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I am not sure how many of you are having the same problem in your sex life post A but I am. Please share anything that may help alleviate my worries.

Our sex life just has not been the same. We are in Reconciliation now for over 5 months but our intimacy has been moderately affected. Going from 2-3 times per week pre A down to 1 every 10 days. I am sure I should be great-full for that since some probably aren't intimate at all, but here is where I think our problem is. When it does happen it seems almost forced/expected on my wife's part. I feel she does it because it is expected from her. In order for it to occur we have a discussion and I share with her my need to express myself with my form of affection. We discussed it other night and came with the conclusion that she hates feeling like a piece of meat. Prior to this discussion she made it seem like it was my fault, or that I wasn't doing something right ex. I wasn't being romantic enough, or I was pressuring her too much, or some other excuse. Each time I have been cooperative with her suggestions but nothing changed. So finally I told her that I have been accommodating to her but we have never suggested that she make any adjustments. Mentally she said its hard for her to initiate intimacy or accept intimacy with me but while and after she loves it and doesn't understand why its so hard for her to want this part of our relationship more. Personally I think she feels guilty for what she did, and sex is a trigger for her since it can be easily associated with her actions. Has anyone had a WS admit to this or what types of reasons for this problem. And if so what did they do to help them get over this hump. Thanks in advance.

Hello, you might want to post this in the Betrayed Men section of I Can Relate.

I have seen this type of things mainly from a BH / WW direction, so perhaps they will have more insight.

but here is where I think our problem is. When it does happen it seems almost forced/expected on my wife's part

Yes, as a BS it is hurtful to have a WS begrudgingly attempt to meet our needs, does not really do anything to build up those good feelings does it? I can see how this would be a problem on your side, but I would guess the problem looks very different from her side. Perhaps all this has brought up old wounds/issues that she needs to work through and her "feelings" about sex are the symptoms bringing awareness of what she needs to work on to heal and grow, but in the process, it is hurtful to you to feel like an obligation/duty and not to feel like it is joyful and fun and a privilige to be intimate with you.

Good luck getting to the bottom of this.

Grace

How are other aspects of your relationship? Are you each meeting other needs? Like communication, non sexual affection, admiration, etc.?

My WS wasn't, and so for me it was difficult having sex because other needs weren't being met. I didn't feel a bond with him. We had very little communication, very little non sexual affection (grabbing my breasts or crotch is not affection, LOL) and so there was no non sexual intimacy in our relationship. And for me to want that connection, and sexual bond, I need intimacy in other parts of our relationship.

I HIGHLY recommend His Needs, Her Needs by Willard Harley. It's wonderful at talking about the 10 emotional needs (including sex). You can each rate your needs, so that you each know what the other's top needs are and you can BOTH try to meet each others needs. When you're both actively meeting each others needs, then emotional intimacy occurs more, and in turn, physical intimacy becomes easier as well.

Pre-A our sex life sucked horribly (no pun intended). I DID feel like a piece of meat because that was the only time he took any interest in me. Yes, the physical act of sex was enjoyable. But, there was so much lacking in our relationship overall, I just didn't feel like having sex because it was truly, all about him. I'm not saying this is your case, just explaining my own reasons.

After the A, after we got through HB, (sex daily during that) I did go through an anger phase and didn't want him to touch me for awhile, but once I got through that, we're about 3-4 times a week, and we were NEVER like that pre-A. But we've honestly been working hard on meeting each others needs. I'm sure he gets bored of talking with me all the time, but it's one of my top 5 needs, to have intimate conversation with him. And he gets that now. One of his needs is affection. I used to not because i thought he'd immediately associate it with sex. Now he knows, just because I kiss him on his neck, or rub his back or run my fingers through his hair, it doesn't mean I want to jump him right then and there. I'm just trying to show affection.

Okay thanks I will try to look there.

