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Reconciliation
User Topic: How well do u know OW?
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 7:11 AM, July 11th (Friday)

My therapist said my situation is one of the "worst" affairs she's seen as the OW was my friend, lives in town, and is son's friend's mom.
We know each other's families( parents, inlaws, colleagues, etc). I've spent thanksgiving Easter, Xmas with them.

She said she's only seen one worse- clergyman at church whose wife in clergy had affair w another clergyman. Entire congregation knew, kids knew, etc

Our kids do not know. Her H and family does not know. Ours doesn't either. Just a few of my friends know. I've kept it to myself bc of kids. Mine and hers.

Bc of the "connections" recovery will be challenging, therapist says.
It sure is. Every day I'm hit in the face with ten reminders. But I'm ok. I'm pushing thru


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
struggling3
Member
Member # 34671
Default  Posted: 7:18 AM, July 11th (Friday)

I don't have any good advice for you except to hold your head high and try to breathe. I know it is hard...and honestly I couldn't imagine dealing with that anxiety. Remember that you are a much better person and she is a POS that couldn't keep her hands off another friend's husband. I have never come face to face with OW...they work in the same building over an hour away from my house. The thought of it turns my stomach. You will do good. Best of luck to you!!


Me - BS 55
H - WS 57/very remorseful and supportive
Kids 29, 26, 22
D-Day 8-5-11
discovered 4 month long EA
R - slow and steady but very optimistic

Posts: 319 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: New Jersey
blakesteele
Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 7:23 AM, July 11th (Friday)

(((Hatemyhusband)))

I am so saddened when I read about OW/OM that were "friends of the family".

Though we live in a small town, My wife's OM is fairly "unto himself". I only knew of him pre-A because he is a joint owner in a small business. Which is more or less how their affair launched.

Several times I question our decision to stay in this area....

I can't say I feel your pain as I don't know the pain of double betrayal, others will be along soon enough to authentically empathize with you. I would ask if moving is an option?

I am torn......some of my triggers I felt I had to physically go to and face head on.....others I can heal from mentally going there.

In your sitch......I just don't know how people should process through it.

Dang.....not much wisdom from me. Prayed a prayer for you all right now.

God is with us all.


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4008 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
rachelc
Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 7:23 AM, July 11th (Friday)

Her H and family does not know.

why doesn't her husband know? It helps to have another set of eyes on things in the beginning.

This is horrible, the double betrayal.

I didn't have that but yesterday experienced about 18 triggers. They're like little zings. I'm tired of it. I hope you find peace.

[This message edited by rachelc at 7:24 AM, July 11th (Friday)]


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5281 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
SI Staff
Moderator
Member # 10
Red  Posted: 8:15 AM, July 11th (Friday)

Struggling3,

Please remember that there is no OW namecalling in the Reconciliation Forum.

Thank you.


Posts: 10000 | Registered: May 2002
Neverwudaguessed
Member
Member # 41884
Default  Posted: 8:29 AM, July 11th (Friday)

I am feeling so much for you right now. I was not even current friends with the AP, but she was a "friend" during my teenage years. I knew her sisters and parents, and she new mine. I have adds from her expressing her feelings of gratitude for our friendship. This person lives in our town, has a business in our town and is still friends with my mother in law. My counselor revisits the idea of us moving every other week since I see her daily driving around etc. We are torn because our children are settled here. They are secure and happy. We have family here and my sister is expecting a baby. Additionally, I have a poor attitude about it. I feel like I should not have to give up what I love because of her. This is so shortsighted really, and I know I still have work to do around this. It really does make reconciliation more complicated because there is NO distance. I cannot imagine having the children around as reminders too. My IC says that ours is one of the toughest affair stories she has come across as well, for other reasons which involve my mother in law and my husband's childhood, but I can relate to the weightiness of such a statement made by a professional. It is sobering for sure. But this CAN be done; you, i and everyone else here in Reconcilication with similar stories are proof that, while it may be harder, it can be worked through. I am sorry that you have to go through a terrible situation with this additional stress. It does suck… ((hatemyhusband))


BW: 44 Me
WH:48
DDay1 9-9-13 (18th Wedding Anniversary) 6 wk EA, 1 wk PA
DDay2: 10-25-13 EA/PA with same OW 12 1/2 years ago for 3 months
OW: XGF Predator who never stopped pursuing WH
DS 13
DD 11

Posts: 645 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: New York
bionicgal
Member
Member # 39803
Default  Posted: 9:12 AM, July 11th (Friday)

The AP and her husband were our closest couple friends, and they live less than 10 blocks from us. We'd known them for about 7 years, but were close for perhaps the last two. While I was better friends with her than my husband was with her OBS, we were not close "girlfriends," per se. But, I obviously thought she cared for my family, that she would protect my family, and I certainly did hers. Losing one of her sons in my life was one of the saddest parts of the affair, as I truly loved him.

We spent countless hours with them, go to the same church, go to the same gym (and gym classes), our kids were friends, we looked after each other's houses while on vacation, etc., etc. We were even planning a vacation together.

But, this is a pretty common story. I am surprised that your therapist even blinks an eye at it.

