MM, seeing as I don't want to leave and apparently neither does he. None of that requires that I stop openly honestly dating multiple also-single men.


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
authenticnow
Moderator
Member # 16024
Default  Posted: 9:52 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

I understand, thank you for the explanation.

My opinion is that you are enjoying messing with MM and eventually it will lead you back to the A, unless you change your mindset. It sounds like it's a bit of a game to you.


Take up your space (and do it well).

"That's the thing about pain, it demands to be felt."


Posts: 37755 | Registered: Sep 2007
sunnyrain
Member
Member # 30164
Default  Posted: 10:01 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

by 210012:hoping for advice on how to work side-by-side with MM,

Business appropriate, bare minimum contact.

Take the yoga lessons to a neutral site away from the office.

Keep your private life (dates, flirting, etc) PRIVATE.

Continue to work on and improve your body language.

Refrain from discussing your prior R with AP at the office or with co-workers.


"I'm not much into health food, I am into champagne."

Posts: 389 | Registered: Nov 2010
StillLivin
Member
Member # 40229
Default  Posted: 10:16 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

210012,
Regardless of your moral compass or your lack of concern for whether people view you as a slut, you should be concerned about your lack of professionalism.
In a mostly male dominated arena, it is imperative that you create the image of utmost professionalism.
Whatever your sexual prowess is outside of the work place, it needs not to be discussed by the gossips at work. The best way to do that is to have rules about what you will and won't do with co-workers. Most places also have strict no fraternization laws.
Honey, this can affect your future employment (i.e. future references), as well as the possibility for promotion at work currently. If the people you work with and for don't take you seriously, it WILL affect your opportunities and possibly your employment status at your organization.
Rule of thumb,
No sex with co workers or bosses
No discussion about sex life with fellow co workers and bosses
No flirting or other sexual games in the work place
No innuendo or inappropriate (sexual) conversations in the work place

You are young, by all means, go and have fun. Just don't have fun with the fellow workers or they will be laughing at you behind your back.
As for the "friend" that wanted to see the drama, drop him. He is NOT a friend. A true friend has your back and will oftentimes tell you what you need to hear and not what you want to hear.
Him putting a seat for the MM next to you, so not cool at all. Matter of fact, sounds like he is laughing at you and the MM. He is a drama queen, he should have left that crap in H.S. He is screwing around with peoples lives. Bet the BS wouldn't want to see that nonsense.


I don't need further confirmation of what a fuckwit he is. I already have plenty, thanks very much. -SBB
D: 7/2/2014

Posts: 2263 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: AZ
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 10:31 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

Refrain from discussing your prior R with AP at the office or with co-workers

The rest of your advice makes sense, but this one surprises me! Things I've read suggested that an affair should be widely disclosed to kill it and that one of the reasons affairs are addictive is the secrecy?


My opinion is that you are enjoying messing with MM and eventually it will lead you back to the A, unless you change your mindset. It sounds like it's a bit of a game to you. 

I hope not... I realize I've spent quite a bit of mental energy on him recently, but I only ended it one week ago and I'm still trying to adjust to the new reality at work. The affair lasted for a year and a half, including several months when his wife went abroad and he spent a lot of time with me - this wasn't some meaningless fling (that would have been much easier to resist!).


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
sunnyrain
Member
Member # 30164
Default  Posted: 10:37 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

210012: Things I've read suggested that an affair should be widely disclosed to kill it and that one of the reasons affairs are addictive is the secrecy?

The A has already been exposed to his wife and around the office. No reason to talk about it in the office if you are attempting to tame things between you and AP.

Talk here, talk to a neutral (non-work) friend, talk to your mother or sister, talk to an IC, just keep it out of the office.


"I'm not much into health food, I am into champagne."

Posts: 389 | Registered: Nov 2010
painfulpast
Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 11:14 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

210012,

How long has AP been married? Is there a chance his wife will leave him? If not, do you think he may need to find another place of employment, as I mentioned previously?

I'm just wondering really about the length of their relationship and if they have kids. How easy would it be for her to leave?


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1893 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
210012
New Member
Member # 42052
Default  Posted: 11:45 PM, March 2nd (Sunday)

How long has AP been married? Is there a chance his wife will leave him? If not, do you think he may need to find another place of employment, as I mentioned previously?I'm just wondering really about the length of their relationship and if they have kids. How easy would it be for her to leave?