@SamanthaBaker

(grabbing my breasts or crotch is not affection, LOL)

ok what would your idea of affection be. I ask because what she suggests doesnt help.

For me, honestly things that don't involve my breasts, ass or genital area. I mean seriously, while I'm cooking dinner, it's not a turn on for him to come up behind me and put his arms around me, for what *I* would love to be a nice hug, only to realize he's going for my boobs you know? Affection doesn't have to equal sexual affection.

Coming up behind me and putting his arms around me in a hug vs. groping me. Kissing my neck and having it JUST be a kiss, not having it lead to something more every.single.damn.time. If he wants to give me a passionate kiss, I don't mind that, but just KISS me without strings (sex strings) being attached. Kiss me, dont' kiss me and grab my ass at the same time. Walk by while I'm sitting at the computer and rub my back, stroke my hair a bit. When we're walking, hold my hand. When we're watching TV, put my legs on your lap and rub my calves (withour running his hand up to my groin).

Basically, affection without sexual connotation/strings attached. I'm not a sex toy, treat me like a PERSON. Not like all you think about is ex every second of the day. I mean even if you do, PRETEND you don't, for my benefit. I don't like being constantly reminded how he wants to have sex all.the.time. It's tiring. It makes me feel like every time he touches me, that's his expectation, and it puts me on edge. I feel like if I rebuff his affection, then he'll be upset. But if I take his advances, then he'll get all hornball on me.

I just want plain ole non-sexual affection. I want to be able to relax, not have expectations put on me all the time. i want to know that a hug...is just a hug. That a kiss, is just a kiss. That if *I* give affection, he's not going to think in his mind, WOOT, let's get it ON!

For me, there is a time and a place for sex. I'm nor prude, honest. Our sex life is pertty active at this point. But, I don't want/need sexual connotations 24/7.

Can you tell I've had to deal with this? A lot? He's gotten much much better, but it's been YEARS of dealing with it, beating it into his head, lots of frustration, tears and anger on my part. I should be in my sexual prime right now, and I've felt that I can't be because he won't give me the chance. He's said to me, that he wants me to initiate, but well, he doesn't give me the chance! Well, until recently that is.

It's something we've really struggled with. I do NOT like feeling like I'm a sexual object. I want to feel like I'm a person, with thoughts, feelings, emotions. Yes, I enjoy sex, a LOT. But it's not who I am, I am not defined by it. And I like being appreciated for all of my qualities, not for what's in between my legs.

Sorry if that's harsh.

Sex for us has changed. Initially it was more frequent but I wouldn't say it was HB because it was only a couple of times a week. Now its every ten days or so and it drives me crazy. I really enjoy sec and making love but he isn't as interested.

After d-day I assumed it was because he had been having sec with her and it would get better. It really hasn't. Not sure why but I just really need to figure it out. It bothers me. It also is 'sex' instead if making love. Also he usually waits til we are in bed and approaches me from behind...sometimes I think I am a substitute but he swears I am not...who knows where his mind is?

@Samantha - YES!!! tired of the gropes while cooking dinner. Seriously? If I say "sure lets go" he backs down quickly....what is that about?

Mine would love it if I said sure let's go, but 5 kids running amok you know? He also would love it if I groped him constantly, but again, time, place. I have a 15 and 10 year old, both of whom are josh as hell. Not an image I want to give them. I'm not a teenager in heat anymore. Sure its nice at times, but i also think there needs to be a time and place.

Not to mention the whole I am more than a sexual object thing too.