For me, it has been insidious in the fact that we cared for them, and I knew that she and her husband had real affection for my husband, and I encouraged it & took a lot of pleasure in that. I didn't know that she had had a crush on him for years, and that when she saw a weak moment for him (bad time career-wise, personally, and in our marriage) that she'd pounce like a feral cat. (ha.) I didn't know that he was so desperate for an ego boost that he'd become infatuated with someone he had never had an attraction to when she started flattering him, and making him feel "understood." I thought we were just close friends, acting like a support for each other. And really, we were. The affair was just two broken folks who had a radar out for broken, and when they needed a selfish escape, they acted on it. It is crazy making, because my husband kept thinking that because we were friends, she must be "like me." After the affair, he could point to almost nothing he liked or admired about her.

I will say this - I do not miss her. I realized after this happened, that she was really just a good mirror. She reflects those around her, but there is no real substance there. She is narcissistic, and not a good friend, wife or mother. She is likely an alcoholic, and I just hope every day that her kids have a fighting chance. I realized that our friendship with them, while a lot of fun, was pretty surface. I thought we had this great connection, but it was always fueled by a bottle of wine and snarky gossip about mutual friends/acquaintances, and picking on my husband. I miss talking music and books with her OBS, but at a year out, I mostly don't miss them in my lives, and really came to the realization this week that she was no friend of mine, ever really.

And seeing her is getting easier. I see her a few times a month, I guess. I don't go out of my way to avoid her, but I haven't had to come face to face with her in a small setting, yet. Think of each viewing as an innoculation -- making you stronger. She only has the power over you that you let her have.

Our kids know we are not friends with them any more, but not why. (Which has turned into more of a mystery than I'd like. My 10 year old presses me on the "why" all the time. ) He has a sense it has to do with her as she has snubbed him a few times (b&tc%!!) while the OBS is always very nice to him.

I am sorry the OBS doesn't know in your case. I couldn't handle that, myself. We actually met one day about a month after dday - kind of for closure. It was sad, but I am glad we did it.

I hope for peace for you - it does get easier.


[This message edited by bionicgal at 9:38 AM, July 11th (Friday)]


me - BS (40s)
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months, EA then PA
In MC & Reconciling
An affair is a personal crisis, not a relationship.

I edit, therefore I am.


Posts: 2065 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: USA
karmahappens
Member
Member # 35846
Default  Posted: 10:06 AM, July 11th (Friday)

Its actually very common. We were friends... our families were friends.

Our kIds know now and have cut all ties with them.

It's a special hurt the double betrayal. ... infiltrates everything.

(((Hugs)))


“And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom”
Anaïs Nin
Me: 45
Him: 47
Dday 8/2007
We have R'd

Posts: 3846 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: Massachusetts
myeverafter
Member
Member # 41012
Default  Posted: 10:08 AM, July 11th (Friday)

OW was fWH's coworker, but was also my best friend here. Also her BS considered fWH his best friend. And we hung out as couples.

We all hung out together. We had all went on a big family vacation with them the month before DD. The guys had also gone a guys trip with some other guys while the affair was going on. I was thinking of talking to fWH about having OW and her BS be listed as guardians of our kids if something ever happened to us.

I am so THANKfUL that we live in a big enough town and we live on the opposite side of town as OW and her family. OW and fWH are now on opposite shifts also. I am still sort of waiting/scared of when we run into them again... I pray that that I don't have the kids when that happens. They all loved OW and her BS...


Me - BW 35
Him - fWH 37
D-Day: 7/13
2 yr EA; 8 mo PA.

Posts: 86 | Registered: Oct 2013
KeepCalm_CarryOn
Member
Member # 33374
Default  Posted: 10:14 AM, July 11th (Friday)

Add us to the "best friends" list. We hung out literally every weekend. Her kids called me aunt, I was at their births.

But to answer the "real" question, I guess I didn't know her that well. I never dreamed she would do this to me, her H and her kids. I *thought* she was a good person, a little young and immature, yes, but never THIS.

I think you need to tell her H. It is better to have two sets of eyes watching the situation than just yours. In our situation it never would have worked to not tell. My FWH called OBS the day he told me and blew the lid off of everything. No more secrets, no more lies.


You are not dealing with rational people or situations. Normal thought processes won't work...story of my life.

Me- BW, 28
Him- fWh, 34
Mostly R'd, minus a few scars...bought a house and got a puppy...And baby makes 3! She arrived August


Posts: 2030 | Registered: Sep 2011
2married2quit
Member
Member # 36555
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, July 11th (Friday)

I feel your pain.

My FWW's OM was a friend of mine and hers. She's worked together with him and so have I. We became pretty good friends through the years and I never had reason not to trust. At least no reason that I knew of.


BS - Me 43 WS - Her 41
DDAY - June 2012 (found the texts)
DDAY2 - Next Day (found out who) EA
TT- till 9/2012 (some PA)
Married 20yrs. 2kids
Status: in careful R. Sometimes spinning our wheels

Posts: 1397 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: USA
2married2quit
Member
Member # 36555
Default  Posted: 10:27 AM, July 11th (Friday)

BTW - My therapist said the same. In cases where OM/OW are a friend, it is horrible.