I'm not sure how she will react and have mostly tried not to think about it since I shouldn't care anymore... but since you asked...

She's a foreign bride, he met her while visiting extended family there, I believe she has a greencard but not a citizen. She stays home with their two kids, though he has been pressuring her to go back to work (idk why, didn't pursue that topic, seemed like meddling to discuss it with him). They sold their previous condo and are living in a rental right now while home shopping. This is one of the factors that made me feel guilty, reading posts here where the BS wished they'd known the truth before making certain decisions that would make it harder to leave.

A mutual friend who knows all that's gone on believes she will leave him in an instant, that their marriage has a lot of conflict rather than emotional intimacy and that their culture would see staying as shameful. Knowing him, I don't see him being capable of what is prescribed for R- he has controlling tendencies and likes to be right (mitigated between us by the fact that he somehow convinced himself I'm smarter than him, lol!). He has also lied to her about many things before / unrelated to the affair, and he resents being limited or told what to do. I do think he controls all financial decisions and would tell her he can't find another job, if he wants to stay on for whatever reason.

Personally I can see it going either way, and can see there's a lot of mess that won't be resolved overnight regardless. So I figure either way I don't want to be involved in the aftermath until/ unless he's cleanly separated from her. He was married once before, and divorced within a few years with no kids, but I know it weighs on him that he's on his second marriage already.


Posts: 40 | Registered: Jan 2014
BrokenButTrying
Member
Member # 42111
Default  Posted: 1:47 AM, March 3rd (Monday)

The affair lasted for a year and a half, including several months when his wife went abroad and he spent a lot of time with me - this wasn't some meaningless fling (that would have been much easier to resist!).

Gently, I disagree.
He was a MM, for a year and a half he lied to you. If he was serious about you in any way he would have left his wife before anything happened between the two of you. The reality is, he was cake eating. He wanted his marriage and you on the side, the best of both worlds. Any feelings he had for you in those 18 months were not real. They were all part of the fantasy of the affair.

For your own sake, you need to let this guy go. He may be in your office but it is not beyond you to behave in a professional manner. Disengage from him and become indifferent.


Me - 27
Him - 27
Madhatters

My Ddays - 01/10 & 12/04/14
His Dday - 23/12/13

Chin up. Unwavering. Fight. I can do this.


Posts: 1235 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: UK
Stillstings
Member
Member # 36549
Default  Posted: 3:29 AM, March 3rd (Monday)

I used to travel a lot for work and that neither made myself nor DH single or not married. He didn't get to have a fling while staying in state and neither did I half way across the country.

Word of advice. Don't shit where you eat. Workplace cheating is so messy it isn't worth it. Especially when everyone else knows.


Love yourself. You're worth it. Face your self. You need to do it.

Posts: 365 | Registered: Aug 2012
Mrs Panda
Member
Member # 27303
Default  Posted: 6:45 AM, March 3rd (Monday)

. This is the first time I've been involved with a married man, and I don't want to get involved with another one!!

If I am not mistaken, in a previous post you said you have been the OW to "taken" men before.

I think that your claim to enjoy being a "slut" is bullshit. I think many women convince themselves that they are fun and free and easy and sex is just sex. Free spirits!

That's fine and good. But eventually you may tire of being not taken seriously, not having a real R, always being the ONS but never the girlfriend, being the OW, the mistress, the joke.

I guess I am worried that you feel like this is the way to feel valued or to get attention. You have admitted to a pattern of behavior that suggests a lack of confidence...and perhaps you deliberately go overboard with men to prove yourself.

So I guess I would ask you to really think about your behavior and how you act towards men, and are you truly ok with that?

Even if you are truly OK with your behavior now, you may change your mind later.

I would caution you about these men in your office. If you present yourself as easy, they will see you like that.

You are smart, you are an engineer. Don't you want to be respected at work?

[This message edited by Mrs Panda at 6:58 AM, March 3rd (Monday)]


Me-41 FWW Him-45BH
M 13years. Reconciled.
DDay#1 Nov 2008 (OM2)
DDay#2 Aug 2009 (Confessed to OM 2001)
"Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand." -Kurt Vonnegut

Posts: 1986 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: The SouthEast
Topic Posts: 24