Ok, ok. So no groping from behind while cooking. Lol must be a guy thing, I am guilty of this. My reasoning is your cooking for me to make me happy let me softly rub your behind to arouse you to make you happy. Hmmm I am guessing arousal doesnt equal happines? I have tried doing other thing in hopes of igniting love points ex, washing dishes, rubbing shoulders/upper arms making sure to stay away from no-no zones but dont get the appreciation. Its like she only notices when I do the things that annoy and is not appreciative when I am sweet and not sexually motivated. But lets be honest I cant tape it to my leg, I am sexually aroused by her, even from a simple hug. Its crazy. I have become afraid to turn her off in any way that I am afraid to touch in any way which can be mistaken as sexual. I feel like a dog with a shock collar that has gotten too close to the electrical fence too many times. Any more tips would be greatly appreciated. Thx

Have you ever read His Needs, Her Needs by Willard Harley from Marriage Builders? I've both my FWH and I have learned a LOT from this book. THey have worksheets in the end of thebook too that can break down your top 10 emoional needs, how you rank them, how you need them (expalin how you like affection, how you like admiration, etc.)

Actually part of my blog post was about that yesterday too. Link is in my siggy if you want to check it out. In my blog I list the worksheets too. But the book is FANTASTIC.

I think it just depends on the person because I'm all for groping at any time, cooking, doing laundry, whatever. Grope away! But then my primary love language is physical touch.

HopeOneDay,

Sex was a big issue for FWW and I after dday. She was comfortable with once a month or less, I wanted more. Physical touch is my primary love language, but touch is last for her.

Up until she started the IC after dday, she saw sex as an obligation to men to make them like her. She did not see sex as a way of connecting at all, just the opposite. She has a history of FOO issues, sAb from and uncle and a rape as an adolescent.

When I initiated sex she felt obligated and that led to resentment. I spent the better part of a year waiting for her to initiate. Also during this time she had a hysterectomy. We did not have much sex that year. It got to the point I began working on D, not because I did not love her, but because I really felt like deep down she did not love or want me.

She worked with her IC to address her side of the issue, and we did some MC prior to finalizing a D. She came to understand that sex was an expression of love to me. It was not that I was leaving because I did not get as much sex as I wanted, but because I felt unloved, unworthy. The MC (her IC) helped her to make these connections.

FWW started taking testosterone shots to improve her libido. This was a little triggery for me as she did it during her A's too. She says she did it then to feel more sexual with me, but still uncomfortable at first.

The shots have worked, and she initiates almost weekly, and is aroused enough if I initiate that she does not feel resentful. There are some physical effects from her T shots, so I do not know how sustainable this is, but for now it is working. My hope is that we will be healed enough and reconnected that if she has to stop I will not feel unloved or settled for by that time. I also hope that after a time of increased sexual activity with the shots, she will be more responsive to sex even without them, albeit probably less often than we are doing it now.

Like everything else, I wish we could have figured this out before the A's and years (decades) of her resenting me for wanting sex.

BTW, when the shots are really engaged and working, she says she feels sorry for men if that is what our level of sexual arousal is like. There are times I have trouble keeping up with her desire (I am getting older).

ETA:

I have tried doing other thing in hopes of igniting love points ex, washing dishes, rubbing shoulders/upper arms making sure to stay away from no-no zones but dont get the appreciation.

Over the years I took on a lot of laundry, dishes, stuff around the house too. Trying to do like the books said and reduce the work load for my W and show my love. None of it worked. As FWW will say now, if she felt the love and attraction none of that would matter, and if she did not feel the love and attraction none of that would help. The OM never did dishes or laundry for her.

It is only recently that FWw has expressed a desire for hugs when she gets home, and some touching during the evening. For most of our M she really did not like to be touched.

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 10:25 AM, April 26th (Thursday)]

I will say for me, it's not about him doing chores around the house, or anything like that.

For me? My need is intimate conversation. I HAVE to talk to my husband more than "Hey how was your day" in order to feel an emotional connection with him. ANd he was always too busy gaming (and I resented it) and would only talk to me in effort to guage if I was interested in sex. Clearly...I was not.

NOW, we talk all.the.time. I'm sure he doesn't enjoy the talking as much as I do, however, because I feel that he's connecting with me, willing to fit a need of mine, then I'm way more willing to fulfill his need for sex because *I* am having my needs met too.