BS - Me 43 WS - Her 41
DDAY - June 2012 (found the texts)
DDAY2 - Next Day (found out who) EA
TT- till 9/2012 (some PA)
Married 20yrs. 2kids
Status: in careful R. Sometimes spinning our wheels

Posts: 1397 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: USA
blakesteele
Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 10:40 AM, July 11th (Friday)

But, I obviously thought she cared for my family, that she would protect my family, and I certainly did hers.

And this what I think is why I have it "easier" without the double betrayal.

7 kids have been hurt by the affair that is a part of our life now. I don't think I am minimizing when I say I have it "easier" because my wife did not know his kids, nor did he know ours....that our familys knew nothing of each other prior to their choices.

A trigger for me was our family dog.....they walked with her in the park 1 block from our house. He snuggled and played with her. It is extremely painful to think about even 2 years out. And that is how I feel about a DOG!

A thought.......


Flip side of this.......how painful is this for the wayward to have to face? In your sitch Hatemyhusband, your husband must deal with the fact that he destroyed a family he bonded with too. Or maybe better said....the fact remains he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its intirety is up to him. But the pain of his choices is within him NOW....he may turn a blind eye to it, but pain is within him. Like playing hide and seek with a baby...the baby puts a napkin over his face and thinks he's hidden! I know it was his choice...but the fact must be he is struggling hard with this pain too....consciously or subconciously. More so than a wayward who never really "knew" the other family.....right?

Yes, I know my wife knew he had 5 kids...OM knew my wife had 2 daughters. (their physical affair would start after dropping respective kids off at school and stop after picking them up) But there is a very big difference between "knowing of" and "knowing them".

ugh........

Pain all around.


I don't know if it helps....but this pain that you are feeling? The painful fact that even innocent children where no match for temptation and sinful desire? It was helpful in IC for me to own the truth that my wife and the OM never shared love for each other...if they had they would not have been so eager to help each other destroy so much, including parts of themselves.

My wife not knowing his wife or his kids, him not knowing our girls or me....would actually make adultery easier for them. "Kids are resilient" would be an easier thought for them since the kids remain "surface level" in identity. This would help the wayward in this sitch as they thought thoughts such as "This is my soul mate...wouldn't it be better to be married to him and model this relationship for my girls than the dreadful, dead one I am stuck in with my original man?"

The ADDED "deterrent" in your sitch, hatemyhusband, of both waywards intimately knowing all affected was not even strong enough to get your husband to find the courage to search out his "whys" as to his own thoughts, feelings and actions.

It is quite the opposite of him thinking "she is all that and a bag of popcorn".....quite the contrary, IMO. His brokenness and pain is so tremendous that he actually sacrificied MORE to get his "fix" than I did. OW is NOT a factor in your husbands choice to commit adultery. She was available...end of story.

REMEMBER: Adultery is first and foremost sin. Sin, by its nature, is singularly selfish. Even if done in group settings.....it comes down to personal choice as to how they feed their personal desires. The first lie that is told for sin to be chosen is one the person choosing to sin tells themselves. I know....I am "that guy".

Please please please keep that thought present in your mind. I could see the temptation to think really bad, untrue thoughts in your sitch....believe her egg salad was better than yours and thats why your husband choose her over you. It is NOT THAT WAY. He choose as he did because of how he was coping with life....not out of a choice to love the OW.


This painful fact also helped me own that nothing I could have done would have deterred my wife from harvesting the fruit she was so intent on growing. Couldn't have chose to love her better, more sex, nicer car, date nights, fun, excitment.....nothing could have deterred her from her path outside of something from within her.


This is one of the reasons it is so critical for a WS to aggresively search for and work through all of their "whys". If they are interested in accepting R, it is equally important to share that journey with their BS. It appears most waywards cope with life by concealing and hiding from it. The fact that they were able to do so all the way into adultery speaks to just how much of a challenge they have laid before them.

I pray Mr. Hatemyhusband is sharing his journey with you.

God is with us all.

[This message edited by blakesteele at 10:45 AM, July 11th (Friday)]


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4008 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 1:13 PM, July 11th (Friday)

I chose not to tell OW's husband bc of a few factors, but mostly the children. Mine and hers. I can not assume he'd remain calm, not flip on my H and his W causing her kids to hear details and mine. Sorry, it's not worth it to me. My H and my "friend" has sex in her classroom after school let out. She teaches in town. Her moms, sisters, his job sites.
Too much info that could hurt my kids and hers. Although it would be justified she'd deal w huge fall out, I'll let her live w guilt and wonder if and when I will sell her out.

I've instructed her to avoid me and H and each time I run into her face to face, I will share her info with one person of my choice in town. (7 mo and she missed parties, dropped our gym, skips school functions). So far, I don't ever see her

Her H has cheating, drug and drinking issues. He's a loose cannon. I don't need the drama. Let them cheat on each other but stay away from my family

The "other set of eyes" advice I question. Why do I want anyone stopping my H from an A or starting again? He chooses this, he's gone. He wants that, he's gone. He can have it. I don't want anyone w me that wants to be elsewhere

I'm strong. It is easier to move but I live two mins from works. My kids are excelling in school. I love my town. I'm never sacrificing what I dreamt ---for him, her or the fall out of the A. Not an option. I'll force her out before that occurs, by telling her school her nastiness.

My H chose this path for 2 years. My friend chose to bait him, use me and set this up. He allowed himself to be tangled in her web. I warned him she was having a crisis and distanced myself from her. She hated I called her out on inappropriate behavior and worked my H to turn against me.

Now, she holds no power. I do. He sold her out on DD, giving me every dirty perverted detail. He spilled lots that he didn't need to. After confronting her and letting her know I know the level of low she stooped to, and all she could lose, she got the pic loud and clear.

Lastly, I permitted her to contact my husband whenever she felt like it bc the day he takes the call, the day our M is over and I no longer play the nice way.

[This message edited by Hatemyhusband at 3:51 PM, July 11th (Friday)]


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
Sunnydaysahead
Member
Member # 43756
Default  Posted: 1:24 PM, July 11th (Friday)

I admire your strength!!! I like your way of keeping the OW away from you.....that is a great tactic.

The OW in my situation is a co-worker of H. I worked at same company in a different division and knew her for years. Luckily I have moved on and don't have to see her anymore on a regular basis.


Posts: 63 | Registered: Jun 2014
julesinpain
Member
Member # 36746
Default  Posted: 1:33 PM, July 11th (Friday)

I knew her really well!! I thought she was my friend. I babysat her kids for her 100% free, while she worked!! Little did I know right after she drop her kids off with me, she was contacting my husband. SICK!! I would encourage others to invite her to parties when they didn't want to because she was "obnoxious" but I encouraged because I thought she was my friend. Little did I know she was doing inappropriate things with my husband when they would pass in the hallways at these parties. SICK!! Our families did a lot together!! Our kids were really good friends!

She chased my husband full force and he fell for her crap!! I saw red flags, ignored at first then investigated and discovered! It took my WH a long, long very painful time to come clean. I still to this day do not have the whole story. I choose to move on! I had to get her out of my head!

She was never sorry, remorseful and treated me bad, after all I did for her! I still have to see her sometimes. I pretend she doesn't exists as best I can, as does my husband! She is still trying to get his attention when we end up in the same place. When we are around she talks extra loud and turns around in her seat constantly starring our way. She is hard to pretend to miss sometimes, as she is a very loud and look at me type person.

The good thing, when she is around (and other times) my husband is so loving and touchy and sweet. Always holding my hand or putting his arm around me. He makes me feel so loved now a days whether she is around or not! When she turns around in her seat she gets to see how well we are healing and how loving we are to each other. This makes me feel good!! She can watch all she wants!!


Me 44
WH 46
DDay 1 8/22/08
DDay 2 9/22/10
DDay 3 12/22/10 same OW each time. (so called friend)
To many TT's to count, last one Jan. 2013 ugh!
Married 21 years, together 23
4 amazing children, 2DS 2DD
Working on it!

Posts: 153 | Registered: Sep 2012
somethingremorse
Member
Member # 42047
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, July 11th (Friday)

WH here --

Flip side of this.......how painful is this for the wayward to have to face? In your sitch Hatemyhusband, your husband must deal with the fact that he destroyed a family he bonded with too. Or maybe better said....the fact remains he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its entirety is up to him.

This is true for me. I don't know if it adds to the discussion, but I wanted to let blakesteele know he's right on the mark.

If I was willing to risk my BW, my M and my kids, destroying the life of another family came pretty easy. I hurt so many people that are close to me, people who have taken me in as family.


Me: WH (42)
DDay 11/03/13
In MC and IC

Posts: 633 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: Pennsylvania
rachelc
Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 2:40 PM, July 11th (Friday)

he helped the OW destroy parts of his family and he knows that at some level, whether he finds the courage to face and own that fact in its entirety is up to him.

t/j: there's no way my WS has even considered this. He looked blank when I asked him about it.

so then what?

Sigh...I have so far to go on this topic.


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5281 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
mozzchops
Member
Member # 42896
Default  Posted: 2:42 PM, July 11th (Friday)


I knew him very well. Went on weekends away together.
Even Had a holiday booked, 6 weeks before I found them.

I was even going to be sat next to him on the plane!
Lives on the same street, 2 houses away. Walk to school every day.

Its just horrible, a special kind of horrible.



The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them.

Posts: 118 | Registered: Mar 2014
rachelc
Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 2:52 PM, July 11th (Friday)

mmozzchops and others with these types of betrayals - hugs! And i'm so sorry...


his Dday: 2/10 but TT until 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

“Follow your intuition. Be smart, be brave. Tell the truth and don’t take any shit.”


Posts: 5281 | Registered: Dec 2010 | From: Midwest
blakesteele
Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 2:58 PM, July 11th (Friday)

(((somethingremorse)))

Thanks for responding. I knew I was correct...not because of being a wayward or your confirming post, but by being human. I know of some of my "whys" behind my sins....this is how I know what I spoke of and what you embraced is true.

Hopefully you know the diffence between being condemned and being convicted. Know it FULLY....heart and mind.

Rachelc....hang in there. My sins are tough tough tough to face....and, while they had the potential to destroy my family as well as other families...they did not. So I expect the struggle within a waywards self is far greater than the ones I struggle with.