I'm also not a touchy feely girl in general. I like holding hands, I like a kiss when he gets home, but not him frenching me or anything. I guess I'm a bit reserved if you will. I'd like that to remain in the bedroom. I like little rubs on the back, but not for 5 minutes while I'm standing there. Just a small rub, move on. I like hugs, but not ones that last for ever.

I think part of the problem is, we have 5 kids. And I was nursing, literally non stop (even during pregnancy) for 9 years straight. I constantly had a child hanging off of me. I finally stopped nursing just over a year ago. We also co-slept so we finally just got our bed back right after DDay last year too. So...part of it for me, is that I have been so *touched out* by kids for so long. That sometimes, I like my body just being *MY* body. To not have someone hanging on me anymore, not having to give my body to one more person. And in between all that I was poked, prodded and at every dr. you can imagine for 4 years, two major surgeries, about 15 procedures, 4 hospitalizations. So really???? Sometimes I just want my body to be left alone.

But my husband does like to express his love through sex. However, I doubt him grabbing my crotch, coming out of the shower naked and him wiggling it around at me, is an expression of love.

So, he's gotten MUCH better on that front as we've read through HN, HN and he's realized our needs are rated differently. And our sex life HAS gotten better. So much. We went from maybe once a month to approx 3 times a week. But it took awhile to get to that point. And I will asy at times when I'm triggering, we have a dry week.

I too had myhormones checked last spring, and mine were very much out of what, even my testosterone. But I didn't go on the shots since they are synthetic. I went on the bio-identical cream. and that did help too, if your wife thinks that may be an issue. I'm 35, and after 5 kids, at an age where my hormones are all out of whack.

Oddly, my FWH testosterone is low. at like 300, when it should be over 600. I had to laugh, because he has such a high drive. He's been on the bio-identical cream for a month and if he gets ack up to 600, I don't know what the hell I'm going to do at that point, I can't keep up with that.

I have tried doing other thing in hopes of igniting love points ex, washing dishes, rubbing shoulders/upper arms making sure to stay away from no-no zones but dont get the appreciation.

Hope - I recommend reading The Five Love Languages. It will open your eyes immensely. It is a super easy read!

From what you've said above, I would guess your languages are Acts of Service and Physical Touch. Hers are probably different, so she doesn't understand as she doesn't speak your language.

Example: My FWH languages are Acts of Service and Words of Appreciation. So in his mind he was showing his love to me by doing the laundry, dishes, etc. and telling me how great the clean bathroom looks. But because my languages are Quality Time and Touch, instead of hearing his profession of love, I was thinking: "good for him helping to clean up his own messes and noticing that I cleaned up too!"

Seems so simple once you understand and learn to speak each others languages.

ETA: It also helps understand your kids when you can figure out what their languages are

[This message edited by Lucky2HaveMe at 2:28 PM, April 26th (Thursday)]

..who knows where his mind is?

For me this is the key to unlocking my passion. I want to know where his mind is. Is he feeling, happy, lonely, scared, indifferent? I have to feel emotionally connected to him. To me sex is not intimacy. Intimacy is feeling like you understand the other person. The way they think, feel and react. I often think the HB comes from sharing honnest emotions - the good, the bad and the ugly. As a woman I want to feel a sense of oneness with my mind first, and then my body naturally follows. If he had a bad day I want him to tell me how it made him FEEL. I've used this analogy with my spouse.

You can ask someone, Hey how could you punch that person in tje face? I don't want to hear, well I made a fist, raised it, and thrust it forward. That doesn't tell anything about your feelings. I want you to tell me, well i just became so frustrated. I wasnt getting through to this person and when they were screaming at me it made me feel little and scared. I dont like to feel that way. What they said hurt my feelings, so to protect myself i punched them in the face. Do you see the difference? One is facts, the other is vulnerability.

(btw totally fake scenario. Just making a point).