Sin is sin...but consequences of various sins are HUGELY variable. Adultery is listed as a grievous sin. The consequences are far reaching.

Keep the faith, Hatemyhusband.....your post is full of pain, but resonates strength!

[This message edited by blakesteele at 3:05 PM, July 11th (Friday)]


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4008 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
Summerluv123
Member
Member # 43876
Default  Posted: 3:08 PM, July 11th (Friday)

Add me to the long list of OW being a good friends. As you can see from my signature there have been 3...yes 3. The first was 15 years ago and was WH's co-worker. The last 2 were in the last 2 years and just last month. The last two hurt the most as one is a neighbor (who I know now is a drug addict/dealer and is also crazy) and the last was one of my very good friends. That one hurts the most.

I truly think the last one was convenient and she came on to him (her BH said she told the same story - plus he cannot have sex due to a health condition). Since my WH is a KISA he was always available to anyone men and women who need his help that is how it started with #2 as well. She said he reminded her of her father - yuk!

You really learn that people are not who you think they are. I told WH that he should go to Hollywood as he is a fantastic actor.


BW - 46 (me)
WH - 47
M - 29 yrs
Together - 30 yrs
2 kids - over 18
3 A's - 2000, 2012 and 6/14
In R (lots of therapy!!)

Posts: 85 | Registered: Jun 2014 | From: Southern US
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 3:59 PM, July 11th (Friday)

Thanks, Something Remorse
And thanks blakesteele.
I get that my H, the AP, must be dealing with pain too. You te so right. At times, when I'm feeling a bit anxious about attending a function bc who we may run into and shoot off "
" u get to walk in and feel fine. I feel anxious" He shared it's tough to watch me and kids feel this way

My kids know something occurred. The don't know exactly but when my 12 year old said "Mom, did that time u almost for D have to do w person X? And h heard, it was hard on us all.
I told him it did, that X crossed he line w dad. My son said " I knew it. She was always trying to cause trouble for u two and jealous"
My husband cried after hearing me and son talking.

Yes. So muh pain. Pain for me. My kids. My husband. Pain

I'm glad her kids are atleast spared the pain mine have been hit with. I'm a better person who actually thinks ahead before I act therefore not going over and grabbing her by throat and telling her H. I know he will explode in front of the kids.


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
painfulpast
Member
Member # 41038
Default  Posted: 4:00 PM, July 11th (Friday)

My therapist said my situation is one of the "worst" affairs she's seen as the OW was my friend, lives in town, and is son's friend's mom.

Forgive me, but how is this information helpful to you? I think based on the responses here, and some of the stories on this site, that your therapist may or may not be experienced in infidelity, but I don't understand how saying something like this to you is helpful, in any way.


She said she's only seen one worse- clergyman at church whose wife in clergy had affair w another clergyman. Entire congregation knew, kids knew, etc

To me, this is comparing pain. Again - where is the help in this? Do you think that the clergyman hurt worse than you? Less? It seems almost gossipy.

The "two sets of eyes" comment - about why would you want someone stopping your H - it's really more about another set of eyes to tell you if your H is at it again. He cheated for 2 years, so he's proven he's willing to lie. If another person is watching on the other side of the A, then it's more difficult to get away with long term.


The stones from my enemies, these wounds will mend
but I cannot survive the roses from my friends

Posts: 1898 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: East Coast
blakesteele
Member
Member # 38044
Default  Posted: 4:52 PM, July 11th (Friday)

Man, that retelling of the convo between you and your son broke my heart. I still get soooo nervous thinking about any time when our daughters will find out about the affair or at a time when my wife and I decide it is prudent to discuss with them....just heart breaking. Mercy and grace to you.

Painfulpast brings up some solid points here.....really look into them. It could affect your healing pathway.

I think based on the responses here, and some of the stories on this site, that your therapist may or may not be experienced in infidelity, but I don't understand how saying something like this to you is helpful, in any way.


I am seeing a christian therapist for my IC sessions. When I shared with her my "hands on sex talk" with my parents....she literally gasped and covered her mouth. Yeah....kinda shocked me. Not to the point of retraction but to the point "Shit, that was f'ed up....wasn't it?" point.

Since I believe it was a one time abuse sitch I am electing to not seek out a CSA specialist.

But I DID make a mistake with choosing my therapist that was seeing me for anxiety issues (during the summer my wifes affair was going on but of which I did not know about) as our MC. She was not an infidelity specialists....and it showed.

Your therapists technique of categorizing your experience, your level of trauma, your pain is very unhealthy. Even if your pain is more or less than anothers.....it matters not. What matters is that this therapist has the skills to lead you to the pain, enable/teach you how to face and release the pain, and come out the other side a better person...meaning more able to process pain and discomfort of all levels and sorts. It appears to me she has the potential to prolong your pain, trip up your ability to process life in healthy ways....almost in a "non-relationship friendly way". Much like I envision a group of relationship-burned people would. Kind of a "Oh sister, I can't BELIEVE he would do that to you!!!" sort of way.


Not for me to decide...just wanted to have you examine a wise nudge from Painfulpast. I have reaped a harvest from such nudging.

God is with us all.

[This message edited by blakesteele at 4:55 PM, July 11th (Friday)]


ME: 42 BH, I don't PM female members
SHE: 38 EA
Married: 15 years
Together: 17 years
D/Day 9-10-12
NC: 10-25-12
NC: Broken early November 2012, OM not respond
2 girls; 7 and 10
Fear is payments on debts you have not

Posts: 4008 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Central Missouri
Allornothing
Member
Member # 42354
Default  Posted: 5:40 PM, July 11th (Friday)

She's right next door. Our families and children were all friends. It was her son and my daughter that walked in on them. I just wish that my hubby had listened when I said that this charismatic, charming person was trouble...


Me- BS 43
Him- FWH 43
Married 19 years, Together 26
Kids- 23,21,15,14
D Day- 7 Sept 2013
OW- Irrelevant

Posts: 190 | Registered: Feb 2014 | From: Australia
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 6:25 PM, July 11th (Friday)

Clarification-- I was explaining to my therapist that a friend said "u love him. He loves u. Make it work. Get over it" and how I responded "it isn't easy. 7 months and I have multiple triggers to tackle a day w living in town she does, passing places of encounters, etc. It's not like he slept w someone in another state once and it doesn't have to be in my face"

My therapist was not comparing pain,
But addressing that an affair with such betrayal, the duration, the people involved, etc will take a long time to heal from. And she stated that this is by far one of worst she has heard of. The clergyman story she shared bc she was telling me how she saw the same- family intertwined BUT religious believes and entire congregation knew about it YET they were able to recover and reconcile. Not so much of a comparison. She was trying to acknowledge it isn't easy, it's ok to take my time, and there is hope

[This message edited by Hatemyhusband at 6:52 PM, July 11th (Friday)]


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
Neverwudaguessed
Member
Member # 41884
Default  Posted: 8:35 AM, July 12th (Saturday)

Regarding the therapist's comment, when my counselor said how difficult my case was, I actually felt a sense of understanding from her just how difficult this was for me. It was like confirmation of why I was struggling so hard to push through this, what complicating factors make such a notoriously difficult situation even tougher. It was not done in a way that made me feel defeated, but more an acknowledgment of the multiple levels of betrayal and the difficulty in having to deal with the intense repeated exposure to those who betrayed me (ex-childhood friend and mother in law, in addition to my husband) with their "in my face" behavior For me, it was validating and helped me to see that there were reasons for my intense struggle.


BW: 44 Me
WH:48
DDay1 9-9-13 (18th Wedding Anniversary) 6 wk EA, 1 wk PA
DDay2: 10-25-13 EA/PA with same OW 12 1/2 years ago for 3 months
OW: XGF Predator who never stopped pursuing WH
DS 13
DD 11

Posts: 645 | Registered: Jan 2014 | From: New York
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 9:01 AM, July 12th (Saturday)

Exactly

Validating the challenge I am experiencing.


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
Ascendant
Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, July 12th (Saturday)

*Raises hand*

OM was one of my good friends. Near-daily text messages, jokes, funny pictures, etc. I helped him get his apartment, talked to the landlord for him when he was having car problems, vented to him about married life, the works.

It sucks.


I keep my mind on my future/and my eyes on the sky/I don't really smile much/If you were there you'd know why.

Posts: 2175 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: City in the Midwest/Best In The Whole Wide World
Furious1
Member
Member # 42970
Default  Posted: 10:51 AM, July 12th (Saturday)

One of the OW was my sister. My WH had a three year affair with her. She is a year older than me and we were very close. My kids knew. Her kids knew. Her BH knew. Everyone knew except me.

It has totally destroyed what little sense of family I had. WH is an only child whose parents and grandparents have all passed away. There are no more family holidays or gatherings of any kind on my side as a direct result of their A.

There is no escaping it for me either. When I run into people I know, no one ever asks me how anyone is my family is doing. I don't go to events that I think my sister might go to. Most of the time, I just stay home.

The grief if tangible. Not only do I grieve the loss of my innocent trust, I also grieve the loss of my family. The affect has been profound in my life.

So yes, I do understand the additional struggle that comes with double betrayal. It sucks.


BW (me): 41 WH (him): 49
Married 18 years. SD: 26 from his 1st. M. DS: 21 from 1st M. DD: 17 (autistic)
D-day: 10/4/13 with ongoing TT (last TT was 10/2/14).
2 OC with 2 different OW. 15 year A with my sister.

Posts: 325 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: United States
TheGarden
Member
Member # 40788
Default  Posted: 11:17 AM, July 12th (Saturday)

Like BionicGal, the OW and her husband were our closest couple friends. The really bad part about my situation is that there is no other BS - the OW's husband was also "in on it" and encouraged his wife to have an affair with my husband.

They were an integral part of our entire social life, and it negatively affected some of our close friendships. The most substantial part of the EA (later PA) started when we were on a vacation together with a bunch of of our mutual friends (renting a beach house on the Outer Banks). While I don't have any reason to believe our other friends knew about what was going on between them during the affair (they worked to hide what they were doing), some of our "friends" still spend significant amounts of time with OW and her husband after the fact. And yes, everybody knows what happened. I outed them all after DDay, and what they did was fairly horrific - they not only wrecked my marriage but also almost torpedoed my Ph.D.. Because we are out of state, we are just letting those friendships fade away rather than cause additional drama, but I have felt pretty betrayed that some of our oldest friends wouldn't take a stand on my behalf or on behalf of our marriage. One thing that I have learned during the infidelity process is just how weak and morally deficient some people are. I have come to the conclusion that there is literally nothing another person could do to me that would be bad enough that certain people would be willing to cause any conflict over it. And that's a shitty realization to have about other human beings who you loved and trusted.