I want to feel I am accepted and appreciated for my mind as well as my body. If I haven't connected emotionally I do feel used- like a piece of meat!

Just my personal opinion here, but I think men in general (please don't take offense if this isn't you) are raised to believe that there are good girls and bad girls. They'd like to think that every woman has a little bad girl in her and that meaningless sex is ok with women. I think every woman (yes, even the one who are in the sex industry) wants to feel valued not for what she gives sexually, but for who she is as a person. I think women in the sex industry often misenturprite sex for intimacy, when what they really want is someone to love them. Anyway, our sex obsessed society has blurred the lines of intimacy and sex and everyone, male and female is confused about both. Ok, climbing off my soap box.

I really am glad you started this topic. It's nice to see the different gender perspectives.

Does anyone have this problem:

We are 2 1/2 years out from Dday.

Pre-A: we had sex 3-5 times per week. If we did anything new or exciting it was because I initiated it- not him- although he would enjoy it. I asked him about fantasies etc. sex was never a struggle. We had a great sex life and we BOTH knew it because we talked about it often. We also had a lot more sex when I was pregnant- and he cheated while I was pregnant- go figure.

Post-A: at first- HB-I was pregnant- I was in shock and didn't know what to do- sex was a big part of our marriage. Now, the the sex has dwindled. Maybe 2-3 times per month if that. This is because I'm just so grossed out by him now. I'm just not attracted to him like I was. I see him like a dog in heat or like some asshole who just wants to use me. It also requires so much mentally and emotionally from me that it's too exhausting to have sex. It used to be so easy and relaxing. Now it's such a struggle in every way- I just can't stand it anymore. That loving, caring, sweetness I was attracted to physically is gone. I guess I was attracted to him physically because of who he was on the inside. I've lost that. He isn't sweet and he isn't nice or caring- or why would he have an A. That's the tape that runs through my head. I also think about OW EVERY time. I used to be able to have orgasms 9 out of 10 times we had sex. Now I can't fully or I just fake it- pathetic I know.

On a sad note- I used to be very affectionate and hands on. I was a groping kind of wife. That was so much fun to me. Well- i haven't done it for 2 1/2 years. I miss that- but that loving, playful, fun girl is gone.

I'm a very sexual woman- I always have been. I definitely has sexual desires and needs. I just can't fulfill them with him anymore. He is an unsafe person for me. This is so sad to me.

He gave it all up for his "ego, because he could, because she pursued him, he thought he would get away with it, he thought she wouldn't tell, it was just a game, it was a mistake, he wasn't thinking, he wasn't thinking about me, he didn't know how to love or receive love, he never stopped loving me"- WHATEVER!

RE: hopeoneday post.

you probably need to really try to connect with your wife on an emotional level. Have you truly engaged her with compassion for the issues that led her to do what she did? Been compassionate for her feelings not yours?

RE: momof4 post. If your husband has been 100% remorseful, has worked hard to make amends, has been fully transparent, and has engaged in important behavior changes, worked to address his share of marriage relationship issues then what more do u want?

You are the person making yourself unhappy not him. do you not have any other identity other than victim?

For me as a BH, and my wife being the poster-girl for remorseful and committed WW, having sex with me every day for the 50+ days since Dday (since that is the topic of the post), what kind of man am I if I can't forgive her at some point? I refuse to be some vindictive, weak man. I understand my critical role in creating the shitty marriage we have had.

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 10:49 PM, April 26th (Thursday)]

t/j

MC_Jack,

We posters on SI do not usually attack other posters who are expressing their thoughts and opinions.

I personally find your remark to Mom-of-4 to be offensive and cruel.

You are the person making yourself unhappy not him. do you not have any other identity other than victim

MC_Jack...

You can make your point without being insulting to the members here.

Please be more considerate in the future.

Looking at the flippancy and insensitivity of my comments, I agree with your assessments. To momof4 and the community I apologize.