Anyway, we moved out of town a couple of months after DDay - not specifically to avoid OW and her husband, but because I got a really good job in another state. I do not know how we would have made it if we hadn't had the opportunity to move. I think having to worry about running into them at parties, or hearing about them from other people, and having to deliberately alter aspects of our life to deal with their presence would have been a nightmare. I really think it would have undermined the reconciliation process in a big way.

As it is, it is still a very long, hard road putting this marriage back together. And one of my biggest issues is that I am kind of afraid of other people now. We have been here a year, and we have not made a single friend, nor do I even want to (and WH has said he doesn't want to either). When I think about ever inviting another couple into my home again, I want to throw up. I think both of us actually have PTSD about the whole "couple friends" thing now. For me, it's not even just about other women - the OW's husband in my case also betrayed me and was emotionally abusive towards me after DDay. There was no remorse at all from OW or her husband. I never even got an apology from either of them. Over time it's been more difficult to process that than to deal with my husband's betrayal. I still cry frequently thinking about how badly OW treated me during this whole thing. How could I ever trust another friend after everything that has happened?

The double betrayal is one of the worst things anyone can ever go through. It has the potential to destroy a person's faith in other human beings. Not only is your spouse betraying you, but the people you might turn to in a time of crisis are helping him do it, and then other people often fail to stand next to you after the SHTF. And you lose all of your happy memories, pictures, holidays, everything - five entire years of my life are now completely tainted because of my husband's affair with my friend. The whole process is an absolutely cruel and evil thing to do to another human being.

[This message edited by TheGarden at 11:37 AM, July 12th (Saturday)]


Me: BW, 39, Him: WH, 43; married 9 years, together 13 years
DDay:July 2013; EA progressing to a PA
APs: ex-"friend" & her enabling polyamorous husband
Status: Dual-income-no-kids, 2 cats, taking it day-by-day, married till we're not

Posts: 61 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Florida
Angel177
Member
Member # 37274
Default  Posted: 11:24 PM, July 12th (Saturday)

Ow was my friend. We were really close in 2011 and the beginning of 2012....then we drifted apart around the time the affair started....she started spending most of her time with my sister in law and I found the two of them together really irritating and they were ALWAYS together so I just kind of avoided them.

Fwh was obs best friend...best man at the wedding...they had been friends 12 or so years....obs, fwh and I lived together when we were younger then fwh and obs lived together again I'm 2012 when they were away for work. So they were way closer then ow and I but still I confided in her and trusted her....I don't have friends anymore...how can I? I can't trust anyone. It messes you up. I hate her and wish her nothing but a miserable life. Obs and fwh are friends again (obs and ow are divorced) which I have never seen in my 2 years here...it can be awkward. Obs is here 4 or 5 times a month and him and fwh text almost daily again....obs says it is still weird for him at times but I feel like I'm the only one it's weird.I have to leave the room sometimes.

None of us have anything to do with ow.


Me:BS
Him:WH
D-Day Sept. 14/12...R started Dec. 3/12
Together-10 years Married-5 years
Daughter-3
Son-13 months (died July 2, 2014)
Baby #3 due Feb. 2015
4 month EA and 4 month EA/PA in 2012 with my "friend"

Posts: 251 | Registered: Oct 2012
littleflower
Member
Member # 42673
Default  Posted: 8:28 PM, July 13th (Sunday)

I thought I knew the OW
But really I didn't have a clue


DD 13/1/14
Him WH
OW - what a cow
3 kids under 4

Posts: 101 | Registered: Mar 2014
Beautifulmom
Member
Member # 37611
Default  Posted: 9:51 AM, July 14th (Monday)

The OW was my best friend of 14 years. She was my maid of honor and I was hers. Our families went on vacation together, spent holidays together, and her mom always told me that I was part of the family. 3 years before I found out they were having an affair, I started noticing things that made me feel uncomfortable. Just the way they acted together and towards their spouses. The thing is, they both knew me so well. They would both know what to say to make me think that I was at fault for the way I was feeling, when in truth...THEY WERE HAVING AN AFFAIR! I don't think it was malicious as much as it was that they had both decided that really the problem was their spouses, not them, who were at fault.
One day my husband announced that he wanted to throw away his military career and settle down, moving 3 streets away from her, all the way across the country. I thought, Why not? Our kids will grow up like brothers and sisters (thank God they lost the bid on the house right next door to ours!!!).
I remember when I first found out, I yelled at my WH that he had taken HER away from me. The excruciating pain that comes from knowing that the 2 people you trust most in the world think that you deserve to be thrown away like a piece of trash. To me, to do something like that requires a hatred for someone.
The sad part is that now, almost 2 years later and with no contact between either family, everyone is still having to sift through the humongous pile of wreckage from burden OW and WH have left us with. Last week my 5 year old came home with a poster from camp of her favorite things, and under "best friends" she had listed OW's 2 children. She hasn't seen them for almost 2 years and still asks and talks about them. Things like this will always come out of the blue and stab us I suppose, forever and ever.
Almost 2 years, and I see this whole thing (today anyway) as a gift mostly. Never again will I believe that anyone has the right to treat me the way that OW and WH did. I let them treat me that way just because I thought they loved me. It is a gift that she is not in my life anymore (must I explain why?). Most of all, it is a gift that I will see her at the grocery store or at the school where my oldest will start kindergarten or running in the neighborhood and I will hold my head high and know that I survived and that my life is moving upwards. I will be shaking, but she won't know that. And her life? Knowing her, it is probably where it was when I left her, miserable. And trying to get someone else's life or husband will never fix that.


33 years old (Wh and me)
Married 10 years
2 children: 4yo and 1yo
Dday#1 10/28/12
Dday#2 12/24/12 (Merry Christmas)
Affair: 3+ years (as far as I know) w/my best friend of 14 years

Posts: 71 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Beautifulmom
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 11:21 AM, July 14th (Monday)

I'm sorry BeautifulMom. I hear ur pain in ur post. As times moves on, we get stronger. And I'm so much stronger bc if this. I know I can and will take care of myself and kids should DD2 ever arrive or I get to the point where H no longer makes me happy

I have yet to run into her. Just her kids, parents, her naive H. I can't wait for the day she and I are at the same place. I had two "discussions " w her. Days after. I will never cry, yell or make a scene. I'll look her in the eye and hold my head up high and she will get the heck out of my space so fast. I. Can. Not. Wait.


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
sunflowergirl30
Member
Member # 28979
Default  Posted: 10:52 AM, July 15th (Tuesday)

I dont post much anymore. But...I really think its wrong to leave the other betrayed spouse in the dark. He is living a lie. He has a right to know.


Together 21yrs married 18yrs
2 kids, now 19 & 16
Bw: now 38
Wh: now 37
Mow: now 50
1st D-day EA w/mow our realtor 4-?-2007, 2nd D-day PA w/ same mow 5-29-2010

Posts: 1079 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Pacific Northwest
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 11:17 AM, July 15th (Tuesday)

Sunflower, I get it. I get what it felt like to be betrayed and I don't think it would hurt less if I found out from someone or myself. Anyhow, I'm being honest. I care about my kids and my kids only. If her betrayed spouse doesn't know, shame on him. She's out at bars almost every nite. She flirts w every man publicly. She's obnoxious and nasty. And according to her, her husband is a drunk, cheater himself and one mean person.

I'm the first person to call people out for their wrong behavior but quite frankly if protecting my kids from this nitemare costs this chick's husband living a lie, so be it.
I'm not chancing that this man doesn't explode in front of his own kids, mine and the entire town. They are an unstable couple w drugs and alcohol part of their lives

And.. You know what else I would LOVE to do if it wouldn't hurt my kids to hear, out the fact that an elem teacher-her- was screwing my husband in her classroom 15 mins after her students left.

I'd love to protect the other man but not if it hurts my kids or her kids. Not happening She can live with that guilt or no guilt. I don't own that. She does


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
sunflowergirl30
Member
Member # 28979
Default  Posted: 11:30 AM, July 15th (Tuesday)

I dont know the situation. But for me personally...it would matter to me to know that others knew way before I did. If They had the opinion that if I was to dense to figure it out on my own then thats my problem. Im just sayin. I understand that its not up to you to tell the mow's bh. Not my circus, not my monkeys. Just my thoughts.

[This message edited by sunflowergirl30 at 11:49 AM, July 15th (Tuesday)]


Together 21yrs married 18yrs
2 kids, now 19 & 16
Bw: now 38
Wh: now 37
Mow: now 50
1st D-day EA w/mow our realtor 4-?-2007, 2nd D-day PA w/ same mow 5-29-2010

Posts: 1079 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Pacific Northwest
sunflowergirl30
Member
Member # 28979
Default  Posted: 11:43 AM, July 15th (Tuesday)

I know all to well what it feels like to be angry.
I am not trying to argue or say this is how you should do this or that. Im 4 yrs out. I know all to well the damage an affair can have on kids. Everyone handles it differently. Thats all I'm saying.


Together 21yrs married 18yrs
2 kids, now 19 & 16
Bw: now 38
Wh: now 37
Mow: now 50
1st D-day EA w/mow our realtor 4-?-2007, 2nd D-day PA w/ same mow 5-29-2010

Posts: 1079 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Pacific Northwest
Hatemyhusband
Member
Member # 41633
Default  Posted: 1:59 PM, July 15th (Tuesday)

Believe me, if I didn't have kids who could get hurt, I would have been there and her job

I won't put my kids at jeopardy of having to hear the gossip. It's their friends mom. It would be all over the school they all attend, the town. Etc. I won't make my kids have to deal w that when they know their dad and mom at having some issues. That's hard enough

Plus she's a teacher. We were all close. Too much hurt that I could avoid for my kids and hers.

I'll sacrifice this. It's on her. Not me


Posts: 354 | Registered: Dec 2013
Topic Posts: 41